Gmac

[CuseMan4]

I love Gmac and what he has done for this program and I'm not saying we need to let him go but there are a couple things that concern me.

1) this recruiting class is not as good as it could be because Gmac couldn't finish. I'm not talking just about Quade, there were a couple others. So he has shown he is not a strong recruiter, perhaps he needs time.

2) he is the guard coach, and not even up for debate that is our worst position. I know he developed G and helped develop MCW, but those guys were already extremely talented. I don't want to overreact based just on this seasons results but hopefully this season lights a fire under him and he gets going or he'all be going out the door in a couple years if he doesn't show some value to the staff.

 

[tbonezone]

maybe it's time to push a few baby robins out of the nest and see if they can actually fly on their own.

 

[RF2044]

I said in another thread yesterday that maybe being so insular is not what's best for the program.

We should be hiring the best ACs we can, the best recruiters we can. On the list of prerequisites, having former ties to the program should be far down the list. Nothing against Red--he seems like a good recruiter. And nothing against GMac, he's young. But we need to hire a guy like Arizona has on their staff--a bulldog recruiter with ties to major, major east coast AAU programs and urban high school programs.

 

[Toga]

I love Gmac and what he has done for this program and I'm not saying we need to let him go but there are a couple things that concern me.

1) this recruiting class is not as good as it could be because Gmac couldn't finish. I'm not talking just about Quade, there were a couple others. So he has shown he is not a strong recruiter, perhaps he needs time.

2) he is the guard coach, and not even up for debate that is our worst position. I know he developed G and helped develop MCW, but those guys were already extremely talented. I don't want to overreact based just on this seasons results but hopefully this season lights a fire under him and he gets going or he'all be going out the door in a couple years if he doesn't show some value to the staff.

I like the guy and love the player. I was surprised when he was hired as he always seemed on the reserved side when he wasn't playing. I didn't think that was a good quality at least on the recruiting end, particularly as his playing rep becomes more distant.

 

[Brooky03]

1) GMac's not the closer/finisher, especially not for big recruits like Quade, Boeheim is. We're not going to win recruiting battles with UK and Duke. It's just not going to happen. As for the 'couple others', there wasn't much there. The NCAA's sanctions on the recruiting trail have hurt us more than any other part of the punishment, including the scholarship reductions.

2) Our guards aren't talented. You're asking him to mold poop into an artistic vase when it's ceiling is as a bowl for pooping in. Gillon is not suited to play at this level. He's a good midmajor guard whose strength is shooting but he can't get his shot off against the big boys. IDK what GMac is supposed to do with that. Howard will be a solid upperclassman for us, but he wasn't a particularly highly rated recruit out of high school and he has skill deficiencies that are killing him on top of the mental mistakes. Is not being able to dribble a ball against any level of defensive pressure GMac's fault or Howard's fault? I'd lean Howard. We've had worse rated recruits play better than Howard as sophomores but we've also had better rated recruits play worse. It happens. Battle's a freshman and exempted from the discussion because he's basically playing how most freshman play.

 

[Fly Rodder]

1) GMac's not the closer/finisher, especially not for big recruits like Quade, Boeheim is. We're not going to win recruiting battles with UK and Duke. It's just not going to happen. As for the 'couple others', there wasn't much there. The NCAA's sanctions on the recruiting trail have hurt us more than any other part of the punishment, including the scholarship reductions.

2) Our guards aren't talented. You're asking him to mold poop into an artistic vase when it's ceiling is as a bowl for pooping in. Gillon is not suited to play at this level. He's a good midmajor guard whose strength is shooting but he can't get his shot off against the big boys. IDK what GMac is supposed to do with that. Howard will be a solid upperclassman for us, but he wasn't a particularly highly rated recruit out of high school and he has skill deficiencies that are killing him on top of the mental mistakes. Is not being able to dribble a ball against any level of defensive pressure GMac's fault or Howard's fault? I'd lean Howard. We've had worse rated recruits play better than Howard as sophomores but we've also had better rated recruits play worse. It happens. Battle's a freshman and exempted from the discussion because he's basically playing how most freshman play.

Re: #1, Louisville is under self-imposed (and the threat of more) sanctions and just brought in a top-10 class.

