Is Marrone on the hot (or even warm) seat in 2012?

[GoSU96]

once again-another guy who cant take the time to read what the post was a reply for-sad

now im starting to get a good read on those who love marrone-they are incapable of comprehending the written word,have no understanding at all of the written word-

they just say -you idiot me smart-

Here's your statement genius,

"so he is incapable of recruiting freshman who can contribute?"

what did I miss, because while there is a question make, the statement itself is false on its face.

 

[CIL]

once again-another guy who cant take the time to read what the post was a reply for-sad

now im starting to get a good read on those who love marrone-they are incapable of comprehending the written word,have no understanding at all of the written word-

they just say -you idiot me smart-

It's tough to comprehend the written word when a mongoloid wearing ski gloves is writing it.

 

[rosconey]

Here's your statement genius,

"so he is incapable of recruiting freshman who can contribute?"

what did I miss, because while there is a question make, the statement itself is false on its face.

and it was in reply to another post Einstein- not a post floating around on its own-
and other than a few linebackers who has done anything? you cant be talking on the offensive side-none have done much

 

[rosconey]

It's tough to comprehend the written word when a mongoloid wearing ski gloves is writing it.

wow did you find a kid and ask for a sweet comeback-that is one for sure

i bet leno give you a call-he could use some new material
-ps-just dont tell him a kid actually wrote it

 

[SoBristol]

. . ..

And in my more positive moments I think of it this way... if you take the last 2 games of his inaugural season, the entirety of the 2010 season, and up through the WVU game last year, he had a run of being 14-8. That's better than any 22-game run this program has had in a decade. Now, the 5-game collapse last year was hideous. And I'm with others who say it made them question just how far we've really come.

...

Yes, disappointing that the 2011 team limped through November.
But this is part of our growing pains. We had a weak group of LBs (some talent, but small and young) -- DBs were playing through injuries -- no pass rush other than Chandler. Specials were by far worst in the league (apart from place kicking). Not much help on offense from any of Marrone's recruits. We got worn down and exposed in November.

But it is a new season -- time for hope. Defense and specials have to be better -- no excuses in year 4. I believe they will be -- almost shocking to see our fan base so negative.

 

[kingottoiii]

And in my more positive moments I think of it this way... if you take the last 2 games of his inaugural season, the entirety of the 2010 season, and up through the WVU game last year, he had a run of being 14-8. That's better than any 22-game run this program has had in a decade. Now, the 5-game collapse last year was hideous. And I'm with others who say it made them question just how far we've really come.

You can also say that we are 6-10 in our last 16 1A games which is a trend downwards. There are a lot of positives and a lot of negatives. At the end of this season we will see where the team is. Hopefully it will go to the positives. But a major change will have to happen with the way this team plays in the 2nd half of the season. And that just might be the key. We have started off well all three years. If we finally break through in teh second half we will be a Bowl team this year against a difficult schedule.

 

[ImperialOrange]

Lack of Depth in year 4 is no longer a valid excuse. Maybe he shouldn't kick so many damn players off the team every year.

I dont think the lack of depth or talent excuse will fly this year or moving forward FWIW. We've finally got enough talent in the 2 deep to play well and I dont think that will be the issue.

Inconsistancy, which you could attribute to having so many young guys playing at once, should start to clear up from this point forward. If not then it's time to start thinking about a change in coaching.

Being ever the optimist, I think we have enough talent in the ranks at this point and just need to see them put it together every series. Too many good series were ruined by one mental lapse in a series last year and we couldn't over come it. Missed throw, dropped pass, fumble, missed blocks, missed tackles (can we get off the field after a 3rd down defensive play?), blown coverage, etc. The problems were many and usually compacted on one another.

What I'm looking at is Nassib CAN get better on deep passes, WR's that CAN hold onto the ball, RB's that CAN protect the ball and break free, defensive players that CAN be in position AND make the play. Will they? We'll see. At this point there is enough talent that has been there long enough that they should put it together IMHO. If not, then it's time to start considering other options.

Looking at the roster I feel alot better than I did at this time last year based on depth, talent, and experience. Hopefully the coaches put it to good use.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Agreed but it's covering the lack of assets we have under center and at WR.

Agreed but it's covering the lack of assets we have under center and at WR.

Nassib is not so bad as you pretend he is. The guy is going to wind up the 4th or 5th best QB we've had since Schwartzwalder was coach. Seriously, since McNabb who is better ?

 

[mantonio]

With Rutgers & Pitt basically starting over, & West Virginia gone, this team should be able to cobble a 6 win season together.

Before you say we beat WVU the with Doug the past 2 years, I would say, winning 3 times in a row against them would be a prohibitive challenge.

