Jacksonville Gameday...

[OttosDad]

Not to derail the conversation, I just recently moved down to the Tri-State area. Anyone on here have any bar recommendations for college lacrosse viewing purposes. Anywhere in Hoboken, Jersey City, or Manhattan??

 

[bjred]

Great stuff here. I don’t think that English played man up, just man down. Pretty sure EMO was Spallina, Thomson, Hiltz, Leo, Deere and Birtwistle. I could be wrong.

I was wrong, I thought he was out there for one of the man ups but he wasn't. The first three it was Spallina, Hiltz, Rhoa, Thomson, Deere, and Leo. On the fourth man up near the end of the game, Leo and Thomson were replaced with Anderson and Elijah-Brown.

2. I was left wanting a bit more out of McCool. I could be wrong but I think he was at 2 goals allowed off 4 shots at half? Not amazing against that team. I was actually really pleasantly surprised by Ippoliti. Seemed to be reacting faster/getting it out of his stick faster on clears. That will be a competition to watch as the season goes on. With McCool’s size I hope he does a bit better next go around. Defenders looked really good though!

One of those was in transition with Rhoa trying to get over to cover and the other was when they were down two men with the same type of shot we usually see Hiltz score with. Granted he wasn't tested much as the defense did a good job in front of him but he still ended the day at 75%.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Not to derail the conversation, I just recently moved down to the Tri-State area. Anyone on here have any bar recommendations for college lacrosse viewing purposes. Anywhere in Hoboken, Jersey City, or Manhattan??

Definitely some Cuse friendly bars in NYC, whether or not they accommodate for lacrosse I have no idea. Curious about that myself tho

 

[DoctahLexus]

As an example, Hop just put up 13 on Denver’s defense. See if you can find one goal that involves one of their attack even drawing a slide against a close defensemen. Closest to it is Bauer dodging on an LSM from up top. Literally all 13 are off challenging short stick match ups, crisp ball movement after the rotations, pick plays, skip passes, and just nice feeds inside to guys who are practically covered. There are more ways than one to put up points on top defenses! Melendez and Chauvette fill up the stat sheet without torching a long pole.

 

[Powellfan]

I know there are risks involved, but having English out there on man down puts so much pressure on the other team. If they turn it over it very well could be a man down goal the other way. Offenses have to hedge their bets.

 

[Cuse4455]

Ryder Ochoa #50 really impressed me at SSDM. He's quick but built well for being 185. Levine is a big guy but he struggles against guys with even decent speed.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Best slightly unexpected performance has to be McCarthy, who beat out a lot of potential guys to get the second line middie spot with Birtwistle and Deere. Fast and has some moves off the dodge. Looks like a guy who can be useful in similar ways to English. They had him doing two way stuff/wing play and I thought he looked solid there too.

 

[cuselaxss26]

yea mcCarthy looks like he can initiate if need be. He seems to had good vision. I do hope they use the 3rd line like they did early in game also. Hottle think had 4th goal of game. I understand want ur top 2 lines get in groove and all. But i think if can throw ur 3rd in also will do wonders. Even if just having third line in with 1st line defenders just to make them waste more energy while giving our top lines breather.

 

[cuselaxss26]

Also like spallina showing little range. Think having guys can snipe from mid to long range can be just as good as someone who can dodge. Force the D to have to press out, opening up inside will we can feast.

 

[PhatOrange]

Some random thoughts

I can see now Anderson isn't quit ready to be a starter like I thought he could be last summer but woah does he have immense potential.

Love Mike Leo. He's just good.

I really loved how physical the D played and we seemed to really want ground balls. Lots of hustle plays.

Thought McCool moved well for a big kid. Took a minute getting used to for me since our goalies are usually thin athletic wiry kids.

Thought the SSDM and LSMs looked good, also thought I saw Figueiras playing SSDM.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Thought the SSDM and LSMs looked good, also thought I saw Figueiras playing SSDM.

That might have been Jake Spillina #1.

 

[PhatOrange]

That might have been Jake Spillina #1.

I was only sort of paying attention and my eyes could've deceived me but I swear the kid's jersey said Figueiras and he had a short stick. He was coming off the field at the time.

