GT Postgame

[orangecuse]

We’re 15 games in and I think it’s time to admit that this team is bad. Individually, they might be talented but they aren’t a well constructed team whatsoever. That’s a Red problem of course, but I think a .500 ACC record is the absolute ceiling. Red continues to get out coached and the players get out hustled 30 minutes of every game. Idk why they seem to think they’re gods gift to basketball when they couldn’t even beat Hofstra and needed every minute to beat Monmouth, but yet here we are. They play with an ill-advised swagger and they refuse to compete when the ball ain’t going through the net.

In my opinion, this is clearly the result of the times. NIL, cough, cough (pay for play) is a significant contributing factor to this new paradigm in college semi-pro sports today. Imagine being an 18-20 something year old kid young adult today where just a few years earlier in your youth, 'what a wonderful world it would be' getting a full ride scholarship (and all that that entails) to a D1 program, let alone a P4 type one. However, in basically a blink of an eye, that dream is so "two thousand and late" type behavior. Nowadays, it's all about "show me the money" (7 figures in some instances) and the ensuing deep belief that it's very well deserved regardless whether the production numbers, etc. are there or not supporting such an MO.

 

[tbonezone]

Looking at the stats, we only took THREE 3 pointers in the 2nd half? And we even made two of them. Betsey’s 3 with a 11:29 left was the last 3 we attempted.

you are not going to win any tournament if you can't nail threes. that's the new reality .
has been for some time . good teams do it. bad teams miss and go home. .

 

[IthacaMatt]

The same people in here calling for perma-benching JJ were also in the game thread complimenting his play in the first half. He was attacking in the lane and also creating several looks as a passer. It really shows the psychology of "it is not how you start it's how you finish" since hardly anybody is even mentioning that now. JJ helped us build the first half lead in the first place. That is a factor in Red not giving him a quick hook in the second. And I do not buy the narrative that our offense/ball movement is far better with him off the court than with him on it. Our offense is a disorganized, iso-oriented mess, with no consistent sets or offball movement, and that is true with or without JJ on the court. It's still bigger than JJ y'all.

For the first 30 minutes last night, our offense was a thing of beauty. That was what it's supposed to look like. Constant movement, cuts everywhere, lob feeds, backdoor cuts. If you didn't see that, you don't really understand what plays look like when you see them.

 

[JustPherU]

Looking at the stats, we only took THREE 3 pointers in the 2nd half? And we even made two of them. Betsey’s 3 with a 11:29 left was the last 3 we attempted.

I get we aren’t a great shooting team, but, at least for this game, it must have helped, right? 7 for 19 up to that 11:29 point helped us get an 18 point lead. I’m not an offense guru, but from what I saw, offense was moving, guys were loose, and we were excelling. I can only assume it helped spread out GT’s defense for better looks inside and we got four of their players to 4 fouls.

Red even said in his pregame appearances that he wanted ball movement and to get better outside looks, in particular, for Kingz/Betsey.

But then we completely stop doing what was working for us for the last 10 minutes of the game?

Why coach?!

Ga Tech really upped the defense intensity once they made a couple threes and you could feel their energy level.

 

[CardiacCuse]

They ran so many sets, so much motion, so many staggered picks, back cuts, cross lane cuts. It was beautiful. They continued to play pretty good offense for the first 5 minutes or so of the 2nd half, increased the 14 point halftime lead to 20, and then they started getting sloppy with the ball, and thinking the game was already won.

Then GT's big guy Ndongo came back in and was unstoppable inside. For those who are asking, why didn't we try to foul him out, well did you watch the game? It got super physical for the last 12-15 minutes of the game, and GT got away with a lot of physical contact.

They had 4 big guys with 4 fouls with 9:15 to play, and somehow none of them fouled out.

first 2 acc games opposing centers have totally exposed kyle as insufficent at center...hes been invisible...clemson dominated the paint and ndongo abused him.

kyle is great vs cupcakes but not vs the big boys

and dont get me started on suuaore...5 fouls in 8 minutes vs gtech

whoever put this roster together totally whiffed at the center spot

 

[CardiacCuse]

For the first 30 minutes last night, our offense was a thing of beauty. That was what it's supposed to look like. Constant movement, cuts everywhere, lob feeds, backdoor cuts. If you didn't see that, you don't really understand what plays look like when you see them.

