gonna be tough to make the tourny

[gmoney44]

If this team makes the tournament I will consider the season a success. Unfortunately I don't think we make it.

 

[Newhouser]

I'm not sure next year is any better. You're losing your senior backcourt and replacing them with a freshman and likely a sophomore in Malachi who really isn't a good defender. Front court gets better, but games are won with good back courts.

the two close games we lost our experienced back court got out played in crunch time both times.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Just dont have the size or depth to win many of these acc games. I think we're gonna see alot of games like tonite, we'll hang around for awhile but just get worn down.

Blew a huge opportunity tonite, conference road wins are golden and this was there for us to take.

You can win the game being out rebounded if your best player plays well. He did not. He missed 5 free throws and 4 layups.

You guys keep bringing up the tournament after every game. I don't think 90 percent of the posters in this thread thought we would beat Pitt.

So now that we lost we aren't going to make the tournament?

Does that mean if we beat Miami, we are going to make the tournament?

I'm not trying to be a D*** here, but I don't understand how people say we had no shot against Pitt, then we lose, then we aren't going to make the tournament. (i'm not saying we are going to make the tournament necessarily) I mean we have had some of our best teams the past 15 years go into Pittsburgh and get blasted. The final four team went in there 3 years ago and Jeremi Grant got pushed around like he was 10 years old. In 2011, we had won about 18 in a row and went in there and fell behind like 18-0. Yesterday was probably the third best game we've played at the Pitt since 2000. That's how bad we play against them.

 

[pfister1]

I think many people are giving our back court way too much credit.

They are experienced no doubt. They are also both very good players in various ways, but imperfect as well. Neither is a great player. Cooney's biggest problems are that he is limited and inconsistent. G's biggest problem is he is being asked to play the point and he is not a point. He is an outstanding player, but not an outstanding guard. Neither one of our guards can get into the lane and make good things happen. When they do that all to often it results in a missed layup, foul, or turnover. I guess its compounded by the fact that DC and TR are having a lot of trouble finishing inside as well.

Both guys are working really hard to fulfill the roles they are being asked to play, I just don't think either guy is a Great guard.

I keep thinking that G would be 100% more effective at the small forward and the team a lot better with him there with a true point guard. Unfortunately we don't have that guy on the roster and ready to go, so G has to be the point guard.

As for next year. We shall see. I think Richardson will step in and replace Cooney. I am very confident that his shooting will improve and I love what I see from him getting into the lane and either finishing or getting fouled. Can Battle be the point, we'll see. If he is as good as his ratings, I'll take my chances. I think we'll be no worse at that position than this year. That's not to say he will give us the same stats as G, just that he'll do as good a job filling the lead guard role as G...some of G's stats will likely have to come from other sources.

 

[Noexcuse]

You can win the game being out rebounded if your best player plays well. He did not. He missed 5 free throws and 4 layups.

You guys keep bringing up the tournament after every game. I don't think 90 percent of the posters in this thread thought we would beat Pitt.

So now that we lost we aren't going to make the tournament?

Does that mean if we beat Miami, we are going to make the tournament?

I'm not trying to be a D*** here, but I don't understand how people say we had no shot against Pitt, then we lose, then we aren't going to make the tournament. (i'm not saying we are going to make the tournament necessarily) I mean we have had some of our best teams the past 15 years go into Pittsburgh and get blasted. The final four team went in there 3 years ago and Jeremi Grant got pushed around like he was 10 years old. In 2011, we had won about 18 in a row and went in there and fell behind like 18-0. Yesterday was probably the third best game we've played at the Pitt since 2000. That's how bad we play against them.

Short of winning or at least going deep in the ACC tournament, you have to make yourself a tournament worthy team by winning enough games in the regular season. I think people are saying it's going to be tough to get there. Whether it's Pitt, Miami or whoever, you still need the wins.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

You can win the game being out rebounded if your best player plays well. He did not. He missed 5 free throws and 4 layups.