 

[Cusefan0307]

1) GMac's not the closer/finisher, especially not for big recruits like Quade, Boeheim is. We're not going to win recruiting battles with UK and Duke. It's just not going to happen. As for the 'couple others', there wasn't much there. The NCAA's sanctions on the recruiting trail have hurt us more than any other part of the punishment, including the scholarship reductions.

2) Our guards aren't talented. You're asking him to mold poop into an artistic vase when it's ceiling is as a bowl for pooping in. Gillon is not suited to play at this level. He's a good midmajor guard whose strength is shooting but he can't get his shot off against the big boys. IDK what GMac is supposed to do with that. Howard will be a solid upperclassman for us, but he wasn't a particularly highly rated recruit out of high school and he has skill deficiencies that are killing him on top of the mental mistakes. Is not being able to dribble a ball against any level of defensive pressure GMac's fault or Howard's fault? I'd lean Howard. We've had worse rated recruits play better than Howard as sophomores but we've also had better rated recruits play worse. It happens. Battle's a freshman and exempted from the discussion because he's basically playing how most freshman play.

Howard was a top 100 recruit. Battle top 40. They should be better than this.

 

[Brooky03]

Re: #1, Louisville is under self-imposed (and the threat of more) sanctions and just brought in a top-10 class.

good for them

 

[Fly Rodder]

good for them

:noidea:

 

[Brooky03]

Howard was a top 100 recruit. Battle top 40. They should be better than this.

Battle's not the first top 40 recruit to struggle early in his first season, though. Unless you're top 10, there are no guarantees. Even in the top 10, there are no guarantees. He's shown flashes of what he can be. I think he'll be excellent next season.

Top 100 doesn't mean a whole lot. He should be better, yes, but a lot of that is on him and him alone.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Battle's not the first top 40 recruit to struggle early in his first season, though. Unless you're top 10, there are no guarantees. Even in the top 10, there are no guarantees. He's shown flashes of what he can be. I think he'll be excellent next season.

Top 100 doesn't mean a whole lot. He should be better, yes, but a lot of that is on him and him alone.

Then maybe they were evaluated incorrectly. Freshman can struggle, but they should get better. He's not getting better. Same with Frank.

 

[Ward]

I love Gmac and what he has done for this program and I'm not saying we need to let him go but there are a couple things that concern me.

1) this recruiting class is not as good as it could be because Gmac couldn't finish. I'm not talking just about Quade, there were a couple others. So he has shown he is not a strong recruiter, perhaps he needs time.

2) he is the guard coach, and not even up for debate that is our worst position. I know he developed G and helped develop MCW, but those guys were already extremely talented. I don't want to overreact based just on this seasons results but hopefully this season lights a fire under him and he gets going or he'all be going out the door in a couple years if he doesn't show some value to the staff.

I agree 100%. Recruiting has been well covered. He inexplicably was given way too much responsibility for 2017 guys and struck out.

Your second point, I think this is a great point and HUGE thing nobody has really mentioned. Howard, Joseph, Buss, Cooney, Gillon, Battle to a certain extent have all under performed on his watch. We had one of the best positional coaches in the country in Hop who was cranking out pros and making great guard play the foundation of the program. That went away to bring an unproven coach and recruiter on board. We went from having guard play and development of our guards be a huge strength to now it's been a weakness since Ennis left. I view Gbinije as more of a flat out basketball player than someone who is strictly a guard we developed.

If he isn't bringing in recruits or really developing guys behind the scenes what is the value to having him on staff? Didn't totally understand it at the time and now it looks even worse in hindsight. When a spot opened why didn't we bring in a big man coach who had recruiting ties? Instead we moved a GREAT positional coach off the guards and then did nothing to enhance our efforts in raising the talent level on the roster. It was a gamble that hasn't paid off the last few years.

 

[Brooky03]

Then maybe they were evaluated incorrectly. Freshman can struggle, but they should get better. He's not getting better. Same with Frank.

Battle's not in a position to get better. Freshman need some help around them; he's getting zero help. Frank should be getting better but, again, is that on the coaches or on him?

So far in this thread, the argument against GMac's coaching ability is that MCW and Gbinije were good, so his efforts there don't mean much. Because Frank and Gillon are bad, he must be bad. That's the argument. Maybe it's not your argument, but that's what we're looking at and it's a clearly BS argument. Mike Gbinije was not a good basketball player when he arrived on SU's campus and nobody would have predicted that he would be able to play PG. After a couple seasons with this coaching staff, despite his poor ballhandling and lack of experience at the position, G was the leader on the team doing everything we needed him to do at PG. That alone speaks to the coaching staff's ability to mold guards. Like I said, Battle gets a pass. He's been underwhelming so far but he's not even in the top 5 most disappointing players on the team so far.