red doesnt know how to close a game out...teams ALWAYS whittle away any lead he has

wonder what he tells his guys at the ends of games,,...whatever it is ...needs to change

if W-L was all that mattered it would be fine...but margin of victory is important...and therefore, this weakness is huge

 

[CardiacCuse]

JJ can handle the ball under pressure.

umm what?

jj had about 5 horrible passes vs gtech...box score says he only had 2 TOs but i dont beleive that is accurate

 

[Orangezoo]

first 2 acc games opposing centers have totally exposed kyle as insufficent at center...hes been invisible...clemson dominated the paint and ndongo abused him.

kyle is great vs cupcakes but not vs the big boys

and dont get me started on suuaore...5 fouls in 8 minutes vs gtech

whoever put this roster together totally whiffed at the center spot

How many points did Ndongo have on turnovers/fast breaks? It’s like you don’t ever watch the games. Ndongo is a PF btw. Your non stop campaign about the center position is absurd. You make crap up half the time to boot despite the game tape often showing something else.

Guard play and coaching is the issue we have. Our front court and Kyle’s play is the strength. We out rebounded GT by 10. Our PG had 6 turnovers and our SG made a ton of bad plays late. Our coach made a number of questionable moves in the second half rotation.

Also what was Kyle’s stat line vs Houston, Kansas and Tennessee ( all without Donnie to help )? What position does Godfrey play
for Clemson( hint it’s not center)?

 

[Fly Rodder]

by AdjO and AdjD on Torvik, last night was SU's 3rd best offensive performance of the season (behind Northeastern and Hofstra) and their 7th best defensive effort, well behind Tennessee game and generally in line with average on the season of 90 to 100. A bit better than average, but not quite in that excellent tier yet.

 

[CardiacCuse]

Kiyan saying all the right things...but i dont get the impression hes happy w such a limited role in the 2nd half (and he shouldnt be!)

he scored 11 in the first half and played really well then didnt get much action in the 2nd(inexplicably w jj bricking all game long)

red needs to play the guys that play well...show that HOW they play gives them more minutes

reds subbing is so arbitrary and doesnt build positive reinforcement to his players

 

[Cusefan0307]

first 2 acc games opposing centers have totally exposed kyle as insufficent at center...hes been invisible...clemson dominated the paint and ndongo abused him.

kyle is great vs cupcakes but not vs the big boys

and dont get me started on suuaore...5 fouls in 8 minutes vs gtech

whoever put this roster together totally whiffed at the center spot

Looking at the box score Kyle was our second most effective player last night after Donnie. He only played 25 minutes. Some of that is on fouls and some on Red.

Defensively he was excellent as he has been all season. The goaltending they called him for was BS. Freemans shot getting blocked was more of a goaltend. He was less effective against Clemson, but most of that was on the offensive end of the court.

He was also great against Houston, Kansas and Tennessee earlier this year. There's no evidence he's just good against cupcakes.

I mean he had 10, 7, and 6 against Tennessee.
12, 10, 2 against Houston
9,9, and 2 against Kansas


I am concerned Red is going to utilize him less with Freeman back. We should play those two together. They are the strength of the team. He's our second best player.

 

[CardiacCuse]

How many points did Ndongo have on turnovers/fast breaks? It’s like you don’t ever watch the games. Ndongo is a PF btw. Your non stop campaign about the center position is absurd. You make crap up half the time to boot despite the game tape often showing something else.

Guard play and coaching is the issue we have. Our front court and Kyle’s play is the strength. We out rebounded GT by 10. Our PG had 6 turnovers and our SG made a ton of bad plays late. Our coach made a number of questionable moves in the second half rotation.

Also what was Kyle’s stat line vs Houston, Kansas and Tennessee ( all without Donnie to help )? What position does Godfrey play
for Clemson( hint it’s not center)?

GT lost bc they were 4-18 from 3...they couldnt shoot

if marshall hadnt gotten all those fouls he woulda put up a 20 spot too

Looking at the box score Kyle was our second most effective player last night after Donnie. He only played 25 minutes. Some of that is on fouls and some on Red.

Defensively he was excellent as he has been all seasons. The goaltending they called him for was BS. Freemans shot getting blocked was more of a goaltend. He was less effective against Clemson, but most of that was on the offensive end of the court.

He was also great against Houston, Kansas and Tennessee earlier this year. There's no evidence he's just good against cupcakes.

