If ACC looked like this...what would you say

[arbitragegls]

Well if the ACC does not survive the FSU exploits and a few other teams choose to leave also like Clemson, NCstate, Georgia Tech joining either the Big 12 or SEC...what would the ACC probably look at. This blog gives a hint and frankly I like it. Two facts that come out of this are...
1. Louisville is only school outside the Top 75--actually gives better academic standing since there are four out of the Top 75 now
2. According to most analysis, if this happens, the ACC will own NYC...with over 40% share of population having a team in the ACC
3. Of course ND is the key here

Of course we have to GET OVER Rutgirls and Uconn being in the conference, but that is not such a bad thing...and ND comes on board (many articles that if and when ND joins a conference it will be the ACC--now if we get ND before FSU and others leave...we probably add ND and one other and remain quite stable for a very long time.

A quick look at divisions:
North: Boston College, Connecticut, Maryland, Notre Dame, Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Syracuse
South: Duke, Louisville, MIami (FL), North Carolina, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest

http://atlanticcoastconvos.com/2012...e-acc-are-safe-from-the-big-12-florida-state/

How do you feel about this?

 

[OrangePA]

Sorry.

I personally have no interest in this topic.

I do not believe that FSU is going anywhere.

 

[kingottoiii]

Sorry.

I personally have no interest in this topic.

I do not believe that FSU is going anywhere.

I think this will end up being like the Texas/OU to P12 talk. I think if the B12 agreed to FSU's terms that they would be gone. However I do not think that will happen and FSU will end up staying. As to the rest of the scenario above, a lot of those assumptions would never happen so why play along?

 

[44PRIDE]

Sorry.

I personally have no interest in this topic.

I do not believe that FSU is going anywhere.

+1
I believe cooler heads have prevailed in Tallahassee. FSU has very publicly made the point that the ACC is too Carolina-centric...and I believe they've finally been heard by Tobacco Road.

All the moves to date made sense. Nebraska to B1G...Mizzou & aTm to the SEC... SU & Pitt to the ACC...and even Colorado to the Pac12 are understandable upgrades. For any Tier 1 program to jump into the B12 (having seen the level of instability there) simply makes no sense.

 

[44PRIDE]

Outside of Notre Dame, all remaining moves will be tier 2 and below schools shuffling positions.

My honest feeling is the next big move is the dissolution of the Big East...following the departure of Louisville. This would be followed up by the Notre Dame sweepstakes.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I think this will end up being like the Texas/OU to P12 talk. I think if the B12 agreed to FSU's terms that they would be gone. However I do not think that will happen and FSU will end up staying. As to the rest of the scenario above, a lot of those assumptions would never happen so why play along?

For FSU to go, Texas for starters would have to give up its preferential treatment relative to the rest of the conference. Fla State would never stand for being a second class citizen in Texas' league, and losing all its southern football rivals to boot.

 

[kingottoiii]

For FSU to go, Texas for starters would have to give up its preferential treatment relative to the rest of the conference. Fla State would never stand for being a second class citizen in Texas' league, and losing all its southern football rivals to boot.

What preferential treatment does Texas currently have? They now share TV $ when under the old contract the didn't. That is why the B12 was able to stay together and will be stable the next 15 years.

 

[44PRIDE]

What preferential treatment does Texas currently have? They now share TV $ when under the old contract the didn't. That is why the B12 was able to stay together and will be stable the next 15 years.

They were allowed to have their own network whose profits they didn't have to share with the rest of the league. And I don't believe it's an even revenue split either.

 

[IthacaMatt]

What preferential treatment does Texas currently have? They now share TV $ when under the old contract the didn't. That is why the B12 was able to stay together and will be stable the next 15 years.

They don't share any of the Longhorn Network money. I know that for sure. And I am pretty sure that it is not an even-share league. I keep hearing that over and over in the media in following all of this.

Here are a couple links that indicate that the league sets aside around half of its revenue for equal distribution, and the other half gets distributed based on TV appearances (which Texas would obviously get more than anyone else). There may also be a ratings factor involved - or at least national TV vs. regional.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/article.aspx?articleid=20111002_92_B1_Equalr807124

http://www.turfburner.com/the-feed/item/485-looking-at-the-big-12s-revenue-distribution

 

[Guinness]

Of all people Bobby Bowden said it best this week. I am paraphrasing but basically he asked why FSU would the want to go to the B12 or SEC to compete for a national title when they cannot even win the weak ACC.

