FIFA U20 World Cup

[orangenauburn]

US up on Nigeria 2-0 thanks to Sebastian Soto goals at 18 and 46 minute marks

Lost to Ukraine 2-1 earlier after tying mid 1st and giving up a goal early in 2nd. Never could get something going.

Both matches US has dominated possession and statistically

U.S. U-20s show some flash, but not enough grit in World Cup loss to Ukraine | Goal.com US

Tab Ramos' team showed some of the quality expected, but not nearly enough to open its World Cup with a win against a tough and disciplined Ukraine

www.goal.com

 

[creatorsgam]

US up on Nigeria 2-0 thanks to Sebastian Soto goals at 18 and 46 minute marks

Lost to Ukraine 2-1 earlier after tying mid 1st and giving up a goal early in 2nd. Never could get something going.

Both matches US has dominated possession and statistically

U.S. U-20s show some flash, but not enough grit in World Cup loss to Ukraine | Goal.com US

Tab Ramos' team showed some of the quality expected, but not nearly enough to open its World Cup with a win against a tough and disciplined Ukraine

www.goal.com

Thanks... didn’t realize it was on today, catching the end of the 2nd.

 

[orangenauburn]

Thanks... didn’t realize it was on today, catching the end of the 2nd.

Nigeria has been rifling shots on goal from 30-40 yards out

 

[creatorsgam]

Nigeria has been rifling shots on goal from 30-40 yards out

I missed the majority of the game... but that doesn’t seem to be a winning strategy. And it wasn’t.

 

[cusefan88]

USA has some good prospects but obviously their professional development will come by breaking into the first-team of the clubs they are at.

Most impressive for me so far are Mendez, Richards, and Konrad de la Fuente.

 

[CanadianSU]

Huge Ukraine soccer fan (born kyiv) looking good so far! Bit lucky to beat the Americans but fair enough. Lunin the keeper showed why Real Madrid went out and got him.

USA has some good players. Was impressed with the De La Fuente guy.

 

[DeGrozz]

USA has some good prospects but obviously their professional development will come by breaking into the first-team of the clubs they are at.

Most impressive for me so far are Mendez, Richards, and Konrad de la Fuente.

I came to post this tweet and found your quote relevant:


I know people want overnight change, but the development of this game in the US has been unreal, even with missing the WC.

 

[cusefan88]

I came to post this tweet and found your quote relevant:


I know people want overnight change, but the development of this game in the US has been unreal, even with missing the WC.

Yeah the quality of club is higher but they need more guys in top leagues. I do firmly believe adopting promotion/relegation would help.

 

[DeGrozz]

Yeah the quality of club is higher but they need more guys in top leagues. I do firmly believe adopting promotion/relegation would help.

I’m not touching that debate with a 10-foot pole!

 

[cusefan88]

I’m not touching that debate with a 10-foot pole!

Yeah it hits some people big-time. I just think if the rest of the world has a good and proven way to do it the US should go with it.

 

[DeGrozz]

Yeah it hits some people big-time. I just think if the rest of the world has a good and proven way to do it the US should go with it.

My biggest worry is how weak the USL is. Fandom/attendance is horrible. Facilities stink. Youth development is essentially non-existent. I worry with pro/rel teams will sink to the depths of the current USL instead of raising USL teams up to MLS standards.

I also look at teams like Philly and the great things they are doing with their academy. I’m not sure they’d have made that investment if they knew they could be going down.

I’m actually not opposed to the idea of a single table and/or pro/rel when the league can support it. I’m just not sure right now is the time for it.

(And I guess I broke my “I won’t touch that debate pledge...)

 

[cusefan88]

My biggest worry is how weak the USL is. Fandom/attendance is horrible. Facilities stink. Youth development is essentially non-existent. I worry with pro/rel teams will sink to the depths of the current USL instead of raising USL teams up to MLS standards.

I also look at teams like Philly and the great things they are doing with their academy. I’m not sure they’d have made that investment if they knew they could be going down.

I’m actually not opposed to the idea of a single table and/or pro/rel when the league can support it. I’m just not sure right now is the time for it.

(And I guess I broke my “I won’t touch that debate pledge...)

Very fair and reasonable take.

 

[cusefan88]

USA moves on the Round of 16 after a pitiful 1-0 win over Qatar. Most likely playing France. Mendez and Durkin out after yellow card accumulation. Will be very tough to advance should they get Les Blues.