I mean he had 10, 7, and 6 against Tennessee.
12, 10, 2 against Houston
9,9, and 2 against Kansas


I am concerned Red is going to utilize him less with Freeman back. We should play those two together. They are the strength of the team. He's our second best player.

https://ramblinwreck.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/01/16_SYR_0106_Book.pdf

idk what you guys are watching but kyle was the ONLY SU player with a negative plus minus vs ga tech - he was invisible...traffic cone status in the paint...offered nothing on offense and put up very little fight on D

i suppose the wind is out of his sails a bit now that donnie is back and hes more in the background...but the team needs him to stay aggressive and proactive not just blend in like he has in the 1st 2 acc games - 2 of his absolute worst of the season

 

[SanDiegoCuse]

Why Why Why is it that every time JJ goes to the hoop he starts fading and makes the shot like 50% more difficult? Is he afraid of getting fouled? If that is the case, there is no way you can justify having him in at the end of the game.

The pre-determined substitution patterns are still killing me. I wish Red had a better feel for the game.

Nate George had a terrific first half but the second half was a disaster of over dribbling and awful passes. When games get tight he gets tight. You can't have that out of your PG.

Donnie was great, Kiyan had a terrific first half, I love the fact that they went to the hoop so much in the first half and drew fouls.

The moved the ball(and their bodies) so wonderfully in the first half. The last eight minutes of over dribbling and meandering without purpose was painful. Even why wife looked up and said, "Why aren't they moving anymore. They moved so much in the first half."

A double digit win on the road is never a bad thing but man...

 

[RedtheGOB]

first 2 acc games opposing centers have totally exposed kyle as insufficent at center...hes been invisible...clemson dominated the paint and ndongo abused him.

kyle is great vs cupcakes but not vs the big boys

and dont get me started on suuaore...5 fouls in 8 minutes vs gtech

whoever put this roster together totally whiffed at the center spot

What about his block at the end? Al’s Looks like we were even on boards with Clemson and +10 against GT.

 

[CardiacCuse]

What about his block at the end? Al’s Looks like we were even on boards with Clemson and +10 against GT.

clemson outscored su 46-26 in the paint...it was a bloodbath

i cant beleive you guys are defending this

 

[Timonen]

Kiyan saying all the right things...but i dont get the impression hes happy w such a limited role in the 2nd half (and he shouldnt be!)

he scored 11 in the first half and played really well then didnt get much action in the 2nd(inexplicably w jj bricking all game long)

red needs to play the guys that play well...show that HOW they play gives them more minutes

reds subbing is so arbitrary and doesnt build positive reinforcement to his players

This is a guess. Kiyan bit badly on a 3pt pump fake and got an immediate hook. I’m rationalizing but it *could* be that that was a specifically-coached scenario (maybe to him or maybe to all) where he and he’s being held accountable.

 

[CardiacCuse]

Why Why Why is it that every time JJ goes to the hoop he starts fading and makes the shot like 50% more difficult? Is he afraid of getting fouled? If that is the case, there is no way you can justify having him in at the end of the game.

The pre-determined substitution patterns are still killing me. I wish Red had a better feel for the game.

Nate George had a terrific first half but the second half was a disaster of over dribbling and awful passes. When games get tight he gets tight. You can't have that out of your PG.

Donnie was great, Kiyan had a terrific first half, I love the fact that they went to the hoop so much in the first half and drew fouls.

The moved the ball(and their bodies) so wonderfully in the first half. The last eight minutes of over dribbling and meandering without purpose was painful. Even why wife looked up and said, "Why aren't they moving anymore. They moved so much in the first half."

A double digit win on the road is never a bad thing but man...

its already been decided that JJ is the star of the team (with donnie)...thats not allowed to change!!!!

 

[DoctahLexus]

For the first 30 minutes last night, our offense was a thing of beauty. That was what it's supposed to look like. Constant movement, cuts everywhere, lob feeds, backdoor cuts. If you didn't see that, you don't really understand what plays look like when you see them.

When things were breaking down late, and for most of the season, it becomes more iso oriented. I think things looked a little better yesterday since our guards were not having too much trouble getting by theirs off the dribble compared to some other opponents. Donnie back has also helped us. Hope it continues, but you can't deny that a boatload of possessions this year have ended up reverting to unorganized hero ball.

 

[Eric15]

Why Why Why is it that every time JJ goes to the hoop he starts fading and makes the shot like 50% more difficult? Is he afraid of getting fouled? If that is the case, there is no way you can justify having him in at the end of the game.