 

[Van111]

Makes more sense that Louisville, Boise and/or Cincinatti may get invites elsewhere, most likly Big 12. I highly dought anyone leaves the ACC, which will become a dominating conference in all sports. Notre Dame is the clear team that evrey conference wants, but being who they are, they will tease everyone and do what they want. Only way anything major happens is if evreyone decides to go to 16 team leagues, otherwise it is just posturing and conferences like C-USA and the Big WEast that will be at the center of it all. Now, if ND opts to go to the B1G, now your talking a major move that might start an avalanche of moves.

 

[OrangeChris]

I have zero interest in being in a conference with Rutgers again. It obviously helps Syracuse if recruits perceive other Northeastern teams to be in "lesser" conferences (which the vast majority most assuredly are). Also, as a fan of a strong ACC I wouldn't want Rutgers either. They've won exactly zero Big East football championships, zero Big East basketball championships (regular season or tournament), and zero Big East lacrosse championships. Heck, they haven't won a Big East championship in ANYTHING in five years (seriously, look it up)!!! I get the whole, "but they're a sleeping giant!" sentiment. OK, fine, but how about we wait until they wake up first? They're not going anywhere... oh wait, I forgot that Big 10 invite is coming any day now.

 

[Admiral Koga]

What preferential treatment does Texas currently have? They now share TV $ when under the old contract the didn't. That is why the B12 was able to stay together and will be stable the next 15 years.

See, this is where the devil may be hiding. It doesn't seem like it is all that 'Texas-centric' at the moment. What if, say three years from now, the LHN is allowed to broadcast HS games? Why has the Big12 able to stay together? Basically giving Texas what it wanted.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I have zero interest in being in a conference with Rutgers again. It obviously helps Syracuse if recruits perceive other Northeastern teams to be in "lesser" conferences (which the vast majority most assuredly are). Also, as a fan of a strong ACC I wouldn't want Rutgers either. They've won exactly zero Big East football championships, zero Big East basketball championships (regular season or tournament), and zero Big East lacrosse championships. Heck, they haven't won a Big East championship in ANYTHING in five years (seriously, look it up)!!! I get the whole, "but they're a sleeping giant!" sentiment. OK, fine, but how about we wait until they wake up first? They're not going anywhere... oh wait, I forgot that Big 10 invite is coming any day now.

I totally agree, as should any sane SU fan. Some on here want to be in an all sports league with UConn, but they are only a decade removed from 1-AA football, and as much as they are a rival in hoops, their football doesn't get our fans excited at all, and their success is at least indirectly at our expense, as is the case with Rutgers.

Having Pasqualoni coaching them is almost like we sent them a trojan horse to set back their program, provided Dougie can get it done here, and turn us into a team that wins at least 8 or 9 games a year again.

As much as we thought he was a crappy coach, Rutgers IS worse off with Schiano having left. Hopefully they fall down this year, too, and give us some breathing room. If we do not make a bowl this year, and Doug doesn't get some momentum going, I'm afraid we will never recover to the quality of the McNabb years.

But if we can get to a bowl again this year, and keep some momentum going in the ACC (which is not unreasonable), then yes, Rutgers and UConn will eventually be perceived to be in the lesser league, and they will go the way of Atlantic 10 hoops teams who once used to be powers.

 

[HtownOrange]

The Big 12 agreed to shared revenue last fall.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/football/ncaa/10/03/Big.12.revenue.ap/index.html

The LHN is a boon for Texas. OU has TV deal and makes $5MM or more. The conference money is split evenly going forward.

Still, nobody has explained why FSU would want to join a conference that split apart the Southwest Conference relegating four rivals to CUSA; chased away Arkansas, TAMU, Mizzou, Colorado, and Nebraska; sought refuge in the B1G, then the Pac 12; decided to drag along TAMU, OU and OSU burying the remaining Big 12 mates in nothingness (hoping for Big East invite), when TAMU balked, sank the PAC 12 deal and finally had to relinquish the $$ advantage they received in the unequal distributions; probably join a division with the Frozen North (Iowa State, KState, Kansas) to "pack" the fans in at home while having the Seminole faithful travel to these same marquee destinations as well as Stillwell, OK, Lubbock, TX, Waco, TX.

Anyway, just wondering.

 

[kingottoiii]

Anyway, just wondering.

