Grassroots effort to renew 44?

[FRANKIEFAN]

I think Floyd’s widow needs to be brought back to reality. She cannot logically argue that it should stay in retirement perpetually unless someone is an exemplary human being according to her own standard, but her grandson can also automatically have it. It comes across as selfish.

I mean she cares about Floyd more than SU which is obvious and there is nothing wrong with that. Its a little insensitive to be asking her about this when Floyd is being honored TBH.

If the grandson works hard for 3 years as a PWO its fine if he wears it as a senior regardless of performance. If he wants it sooner he'll have to drop a few 100+ yard big games.

 

[Cuseregular]

I sent an email to AD Wildhack last week and received a reply. In essence, they are going to consult with families, etc and nothing will be done mid-season. Nothing new but I appreciated the response.

It is kind of odd that a a number that we thought was made to be representative of our university as a whole...is actually not. Even more confusing were the comments made by Floyd's widow.

Now let me emphasize that, as a kid, Floyd was my second favorite sports hero behind Ernie Davis. I can still recall standing next to him for about 5 minutes when he visited my high school. Once I got to SU and came to view athletes as simply kids similar to everybody else, my days of having sports heroes ended.

That being said, Floyd's widow stating that whomever wore it should have the same character traits as Floyd, that it should go to his grandson and after that everything was fair game, etc...well, it left me with the feeling that The Legend of 44 had turned into The Legend of Floyd.

I'm kind of at the point where it wouldn't bother me if Sean kept his number and blazed his own trail. Joe Morris never wore 44, and although sadly his name is rarely really mentioned with Brown, Davis, and Little, he is our alltime leading rusher. Sean is on pace to better Joe's records so maybe he and his number should be the focus and not a number filled with politics. I hope he gets 44 but if he doesn't then #34 will become the new measuring stick for future Orange running backs.

well said bud

 

[David321]

I mean she cares about Floyd more than SU which is obvious and there is nothing wrong with that. Its a little insensitive to be asking her about this when Floyd is being honored TBH.

If the grandson works hard for 3 years as a PWO its fine if he wears it as a senior regardless of performance. If he wants it sooner he'll have to drop a few 100+ yard big games.

Agreed that she should care about her late husband more than SU and that they shouldn’t have asked her on that day. Good points. Still, her campaigning against Tucker is annoying.

 

[donniesyracuse]

Still, her campaigning against Tucker is annoying.

Is she campaigning or just answering questions?

 

[David321]

Is she campaigning or just answering questions?

The adamant way in which she answered seemed to indicate that she knew the question was coming and that she had rehearsed the answer. If that seems unfair, watch it again and tell me this isn’t a logical assumption. I doubt they sprung the question on her without warning, as that wouldn’t be fair to her.

 

[FrancoPizza]

It is kind of odd that a a number that we thought was made to be representative of our university as a whole...is actually not. Even more confusing were the comments made by Floyd's widow.

By odd you mean stupid and short-sighted.

By confusing you mean selfish.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Is she campaigning or just answering questions?

If she wants to campaign we'll give her a campaign to reckon with.

 

[donniesyracuse]

The adamant way in which she answered seemed to indicate that she knew the question was coming and that she had rehearsed the answer. If that seems unfair, watch it again and tell me this isn’t a logical assumption. I doubt they sprung the question on her without warning, as that wouldn’t be fair to her.

I don’t see that as campaigning.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I don’t see that as campaigning.

If nothing else it is obstructionist.

 

[David321]

I’m not saying that the woman is not entitled to her opinion, she certainly is. I simply don’t agree with it as I think her argumentation is inconsistent and view her words as selfish. She deserves respect but I think she is being given more say than is deserved. If she said that it was promised to be retired, end of story, I would respect her position a lot more.

 

[Chip]

I sent an email to AD Wildhack last week and received a reply. In essence, they are going to consult with families, etc and nothing will be done mid-season. Nothing new but I appreciated the response.

It is kind of odd that a a number that we thought was made to be representative of our university as a whole...is actually not. Even more confusing were the comments made by Floyd's widow.

Now let me emphasize that, as a kid, Floyd was my second favorite sports hero behind Ernie Davis. I can still recall standing next to him for about 5 minutes when he visited my high school. Once I got to SU and came to view athletes as simply kids similar to everybody else, my days of having sports heroes ended.

That being said, Floyd's widow stating that whomever wore it should have the same character traits as Floyd, that it should go to his grandson and after that everything was fair game, etc...well, it left me with the feeling that The Legend of 44 had turned into The Legend of Floyd.

I'm kind of at the point where it wouldn't bother me if Sean kept his number and blazed his own trail. Joe Morris never wore 44, and although sadly his name is rarely really mentioned with Brown, Davis, and Little, he is our alltime leading rusher. Sean is on pace to better Joe's records so maybe he and his number should be the focus and not a number filled with politics. I hope he gets 44 but if he doesn't then #34 will become the new measuring stick for future Orange running backs.

I'm with you. It's all just kind of weird, so let Sean do his thing as #34, and it's probably not worth my time anymore.

We'll always have the 2005 USF game.