 

[Bayside44]

Nassib is not so bad as you pretend he is. The guy is going to wind up the 4th or 5th best QB we've had since Schwartzwalder was coach. Seriously, since McNabb who is better ?

I think he's pretty generic, and he has a couple of serviceable guys to throw to, but that isn't the foundation (IMO) to run a wide open offense.

 

[tipphill]

name calling is indicative of immaturity---and is employed as fishing bait, and is not warranted ----and not necessary----, rosconey---any intelligent points that are made get lost and forgotten when couched that way. for people to hear what one says,it must be presented in a way that they will hear you.

 

[GoSU96]

Yes, disappointing that the 2011 team limped through November.
But this is part of our growing pains. We had a weak group of LBs (some talent, but small and young) -- DBs were playing through injuries -- no pass rush other than Chandler. Specials were by far worst in the league (apart from place kicking). Not much help on offense from any of Marrone's recruits. We got worn down and exposed in November.

But it is a new season -- time for hope. Defense and specials have to be better -- no excuses in year 4. I believe they will be -- almost shocking to see our fan base so negative.

I'm not sure that worn down was as much an issue as exposed, as in exposed on game film.

Marrone made it clear that what the team was doing in the first half of the season was about all they could do and was surprised that opponents were playing them straight up. He said that the weaknesses were all there on film and eventually opponents were going to start attacking them. The end of the year came down to the fact that they didn't have any good counters available. It wasn't a function of being unaware and not trying, it was a function of basic capability. At the end of the day they couldn't keep scheming their way around the fact that none of their skill guys were capable of winning one on one battles consistently.

 

[tipphill]

Yeah, but if his wake up call is to be even more strict, more controlling and more uptight, that's the wrong message to take from last year's meltdown.

i hope your wrong, i hope he is using this time to build commraderie and a sense of unity--i guess ---we will see--i could be pollyanna though

 

[rosconey]

name calling is indicative of immaturity---and is employed as fishing bait, and is not warranted ----and not necessary----, rosconey---any intelligent points that are made get lost and forgotten when couched that way. for people to hear what one says,it must be presented in a way that they will hear you.

i reply with the same intent-call me a name i call you one back-
i dont think i ever start it

on another thread i asked a simple question about akron facilities -got called names for it

 

[SoBristol]

I'm not sure that worn down was as much an issue as exposed, as in exposed on game film.

Marrone made it clear that what the team was doing in the first half of the season was about all they could do and was surprised that opponents were playing them straight up. He said that the weaknesses were all there on film and eventually opponents were going to start attacking them. The end of the year came down to the fact that they didn't have any good counters available. It wasn't a function of being unaware and not trying, it was a function of basic capability. At the end of the day they couldn't keep scheming their way around the fact that none of their skill guys were capable of winning one on one battles consistently.

I get what you are saying (lack of good counters once defenses swarmed Lemon & Provo and overall shortage of breakaway skill guys), but I start with the defense. No secret that guys like Lynn and Anderson were playing through injuries; the more talented LBs were underclassmen. When you lack a pass rush, and can't match the size or toughness of opponents, you get worn down -- and that is what I saw with the UConn and Pitt games. On the offensive side, we were short a second running back and a true top-end WR -- basically, what every other team in the league had.
I put some of this on the coaching staff. Marrone has recruited from juco ranks (mainly OL), but didn't go after juco help at skill positions to fill obvious needs (or didn't make headway).

This year, he showed he could reach into JUCO ranks and find help (on paper anyway) for the biggest need (DL). Now, if his skill guys (West, Hale, Smith, Broyld, Thompson) show something, this season should surprise our negative posters.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I'm not sure that worn down was as much an issue as exposed, as in exposed on game film.

Marrone made it clear that what the team was doing in the first half of the season was about all they could do and was surprised that opponents were playing them straight up. He said that the weaknesses were all there on film and eventually opponents were going to start attacking them. The end of the year came down to the fact that they didn't have any good counters available. It wasn't a function of being unaware and not trying, it was a function of basic capability. At the end of the day they couldn't keep scheming their way around the fact that none of their skill guys were capable of winning one on one battles consistently.

That's a good observation / good post.

 

[UBCuse89]

once again-another guy who cant take the time to read what the post was a reply for-sad

now im starting to get a good read on those who love marrone-they are incapable of comprehending the written word,have no understanding at all of the written word-

they just say -you idiot me smart-

What you are describing is yourself...only your a delusional fan who has unrealistic dreams at our current state; who wants to point the finger at a coach who has done a pretty good job for the position he was put in ...get your head out of your a$$ man and look at this with an open mind.

