Is this the biggest game for the program in years? | Page 2 | Syracusefan.com

Is this the biggest game for the program in years?

5-7 is pretty big improvement over last year. It would be hard to justify firing him on that metric. But, 5/6 losing seasons is another metric that shows 2018 was a fluke.
To me improvement over last year doesn't matter. I don't ding him for last year, but part of that deal is he doesn't get credit for performing better this year.

The comparison then gets shifted to 2019. We are a better football team than we were in 2019. But that may not show up in the record.

Things get very simple once Dino hits 6 wins. I want him to just make it all easy on everyone and get us to 6.
 
To me improvement over last year doesn't matter. I don't ding him for last year, but part of that deal is he doesn't get credit for performing better this year.

The comparison then gets shifted to 2019. We are a better football team than we were in 2019. But that may not show up in the record.

Things get very simple once Dino hits 6 wins. I want him to just make it all easy on everyone and get us to 6.

Exactly this, if we aren’t going to count last season whatever…but then you have to see improvement from 2019.

Get us to 6 this year and a bowl game he’s off the hook this year and I am happy to have him back….but he also needs to follow up with another bowl game the next year.

Syracuse should be a bowl game team every year. That isn’t setting the bar too high for a P5 program in the ACC
 
I always said 5 wins and I support his return. 6 would be better, but 5 would be his 2nd best season since being here, and would represent a significant step from last season (which counted, sorry...i just checked). So yeah, as cynical as I am, I am comfortable, given what is coming back to this team in 2022, that 5-7 would be the first step towards something bigger.

That's another reason why, for me, it's such a big game.

Now does that "bigger" mean 8+ wins every season? No. But I do think that this program can and should be a team that is winning between 5-8 games every season, with a occasional flirtation with something bigger.

PS- 5-7 this year means Bowl or bust 100% next season.
 
To me improvement over last year doesn't matter. I don't ding him for last year, but part of that deal is he doesn't get credit for performing better this year.

The comparison then gets shifted to 2019. We are a better football team than we were in 2019. But that may not show up in the record.

Things get very simple once Dino hits 6 wins. I want him to just make it all easy on everyone and get us to 6.

I like Dino. I'm indifferent to him being fired. In my personal rating system I'm excited for a Syracuse football game for the first time since Maryland. So in my rating system he has earned another year, especially since this year reminds me a bit of 2017 and I think good things are on the horizon in 22 if we keep the core together.
 
I always said 5 wins and I support his return. 6 would be better, but 5 would be his 2nd best season since being here, and would represent a significant step from last season (which counted, sorry...i just checked). So yeah, as cynical as I am, I am comfortable, given what is coming back to this team in 2022, that 5-7 would be the first step towards something bigger.

That's another reason why, for me, it's such a big game.

Now does that "bigger" mean 8+ wins every season? No. But I do think that this program can and should be a team that is winning between 5-8 games every season, with a occasional flirtation with something bigger.

PS- 5-7 this year means Bowl or bust 100% next season.

I agree with everything you said…

But for me, for the people who said last season didn’t count…and there are a lot of them out there…that means we have to go off of the 2019 season and after the 2019 season I was saying we are bowl or bust……..So if we are saying last season didn’t count (I don’t agree I think it did) than this year is Bowl or Bust 100% for me.

If we are saying last season counted…he needs a minimum 5 wins…and I said that before the season with the asterisk that all the games needed to be close….we certainly have checked that box. Let’s get the 5th one and then go bowl hunting in Louisville.

This game Saturday is MASSIVE!!!

IF YOU HAVE THE ABILITY TO ATTEND THE GAME THIS WEEK BUY TICKETS! THE TEAM NEEDS YOU!!!!
 
We didn't play an FCS or MAC team last year. If we had we are 3-9. If we are going to count 1-10 then that should also be held against him. He shouldn't get credit for taking the team from 10 Ws to 1 W and then back up to 5 Ws.
We finally have gotten back to having an exciting offense, with a dynamic QB, and RB and you want to start all over. Dino now knows you can't have a stationary QB, who can't make decisions on the run.
We have to stay the course with Shrader, and Tucker.
 