 

[orangenauburn]

USA moves on the Round of 16 after a pitiful 1-0 win over Qatar. Most likely playing France. Mendez and Durkin out after yellow card accumulation. Will be very tough to advance should they get Les Blues.

Still dominated statistically

Just not translating that domination in stats to goals

If you went by stats alone, the team probably underachieved by 2 goals over the first three games.

At the same time, the top line players played well And consistent, which gives hope moving forward.

FIFA U-20 World Cup 2019: Timothy Weah sends USA to knockout stage vs. France thanks to phenomenal late goal

The U.S. finished second in Group B and will meet France in the knockout stage

www.cbssports.com

 

[orangenauburn]

USA moves on the Round of 16 after a pitiful 1-0 win over Qatar. Most likely playing France. Mendez and Durkin out after yellow card accumulation. Will be very tough to advance should they get Les Blues.

Also

I can see France as a 2026 cup contender.

They have a lot of promising prospects

 

[IthacaMatt]

My biggest worry is how weak the USL is. Fandom/attendance is horrible. Facilities stink. Youth development is essentially non-existent. I worry with pro/rel teams will sink to the depths of the current USL instead of raising USL teams up to MLS standards.

I also look at teams like Philly and the great things they are doing with their academy. I’m not sure they’d have made that investment if they knew they could be going down.

I’m actually not opposed to the idea of a single table and/or pro/rel when the league can support it. I’m just not sure right now is the time for it.

(And I guess I broke my “I won’t touch that debate pledge...)

I think they are over-expanding already. Huge mistake. It means that the league will import more Central and South American kids who will take up spaces that US born kids should fill more of.

 

[cusefan88]

What's the point of making real investment in USL if you can never make the first division? Look at the money invested in the sport by Americans OUTSIDE the country, precisely because they can merit their way up and down the pyramid.

People talk a lot about the US eventually winning the Mens World Cup but it will never happen with the current club structure.

 

[CanadianSU]

People talk a lot about the US eventually winning the Mens World Cup but it will never happen with the current club structure.

Is that seriously a thing?

That’s like saying Canada might actually qualify one day.

 

[DeGrozz]

What's the point of making real investment in USL if you can never make the first division? Look at the money invested in the sport by Americans OUTSIDE the country, precisely because they can merit their way up and down the pyramid.

People talk a lot about the US eventually winning the Mens World Cup but it will never happen with the current club structure.

To be fair, pretty much every team in the USL that has made an investment in their club has received an invite to MLS.

My theory:

The issue with domestic soccer isn't the structure. It isn't that owners aren't throwing enough money at it. I'd argue it's something very different -- it's the fans. 90% of the fans of the national team will offer up the same couple of ideas on how to grow and make the domestic league and teams better, but they can't be bothered to buy tickets to go to a game or turn on an MLS game on TV.

If people supported domestic leagues anywhere close to the way they cared about the future success of the USMNT or their favorite Euro clubs (or even put as much energy into watching a game as the do complaining about the system), then we might see enough decent teams to fill a pro/rel system. But even when MLS is producing domestic talent like Tyler Adams (RB Leipzig, Bundesliga player of the week, etc), Alphonso Davies (Bayern Munich), Zach Setffan (Man City), Matt Miazga (Chelsea), etc people still don't show up to games or watch on TV. Even with cheap tickets, great fan experiences, and easily accessible ways to watch. I'd argue that's holding us back more than anything.

 

[cusefan88]

To be fair, pretty much every team in the USL that has made an investment in their club has received an invite to MLS.

My theory:

The issue with domestic soccer isn't the structure. It isn't that owners aren't throwing enough money at it. I'd argue it's something very different -- it's the fans. 90% of the fans of the national team will offer up the same couple of ideas on how to grow and make the domestic league and teams better, but they can't be bothered to buy tickets to go to a game or turn on an MLS game on TV.

If people supported domestic leagues anywhere close to the way they cared about the future success of the USMNT or their favorite Euro clubs (or even put as much energy into watching a game as the do complaining about the system), then we might see enough decent teams to fill a pro/rel system. But even when MLS is producing domestic talent like Tyler Adams (RB Leipzig, Bundesliga player of the week, etc), Alphonso Davies (Bayern Munich), Zach Setffan (Man City), Matt Miazga (Chelsea), etc people still don't show up to games or watch on TV. Even with cheap tickets, great fan experiences, and easily accessible ways to watch. I'd argue that's holding us back more than anything.

