Inside Syracuse’s rough off-season: How portal misses and a lack of NIL money led to a lost year

[Scooch]

JB made Autry his Asst. Head Coach and not Gerry, so I don’t believe those rumors for a second.

Shrug. Boeheim does things.

 

[sufan59]

People need to stop pretending that Weitsman was a big donor. As it was pointed out, he bought he was giving less to the program than guys like Lobdell. That 100k he gave Siena might match what he did before he walked away from SU.

He's nothing like Repole at St John's who is pumping 7 figures into Pitino's program. Red might not be the right HC but the problems at SU lie above his head.

When you make these points you should be specific to the timing. 100k to Siena for this past season and 100k to Syracuse just two or three seasons ago is very different. Unless the matching you mentioned is compared to the market value. The quality of player getting 100k now compared to the quality of player getting 100k two to three years ago is significantly different. We have no idea if the relationship wasn’t broken what Weistman would be doing now for us in the current market. The market is entirely different today than when the relationship ended.

 

[tbonezone]

highly touted frosh Chris McCullough played in 16 games here before injuring his knee (actual surgery required) and got drafted 29th . anyone have great memories of CM ? was he an impact freshman like so many others we've had ? i seem to recall JB jumping on him in more than one post presser. now we have watched donnie freeman calling it after just 14 games. will he enter the draft ? transfer ? stick around a bit ? IDK . great memories ? can't think of any . all i do know is i was expecting more from a possible late round future draft pick. he was the one dude i was excited to watch this season. i said all along shouldda been freeman and not oompah lumpkin wearing #44. i think even DC would've been cool with that.

 

[Scooch]

When you make these points you should be specific to the timing. 100k to Siena for this past season and 100k to Syracuse just two or three seasons ago is very different. Unless the matching you mentioned is compared to the market value. The quality of player getting 100k now compared to the quality of player getting 100k two to three years ago is significantly different. We have no idea if the relationship wasn’t broken what Weistman would be doing now for us in the current market. The market is entirely different today than when the relationship ended.

For the first several years of Weitsman's very public relationship with the hoops program, the primary way donations were funneled was to facilities.

By several accounts, Weitsman didn't donate a dime to SU athletics facilities. Well, other than to renovate a suite at the Dome that he used.

So, I have a hunch what his contribution to NIL would have been the past couple years. Lots of pics on Insta, precious little money.

 

[Sherman20]

Timing may have changed but of course he knew. And that’s not entirely relevant to whether ir not there was a detailed succession plan in place.
One of the leading external candidates was actually coaching in the Dome this year, but that is from second hand knowledge, so take it for what it’s worth.

Good lord, help us all if they hire Matt Langel. We will continue to be a mediocre program with that guy. He’s fine. But we’ll never be a top tier ACC program.

 

[Red2003]

I’m sure Donnie does like SU and the coaching staff. Does Donnie after a year, like our coaching staff to coach him moving forward granted we continue compensating him to his market value considering the NBA option won’t be an option this off season? Through recruiting and other things, I’m sure there are many college basketball players out there that like our coaching staff and SU. Just we aren’t willing to pay their market value or the liking them has to do with them personally and not in a coach-player relationship.

I'm not going to believe any chatter out of this locker room or the "insiders that heard things from players" this offseason. 90% of this team will be gone and cannot wait to talk to their agents and see what their options are.

This is not a healthy operating team that is doing anything right. I do not believe they are honest or accountable with each or their coaches or else the product on court would be different. A team and coaches for that matter playing no defense, losing to Miami, blowing 16 points lead shows that pretty clearly.

It's a waste until the next players are on campus, ideally with new coaches too but the chances of that are the same as winning the powerball.