 

[OttoMets]

I don't know how he recruits and I don't know how he coaches (not, at least, in an objective way), but there's no way that a school like Syracuse should've given one of three assistant jobs to someone who was essentially unqualified four or five years ago. That was a foolish move by Boeheim. Maybe it had a high ceiling, but if his gut feeling was off, he'd be in a position where he either has to fire a popular ex-player with whom he's close or stand pat with a sub-par coach on his staff.

Risky business, hiring of friends and alums. I think it's cool to have an all-alumni staff, but it shouldn't happen at the exclusion of finding the very best candidate for each position.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Battle's not in a position to get better. Freshman need some help around them; he's getting zero help. Frank should be getting better but, again, is that on the coaches or on him?

So far in this thread, the argument against GMac's coaching ability is that MCW and Gbinije were good, so his efforts there don't mean much. Because Frank and Gillon are bad, he must be bad. That's the argument. Maybe it's not your argument, but that's what we're looking at and it's a clearly BS argument. Mike Gbinije was not a good basketball player when he arrived on SU's campus and nobody would have predicted that he would be able to play PG. After a couple seasons with this coaching staff, despite his poor ballhandling and lack of experience at the position, G was the leader on the team doing everything we needed him to do at PG. That alone speaks to the coaching staff's ability to mold guards. Like I said, Battle gets a pass. He's been underwhelming so far but he's not even in the top 5 most disappointing players on the team so far.

I don't know what to think about Gmac. I hope he does well cause I like what he did here as a player and think he is a great guy, but this years product looks pretty bad so far.

I get Battle is a freshman, but a lot of intelligent posters here had him pegged as the BEST PLAYER on the team from Day 1 and thought he was underrated. Even you said you think he could be Dion next year. I don't see that at all. In fact the stats suggest he's been our worst regular overall (worse than Frank) and he like Howard can't perform against top competition.

Again I like Gmac, but either we overrated our players or our coaching stinks. Something has to give.

 

[Alsacs]

Why didn't Trevor Cooney improve from rFr to Senior year?
Why didn't Ron Patterson improve in his 2 years?
Why didn't Kaleb Joseph improve in his 2 years?
I don't consider BJ Johnson a guard so he doesn't count.
Why hasn't Frank Howard improved?
I give him credit for Gbinije but that isn't enough.

Our guard play has been bad since 2014.
Sorry GMac shouldn't be a made man in the SU BB coaching mafia.
GMac's recruiting hasn't been great either.
We need some freaking help on the staff. Our guys aren't improving. That is coaching.

 

[Brooky03]

I don't know what to think about Gmac. I hope he does well cause I like what he did here as a player and think he is a great guy, but this years product looks pretty bad so far.

I get Battle is a freshman, but a lot of intelligent posters here had him pegged as the BESY PLAYER on the team from Day 1 and thought he was underrated. Even you said you think he could be Dion next year. I don't see that at all. In fact the stats suggest he's been our worst regular overall (worse than Frank) and he like Howard can't perform against top competition.

Again I like Gmac, but either we overrated our players or our coaching stinks. Something has to give.

A lot of intelligent posters though Kaleb Joseph was going to be the next Johnny Flynn, too.

 

[retro44]

I said in another thread yesterday that maybe being so insular is not what's best for the program.

We should be hiring the best ACs we can, the best recruiters we can. On the list of prerequisites, having former ties to the program should be far down the list. Nothing against Red--he seems like a good recruiter. And nothing against GMac, he's young. But we need to hire a guy like Arizona has on their staff--a bulldog recruiter with ties to major, major east coast AAU programs and urban high school programs.

Exactly,these AC had come out of high school worshiping the ground Boeheim walks on when playing for him. What Boeheim is doing now is putting his legacy above the longterm health for the University.I have been saying for years to hire the very best we can find instead of getting system longterm coaches. The game is constantly revolving but not this staff.

