JB saying Frank is all league is...

[OrangeDW]

And chukwu missed a dunk.

Par for the course this year.

He missed a dunk and fell on his butt. That’s gotta be a bucket, but at the same time I couldn’t even be mad, felt bad for the kid. His 3 point play at the end was great to see though.

 

[SUFan44]

Whose fault is it he's playing PG for 40?

You can't force a guy to play 40 minutes with zero better options, then be pissed off he doesn't perform up to a level that you arbitrarily choose.

I don’t disagree. Why do you think Boeheim has tried to recruit PGs the last two years and brought in two grad transfers? Because he knows Frank is limited.

And I didn’t arbitrarily choose a Top 25 PG. Our program has dictated my expectation level.

 

[SUFan44]

People are annoyed? Apparently the coach on this team, who's only been around for 42 years, disagrees. I'm going with him. Btw, having the ball in your hands is how you get assists.

The coach that’s been here 42 years tried to recruit over him and played a 5-9 PG in a 2-3 zone over him last year.

He struck out with a top PG in recruiting and is forced to build him up and play him because the alternative is another PG who had offers from Canisius and low major levels.

Until we get a PG, or someone who can dictate tempo and run an offense, our offense will be similar to what we have now. Only asterisk I will add is Bazley might be good enough to help us overcome even the Frank deficiency. A combination of that and Carey potentially being a lead guard, too.

 

[rrlbees]

Frank shoots 3’s too, last I checked. He’s part of that problem.

Frank gets assists because he dominates the ball and plays 40 minutes a game.

He’s improved but he’s not close to a Top 25 PG on a good team. Not even close. That’s why people are annoyed.

Narratives are fun too though.

Yea, Franks not shooting well either so he’s part of the teams shooting problem. But that wasn’t my point about his assists and our shooting. He could be shooting 80% from the field, it’s not going to add 1 assist to his totals.

 

[SoBeCuse]

He’s not slow. His handle is so so. Not great for a PG, but pretty good for a 2 or a “combo guard”. Better than it was Last year though, IMO. He’s way better than Washington now.(he’s a young player who will take time just like Frank has).

I do think he’s a more natural 2 guard. Not an insult. I think he’d play better and his strengths would come out more and weaknesses hidden better playing next to a big time pure PG - which we don’t have right now.

He’s slow. Do you remember the Colgate game? The foot race 3/4 length of the court between him and the Colgate 6’8 forward? He couldn’t catch him then reached in and got called for the And-1. He’s improved for sure and he is all we got. He can score in spurts in different ways. It is what it is. But I think it would be factually incorrect to say he is quick footed, has good speed, or plays with any pace. The offensive scheme does him no favors but that’s another issue.

 

[OrangeDW]

Yea, Franks not shooting well either so he’s part of the teams shooting problem. But that wasn’t my point about his assists and our shooting. He could be shooting 80% from the field, it’s not going to add 1 assist to his totals.

He passes the ball well off penetration and to cutters IMO and has shown in the past that he can find shooters(when we had them). I like his passing ability...in the half court at least.

 

[OrangeDW]

He’s slow. Do you remember the Colgate game? The foot race 3/4 length of the court between him and the Colgate 6’8 forward? He couldn’t catch him then reached in and got called for the And-1. He’s improved for sure and he is all we got. He can score in spurts in different ways. It is what it is. But I think it would be factually incorrect to say he is quick footed, has good speed, or plays with any pace. The offensive scheme does him no favors but that’s another issue.

Maybe. I don’t remember that play. Comes across as average to me in that area, but you might be right.

 

[SUFan44]

Yea, Franks not shooting well either so he’s part of the teams shooting problem. But that wasn’t my point about his assists and our shooting. He could be shooting 80% from the field, it’s not going to add 1 assist to his totals.

Care to discuss his 51 turnovers, which leads the ACC?

Or his 1.43 assist-to-turnover ratio which is the lowest of any ACC guard in the top 20 in assists except Pitt’s freshman PG? Pitt is 8-5 right now.

He has improved but he’s not an all-league guard and most certainly not a starting point guard on a Top 25 team.

 

[manleyzoo]

The coach that’s been here 42 years tried to recruit over him and played a 5-9 PG in a 2-3 zone over him last year.

He struck out with a top PG in recruiting and is forced to build him up and play him because the alternative is another PG who had offers from Canisius and low major levels.

Until we get a PG, or someone who can dictate tempo and run an offense, our offense will be similar to what we have now. Only asterisk I will add is Bazley might be good enough to help us overcome even the Frank deficiency. A combination of that and Carey potentially being a lead guard, too.

Why does that matter? That was then this is now. Get over it already. The problem with the Frank bangers is they just can't get over last year. As Bees said, the problem with the offense isn't Frank, it's we can't shoot. You just want to put it on Frank but apparently the coach doesn't. If you look at JB's history he plays the guys who he thinks can do it. And again, JB only builds Frank up because he's so fragile? That's BS. It's so impossible that he actually believes Frank's pretty good now and can be special next year?

 

[manleyzoo]

Care to discuss his 51 turnovers, which leads the ACC?

Or his 1.43 assist-to-turnover ratio which is the lowest of any ACC guard in the top 20 in assists except Pitt’s freshman PG? Pitt is 8-5 right now.

He has improved but he’s not an all-league guard and most certainly not a starting point guard on a Top 25 team.

And you know this how? Seems like the guy who's been on the job for 42 years may know just a bit more than a guy on a message board.