This! Hindsight is always 20-20 but when he went 1-4 to start the game, I knew the FTs would come back to haunt us and that MG was gonna have an off night.

I'm not trying to be a D*** here, but I don't understand how people say we had no shot against Pitt, then we lose, then we aren't going to make the tournament. (i'm not saying we are going to make the tournament necessarily) I mean we have had some of our best teams the past 15 years go into Pittsburgh and get blasted. The final four team went in there 3 years ago and Jeremi Grant got pushed around like he was 10 years old. In 2011, we had won about 18 in a row and went in there and fell behind like 18-0. Yesterday was probably the third best game we've played at the Pitt since 2000. That's how bad we play against them.

Again, this!!!!! In spite of the struggle on the boards, and shitty FT shooting and at least 6 missed layups, we had Pitt on the ropes. Then Coleman fouled out and we had no answer. I look forward to playing them again in the dome...and I think we will beat Miami.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think many people are giving our back court way too much credit.

They are experienced no doubt. They are also both very good players in various ways, but imperfect as well. Neither is a great player. Cooney's biggest problems are that he is limited and inconsistent. G's biggest problem is he is being asked to play the point and he is not a point. He is an outstanding player, but not an outstanding guard. Neither one of our guards can get into the lane and make good things happen. When they do that all to often it results in a missed layup, foul, or turnover. I guess its compounded by the fact that DC and TR are having a lot of trouble finishing inside as well.

Both guys are working really hard to fulfill the roles they are being asked to play, I just don't think either guy is a Great guard.

I keep thinking that G would be 100% more effective at the small forward and the team a lot better with him there with a true point guard. Unfortunately we don't have that guy on the roster and ready to go, so G has to be the point guard.

As for next year. We shall see. I think Richardson will step in and replace Cooney. I am very confident that his shooting will improve and I love what I see from him getting into the lane and either finishing or getting fouled. Can Battle be the point, we'll see. If he is as good as his ratings, I'll take my chances. I think we'll be no worse at that position than this year. That's not to say he will give us the same stats as G, just that he'll do as good a job filling the lead guard role as G...some of G's stats will likely have to come from other sources.

Battle is not as good of a shooter as Gbinije.

Richardson is not as good of a shooter as Cooney.

You're underrating them.

If we are successful next year it is going to have to be using the MCW/Triche model, because teams are going to pack it in against us I'm afraid. We will be a better rebounding team next year, I'm not sure about offense or defense yet.

 

[pfister1]

Battle is not as good of a shooter as Gbinije.

Richardson is not as good of a shooter as Cooney.

You're underrating them.

If we are successful next year it is going to have to be using the MCW/Triche model, because teams are going to pack it in against us I'm afraid. We will be a better rebounding team next year, I'm not sure about offense or defense yet.

I think you are making a mistake to compare them player to player. You have to look at how they will fill roles within the team concept. And I also think you are wrong in saying Cooney is a better shooter than Richardson. I think Richardson will be as good a shooter as Cooney because he is going to be a much better overall scorer than Cooney. To me his shot looks good, he just needs some confidence. I think that will come...maybe not in time for this season, but I'd be shocked if we aren't seeing it next season.

I have no idea what kind of shooter Battle will be, but my hope is that he will be able to get to the rim and finish consistently. He can leave the shooting to others. For a team whose strength is supposed to be, no NEEDS to be, its outside shooting we are shooting a very pedestrian 35% from 3 and only 42% overall.

 

[cuseguy]

Moyer is going to make things interesting at small forward. It's a piece that will make us better.