 

[Alsacs]

What GMac got would be like me graduating from
Newhouse interning at NY Times and then getting a columnist job at the Washington Post.
His first job as an assistant shouldn't have been at a top 10 school. Atleast Autry worked his way up and was an assistant at a P5 school in VPI under Seth Greenberg.

 

[Cusefan0307]

A lot of intelligent posters though Kaleb Joseph was going to be the next Johnny Flynn, too.

Exactly. Another highly rated recruit that was not evaluated correctly or just wasn't coached good enough.

 

[CuseMan4]

I said in another thread yesterday that maybe being so insular is not what's best for the program.

We should be hiring the best ACs we can, the best recruiters we can. On the list of prerequisites, having former ties to the program should be far down the list. Nothing against Red--he seems like a good recruiter. And nothing against GMac, he's young. But we need to hire a guy like Arizona has on their staff--a bulldog recruiter with ties to major, major east coast AAU programs and urban high school programs.

This exactly, we need to hire coaches outside the program too. I mean come on yeahbits great to have coaches that know/played in your system but do you actually think our best three options as assistant coaches just happen to be Syracuse grads/former players...no. Boeheim hates change and this evidence.

I'm fine with keeping Red and Hop, they are proven coaches and proven recruiters, I think they give Gmac one more year and if he doesn't perform that should be hops first move as a coach is letting him go unfortnately...it's a results business and he hasn't show good results. Realistically Hop could be hiring 3 new assistants once he takes over.

 

[JLine]

Obvious what needs to be done, but never will. Enjoy the memories of 2003, because of loyalty. We need Troy Weaver's, not ex-players. I'm usually very optimistic, but we are in a major hole for years to come, and not because of the NCAA.

 

[OttoMets]

What GMac got would be like me graduating from
Newhouse interning at NY Times and then getting a columnist job at the Washington Post.
His first job as an assistant shouldn't have been at a top 10 school. Atleast Autry worked his way up and was an assistant at a P5 school in VPI under Seth Greenberg.

It'd be more like graduating from some random school, interning at the pizza shop, and then getting a columnist job at the Post.

I mean, this was a crazy move. If Syracuse is really that good a school, they shouldn't be hiring entry-level coaches. This is one of the most competitive fields in the country, the only people whose resumes should even get to Boeheim's desk should be guys who've coached for ten years at several different places and had some success at most of them.

If Boeheim wanted to do McNamara a solid, he should've moved him out after the GA year was up, put his name out there to a friends at a few low-level schools, and let him work his way around the country for years like every other coach in the business.

 

[OttoMets]

Exactly. Another highly rated recruit that was not evaluated correctly or just wasn't coached good enough.

Since more than one insider confidently said at the time that the staff had quit on Joseph before his sophomore year, I think there's something to that.

It's clear that player development has taken something of a back seat to manipulating the personnel to fit some Zone Ideal in the last years of the Boeheim era. I sympathize with his urgency, but it's a crappy way to run a sustainable program and there's a lot of collateral damage associated with it. There are hundreds of coaches out there who'd love to build a team with Roberson, Joseph, and B.J. Johnson.

 

[dasher]

1) GMac's not the closer/finisher, especially not for big recruits like Quade, Boeheim is. We're not going to win recruiting battles with UK and Duke. It's just not going to happen. As for the 'couple others', there wasn't much there. The NCAA's sanctions on the recruiting trail have hurt us more than any other part of the punishment, including the scholarship reductions.

2) Our guards aren't talented. You're asking him to mold poop into an artistic vase when it's ceiling is as a bowl for pooping in. Gillon is not suited to play at this level. He's a good midmajor guard whose strength is shooting but he can't get his shot off against the big boys. IDK what GMac is supposed to do with that. Howard will be a solid upperclassman for us, but he wasn't a particularly highly rated recruit out of high school and he has skill deficiencies that are killing him on top of the mental mistakes. Is not being able to dribble a ball against any level of defensive pressure GMac's fault or Howard's fault? I'd lean Howard. We've had worse rated recruits play better than Howard as sophomores but we've also had better rated recruits play worse. It happens. Battle's a freshman and exempted from the discussion because he's basically playing how most freshman play.

Exactly correct. The sanctions on recruiting have killed us. Other schools have 4 guys on the road when we have 2. And it sure didn't help that not only was jb away, Hop was away to. I have no doubt that Hop will hire a great recruiter when he is promoted. It won't be a loyalty pick. It will be a rainmaker.