Harold Baines | Syracusefan.com

Harold Baines

br801 said:
How did that happen? At no time during his career did it ever cross my mind that he might be even remotely HoF-worthy.
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We have threads discussing this.
 
KaiserUEO said:
We have threads discussing this.
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Sorry, I expected to see one devoted to this. I'll let one of the mods delete this one.
 
br801 said:
How did that happen? At no time during his career did it ever cross my mind that he might be even remotely HoF-worthy.
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Even Harold himself was shocked when he got the call if you read some of the articles. The one good thing about it is my guy Fred McGriff still has a chance now.
 
MSOrange said:
Even Harold himself was shocked when he got the call if you read some of the articles. The one good thing about it is my guy Fred McGriff still has a chance now.
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I thought the days of small committees packed with cronies putting their guys through was a thing of the past. The worst part of this is that there are hundreds of marginal HoF candidates out there with better cases than could be made for Baines.
 
cleveland's joe joe charboneau, detroit mark the bird fidrytch. detroit. ron leflore. all as worthy.
there are many good players in their time . the hall should be reserved for legends of the game.
 
Kirk Gibson is another one that deserves to be in now.
 
Very good for a very long time but I don't really care. You played 22 years and couldn't get 3,000 hits?? 100 RBI just 3 times?? 25 or more HR twice??

It's the hall of fame. It is not the hall of good-for-a-long-time.
 
At one point the HOF question with Baines was if he did somehow did get to 3000 hits, would he be the first player to possibly not get in.

He didn't even get 3000 hits and he got in. Scratch my head.

Last year the committee made a great pick in allowing Alan Trammell into the Hall. He should have been in on the regular ballot. This pick ... not so good.
 
UnknownOrange said:
Very good for a very long time but I don't really care. You played 22 years and couldn't get 3,000 hits?? 100 RBI just 3 times?? 25 or more HR twice??

It's the hall of fame. It is not the hall of good-for-a-long-time.
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He did play his best in the 80s which was much more of a defensive ERA than anything since then (except for 1987). But WAR stabilizes for era, and his career WAR of 38.7 is very underwhelming.

He was a mild elite star for about 4 years, where he was 9th to 20th in MVP voting with Chicago from 1982-1085. But that was it... he needed to have a longer sustained period at that level or a much higher peak.

Not even close to a hall of famer. Who is next? Julio Franco?

Al Oliver has a better case for long time fans (he has a special place in my heart as "Scoop", as 1982 is when I really started to get into baseball and he won the batting title with the Expos.

Oliver had 2743 hits over 18 years, was in the top 10 in MVP voting 3 times, and in the top 16 8 times. Also had a WAR of 44. Not saying either deserves to be in, but Al was much more deserving than him.
 
jncuse said:
He did play his best in the 80s which was much more of a defensive ERA than anything since then (except for 1987). But WAR stabilizes for era, and his career WAR of 38.7 is very underwhelming.

He was a mild elite star for about 4 years, where he was 9th to 20th in MVP voting with Chicago from 1982-1085. But that was it... he needed to have a longer sustained period at that level or a much higher peak.

Not even close to a hall of famer. Who is next? Julio Franco?

Al Oliver has a better case for long time fans (he has a special place in my heart as "Scoop", as 1982 is when I really started to get into baseball and he won the batting title with the Expos.

Oliver had 2743 hits over 18 years, was in the top 10 in MVP voting 3 times, and in the top 16 8 times. Also had a WAR of 44. Not saying either deserves to be in, but Al was much more deserving than him.
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Oliver's long-time Pirate teammate Dave Parker has a similarly good case for induction.

One of the real glaring omissions for me is Gil Hodges, who had consistently elite power numbers playing in a pitching-dominated era and was one of the best fielding first baseman of any era.
 
br801 said:
Oliver's long-time Pirate teammate Dave Parker has a similarly good case for induction.

One of the real glaring omissions for me is Gil Hodges, who had consistently elite power numbers playing in a pitching-dominated era and was one of the best fielding first baseman of any era.
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Yes, Dave Parker too. Parker did not have the longevity of an Oliver or a Baines, but he was the best player in baseball for a couple year period. And being a top 2 or 3 player, even for a short time, means alot to me.

Parker, like Tim Raines, had the Cocaine Era issues in the early 80s hurt his chances.
 