I'm assuming Lydon is going to be playing a lot of minutes at the 3, if he does, how many does Moyer get at the 3?[/QUOTE]


Moyer will get minutes at the 3 and 4.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

I think you are making a mistake to compare them player to player. You have to look at how they will fill roles within the team concept. And I also think you are wrong in saying Cooney is a better shooter than Richardson. I think Richardson will be as good a shooter as Cooney because he is going to be a much better overall scorer than Cooney. To me his shot looks good, he just needs some confidence. I think that will come...maybe not in time for this season, but I'd be shocked if we aren't seeing it next season.

I have no idea what kind of shooter Battle will be, but my hope is that he will be able to get to the rim and finish consistently. He can leave the shooting to others. For a team whose strength is supposed to be, no NEEDS to be, its outside shooting we are shooting a very pedestrian 35% from 3 and only 42% overall.

and a horrible 67% from the FT line.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think you are making a mistake to compare them player to player. You have to look at how they will fill roles within the team concept. And I also think you are wrong in saying Cooney is a better shooter than Richardson. I think Richardson will be as good a shooter as Cooney because he is going to be a much better overall scorer than Cooney. To me his shot looks good, he just needs some confidence. I think that will come...maybe not in time for this season, but I'd be shocked if we aren't seeing it next season.

I have no idea what kind of shooter Battle will be, but my hope is that he will be able to get to the rim and finish consistently. He can leave the shooting to others. For a team whose strength is supposed to be, no NEEDS to be, its outside shooting we are shooting a very pedestrian 35% from 3 and only 42% overall.

That 35% from three is because Richardson is shooting 26%. He's made 6 more threes than Lydon on 51 more attempts.

Cooney is at 36%
Gbinije is at 44%
Lydon is at 46%

Battle does get to the rim. He's not a great shooter, but he's really good at everything else.
I'll be happy if Richardson can turn into Brandon Triche. Who was a good player, but not a great shooter. Defenses aren't keying on Richardson right now and he still misses open shots.

 

[pearl31]

You can win the game being out rebounded if your best player plays well. He did not. He missed 5 free throws and 4 layups.

You guys keep bringing up the tournament after every game. I don't think 90 percent of the posters in this thread thought we would beat Pitt.

So now that we lost we aren't going to make the tournament?

Does that mean if we beat Miami, we are going to make the tournament?

I'm not trying to be a D*** here, but I don't understand how people say we had no shot against Pitt, then we lose, then we aren't going to make the tournament. (i'm not saying we are going to make the tournament necessarily) I mean we have had some of our best teams the past 15 years go into Pittsburgh and get blasted. The final four team went in there 3 years ago and Jeremi Grant got pushed around like he was 10 years old. In 2011, we had won about 18 in a row and went in there and fell behind like 18-0. Yesterday was probably the third best game we've played at the Pitt since 2000. That's how bad we play against them.

exactly

 

[IthacaMatt]

and a horrible 67% from the FT line.

As a team, that's about par for us from the FT line. We've been as low as 60% as a team some years. THAT is horrible. I think that nationwide, the average is around 70% so we aren't that far off the mark.

 

[Brooky03]

We'll probably make the NCAAT. Prolly gonna win the ACC Tournament.

 

[Ghost]

I think many people are giving our back court way too much credit.

They are experienced no doubt. They are also both very good players in various ways, but imperfect as well. Neither is a great player. Cooney's biggest problems are that he is limited and inconsistent. G's biggest problem is he is being asked to play the point and he is not a point. He is an outstanding player, but not an outstanding guard. Neither one of our guards can get into the lane and make good things happen. When they do that all to often it results in a missed layup, foul, or turnover. I guess its compounded by the fact that DC and TR are having a lot of trouble finishing inside as well.

Both guys are working really hard to fulfill the roles they are being asked to play, I just don't think either guy is a Great guard.

I keep thinking that G would be 100% more effective at the small forward and the team a lot better with him there with a true point guard. Unfortunately we don't have that guy on the roster and ready to go, so G has to be the point guard.