I thought it was an experiment and to get other kids on the field (it was late in the game), I'll watch closer next time.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[wgdsr]

Said my piece on this before, but I disagree pretty strongly that the only way an attack can be valuable is by being able to score 1v1 on an elite long pole match up. To say that ball movement can only create looks on man up, is something that I would call just not true. This is not just true for our team but every team in college lax right now. Skip passes, pick plays/two man game, quick ball movement after a defensive rotation, set plays involving offball picks, even just feeding a guy whose man loses him for a fraction of a second or is not right on his hands, are extremely common ways of scoring 6v6 in the game today, by all teams!

I would have more of an issue with Thomson and Spallinas lack of high end speed if 1) They were not literally tops in the nation at creating scoring opportunities with those methods above and 2) if we did not have several different guys in the midfield who were capable of drawing slides and rotating a defense on a regular basis.

And I think we can expect some wrinkles in the lineup like late last season where we put Leo at attack for more traditional speed dodging, depending on what type of defense we face. I do not disagree entirely with 88-09 and he’s clearly knows the game well, but think his view is too black and white on what makes an attack quality. Could certainly say a lot more about this topic and appreciate the discussion.

was about to post much of this, and well said. there are lots of ways to skin a cat nowadays. ultimately, it comes down to execution whatever ways are most prevalent in an offense. with 4? certified box guys in the top 9, it's not surprising it's not filled with run-by-your-guy guys.

to look for for me is whether the gait-free-flowing try-some-things stuff, while fun to watch, isn't something that bites them @ the wrong time as the noose gets tight and every finish needs to be optimized. it worked for the coach in the day because they were so good the noose rarely got tight.

 

[PhatOrange]

was about to post much of this, and well said. there are lots of ways to skin a cat nowadays. ultimately, it comes down to execution whatever ways are most prevalent in an offense. with 4? certified box guys in the top 9, it's not surprising it's not filled with run-by-your-guy guys.

to look for for me is whether the gait-free-flowing try-some-things stuff, while fun to watch, isn't something that bites them @ the wrong time as the noose gets tight and every finish needs to be optimized. it worked for the coach in the day because they were so good the noose rarely got tight.

yep and if you look at last year in the losses the offense wasn’t the problem except for Denver - 8 goals.

5 other losses they averaged 13.4 goals; that’s unheard of. With the same attackman who are not 1v1 iso dodgers. The iso run by you dodgers are the middies.

not sure what the official name is but this weave concept they’re running really fits the teams skill set.

 

[DMVCuseLax]

yep and if you look at last year in the losses the offense wasn’t the problem except for Denver - 8 goals.

5 other losses they averaged 13.4 goals; that’s unheard of. With the same attackman who are not 1v1 iso dodgers. The iso run by you dodgers are the middies.

not sure what the official name is but this weave concept they’re running really fits the teams skill set.

Was gonna post the same. Game isn’t about 1 v 1 dodging anymore. You don’t see too many players dodging without a pick. We did a poor job last year getting through picks and staying on matchups. We did that against a Jacksonville. Hopefully that continues especially against teams like Maryland that set picks all over the offensive end of the field.

 

[Cuse4455]

yep and if you look at last year in the losses the offense wasn’t the problem except for Denver - 8 goals.

5 other losses they averaged 13.4 goals; that’s unheard of. With the same attackman who are not 1v1 iso dodgers. The iso run by you dodgers are the middies.

not sure what the official name is but this weave concept they’re running really fits the teams skill set.

Gary created the weave concept for the womens game. It was deadly, watch any game from his final womens season and you'll see how effective it is..
I told my boss (lacrosse fan) that if he can figure it into the men's game it would be game breaking, hopefully he continues to add more wrinkles.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Would also say that if Hiltz and Spallina were truly useless when it came to dodging that would also be a problem for the offense. Fortunately they have proven they can draw slides or at least the eyes of the defense when initiating against most matchups. Hiltz coming out of the gate looking slimmer and faster should draw some eyes from the defense, even when he is up against a tougher long pole. Then he can exploit that with his feeding ability.

Spallina will likely never be sprint past a longpole levels of fast, but he has proven he can take the body and get to that five and five spot above the cage against most defenders. Even though it is not a speed dodge, defenses do not want to deal with a guy posted up in front of the cage like that, and often send a slide in that situation. Then he is the best in the business at exploiting those slides. Both are more than capable of exploiting a short stick matchup when it happens after a defense rotates. I think there is still a minimum level of dodging still required for most non-offball attack, but Hiltz and Spallina both offer enough there.