 

[JimBoston]

Syracuse is a top men's basketball job. There was no reason to promote an inexperienced assistant coach to become the head basketball coach and he has not shown that he is ready to manage a top college basketball job. That said, the turnaround can be quick with the right hire. Louisville fired Kenny Payne after 2 disastrous years and replaced him with Pat Kelsey who had been a successful head coach for 12 years. Louisville is currently ranked #17 in the coaches poll.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Did we handle it in a manner to come to a mutual agreement? I mean this is sales 101. Sometimes you have to give an inch to take a mile. I think we were extremely naive and ignorant to think we would be just fine with out him (heard that on here a lot).

I think this is probably a fair take. People at SU are really full of themselves. Lots of arrogance on the Hill. People act like they're an Ivy League school, as their academic ratings continue to plummet.

 

[IthacaMatt]

The timing was beyond awkward and harsh.
We could have handled better without making the basketball world at large think we disrespected him.

Well, let's be fair. Remember that whiny press conference Boeheim gave in response to the leak that it was his last year? "I'll decide when I retire, nobody else." Followed a couple days later with a formal press statement, acknowledging that he is a University employee and the University decides.

Remember that? Whose fault was it that it went down that way? Boeheim has never been gracious about being asked to retire, or really anything where he was questioned about his running of the program.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I don’t think Freeman leaving would be because of money.

totally agree. he felt disrespected by the quick hooks and short leash.

 

[IthacaMatt]

We have no idea if the relationship wasn’t broken what Weistman would be doing now for us in the current market. The market is entirely different today than when the relationship ended.

Sure we do. He's all about posting on social media with his celebrity "friends" to build up his reputation. I guess he doesn't like being seen as a glorified trash man.

 

[kingtidge]

totally agree. he felt disrespected by the quick hooks and short leash.

dasher has recently re-engaged with AW in some productive conversations, I believe. Maybe he can clarify?

Also, wasn't AW's basic beef that he was told by intermediaries that the "Chancellor and the BOT don't want you to this and that..." and he wanted to discuss with the Chancellor directly, who refused to take his calls when he reached out??

i.e. He was asked to do things by messengers who couldn't explain why and the decision makers wouldn't talk to him about it.

 

[DilemaCuse]

Good lord, help us all if they hire Matt Langel. We will continue to be a mediocre program with that guy. He’s fine. But we’ll never be a top tier ACC program.

Ha, I was hoping it was Kelcey or Shrewsbury?

 

[Bulldog04]

Syracuse is a top men's basketball job. There was no reason to promote an inexperienced assistant coach to become the head basketball coach and he has not shown that he is ready to manage a top college basketball job. That said, the turnaround can be quick with the right hire. Louisville fired Kenny Payne after 2 disastrous years and replaced him with Pat Kelsey who had been a successful head coach for 12 years. Louisville is currently ranked #17 in the coaches poll.

I think the brand is a top brand but I don’t think it’s a top job anymore. Behind on facilities, behind on resources, behind on pay. Do I think someone could turn it back into what it once was. Sure. Nate oats created a basketball program at Bama out of thin air. With lots of money and good coaching. He also just signed a 6 year 38 million dollar deal. Syracuse is not paying anyone more than $3m a year to coach basketball. So I would disagree that the “job” is a top job.

 

[Red2003]

I think the brand is a top brand but I don’t think it’s a top job anymore. Behind on facilities, behind on resources, behind on pay. Do I think someone could turn it back into what it once was. Sure. Nate oats created a basketball program at Bama out of thin air. With lots of money and good coaching. He also just signed a 6 year 38 million dollar deal. Syracuse is not paying anyone more than $3m a year to coach basketball. So I would disagree that the “job” is a top job.

Syracuse Basketball Coach is a top job in Central NY. Fixed it for the poster before you.

 

[kingtidge]

I think the brand is a top brand but I don’t think it’s a top job anymore. Behind on facilities, behind on resources, behind on pay. Do I think someone could turn it back into what it once was. Sure. Nate oats created a basketball program at Bama out of thin air. With lots of money and good coaching. He also just signed a 6 year 38 million dollar deal. Syracuse is not paying anyone more than $3m a year to coach basketball. So I would disagree that the “job” is a top job.