We finally have gotten back to having an exciting offense, with a dynamic QB, and RB and you want to start all over. Dino now knows you can't have a stationary QB, who can't make decisions on the run.
We have to stay the course with Shrader, and Tucker.
I think there is a better chance of us going 4-0 than 0-4 these next 4 games. So I do not think JW will ever have to make a decision. If (and this is highly unlikely IMO) we do go 0-4 then yes Dino needs to go. Don't we want to maximize Shrader and Tucker? If we go 4-8 it isn't because of talent. So why hold the team back by keeping Dino**** (if we go 0-4 which isn't happening).
 
If we were in year 2 or 3 sure…

But we are in year 6


Every player is now his recruits…everything is a direct reflection of him…

That’s why many are saying bowl game or bust this season….

honestly, 6 years isn’t that long to build a program. I know ppl will say I’m insane but it’s just not. You can tell in 6 years if a guy is incapable of turning around a program and i don’t think anyone is arguing Dino isn’t capable. What happens from here depends on our luck.
 
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My folks and I will be in attendance in 308 and we will be loud. First game my folks have gotten to see in the Dome since 2019's BC game.

My father will be 12 deep in order to avenge the memory.

The North remembers.
 
So if we only go 4-8 this year because of Dino's coaching decisions that doesn't matter as much as being close to winning? The fact that we are close and not winning is directly correlated to his coaching decisions. A 4-8 record would be a huge underachievement for this team. You want to reward that? He would be holding the team back.

We have 4 games left and I would be shocked if we don't get to 6Ws. Only having 4 Ws is a hypothetical that I think will not even come close to being in play.

This is year 6 how is that short sighted? How much more time is needed to build the program in the W/L column? Why did we move on from Shafer after only 3 years and injured QBs every year to not improve at all in the next 6 years?

Especially since we have 2 pretty good options waiting in the wings should Dino fail. If you wait too long those options might not be available. Then you are stuck in the carousel.

his coaching decisions, while some have been problematic and disagreeable, are way overstated. You have to take the emotion out of it and put the pitch fork down. Ppl were irate over what happened at half time in va tech but completely ignore his calls in second half we’re perfect, and some of those were very difficult decisions and disagreeable.

I don’t want to reward underachievement but three games were coin flips. If you flip a coin a bunch of times, you will sometimes get 9 wrong out of 10. You will also sometimes guess right 9 out of 10.
 
Its Big but VT was huge. It in my opinion saved the program. Created a fresh start. Closed the door on the Tommy era and ushered in the Shrader era. Kept the moral high and most likely saved some very good players and coaches from leaving.
VT was a critical win.
 
This is not the biggest game in years and will be one of our easier wins in years. I am not a fan but Dino is not going anywhere even if we don't win another game. I think 5-7 is where we end up which is the perfect sport for ADJW to punt the decision.
 
I feel like there's a massive psychological difference between being 5-4 and 4-5 going into the bye week. Obviously, I hope we win them all, but only having to win one out of @ NC State, @ Louisville, and Pitt (who we are a combined 4-20 against since joining the ACC) to make a bowl would have us on solid ground.
That’s absolutely insane
 
I think 5-7 is where we end up which is the perfect sport for ADJW to punt the decision.
...and a net punt of 30 yards to boot!
 
In my opinion, I don't hold Dino's first two seasons against him. Shafer constructed an awful roster. Dungey got hurt. Twice. One of those seasons, we were bowl caliber but the season sunk because we had zero quality depth behind Eric.

The biggest issue I have was passing the baton after Eric graduated, from the terrific 10-3 2018 season. Dino really needed to connect on DeVito being a quality replacement, or Chance Amie being a dual threat in the Dungey mold. We went 0-2 for various reasons, which lead to another 5 win season [yes, I know we beat WF on the final play, and could have lost the game]. But better QB play could have gotten that team to a bowl. We didn't have it, so we didn't get there - and momentum was squandered.

I'm not of the mindset that last year "doesn't count," but the OL injuries were absurd and couldn't be overcome, and Tommy again didn't show the chops. Disaster season, in every respect.

Post QB-swap this year, we seem to be headed in the correct direction. Whereas we were a poor defensive team under Dino the first couple of years, he made a home run hire in Tony White and shored that up. 3-3-5 is also a good "system" for us to run, given our traditional difficulty recruiting impact DL. I think the jury is still out on Gilbert, but I like what we're doing offensively now with Shrader / Tucker. I'm also pleased that we were able to go toe-to-toe with the best team in the conference [WF] and teams littered with 4- and 5-star recruits in FSU and Clemson. Losing those games were gut punches; going 0-3 might sink the season with respect to bowl eligibility.