As for next year. We shall see. I think Richardson will step in and replace Cooney. I am very confident that his shooting will improve and I love what I see from him getting into the lane and either finishing or getting fouled. Can Battle be the point, we'll see. If he is as good as his ratings, I'll take my chances. I think we'll be no worse at that position than this year. That's not to say he will give us the same stats as G, just that he'll do as good a job filling the lead guard role as G...some of G's stats will likely have to come from other sources.

I agree with most of that - I think people are giving too much weight to the simple fact that both of our starting guards are in their 5th year. I mean, one of those guys is essentially playing out of position. It's not like G is in his 5th year on the job at PG.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

As a team, that's about par for us from the FT line. We've been as low as 60% as a team some years. THAT is horrible. I think that nationwide, the average is around 70% so we aren't that far off the mark.

No...percentages are deceiving. When your best player misses 50% of his FTs that hurts.

 

[iommi]

I'm assuming Lydon is going to be playing a lot of minutes at the 3, if he does, how many does Moyer get at the 3?

Moyer will get minutes at the 3 and 4.[/QUOTE]

He will but Moyer's much better suited to play the 4 and most of his minutes should come at the expense of the disappointing Roberson. It is usually a rarity for a freshman to supplant a senior but that's probably what will happen to a great degree.

 

[Trueblue25]

Hard thinking Malachi and Lydon won't mature and turn into serious players. Think if we allow/get Kaleb or Franklin to contribute we'll have a 20 win team

 

[AZOrange]

We stll won't have a point guard next year.

Howard is a true PG and will start.

 

[AZOrange]

Moyer will get minutes at the 3 and 4.

He will but Moyer's much better suited to play the 4 and most of his minutes should come at the expense of the disappointing Roberson. It is usually a rarity for a freshman to supplant a senior but that's probably what will happen to a great degree.[/QUOTE]
I can't think of a player I've been more disappointed in than Tyler Roberson.

 

[Orangeblue2]

Tough pill to swallow with one of the top 5 guards in CBB, a senior guard along with him and 2 top flight freshmen but yup, I'll be surprised if we make the tourney. Hope I'm wrong but this team looks really mediocre due to our lack of size.

While MG has unique abilities and size for a guard, to say he is one of the the top 5 in CBB is a stretch. After all, FT shooting is of the utmost importance at the position and he comes up way short there.

 

[jsshap]

That'll be 3 straight years without a true PG.

It could also be 3 straight years without a tourney invite.

Anyone who actually does not think SU will make the tourney next year is officially part of the chicken little fraternity that makes this site so unpalatable after losses.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Howard is a true PG and will start.

You're half right. Frank is a true PG and I like his game. But Tyus Battle is an outstanding talent and will most likely be the starter, alongside King Mali.

 

[IthacaMatt]

He will but Moyer's much better suited to play the 4 and most of his minutes should come at the expense of the disappointing Roberson. It is usually a rarity for a freshman to supplant a senior but that's probably what will happen to a great degree.

I can't think of a player I've been more disappointed in than Tyler Roberson.[/QUOTE]


It's going to be a three forward rotation among them, probably with the minutes pretty evenly distributed. Matthew Moyer has a killer attitude and plays hard all the time. I think he's going to start, and it will come down to whether JB wants more offense and spacing at the beginning of the game, meaning that Lydon will start; or whether he wants more defense and rebounding, meaning Roberson will start. Roberson has to up his game / consistency, or it looks like he will be the third guy in the rotation. That leaves the question of whether Coleman returns or not. Right now, match him with Chukwu, and that's a very good pair of centers. If he leaves, we will again be thin at center and prone to foul trouble.

 

[pfister1]

That leaves the question of whether Coleman returns or not. Right now, match him with Chukwu, and that's a very good pair of centers. If he leaves, we will again be thin at center and prone to foul trouble.

I'm not asking this in a sarcastic fashion, but why would he leave? Based on what we are seeing so far this season I don't think he really has a prayer of playing professionally anywhere. Will he graduate after this season?