This^^^^

Respectably competitive is our target at this point.

The years of top 10 teams and top 4 seeds in the tournament are behind us.

It sucks to say out loud, but it's ok to admit.

 

[Scooch]

I do think folks on the Hill need to remember that SU hoops became what it once was because Boeheim landed HUGE recruits for years.

How many times did we have a top 10 class? A bunch is my recollection. Once upon a time the guy was a recruiting machine who got top-tier, super-premium players to come here.

This wasn't SU being a top 25 football program by recruiting undervalued Black QBs, putting starters on ST, or finding undiscovered gems in Florida. SU hoops was a title contender because we went head-to-head with blueblood programs for elite recruits and won some of those battles.

I will admit that our GM talking about using a data model to find unlikely guys in the portal doesn't fill me with confidence that the school endeavors to be a top 10 program again.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Ha, I was hoping it was Kelcey or Shrewsbury?

Shrewsberry is terrible.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

This^^^^

Respectably competitive is our target at this point.

The years of top 10 teams and top 4 seeds in the tournament are behind us.

It sucks to say out loud, but it's ok to admit.

The B1G and SEC are not our competition. We don't play them.
Current bracket matrix has 2. Houston, 3. ISU, 3. Texas Tech, 4. St Johns, 4. Zona. Then just outside that (meaning they could still end up Top 4): 5. Marquette, 6. Clemson. The committee will not only put B1G, SEC, Blue Bloods as Top 4 seeds. Since B1G and SEC teams all play each other, they will compile a bunch of Ls and end up with lower seeds. It is what happened to the Big East back in the day.

 

[pwong]

Shrewsberry is terrible.

The narrative is that Shrewberry is a good coach with bad players. Think next year will be a better indicator if they can retain Burton and add with some of the HS talent he's bringing in. ND doesn't have a ton of NIL money and has a much tougher transfer admissions process.

 

[Cusefan0307]

This^^^^

Respectably competitive is our target at this point.

The years of top 10 teams and top 4 seeds in the tournament are behind us.

It sucks to say out loud, but it's ok to admit.

Disagree. Get the right coach and they will win here. No person on this board thought Syracuse would sign a 5 star transfer QB either 15 months ago. The defeatist attitude is annoying. Will Wade would have us in the top 15 next year if he was hired.

I’m not saying we will hire him.

 

[CuseMan4]

Here’s my thing. Autry is a huge liability coaching wise. Great recruiter. Terrible coach. I would not keep Autry over a few unproven freshman, no matter how good they will probably be.

The thing with college basketball nowadays is you and rebuild a team into a contender in literally one offseason. This isn’t the NBA where the talent is distributed through all the teams for the most part. And all the players in the NBA are really good.

College basketball you can pay for 2-3 studs on your team. Then surround them with some niche role players and with a good coach you’ll easily be top 25 at a school like Syracuse. It’s not rocket science

 

[Cusefan0307]

The narrative is that Shrewberry is a good coach with bad players. Think next year will be a better indicator if they can retain Burton and add with some of the HS talent he's bringing in. ND doesn't have a ton of NIL money and has a much tougher transfer admissions process.

He’s had one decent year coaching and struck iron getting the ND job cause of it.

 

[RF2044]

Disagree. Get the right coach and they will win here. No person on this board thought Syracuse would sign a 5 star transfer QB either 15 months ago. The defeatist attitude is annoying. Will Wade would have us in the top 15 next year if he was hired.

I’m not saying we will hire him.

Agree 100%. I think what some posters miss is that there isn't just one way to build a successful program.

One way is to spend tons of money on transfers, and try to assemble a super team.

Another is to have good systems on both sides of the ball, and recruit to that -- supplementing via the portal.

A team like Marquette is a great model for us. But we need the right coach, not a guy where the only way he can be successful is to have a team stocked with elite players to offset his coaching limitations.

 

[dasher]

This is SU laying the narrative for Red being retained

Wrong. the story was originated by Mike Waters. He has no such agenda.