Marrone obviously has to take some of the blame for last year but seriously it comes down to the talent. Our talent level on the field is clearly not up to par to most of the other Big East teams, you can't win games when your outmatched at most every position and you can be a great recruiter but at the end of the day, if you don't have that wow factor then how are you going to impress a kid, to want to come here. Facilities are a major part to producing that wow factor, fans filling up the stands, talented teams and an exciting offense. Well our facilities need upgrading, the fan turnout is still weak, our talent is still not there and we don't have the players to run an exciting o.

Then comes well how do you fix it, easy get facilities that will impress recruits, impressing recruits means more of them will wear Orange and hey now we have a chain reaction, now suddenly we can get better players, we can change up our offense to make it more exciting because now we have the players and we win more games to attract more fans.

What do you people expect from a guy that comes in to a situation where your program is at its lowest point in their history, who play in a crap BCS conference. Give me a break, I mean I want to see the Orange win 8-10 games every year sure, that would be great but until we start improving other factors then realistically I don't see that happening. And you sure as heck can't expect to get better recruits to join in.

If you think we can get a coach who is going to do a better job than what Marrone has done, then your delusional and in a fantasy world, like Millhouse said, eventually as the years go by Marrone will be more and more responsible for how the team performs.

At the end of the day I look at this and say year 4, we should see improvement, we lost a lot of seniors last year on D and it showed, it is crucial to make it to a bowl this year but if we do not and get close then lets not call for Marrone's head, unless it is clear he is the problem. Evaluate all the factors and understand 4 (well 5 after this year) years ago we were the bottom of the barrel in BCS football. The ACC is right around the corner and so be patient and give this thing time. Lets support the program (i.e. attend games) and not blame Marrone for something he can't completely control.

 

[44cuse]

Is it true that Marrone signed a five-year deal before the 2009 season? If so, that means he's signed on through the 2013 season.

I've never seen a college football coach go into a season as a lame duck (either the coach is extended or they buy out the remaining year), which is what Marrone would be next year unless he is offered an extension before August of 2013. I'm sure lame ducks happen in college football, but I'd have to think it's pretty bad for recruiting. I'm real surprised SU didn't offer him an extension after 2010, but as far as I know it didn't happen. And it hasn't happened.

So if Marrone hasn't been offered an extension up to this point, would SU extend him with a 5-7 or worse 2012 season?

People scoffed at my notion that Marrone could be in deep trouble with anything less than 6 wins, especially after cutting off media coverage of the team. Would the fans be happy (whether or not that matters anymore) enough with a 5-7 record in 2012 to buy into a contract extension for the head coach?

I didn't personally see anyone celebrating our 5-7 record last year. How about back-to-back 5-7 seasons? Would the fans then be okay with a press conference in December to announce that Marrone has signed a 3-year contract extension?

I'm just very curious to know if the majority here believes 2012 is or is not a make-or-break year.

I hate these type of threads, but when the coach closes shop during spring practice I guess this is what we have to talk about.

I don't mean this in a bad way: you have no idea the state this football program was is when Marrone got here. Also, people have no conception how bad our facilities are. A college football coach commented to me directly: the SU facilities would be the worst in the PAC 10 (was PAC 10 at the time).

We are lucky to have Marrone and he will be extended. Building takes time.

This is not about rebuilding.

44cuse

 

[Scooch]

I don't mean this in a bad way: you have no idea the state this football program was is when Marrone got here. Also, people have no conception how bad our facilities are. A college football coach commented to me directly: the SU facilities would be the worst in the PAC 10 (was PAC 10 at the time).

We are lucky to have Marrone and he will be extended. Building takes time.

This is not about rebuilding.

44cuse

Here's the thing... I've been reading about how awful SU's facilities are for 12+ years. This isn't rocket ship science, just build better facilities. If we can't find the money to do so then we clearly don't deserve to have a good program anyway.

This issue has become so ponderous.

 

[IthacaMatt]

What you are describing is yourself...only your a delusional fan who has unrealistic dreams at our current state; who wants to point the finger at a coach who has done a pretty good job for the position he was put in ...get your head out of your a$$ man and look at this with an open mind.

Marrone obviously has to take some of the blame for last year but seriously it comes down to the talent. Our talent level on the field is clearly not up to par to most of the other Big East teams, you can't win games when your outmatched at most every position and you can be a great recruiter but at the end of the day, if you don't have that wow factor then how are you going to impress a kid, to want to come here. Facilities are a major part to producing that wow factor, fans filling up the stands, talented teams and an exciting offense. Well our facilities need upgrading, the fan turnout is still weak, our talent is still not there and we don't have the players to run an exciting o.

Then comes well how do you fix it, easy get facilities that will impress recruits, impressing recruits means more of them will wear Orange and hey now we have a chain reaction, now suddenly we can get better players, we can change up our offense to make it more exciting because now we have the players and we win more games to attract more fans.

