Have you ever been fired?

[SWC75]

Or demoted? I haven't, (although it was threatened at one point). I've never had to do it to somebody else. In Moneyball, Brad Pitt, (as Billy Beane), says you should do it quickly and firmly, without sentiment. George MacDonald is upset that it was done over the telephone. Does that matter?

Is there a best way to fire somebody?

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Working in HR I can tell you - quick and decisive is best for a firing. This situation is so different though. these guys are/were so "close" I do not even believe the words fired or demoted came out of Shafers mouth.

I think it was to be a switch, internally that could have allowed for McDonald to walk at the end of the year or take the reigns back over if it didn't work. Look at it like this.

Guy gets sales manager job because of his sales prowess.
Guy cant motivate team, manage sales force to sell like him so team suffers.
Friend/Boss says listen lets get you back on the road to make money for organization and we will hire promote someone to do the internal managing of the sales force while you manage the sales process and train them.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I got a phone call from my boss once that the company was ceasing operations in 7 days, and he wanted to tell me before I got a call from someone else.

Not really the same as being fired.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Hire slow, Fire quick.

 

[jekelish]

The movie Up in the Air covers this pretty well, I think (I assume the book does as well, but I've never read it). It's basically the same message as in Moneyball - quick and decisive, don't drag your feet, let them know "This is what's happening, here is some information on how we can help you move on from this point, thank you for your service" and that's about it.

 

[SWC75]

Working in HR I can tell you - quick and decisive is best for a firing. This situation is so different though. these guys are/were so "close" I do not even believe the words fired or demoted came out of Shafers mouth.

I think it was to be a switch, internally that could have allowed for McDonald to walk at the end of the year or take the reigns back over if it didn't work. Look at it like this.

Guy gets sales manager job because of his sales prowess.
Guy cant motivate team, manage sales force to sell like him so team suffers.
Friend/Boss says listen lets get you back on the road to make money for organization and we will hire promote someone to do the internal managing of the sales force while you manage the sales process and train them.

The term"promoted to your level of incompetence" comes to mind.

 

[RandygoCuse]

Or demoted? I haven't, (although it was threatened at one point). I've never had to do it to somebody else. In Moneyball, Brad Pitt, (as Billy Beane), says you should do it quickly and firmly, without sentiment. George MacDonald is upset that it was done over the telephone. Does that matter?

Is there a best way to fire somebody?

Like @HeaterCus22 I have worked in HR. Agree that quickly and firmly is the way to go - The best advice I saw was be clear, concise, and gone. It probably wasn't best to do it by phone (we've had to do it that way in the past when the employee called in sick and we needed them gone ASAP), but I don't think that excuses what McDonald did. He should have known it would cause a distraction and take away attention from what the team is trying to do - and from what I saw in the video, it didn't look like a spur of the moment thing. It seemed calculated.

 

[JoeSU]

Or demoted? I haven't, (although it was threatened at one point). I've never had to do it to somebody else. In Moneyball, Brad Pitt, (as Billy Beane), says you should do it quickly and firmly, without sentiment. George MacDonald is upset that it was done over the telephone. Does that matter?

Is there a best way to fire somebody?

I wonder about the circumstances surrounding the phone call. It doesn't seem like Shafer's style. Was one of them out of town? If so, was Shafer anxious to make the change to provide Lester with the maximum amount of time to prepare for FSU?
At least it wasn't done with an email.

 

[PhatOrange]

phone call is pretty lame if that's 'actually' how it went down.

 

[jgeorge322]

Or demoted? I haven't, (although it was threatened at one point). I've never had to do it to somebody else. In Moneyball, Brad Pitt, (as Billy Beane), says you should do it quickly and firmly, without sentiment. George MacDonald is upset that it was done over the telephone. Does that matter?

Is there a best way to fire somebody?

the difference is these coaches have a long history and it seems like their families are close.

 

[OrangeinBoston]

phone call is pretty lame if that's 'actually' how it went down.

Lame? That's nothing. The last time I got fired, I was CCd on an email!

 

[HeaterCuse22]

The term"promoted to your level of incompetence" comes to mind.

Yes I think that is the point and how I would rephrase in business as well.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Like @HeaterCus22 I have worked in HR. Agree that quickly and firmly is the way to go - The best advice I saw was be clear, concise, and gone. It probably wasn't best to do it by phone (we've had to do it that way in the past when the employee called in sick and we needed them gone ASAP), but I don't think that excuses what McDonald did. He should have known it would cause a distraction and take away attention from what the team is trying to do - and from what I saw in the video, it didn't look like a spur of the moment thing. It seemed calculated.

Here is another thing. When any of you are getting fired your HR and IT people have cut off your internal communication lines (emails phones etc). To make this move, then allow him to actually speak into a microphone is on Coach, Gross, Sue and Joe. CTO could probably walk you down this how to deal with public thing better.