Which means that it all comes down to Saturday. Need to win against a BC team decimated by injuries, at home, and get closer to the goal.

Then, we get a much needed bye week -- where the team can rest up, recuperate, hopefully get some guys back on the field who've been hindered by nagging injuries, and spend an extra week preparing for the next opponent. Louisville is good, but not unbeatable -- not given how we're playing now. Ditto NC State. Have to find a way to get another win from those last three games.

Moving forward, we seem to be positioned well. Hopefully, Tucker gets #44 -- that would generate a lot of enthusiasm amongst the fan base. And if we scrap our way to a bowl, we'll see a lot of momentum -- both on the recruiting trail as we finish up this class, but also with class of 2023 recruits. And the team itself will have a lot of excitement, coming back with Shrader / Tucker. And I'm also hearing that Lamson is impressing the coaching staff, so the long-term future looks bright beyond Shrader.

As long as we've got those Shrader / Tucker, we can play with just about anybody. Perhaps not the truly elite teams, but those two are going to give us a helluva advantage over peer programs. I can't see us not getting to 7 wins the next two seasons with them as the nucleus of the offense. Stringing together multiple bowl seasons would go a long way toward righting the ship, and getting the fans back on-board.

Dino still has flaws. Most coaches who haven't ascended to elite programs do. And some changes need to be made -- he needs someone to help him do better with game management, and we've got to get ST figured out. But much as how Dino was perceived as being lousy defensively and then bolstering the staff to get that sorted out, it will be incumbent on him to make those adjustments and improve the staff in both of those domains.

Not an insurmountable task.

But it all comes down to getting a win against BC on Saturday. If we do, then excitement continues to build. We're practically in November, and football is fun again. We have something to play for, and players that are exciting as hell to watch. Tucker is producing a record shattering season. A bowl this year is within reach.
 
In my opinion, I don't hold Dino's first two seasons against him. Shafer constructed an awful roster. Dungey got hurt. Twice. One of those seasons, we were bowl caliber but the season sunk because we had zero quality depth behind Eric.

The biggest issue I have was passing the baton after Eric graduated, from the terrific 10-3 2018 season. Dino really needed to connect on DeVito being a quality replacement, or Chance Amie being a dual threat in the Dungey mold. We went 0-2 for various reasons, which lead to another 5 win season [yes, I know we beat WF on the final play, and could have lost the game]. But better QB play could have gotten that team to a bowl. We didn't have it, so we didn't get there - and momentum was squandered.

I'm not of the mindset that last year "doesn't count," but the OL injuries were absurd and couldn't be overcome, and Tommy again didn't show the chops. Disaster season, in every respect.

Post QB-swap this year, we seem to be headed in the correct direction. Whereas we were a poor defensive team under Dino the first couple of years, he made a home run hire in Tony White and shored that up. 3-3-5 is also a good "system" for us to run, given our traditional difficulty recruiting impact DL. I think the jury is still out on Gilbert, but I like what we're doing offensively now with Shrader / Tucker. I'm also pleased that we were able to go toe-to-toe with the best team in the conference [WF] and teams littered with 4- and 5-star recruits in FSU and Clemson. Losing those games were gut punches; going 0-3 might sink the season with respect to bowl eligibility.

Which means that it all comes down to Saturday. Need to win against a BC team decimated by injuries, at home, and get closer to the goal.

Then, we get a much needed bye week -- where the team can rest up, recuperate, hopefully get some guys back on the field who've been hindered by nagging injuries, and spend an extra week preparing for the next opponent. Louisville is good, but not unbeatable -- not given how we're playing now. Ditto NC State. Have to find a way to get another win from those last three games.

Moving forward, we seem to be positioned well. Hopefully, Tucker gets #44 -- that would generate a lot of enthusiasm amongst the fan base. And if we scrap our way to a bowl, we'll see a lot of momentum -- both on the recruiting trail as we finish up this class, but also with class of 2023 recruits. And the team itself will have a lot of excitement, coming back with Shrader / Tucker. And I'm also hearing that Lamson is impressing the coaching staff, so the long-term future looks bright beyond Shrader.