Money. The new B12 contract is said to be $3 million more than the ACC's already. If they add 2-4 more teams how much will that number go up? How much will it go up for a B12 CG? How much can FSU make selling 2-3 cupcake FB games and a handful of BBall games to a regional sports network? Then the biggest money question how would a 4 team playoff money be split up? If they go to the Top 6 model, then based on the BCS era the B12 would have made it over 3x as often as the ACC. So if the money rewards who makes it, then the B12 will be getting 3x the playoff money. How much does all of that add up to? I think conservatively it would be about $10 million more a year. If I am FSU and I know that Miami, Clemson, and one of GA Tech of Louisville will come along, then it would be dumb not to go.

However I do not think that Miami or GA Tech have any interest in going. I also think the B12 has no interest in Miami. And then there is Texas who would rather have a 10 team league and would likely be against a 14 team league.

 

[HtownOrange]

The Big 12 deal calls for the same payouts for new teams added, no increase, no negotiation. The championship game is already included in their package, they are getting paid even though they do not play a CG. FSU already makes around $5-6MM, from what I've heard, on radio, coaches shows, rebroadcasts, so determining what a cupcake game is worth is difficult but probably not much. It is highly doubtful they can get a network unto themselves.

The playoffs payout will probably include every conference with larger portions to the participating conferences. It is highly doubtful you get cooperation on anything less than a 16 team field where every conference champ is invited unless every conference gets a slice of the pie, otherwise status quo is better for the more numerous lesser conferences (ACC and Big East included as by your logic they will not participate often).

Your number sseems high, especially when you factor in that other than UT, OU and possibly WVU, teams in the Big 12 will not fill the FSU stadium. FSU fans only fill it for Miami and Clemson, even VATech and GATech don't draw full houses.

Your number seems really high when all factors are considered. Probably closer to break even than $10MM.

Miami is a better TV draw than Clemson. Clemson is playing better than Miami of late. Either team may be coveted. I agree, I don't see Texas wanting 14, 12 or 16 maybe.

 

[arbitragegls]

They don't share any of the Longhorn Network money. I know that for sure. And I am pretty sure that it is not an even-share league. I keep hearing that over and over in the media in following all of this.

Here are a couple links that indicate that the league sets aside around half of its revenue for equal distribution, and the other half gets distributed based on TV appearances (which Texas would obviously get more than anyone else). There may also be a ratings factor involved - or at least national TV vs. regional.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/article.aspx?articleid=20111002_92_B1_Equalr807124

http://www.turfburner.com/the-feed/item/485-looking-at-the-big-12s-revenue-distribution

In most cases I agree with you...and once again you are correct. The Big 12 does not share everything equally. There is a concession for dividing at least a good portion of TV rights money based on TV appearances...additionally the LHN does not share. However, dont forget that ESPN paid for almost all the start up of the LHN and does share in its revenue and production costs. So far LHN hasnt made much profit as it has not penetrated more than 25% of HH.
And the big $$$ here for Florida State are already being gotten in the third tier that any ACC team has including coaches shows etc. Florida State is only going to add a few dollars to their third tier even in the Big 12.

 

[Van111]

In most cases I agree with you...and once again you are correct. The Big 12 does not share everything equally. There is a concession for dividing at least a good portion of TV rights money based on TV appearances...additionally the LHN does not share. However, dont forget that ESPN paid for almost all the start up of the LHN and does share in its revenue and production costs. So far LHN hasnt made much profit as it has not penetrated more than 25% of HH.
And the big $$$ here for Florida State are already being gotten in the third tier that any ACC team has including coaches shows etc. Florida State is only going to add a few dollars to their third tier even in the Big 12.

It would be a stupid move for a program that is in a great conference for all sports. It would be idiotic for them to make this move, so it will probably happen!

 

[Guinness]

Well the folks doing this are doing so out of some misguided idea that it is the ACC's (Tobacco Road's in particular) for their fall from the football elite. They are blaming the ACC officials for their losses to teams they never would have lost to in the past. Seems they cannot deal with the fact that they are no longer an 'it' football school. So instead of looking in the mirror they are lashing out like a spoiled child blaming everyone else but themselves.

To me it would seem an easier climb back to the top in the ACC where the other good programs are Clemson and VT instead of the B12 were they would be competing with Texas and Oklahoma. Clemson and VT are both nice programs but neither is in the same stratosphere as the Longhorns and Sooners.

Also seems to me that the want to join the B12 is more about the bragging rights of the fans than anything else.