Example: A guy I know was fired at my last organization (different business unit than my HR responsibility). Email was not turned of inadvertenly. The gentlemen spent the next night sending emails via company account to several customers and employees. Bad, bad, Bad.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

phone call is pretty lame if that's 'actually' how it went down.

Stephen Bailey ‏@Stephen_Bailey1
Shafer says he did not tell McDonald that he was demoted over the phone.

 

[RandygoCuse]

Here is another thing. When any of you are getting fired your HR and IT people have cut off your internal communication lines (emails phones etc). To make this move, then allow him to actually speak into a microphone is on Coach, Gross, Sue and Joe. CTO could probably walk you down this how to deal with public thing better.

Example: A guy I know was fired at my last organization (different business unit than my HR responsibility). Email was not turned of inadvertenly. The gentlemen spent the next night sending emails via company account to several customers and employees. Bad, bad, Bad.

Do you think it's trickier to do that when they've been demoted. It might look worse if the media finds out they aren't letting him talk (although there are probably more discreet ways of doing this). I'd love to have cto weigh in.

 

[Finwad32]

Stephen Bailey ‏@Stephen_Bailey1
Shafer says he did not tell McDonald that he was demoted over the phone.

Not even necessary to explain IMO. Shafer's text that said they're unified and moving forward together was all that mattered and needed. Holy crap I seriously hope we're not going to receive another set of answers trickling in to each of GM's statements.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Do you think it's trickier to do that when they've been demoted. It might look worse if the media finds out they aren't letting him talk (although there are probably more discreet ways of doing this). I'd love to have cto weigh in.

Well they could have had a prepared statement, he was now the WR coach. Do we often have mid season media sessions with the WR coach? It wasn't quiet last night though. CTO could walk it down.

 

[sutomcat]

Stephen Bailey ‏@Stephen_Bailey1
Shafer says he did not tell McDonald that he was demoted over the phone.

How much uglier can it get? In a situation like this, I know who I believe. Maybe McDonald has decided he wants to get fired and is pressing forward to make it happen?

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Here is another thing. When any of you are getting fired your HR and IT people have cut off your internal communication lines (emails phones etc). To make this move, then allow him to actually speak into a microphone is on Coach, Gross, Sue and Joe. CTO could probably walk you down this how to deal with public thing better.

Example: A guy I know was fired at my last organization (different business unit than my HR responsibility). Email was not turned of inadvertenly. The gentlemen spent the next night sending emails via company account to several customers and employees. Bad, bad, Bad.

Shut it down, 10 minutes later you fire face to face with witness, 2 minutes to gather personal belongings, no more and walk them to the door, send the rest of their personal stuff they forgot home in a box that afternoon, by the time the shock wears off they have everything they need. Tell staff at end of day and move on business as usual next day, depending on what level, usually takes 2-3 days to hear from their attorney, where you then forward to yours and move on business as usual. Everybody is wronged when they are fired, everybody, never their fault. Insurance always a good idea here as well.

 

[Pyle]

I got fired once. I was 17, senior in HS, worked at BK Sunday mornings. Had to be to work at 6am. Needless to say I called in more than I should. One day I called to get my schedule, that managers says to me 'You're not on it'. I said 'Thanks' and turned in my uniform the next day. I hated that job.

 

[Chip]

Stephen Bailey ‏@Stephen_Bailey1
Shafer says he did not tell McDonald that he was demoted over the phone.

He said/she said. This is awesome.

I think he tweeted him about his demotion.

 

[javadoc]

As I am not a clay pot from art class, the answer is no.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

He said/she said. This is awesome.

I think he tweeted him about his demotion.

Actually, I think he read about his demotion on the pay side.

 

[CuseTroop]

I was a busboy at a restaurant in Watkins Glen for a summer, Bartended on the dinner cruise boat. Showed up for work one day with two black eyes and a broken nose. Eyes pretty much swelled shut. They send me home and told me to call them back in a week, and when I did, I was no longer on the schedule.

 

[orangeinjersey]

I have never been fired. Have always been told I was smart, engaging, and personable engineer. After 8 years with the same group of folks (company was aquired once during that time) I decided this past May it was time for a change. I have 10 years of expereince. I put some feelers out around memorial day, I was feeling confident and knew i could "pick" my next job. I declined two offers before actually agreeing to the terms of a third offer in mid august. A month in, so far so good.

That being said, lets say I get canned in a year or so, that would be a pretty big hit to my ego. My confidence would be hurt and I would def be upset. I can understand why GMac was upset. He was "an up and comer, the rising star". He was shown the door after 20 months of very subpar results. You can quantify his results, they haven't been good. I can see why he is upset. I would be as well.