 

[PhatOrange]

Gary created the weave concept for the womens game. It was deadly, watch any game from his final womens season and you'll see how effective it is..
I told my boss (lacrosse fan) that if he can figure it into the men's game it would be game breaking, hopefully he continues to add more wrinkles.

It's box influenced and I love it. Love the constant movement and when O kids are moving it's makes the defense susceptible to any number of different mistakes. From an offensive standpoint when you're catching the ball on the run like that you can get downhill in a hurry. It puts a lot of pressure on the defense.

 

[PhatOrange]

Was gonna post the same. Game isn’t about 1 v 1 dodging anymore. You don’t see too many players dodging without a pick. We did a poor job last year getting through picks and staying on matchups. We did that against a Jacksonville. Hopefully that continues especially against teams like Maryland that set picks all over the offensive end of the field.

unless you're at a HS showcase LOL

 

[JeremyCuse]

Thank you for the nice comment and the question.

I recommend to rewatch any of the games we played against top 5 teams last year (ND, Denver, Maryland, Army, or Duke in the ACC tournament). Our team last year looked Very similar to this year’s team (we basically have the same players), so you’ll be able to see how our offense struggles to beat good defenses 1 on 1. Our attackmen could not create unassisted goals by just beating their long stick defenders 1 on 1. In field lacrosse, beating your defender 1 on 1 is the essence of lacrosse. Gait, as a coach, puts more emphasis on ball movement on offense (which is ironic because Gait, as a player, was one of the most unstoppable 1 on 1 players ever!), but ball movement is only effective if you have a man advantage, either through a man-up or a fast break or by beating a defender and then drawing a slide and creating an open player. If we can’t beat a defender 1 on 1, then we end up just passing the ball around in a circle… Almost all of Spallina’s goals will come in fast break, and mostly true for Hiltz, too. At some point we’ll need an attackman who can beat a defender 1 on 1, and Spallina and Hiltz are just too slow. All good lacrosse teams (including all of the great past SU teams) have a balanced attack with each of the 3 attackmen serving a role of either dodging, shooting/finishing, or passing (most good attackman can do 2 out of those 3; only the special Tewaarton-candidate players can do all 3, and we, again, don’t have one of those), but having 3 ‘finishers’ on attack and no dodgers is not smart and is not a strategy that has ever shown to be successful for winning a national championship.

Leo is again the team’s best player, and he’s actually a natural attackman, a good dodger, is even a lefty, so he should be on the field the whole game as an attackman.

You’ll see it when we play Maryland in a few weeks. Our non-Rice SSDM will get exposed and our offense will have difficulty scoring if we’re not in a fast break or man-up (just like last year; it’ll feel like Deja vu, although I’ll be shocked if Maryland again puts a SSDM on Leo; that was a big mistake they made against us last year).

I’m also really concerned that we have No depth at the face-off X. Mullen is very aggressive after he gets the ball, so he will get tired and banged up as the season goes on. We don’t appear to have a solid second face-off specialist. That will be a horrible case of Deja vu if we lose a big game because we get dominated at the X again. I think we should have gotten a solid face off specialist back up through the portal or recruitment

You make some interesting points esepcially on attack. I have been a strong advocate of putting an above average dodger out there with Joey and Hiltz but I am willing to see how it works with Thomson against a team like Maryland and what adjustments Gait/March make. I do hope if we see a repeat of last year we will simply swap Thomson and Leo or bring in Bear Anderson who I think clearly showed his future is at attack.

On the faceoff front the staff did bring in Drew Angelo who they are high on but he's just a frosh. I agree it isn't optimal but hard to bring in a seasoned FOGO who clearly is going to be the #2 with Mullen already on the roster. I do think they will have to add someone next offseason even with the roster cap as Richiusa and Fine both graduate and there is no current FOGO coming in next year as a recruit. I do think Richiusa could do a decent job in a pinch. Certainly struggled a few years ago when asked to be the main FOGO but I'd like to think if he had to take a handful of draws a game he could be around 50%.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Film Review: Analyzing No. 2 Syracuse’s 10-0 run vs. Jacksonville

In No. 2 Syracuse's 24-5 thrashing of Jacksonville Saturday, its explosive offense jumped out to a 10-0 lead. Our beat writer breaks down four key goals that defined SU’s offense in its season-opening win.

dailyorange.com