As long as we've got those Shrader / Tucker, we can play with just about anybody. Perhaps not the truly elite teams, but those two are going to give us a helluva advantage over peer programs. I can't see us not getting to 7 wins the next two seasons with them as the nucleus of the offense. Stringing together multiple bowl seasons would go a long way toward righting the ship, and getting the fans back on-board.

Dino still has flaws. Most coaches who haven't ascended to elite programs do. And some changes need to be made -- he needs someone to help him do better with game management, and we've got to get ST figured out. But much as how Dino was perceived as being lousy defensively and then bolstering the staff to get that sorted out, it will be incumbent on him to make those adjustments and improve the staff in both of those domains.

Not an insurmountable task.

But it all comes down to getting a win against BC on Saturday. If we do, then excitement continues to build. We're practically in November, and football is fun again. We have something to play for, and players that are exciting as hell to watch. Tucker is producing a record shattering season. A bowl this year is within reach.

absolutely excellent post
 
comparing this year to 2019 , we are clearly a much better team whether the w/l will be better remains to be seen and it seems like we can be on verge of another 2018 season next year . Dibno has his flaws with time management for sure and the no dedicated special teams guy was a mistake with the inexperience coming back
 
After '19 and '20, just grateful to be having the possible bowl conversation. Beat BC and then watch me get greedy for another win and an upper echelon bowl.
As far as what might have been, I can salve my wounds with "we could easily be 2-6 and dead in the water."
 
Right now I’m like Indiana Jones hanging onto that whip being dragged beneath the truck, and trying desperately to get back on board the bandwagon. Last week I pulled myself onto the front grill, and now face only one more stage before getting fully on board. This BC game will do it - if we win I get in the cab and throw my fears out the side of the truck and watch them tumble behind me never to be seen again. Here’s hoping we have a comfortable win.

Back to reality - I have always liked Dino. He seems like a fine man, and someone I would not mind have coaching, teaching and guiding my sons for 4 years if either played football at Syracuse. He does, however, have his flaws as we all do. Fortunately, mine are not dissected every single day on a message board frequented by folks who watch what I do for a living on TV.

I’m not positive how I would react to: “ did you see how long it took Big Mike to get to that phone message?” “The book says you should get back in 5 minutes - he took 17…”. And, after a few days of that - several times after losing a deal I thought I had won - you tell me that I have to have a presser and explain myself to a horde of click bait driven media types - no thank you.

Yes, I know Dino makes a lot of money, and that goes with the territory - so that’s fair. I also think it’s fair to point out that Dino seems, finally, to have this thing pointed in the right direction. He’s made very tough decisions, both with his staff, and with some players. I guess for me, it just seems like they take a little too long, but I’m a fan and instant gratification is in my DNA.

At this point, to my untrained eye, the core of this team is young, strong and improving. This core, let by GS and ST and all those single digit fellas on defense, is as competitive a bunch as we have seen in some time. This, hopefully, will lead to at least 2 more wins and a bowl berth. It will also, knock wood, lead to more young men with football talent wanting to come to Syracuse to play for the Orange. The next step is Saturday against BC. Let’s keep this thing on track now and into the foreseeable future.
 
5-7 is pretty big improvement over last year. It would be hard to justify firing him on that metric. But, 5/6 losing seasons is another metric that shows 2018 was a fluke.
I don’t think 2018 was a fluke. I think SU overachieved by a game or two. 2016 and 2017 we perfumed well, played exciting football most of the time, but couldn’t keep our QB on the field. Ultimately too Many injuries and not enough depth. 2019 was underachieving by a game or so. 2020 was the fluke.
 
Every player is now his recruits…everything is a direct reflection of him…
Agreed it’s all on him. A RB leading the nation in rushing and garnering a lot of national exposure for the program. A QB who is high nationally in rushing and is just starting to get comfortable with a young corps of receivers who appear to have a lot of potential. An offensive line who finally seem to be performing and well coached.A defense that is performing well by many measurements. Cornerbacks who seem to be making a name for themselves in back to back years despite the turnover. Linebackers who perform consistently high. A defensive line who brings it every game with a sizable rotation. A punt/kick returner who is a threat to break one every time he touches the ball. Excitement from the fans at the possibility of returning #44 to prominence. A young team with a ridiculous number of 1st and 2nd year players in the two-deep. A team that has finally demonstrated a competitiveness with our peer group of opponents.