Quick trivia, the Syracuse leading receiver on that unforgettable day where the 44 was retired was Alex Shor with 1 catch for 17 yards.

 

[Stevenson]

I'm in the minority, but the 44 mystique is a relic of the past. Its actually kind of embarrassing now when the TV games hype the Legend of 44. The last great to wear it was FL in the 60s. That's 50 years ago. Kind of puts an exclamation point on the fact that the program had been hot garbage for nearly a quarter century.

...and as a recruiting tool? 17 and 18 year old kids today don't even know who JB, ED and FL were...if they do, most probably think Jim Brown went to Newhouse and calls games for CBS...

unretire it, retire it...who cares. Just win games please.

 

[tep624]

It is my opinion, that once the decision is made by the university to retire the number it should stay retired. i understand the other point of view. I just don't agree with that point of view. Yes, it is true that all the SU numbers belong to the university.. My point is if they retire the number they should stick with that decision. If they just want a Ring of Honor and keep the number in play that is fine too. Just don't dilute the honor by unretiring a number and using it as a marketing ploy. As for Mr. Tucker, if he keeps doing what he is doing SU mat want to retire his 34 as well. No matter what number is on his back he is a very talented young man. We are lucky to be able to cheer for such a talent.

It was retired as a marketing ploy to begin with. I just find it odd to align yourself with a decision like that in the way it was done if you don't want the number used as a marketing ploy.

This is Gross at the time of retiring it:

“If there was ever a number that needed to be retired it is 44,” said SU Director of Athletics Dr. Daryl Gross in announcing the decision to honor those who have worn it. “If you can’t take 44 off the table, then you’re just never going to retire a jersey."'

So the reasoning to retire it is because...well...we needed to retire a number! No, Gross needed a press release to create some buzz in the program during GRob's inaugural season (Gross's first big decision as AD) while the program was 1-7 heading into a matchup with South Florida of all programs. Because we have such a legacy playing South Florida afterall.

 

[FAL]

I believe it should only be used with the consent of the living greats and/or their immediate family. Retiring a number is very significant. It should only be utilized when a player does things of enough significance to warrant a singular honor. I do not think it should be recycled without the ok of the living members. I can agree with an exception for Floyd Little's Grandson or a similar proginy

So it was ok to retire it without their consent?

 

[Dick_in_MI]

I'm with you. It's all just kind of weird, so let Sean do his thing as #34, and it's probably not worth my time anymore.

We'll always have the 2005 USF game.

Quick trivia, the Syracuse leading receiver on that unforgettable day where the 44 was retired was Alex Shor with 1 catch for 17 yards.

Well done, Chip. That may be the single most obscure piece of trivia that I have ever read on the board.

 

[Chip]

Well done, Chip. That may be the single most obscure piece of trivia that I have ever read on the board.

The catch was in the 2nd half. He was clearly inspired by the retirement ceremony.

 

[tep624]

The catch was in the 2nd half. He was clearly inspired by the retirement ceremony.

Speaking of Florida. here's a classic GRob here:

FBALL : SU recruiting departs Fla. for Northeast

Most college football coaches travel to the Sunshine State every year because Florida is widely considered one of the best places in the country to…

dailyorange.com

Might as well coin 2005 as the year the music died for the Syracuse football program. What a disaster.

 

[RandomGuy]

We need ottos army(or someone) to start a 44 chant, on Tucker TDs. I will wholeheartedly join in.

If someone happens to have a sign, "We want OUR # back. Tucker 44" ? Hard to complain, and its all MUCH more visible than a petition. (Which i also support) Announcers may even mention what 44 means, and that we want it back- for one of the best running backs in the nation.

Sometimes, if you want something done, you just have to do it yourself. Even if that's just repeated public displays of positive support, to push the beaurocracy to the same point of view.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I'm in the minority, but the 44 mystique is a relic of the past. Its actually kind of embarrassing now when the TV games hype the Legend of 44. The last great to wear it was FL in the 60s. That's 50 years ago. Kind of puts an exclamation point on the fact that the program had been hot garbage for nearly a quarter century.

...and as a recruiting tool? 17 and 18 year old kids today don't even know who JB, ED and FL were...if they do, most probably think Jim Brown went to Newhouse and calls games for CBS...

unretire it, retire it...who cares. Just win games please.

Right now it's a relic. But Tucker can bridge the old with the new and make it relevant again. We should be doing anything in our power to develop a recruiting asset. You want to "just win games"? It starts with recruiting playmakers.

 

[DoubleDee]

FYI: Brent Axe reached out to me to discuss the petition, as he’s working on an article.

 

[Jake]

Fan petitions always work!

The last one I recall was to the one to get Billy Edelin reinstated to the team in 2001.

 

[Cuse181]

I believe it should only be used with the consent of the living greats and/or their immediate family. Retiring a number is very significant. It should only be utilized when a player does things of enough significance to warrant a singular honor. I do not think it should be recycled without the ok of the living members. I can agree with an exception for Floyd Little's Grandson or a similar proginy

Nah, why should their opinion matter? They can be consulted in a symbolic way, but as to actually making the decision, especially if they are only a family member, no way. No one is saying they should walk out with “Little” or “Brown” on the back of the jersey. Not to mention what a waste the ring of 44 is if the number holds no significance anymore, might as well just call it the ring of honor.