I will give Dwight Evens the call that he is going to be in the Hall of Fame. 8 gold gloves and 385 HR's. And Luis Tiant, who has stats that are exactly like Jim Hunters, I mean exactly, gets my next call
 
dasher said:
I will give Dwight Evens the call that he is going to be in the Hall of Fame. 8 gold gloves and 385 HR's. And Luis Tiant, who has stats that are exactly like Jim Hunters, I mean exactly, gets my next call
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Tiant isn’t exactly like Hunter.

Catfish won 20 games 5x straight, has a Cy Young and finished top 5 3 other times.

And 5 WS rings.

Dewey was better than Baines but not those 2 Yankees.
 
KaiserUEO said:
Tiant isn’t exactly like Hunter.

Catfish won 20 games 5x straight, has a Cy Young and finished top 5 3 other times.

And 5 WS rings.

Dewey was better than Baines but not those 2 Yankees.
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Well, let's see. Hunter had a 224 wins 166 losses. Tiant had 229 wins 172 losses seems the same to me
Hunter had a career era of 3.26 Tiant had a career era of 3.30 seems the same to me
Hunter had 3449.1 innings Tiant had 3486.1 innings seems the same to me
Hunter had a carreer k's of 2012 and career walks of 954 Tiant had 2416 k's and 1104 walks seems the same to me
Hunter gave up 374 HR's Tiant gave up 346 Seems the same to me
Hunter did we 20 5 times tiant won 20 4 times wow.
Hunter had 181 complete games Tiant had 187 Seems the same to me
Hunter pitched for better teams. When given the chance, Tiant was great in big games. He shut out the big red machine in the '75 world series.
As I said, their stats are the same.
 
Now lets talk about Thurman, Donnie and Dewey
HR's Evans 385 Mattingly 222 Munson 113
RBI's Evans 1384 Mattingly 1099 Munson 701
Average Mattingly .307 Munson .292 Evans .272
Gold gloves Mattingly 9, Evans 8, Munson 3
truth is, none are Hall of Famers. except in the ridiculous world we seem to find ourselves in today.
 
dasher said:
Now lets talk about Thurman, Donnie and Dewey
HR's Evans 385 Mattingly 222 Munson 113
RBI's Evans 1384 Mattingly 1099 Munson 701
Average Mattingly .307 Munson .292 Evans .272
Gold gloves Mattingly 9, Evans 8, Munson 3
truth is, none are Hall of Famers. except in the ridiculous world we seem to find ourselves in today.
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Oh i agree.

Catfish, Donnie and Thurm had higher highs and awards, but careers, hunter not so much...but we on same page.

Participation trophy’s have no place in Cooperstown.

But if we letting in the average compilers...then the ‘high peak and over in a blink’ guys need their spot too.
 
I know this latest "Veterans" committee is meant to bring in players around the 80s which were initially overlooked -- which makes me feel old.

Any of their picks would have felt a bit "Weak". But if I had to make one pick I probably would have went with Dale Murphy.
 
dasher said:
Now lets talk about Thurman, Donnie and Dewey
HR's Evans 385 Mattingly 222 Munson 113
RBI's Evans 1384 Mattingly 1099 Munson 701
Average Mattingly .307 Munson .292 Evans .272
Gold gloves Mattingly 9, Evans 8, Munson 3
truth is, none are Hall of Famers. except in the ridiculous world we seem to find ourselves in today.
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I could be talked into Evans, due to his incredible defense. Mattingly was good with the glove as well, but Evans took away bases and base runners, and ultimately, runs.
 
dasher said:
Well, let's see. Hunter had a 224 wins 166 losses. Tiant had 229 wins 172 losses seems the same to me
Hunter had a career era of 3.26 Tiant had a career era of 3.30 seems the same to me
Hunter had 3449.1 innings Tiant had 3486.1 innings seems the same to me
Hunter had a carreer k's of 2012 and career walks of 954 Tiant had 2416 k's and 1104 walks seems the same to me
Hunter gave up 374 HR's Tiant gave up 346 Seems the same to me
Hunter did we 20 5 times tiant won 20 4 times wow.
Hunter had 181 complete games Tiant had 187 Seems the same to me
Hunter pitched for better teams. When given the chance, Tiant was great in big games. He shut out the big red machine in the '75 world series.
As I said, their stats are the same.
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