Yeah, I can’t imagine what there is to be optimistic about! Damn you Dino Babers!
 
In my opinion, I don't hold Dino's first two seasons against him. Shafer constructed an awful roster. Dungey got hurt. Twice. One of those seasons, we were bowl caliber but the season sunk because we had zero quality depth behind Eric.

The biggest issue I have was passing the baton after Eric graduated, from the terrific 10-3 2018 season. Dino really needed to connect on DeVito being a quality replacement, or Chance Amie being a dual threat in the Dungey mold. We went 0-2 for various reasons, which lead to another 5 win season [yes, I know we beat WF on the final play, and could have lost the game]. But better QB play could have gotten that team to a bowl. We didn't have it, so we didn't get there - and momentum was squandered.

I'm not of the mindset that last year "doesn't count," but the OL injuries were absurd and couldn't be overcome, and Tommy again didn't show the chops. Disaster season, in every respect.

Post QB-swap this year, we seem to be headed in the correct direction. Whereas we were a poor defensive team under Dino the first couple of years, he made a home run hire in Tony White and shored that up. 3-3-5 is also a good "system" for us to run, given our traditional difficulty recruiting impact DL. I think the jury is still out on Gilbert, but I like what we're doing offensively now with Shrader / Tucker. I'm also pleased that we were able to go toe-to-toe with the best team in the conference [WF] and teams littered with 4- and 5-star recruits in FSU and Clemson. Losing those games were gut punches; going 0-3 might sink the season with respect to bowl eligibility.

Which means that it all comes down to Saturday. Need to win against a BC team decimated by injuries, at home, and get closer to the goal.

Then, we get a much needed bye week -- where the team can rest up, recuperate, hopefully get some guys back on the field who've been hindered by nagging injuries, and spend an extra week preparing for the next opponent. Louisville is good, but not unbeatable -- not given how we're playing now. Ditto NC State. Have to find a way to get another win from those last three games.

Moving forward, we seem to be positioned well. Hopefully, Tucker gets #44 -- that would generate a lot of enthusiasm amongst the fan base. And if we scrap our way to a bowl, we'll see a lot of momentum -- both on the recruiting trail as we finish up this class, but also with class of 2023 recruits. And the team itself will have a lot of excitement, coming back with Shrader / Tucker. And I'm also hearing that Lamson is impressing the coaching staff, so the long-term future looks bright beyond Shrader.

As long as we've got those Shrader / Tucker, we can play with just about anybody. Perhaps not the truly elite teams, but those two are going to give us a helluva advantage over peer programs. I can't see us not getting to 7 wins the next two seasons with them as the nucleus of the offense. Stringing together multiple bowl seasons would go a long way toward righting the ship, and getting the fans back on-board.

Dino still has flaws. Most coaches who haven't ascended to elite programs do. And some changes need to be made -- he needs someone to help him do better with game management, and we've got to get ST figured out. But much as how Dino was perceived as being lousy defensively and then bolstering the staff to get that sorted out, it will be incumbent on him to make those adjustments and improve the staff in both of those domains.

Not an insurmountable task.

But it all comes down to getting a win against BC on Saturday. If we do, then excitement continues to build. We're practically in November, and football is fun again. We have something to play for, and players that are exciting as hell to watch. Tucker is producing a record shattering season. A bowl this year is within reach.
the only thing I disagree with in this outstanding post is that we will have two more years of Shrader/Tucker. I will be shocked if Sean does not leave for the NFL after next year. otherwise, this post kicks arse
 
Everyone bring a pizza box on Saturday… for no particular reason…

Especially if you’re on the BC sideline
 
because im not short sighted and understand the vagaries of sport. I also have the ability to look at more than win-loss. I give credit for the way a team looks and also how difficult it is to win here. I also look at the coaching carousels that happen at other losing programs and feel it should be a situation that should be avoided. It takes time to build a program, multiple recruiting cycles, unless your bama.

no offense to you, but i view the ppl on the fire dino bandwagon as incredibly ignorant ppl who lack ability to think through complex problems and view things in very black and white terms. I wouldnt trust them with my grocery list. I know thats an overgeneralization but i just feel its a very dumb opinion to have.
Lol at the "no offense" caveat.
 
No one wants to hear this but the Maryland game was bigger
 

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