 

[SUDadx2]

I hope Syracuse doesn't mess this up.

Sean Tucker is special, but he has only played in 16 games. And although he's on track to accomplish some great things and be one of the most accomplished running backs in Syracuse history, he hasn't done that yet. I suspect this is what Wildhack meant when he said it was too early for this decision. The athletic department has already spoken to the four principal families (Brown, Davis, Little and Konrad) so I have to believe Tucker will be given the opportunity to wear 44 after the season is completed. You don't reach out and initiate "powerful conversations" with those families unless you're giving serious consideration to assigning 44 to someone.

The conversations have started, the ground work is being laid, now its up to Tucker to finish this season with strong numbers.

By the time the Orange come home to play Pitt on Thanksgiving weekend Tucker could very likely be the all-time leader at Syracuse in rushing yards gained in a season (1372) and the number of 100 yard games in a season (7). Tucker would need to average 107 yards a game and have two 100 yard games over the next four games to accomplish this. All very possible.

What does the number 44 signify? Greatness? A great season or a great career?

Career	Games	Carries	Yards	Avg./Carry	TD’s	Yds/Game	Points	100 Yd Gms
Floyd Little	31	504	2,704	5.37	35	87.2	156	13
Ernie Davis	29	360	2,386	6.63	28	82.3	168	12
Jim Brown	24	361	2,091	5.79	24	87.1	144	11
Sean Tucker	16	292	1,574	5.39	13	98.3	78	9
Joe Morris*	37	813	4,299	5.29	25	116.2	150	22

* I added Joe Morris because his career numbers are outstanding. Joe Morris holds the records for rushing yards gained (season and career) and 100 yard rushing games (season and career).

Season	Games	Carries	Yards	Avg./Carry	TD’s	Yds/Game	Points	100 Yd Gms
Floyd Little	10	193	1,065	5.6*	14	106.5	84	5
Ernie Davis	10	150	877*	7.8*	12	82.3	72	6
Jim Brown	8	158	986	6.2	13	123.3	78	7
Sean Tucker	7	155	948	6.1	9	135.4	54	6
Joe Morris	11	238	1,372	5.8	10*	124.7	60*	7

* This stat was taken from a different season.

 

[baggerbob]

Nah, why should their opinion matter? They can be consulted in a symbolic way, but as to actually making the decision, especially if they are only a family member, no way. No one is saying they should walk out with “Little” or “Brown” on the back of the jersey. Not to mention what a waste the ring of 44 is if the number holds no significance anymore, might as well just call it the ring of honor.

It was an insult to the 3 great 44's to put the number up with no name, rather then honoring each individually, as we have with all the other football and basketball greats.
I would bet most of the fans from visiting teams couldn't tell you why the number with no name is up there.

 

[David321]

I hope Syracuse doesn't mess this up.

Sean Tucker is special, but he has only played in 16 games. And although he's on track to accomplish some great things and be one of the most accomplished running backs in Syracuse history, he hasn't done that yet. I suspect this is what Wildhack meant when he said it was too early for this decision. The athletic department has already spoken to the four principal families (Brown, Davis, Little and Konrad) so I have to believe Tucker will be given the opportunity to wear 44 after the season is completed. You don't reach out and initiate "powerful conversations" with those families unless you're giving serious consideration to assigning 44 to someone.

The conversations have started, the ground work is being laid, now its up to Tucker to finish this season with strong numbers.

By the time the Orange come home to play Pitt on Thanksgiving weekend Tucker could very likely be the all-time leader at Syracuse in rushing yards gained in a season (1372) and the number of 100 yard games in a season (7). Tucker would need to average 107 yards a game and have two 100 yard games over the next four games to accomplish this. All very possible.

What does the number 44 signify? Greatness? A great season or a great career?

Career	Games	Carries	Yards	Avg./Carry	TD’s	Yds/Game	Points	100 Yd Gms
Floyd Little	31	504	2,704	5.37	35	87.2	156	13
Ernie Davis	29	360	2,386	6.63	28	82.3	168	12
Jim Brown	24	361	2,091	5.79	24	87.1	144	11
Sean Tucker	16	292	1,574	5.39	13	98.3	78	9
Joe Morris*	37	813	4,299	5.29	25	116.2	150	22

* I added Joe Morris because his career numbers are outstanding. Joe Morris holds the records for rushing yards gained (season and career) and 100 yard rushing games (season and career).

Season	Games	Carries	Yards	Avg./Carry	TD’s	Yds/Game	Points	100 Yd Gms
Floyd Little	10	193	1,065	5.6*	14	106.5	84	5
Ernie Davis	10	150	877*	7.8*	12	82.3	72	6
Jim Brown	8	158	986	6.2	13	123.3	78	7
Sean Tucker	7	155	948	6.1	9	135.4	54	6
Joe Morris	11	238	1,372	5.8	10*	124.7	60*	7

* This stat was taken from a different season.

Man, thanks for putting in the work and breaking these stats down.