 

[SUFan44]

Why does that matter? That was then this is now. Get over it already. The problem with the Frank bangers is they just can't get over last year. As Bees said, the problem with the offense isn't Frank, it's we can't shoot. You just want to put it on Frank but apparently the coach doesn't. If you look at JB's history he plays the guys who he thinks can do it. And again, JB only builds Frank up because he's so fragile? That's BS. It's so impossible that he actually believes Frank's pretty good now and can be special next year?

You believe what you want, I believe what I see and want, too.

I hope like heck Frank gets better and improves to the point that he can be a Top 25 PG. I just don’t see it.

 

[shermstheman]

Not sure I get the point of Frank bashing. Considering he’s the best point Cuse has, considering how far he’s come, considering the team is so far ahead of where 99% predicted they’d be I feel very good about him- especially since he’s really playing out of position. It’s not like there is a better option. He wears Orange, plays hard, and is the best Cuse has at his position. Therefore, I’m all for Frank.

 

[OrangeDW]

Care to discuss his 51 turnovers, which leads the ACC?

Or his 1.43 assist-to-turnover ratio which is the lowest of any ACC guard in the top 20 in assists except Pitt’s freshman PG? Pitt is 8-5 right now.

He has improved but he’s not an all-league guard and most certainly not a starting point guard on a Top 25 team.

Agreed. He’s improved and doing some things well and clearly a top 3 player on this team. I feel like on a strong SU team he’s a 15 mpg combo guard (backing up the one and the two) off the bench or possibly a starting SG if we’ve got a real good PG.

Comparing him to SU starting PG’s...he’s definitely better than guys like Wright, Edwards, Thues, and Joseph.

I’d take our non-NBA, not All League PG’s like Triche, Griffin, Sims(don’t think any of them were all league off memory), over him without hesitation.

We usually have someone better, but this year we don’t. I can’t be mad at him - he’s improved a lot and is one of our better players.

 

[rrlbees]

Care to discuss his 51 turnovers, which leads the ACC?

Or his 1.43 assist-to-turnover ratio which is the lowest of any ACC guard in the top 20 in assists except Pitt’s freshman PG? Pitt is 8-5 right now.

He has improved but he’s not an all-league guard and most certainly not a starting point guard on a Top 25 team.

That’s called deflecting.

 

[hoopsupstate]

Frank has done much better than I thought he ever would. Frank is giving us everything he has and his effort is so much better. My issue isn't’ with Frank, but with the coaching staff who hasn’t or can’t bring in a capable point guard since Ennis. What is it now? Five or six years. Totally unacceptable and mind boggling. You look at this roster and we have 4 open scholarships. It’s hard to believe they couldn’t find someone out there who could shoot the ball or play the point.

 

[Arangeman]

JB is clearly on a season long campaign to build Frank up. It's sort of the opposite of the Roberson campaign from last year.

 

[SUFan44]

That’s called deflecting.

It’s called a counterpoint.

 

[rrlbees]

It’s called a counterpoint.

unrelated to my post. that's like me saying the sky is a pretty blue and you saying the grass is an ugly brown.

 

[Cusefan0307]

He actually has the 30th highest assist rate in the country according to Kenpom. He might be first if we had a shooter or bigs that could finish.

 

[JazzNC]

IMO the issue with Frank is complicated.

1. He's playing out of position
2. He's being judged by the shadows cast from last year
3. He truly does have a lot of talent
4. He can make the spectacular play look easy at times
5. BUT... he makes the stupidest plays I've ever seen... ghost passes, poor shot selection, high/lazy dribble.

I think what's frustrating, is that the potential is there. But where Frank's head is half the time... I don't know. He's a puzzling player. I'm not anti-Frank, and truth be told, I don't think his critics are either, really. We all want Frank to excel. He's just maddening to watch and understand.

 

[Arangeman]

IMO the issue with Frank is complicated.

1. He's playing out of position
2. He's being judged by the shadows cast from last year
3. He truly does have a lot of talent
4. He can make the spectacular play look easy at times
5. BUT... he makes to stupidest plays I've ever seen... ghost passes, poor shot selection, high/lazy dribble.

I think what's frustrating, is that the potential is there. But where Frank's head is half the time... I don't know. He's a puzzling player. I'm not anti-Frank, and truth be told, I don't think his critics are either, really. We all want Frank to excel. He's just maddening to watch and understand.

He doesn't have the requisite traditional PG skill set to be a 1, he doesn't shoot well enough to be a 2 and he's too small to be a 3.

But he also does some great things out there, some slick passes, big shots/drives and key steals. He's kind of a player who will be out of position, no matter what position he plays, but still brings value on the court. If that makes any sense.

 

[FrancoPizza]

You're just gonna be miserable the next 1 1/2 years as he's the starting PG this year and next.

I guess we should check back in 2019-2020 to see if we have a point guard who knows to run a break.

 

[MonsterGame]

What league?

Tavern league, of course.

 

[rrlbees]

I guess we should check back in 2019-2020 to see if we have a point guard who knows to run a break.

You do that.

 

[cuseinseattle]

Frank shoots 3’s too, last I checked. He’s part of that problem.

Frank gets assists because he dominates the ball and plays 40 minutes a game.

He’s improved but he’s not close to a Top 25 PG on a good team. Not even close. That’s why people are annoyed.

Narratives are fun too though.

I’m not sure I understand your 3rd point. Are you saying every PG on every team in the top 25 is better than Frank. If so I think your completely wrong.