What do you people expect from a guy that comes in to a situation where your program is at its lowest point in their history, who play in a crap BCS conference. Give me a break, I mean I want to see the Orange win 8-10 games every year sure, that would be great but until we start improving other factors then realistically I don't see that happening. And you sure as heck can't expect to get better recruits to join in.

If you think we can get a coach who is going to do a better job than what Marrone has done, then your delusional and in a fantasy world, like Millhouse said, eventually as the years go by Marrone will be more and more responsible for how the team performs.

At the end of the day I look at this and say year 4, we should see improvement, we lost a lot of seniors last year on D and it showed, it is crucial to make it to a bowl this year but if we do not and get close then lets not call for Marrone's head, unless it is clear he is the problem. Evaluate all the factors and understand 4 (well 5 after this year) years ago we were the bottom of the barrel in BCS football. The ACC is right around the corner and so be patient and give this thing time. Lets support the program (i.e. attend games) and not blame Marrone for something he can't completely control.

You're a whiny apologist - "Waah, we couldn't possibly compete ~ Waah ! Everyone is so much more talented than we are ! Waah, we can't be critical of this coach; he's the best we could get !"

Dude, this terrible untalented team just went 14-7, and then went 0-5. In that 14-7 stretch, we went 5-4 against the Big East. Should have been 6-3, but for blowing that double-overtime loss to Rutgers at home.

So, no, we can compete in this league. Yes, our players are good enough. And no, Marrone didn't do a good job in the 2nd half of last season, after beating West Virginia.

 

[rosconey]

when we beat wv everyone said we finally had on field talent-watch out big east
by the end of the season they all said it was because of this or that piece of talent was missing -

i think some noticed the 5 wins were 90% smoke and mirrors with some very good luck mixed in-they didnt show anything legit except wv game-
year 3 and the offense was still a major disappointment and a total lack of special teams-2 items that for all intent and purpose looked like they were ignored and never tried to improve from the previous season -special teams was a national joke-

team never looked like it played with the same intensity it did the previous year,thats on the staff-
durring the streak they coached tight and desperate and the kids played the same way-lots of dumb ass fouls-

but the apologists are the first to point out no depth and ignore the reason why the depth was so low- maybe there was a more legit center available in that group or a outside linebacker who could tackle

and now even more excuses are being formulated making us constipated and agitated

 

[44cuse]

Here's the thing... I've been reading about how awful SU's facilities are for 12+ years. This isn't rocket ship science, just build better facilities. If we can't find the money to do so then we clearly don't deserve to have a good program anyway.

This issue has become so ponderous.

I'm with you 100% on that. That is what I have been saying for years and years. Competing at the highest level in college football (not even stratosphere OK, OKSt, Oregon, USC, etc) is not as easy as everyone thinks it is.

The practical side of this is that your 100% correct: if we aren't going to put up the money to compete, we don't deserve to have a good program. No other way to spin that.

44cuse

 

[UBCuse89]

You're a whiny apologist - "Waah, we couldn't possibly compete ~ Waah ! Everyone is so much more talented than we are ! Waah, we can't be critical of this coach; he's the best we could get !"

Dude, this terrible untalented team just went 14-7, and then went 0-5. In that 14-7 stretch, we went 5-4 against the Big East. Should have been 6-3, but for blowing that double-overtime loss to Rutgers at home.

So, no, we can compete in this league. Yes, our players are good enough. And no, Marrone didn't do a good job in the 2nd half of last season, after beating West Virginia.

I am in no way saying Marrone is immune to blame, sure the coach needs to take some blame but a lot of the problem is out of Marrone's control. And yes we are a talented team and sure our team has similar talent towards some of the Big East teams, however if you think our talent compares to most of them or is better than you are wrong.

Also your mistaken facts for being a whiny apologist, I was merely sick of people who can't see the big picture, is it coincidence we don't get top recruits, do you think the blame is solely on the coach? Because if so then your an idiot and if you don't then why are you even trying to argue? Marrone can only control so much, he doesn't control our outdated facilities or the lack of fans. Sure he can do things to attract attention but that only goes as far as we WIN.

I never said we were untalented or can't compete, I think we still can be very competitive but I don't expect to see us always win close games when other teams have more talent and skill on the field. We compare talent wise with some of the Big East teams but not most.

What top coach would want to have come here after the mess SU went through and do you think we are willing to shell out 3-5 million for one of those after what we went through with GRob.

I trust Marrone is trying to win games. I am no coach and he is, he was the OC of the Saints, I am sure he knew if our offense was capable of becoming more exciting and I am sure if he was confident he would have made adjustments.

All I am saying is there is a bigger picture here, a bigger problem. Marrone is not that big problem, it is funding/money. Without it our school doesn't have any Wow factor to bring in talent.