You're theory is definitely possible. But we'll never know since our system is closed and most of the regular season is useless.

 

[orangenauburn]

The MLS need better exposure ... It's improving but still not where it needs to be. It needs a Sunday showcase like EPL on NBC or CBS or ABC, and the league needs to piggy back the USL off their exposure and work in unison to build development deals and financing

 

[DeGrozz]

You're theory is definitely possible. But we'll never know since our system is closed and most of the regular season is useless.

About as closed and pointless as the NBA, NFL, NCAA, MLB, and NHL systems except regular season champions have a real trophy and others qualify for champions league through the regular season.

 

[orangenauburn]

To be fair, pretty much every team in the USL that has made an investment in their club has received an invite to MLS.

My theory:

The issue with domestic soccer isn't the structure. It isn't that owners aren't throwing enough money at it. I'd argue it's something very different -- it's the fans. 90% of the fans of the national team will offer up the same couple of ideas on how to grow and make the domestic league and teams better, but they can't be bothered to buy tickets to go to a game or turn on an MLS game on TV.

If people supported domestic leagues anywhere close to the way they cared about the future success of the USMNT or their favorite Euro clubs (or even put as much energy into watching a game as the do complaining about the system), then we might see enough decent teams to fill a pro/rel system. But even when MLS is producing domestic talent like Tyler Adams (RB Leipzig, Bundesliga player of the week, etc), Alphonso Davies (Bayern Munich), Zach Setffan (Man City), Matt Miazga (Chelsea), etc people still don't show up to games or watch on TV. Even with cheap tickets, great fan experiences, and easily accessible ways to watch. I'd argue that's holding us back more than anything.

There's 36 USL teams and eventually going to be 30 MLS teams. They should add four more and partner to form four tiers.

MLS gets top 20 franchises
Next tier can be next 20
Third tier is 15
Fourth tier is 15

Bottom three relegated down a tier, top 2 and playoff winner promoted.

Work with US soccer development and association to help lower division teams field squads. Have the U16 and U18 kids not quite elite enough for foreign leagues play full seasons in domestic leagues.

The biggest obstacle will be Fielding sufficient quality coaching staffs to train and develop the prospects. Your average tier 4 staff probably will be community college type coaches.

 

[DeGrozz]

There's 36 USL teams and eventually going to be 30 MLS teams. They should add four more and partner to form four tiers.

MLS gets top 20 franchises
Next tier can be next 20
Third tier is 15
Fourth tier is 15

Bottom three relegated down a tier, top 2 and playoff winner promoted.

Work with US soccer development and association to help lower division teams field squads. Have the U16 and U18 kids not quite elite enough for foreign leagues play full seasons in domestic leagues.

The biggest obstacle will be Fielding sufficient quality coaching staffs to train and develop the prospects. Your average tier 4 staff probably will be community college type coaches.

Again, I'm not saying this can't ever work, I'm saying it won't work until US fans start supporting their own leagues as much as they support the national team or their favorite Euro clubs.

Lower level teams do not have the capital to keep up with MLS clubs and I believe that MLS teams will be harmed more by loss of fanbase by 'playing down' than USL teams will improve by 'playing up'.

It's because there is little incentive for USL teams to invest the amount of money needed to be competitive with MLS clubs. It's not the premier league where teams are splitting over $3 billion/year in TV money, or the Bundesliga where they are splitting $2.6 billion/year. The MLS gets $90M/year -- about $3 million/team -- why build a stadium, build an academy, and invest millions in salary for that? In hopes that you get a $10 royalty for every jersey you sell to the 4,000 fans that come to each of your 17 home games?

It's like you mentioned in your post, the MLS is still looking to expand. Investors who are willing to commit that type of capital in a gamble on the long-term growth of the sport in this country have already made that investment -- there aren't a lot of other viable options at the moment with the support our league is currently getting.

It's why I blame soccer fans in the US for the state of the leagues' structures more than the Federation/MLS/USL.

And that doesn't take into account potential fourth-tier travel costs for teams who only get one or two hundred fans at their home games. You put them into their own league and they are no longer getting checks for being body-bag games for MLS II teams or the bigger USL teams -- they are basically marked to fold.

 

[NailstheCusefan12]

A massive upset for the Baby Yanks against France! Their goalkeeper alone had more professional appearances than our whole squad and they’ve got players from PSG, OM, Leipzig, etc. A huge win for the boys!