I don't have any formal data to back this up, it's just my intuition, but I feel like JJ is way more effective when the attacks the rim north/south for short floaters. Whenever he takes those weird 45 degree angles, I always expect the worst and a likely run out on the other end.

 

[billsin01]

When things were breaking down late, and for most of the season, it becomes more iso oriented. I think things looked a little better yesterday since our guards were not having too much trouble getting by theirs off the dribble compared to some other opponents. Donnie back has also helped us. Hope it continues, but you can't deny that a boatload of possessions this year have ended up reverting to unorganized hero ball.

Yeah, I think it'll be worth watching to see if it becomes a pattern. We were able to win off the dribble a bunch but made some not great decisions with the ball. We had one trip where the lob was there and we didn't throw it (JJ or Nate, can't remember which) and then a possession or two later JJ threw the lob when he should have shot. Those things happen, but if you add those two to the JJ missed layup (again, that happens sometimes), that game probably stays in double-digits.

Need to give a bit of credit to GT for ramping up their pressure. ONe thing, when we're running that dribble handoff/weave motion, GT was overplaying that like crazy -- not pressuring Kyle when he had the ball and having their guards and wings overplay. The guys cutting off ball have to come off Kyle tight at the top and occasionally they could break it off and fade to the wing or cut to the middle so it's not so predictable.

Lastly, I think close games could be tough. When it comes to creating a good look we have limited options. JJ on a straightline drive, George getting something going off the dribble ... Not a lot to be honest. Kiyan is probably our best option there due to the variety of ways he can get buckets. But he's a frosh and has some defensive questions. So, anyway, might be tough for us to close out games.

 

[tbonezone]

kyle is great vs cupcakes but not vs the big boys

kyle held his own in vegas without donnie. is he smaller yes. but don't write him off yet.

 

[RedtheGOB]

clemson outscored su 46-26 in the paint...it was a bloodbath

i cant beleive you guys are defending this

just cherry picking random stats the same as you are. Kyle and the frontcourt with Donnie back are by far the least of our worries.

 

[Forza Azzurri]

At the 9:16 mark of the second half, we were up 18 at 69-51.

From that point, we went:

1-7 from the field (JJ 1-3; Freeman 0-3; Kyle 0-2)
1-2 from the line (Kyle)
5 turnovers (Kingz 3; Freeman 1; George 1)

Until it was 72-67 at the 3:26 mark.

Ouch.

 

[Cusefan0307]

GT lost bc they were 4-18 from 3...they couldnt shoot

if marshall hadnt gotten all those fouls he woulda put up a 20 spot too

https://ramblinwreck.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/01/16_SYR_0106_Book.pdf

idk what you guys are watching but kyle was the ONLY SU player with a negative plus minus vs ga tech - he was invisible...traffic cone status in the paint...offered nothing on offense and put up very little fight on D

i suppose the wind is out of his sails a bit now that donnie is back and hes more in the background...but the team needs him to stay aggressive and proactive not just blend in like he has in the 1st 2 acc games - 2 of his absolute worst of the season

You do realize that's because when he was in as GT was cutting into our lead the perimeter players kept turning it over or missing shots. The loss of the lead had nothing to do with him.

 

[IthacaMatt]

first 2 acc games opposing centers have totally exposed kyle as insufficent at center...hes been invisible...clemson dominated the paint and ndongo abused him.

kyle is great vs cupcakes but not vs the big boys

and dont get me started on suuaore...5 fouls in 8 minutes vs gtech

whoever put this roster together totally whiffed at the center spot

Eh, an exaggeration. Kyle is only about 6-7, but he's the 2nd leading shot blocker in the country.
He doesn't have the bulk to defend a 240-250 lb guy in the low post, but we recognized that and Donnie frequently doubled Ngongo in the 2nd half.

So, they tried to address that. But he had 3 blocks, at least, and close to 10 rebounds again. So it's not like he was a total liability. He is who he is. That's why I'm glad we have Soare as his back up. He plays pretty good defense, is pretty physical, and blocks shots, too. And he's a legit 6-9.

It would be nice if Diawara was able to play a 4 minute shift, because he's about 240. But having Sadiq White as a backup big is a pretty good option. Betsey has some bulk about him, too. We have 4+ big guys who can contribute. That's pretty good. I think this team is primed for a run, if everybody stays healthy and keeps their heads screwed on right.