 

[cusenole9]

Well the folks doing this are doing so out of some misguided idea that it is the ACC's (Tobacco Road's in particular) for their fall from the football elite. They are blaming the ACC officials for their losses to teams they never would have lost to in the past. Seems they cannot deal with the fact that they are no longer an 'it' football school. So instead of looking in the mirror they are lashing out like a spoiled child blaming everyone else but themselves.

To me it would seem an easier climb back to the top in the ACC where the other good programs are Clemson and VT instead of the B12 were they would be competing with Texas and Oklahoma. Clemson and VT are both nice programs but neither is in the same stratosphere as the Longhorns and Sooners.

Also seems to me that the want to join the B12 is more about the bragging rights of the fans than anything else.

I disagree with the reasoning here. For FSU fans it is all about money. They don't want FSU to be left in the dust when all these new TV contracts get signed. FSU is the most valuable team in the ACC when it comes to TV dollars (yes I know they lost to Wake Forest a lot lately, this fact remains unchanged), so the fans don't like the idea of making less TV money than every team in the other 4 major conferences. It's really that simple. Whether or not this move would actually bring in a significant dollar increase remains to be seen. I don't buy it when people say this would only make FSU 2 million dollars and I don't buy it when people say this would make FSU 15 million dollars/year. I don't think anyone knows without doing a lot of research and knowing some inside information. I just hope FSU is disciplined in getting this information and making the right decision.

 

[Guinness]

My larger point is it doesn't matter how much money you have if you lose to teams like Wake Forest. FSU fans (not all but a lot) are looking for scapegoats.

 

[cusenole9]

My larger point is it doesn't matter how much money you have if you lose to teams like Wake Forest. FSU fans (not all but a lot) are looking for scapegoats.

Ok. Fair enough. I definitely agree with you that money does not buy on the field success. Just look at Texas the last few years, or Florida the last couple years, and the list goes on... However, it does get you equal footing to field a winning team as well as benefiting the school as a whole (this is especially true for a school like FSU that doesn't have a large endowment). I also agree that there are SOME FSU fans that are looking for scapegoats. I don't and never have bought the argument that the ACC has pulled down the Florida State program. I also think there are many like myself that say we should beat a team consistently before ridiculing them. Again, I view this possible conference shifting business as 95% financial.

 

[HtownOrange]

Well the folks doing this are doing so out of some misguided idea that it is the ACC's (Tobacco Road's in particular) for their fall from the football elite. They are blaming the ACC officials for their losses to teams they never would have lost to in the past. Seems they cannot deal with the fact that they are no longer an 'it' football school. So instead of looking in the mirror they are lashing out like a spoiled child blaming everyone else but themselves.

To me it would seem an easier climb back to the top in the ACC where the other good programs are Clemson and VT instead of the B12 were they would be competing with Texas and Oklahoma. Clemson and VT are both nice programs but neither is in the same stratosphere as the Longhorns and Sooners.

Also seems to me that the want to join the B12 is more about the bragging rights of the fans than anything else.

If you have to take a loss, a loss to UT or OU IS far better than a loss to Wake or UNC. Basically, it sounds like FSU fans are comping to grips with their "inner losers" and are determined to at least get paid for losing. Much like thier annual body bag game, who gets paid handsomely to take a thrashing by FSU, FSU wants to get paid better and with more prestige than they have been getting in the ACC.

 

[IthacaMatt]

The Big 12 agreed to shared revenue last fall.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/football/ncaa/10/03/Big.12.revenue.ap/index.html

The LHN is a boon for Texas. OU has TV deal and makes $5MM or more. The conference money is split evenly going forward.

Still, nobody has explained why FSU would want to join a conference that split apart the Southwest Conference relegating four rivals to CUSA; chased away Arkansas, TAMU, Mizzou, Colorado, and Nebraska; sought refuge in the B1G, then the Pac 12; decided to drag along TAMU, OU and OSU burying the remaining Big 12 mates in nothingness (hoping for Big East invite), when TAMU balked, sank the PAC 12 deal and finally had to relinquish the $$ advantage they received in the unequal distributions; probably join a division with the Frozen North (Iowa State, KState, Kansas) to "pack" the fans in at home while having the Seminole faithful travel to these same marquee destinations as well as Stillwell, OK, Lubbock, TX, Waco, TX.

Anyway, just wondering.

I'm not so sure that happened. The article was talking about "if" they did that and committed their media rights for 6years, would Missouri stay. Missouri did leave, as you, and the article is from last October. This may have happened, but your article isn't the one that says so.