JG3 on third team AND what we will need for next year

[two3zone]

What is it about our pace that he couldn’t keep up with?

People make it sound like he’s Celtics Shaq trying to get across center court with 15 seconds left on the shot clock.

 

[sufan59]

No, I understand that. I was just curious why Joe couldn’t play for a fast paced team.

If we played a lot of full court press, for instance, I’d see how that wouldn’t be great for him. But we don’t. We’re not terribly efficient at starting or converting fast breaks either. We just try to get the offense moving earlier in the shot clock, for the most part. I’d think Joe could handle that.

Handling it and being successful at it are two different things. I think people think we should have remorse that Joe left, but I think looking at this like Joe is successful at a team that is better than us is not the way to make a judgement of whether Syracuse lost someone that they should’ve kept.

 

[Brooky03]

Handling it and being successful at it are two different things. I think people think we should have remorse that Joe left, but I think looking at this like Joe is successful at a team that is better than us is not the way to make a judgement of whether Syracuse lost someone that they should’ve kept.

Okay, I think he’d be successful at it

 

[MikeSU02]

1. Happy that Joe landed somewhere and is having success.

2. He still wouldn’t fit on this team. Not in the way he would want.

3. He’s being much more efficient on O. Kudos.

4. The story for me isn’t about Joe, it’s about showcasing just how poorly run this program was recently and as soon as Joe jumps, he tackles efficiency issues immediately.

That’s the story. It’s not Joe. It’s how the program was being run.

 

[djcon57]

It was your favorite metric to through out last year. And what is DPBR? I assumed a typo.

LOL.

What am I lying about? All these acronyms look alike. And you certainly did hammer the other one. We discussed it numerous times how it’s useless and what sports reference said about it. And I found BPR and Mya. And yes DBPR jj is slightly better than Joe but Box DBPR Joe is better. But the Offensive metrics are such a disparity that Joe overall is graded far higher.

But again, none of this means diddly to me. Box score metrics for defense don’t exist. It’s almost meaningless.

I hope all is well with you sincerely. Have a good night.

 

[two3zone]

People gotta ask themselves if a Joe Girard clone was a High School senior right now, would be all in on recruiting his type of player to be a starter?

Now ask the same question and without naming Judah who would you recruit to play on your team?

 

[rrlbees]

I hope all is well with you sincerely. Have a good night.

Well when I said you hammered DBPM last year, you called me a liar. I’d say about 20 posts about BPM and sports reference was hammering.

 

[Day2]

Why is it that someone who left the program and transferred to a conference rival is treated with higher regard than some former and current players?

 

[Brooky03]

Why is it that someone who left the program and transferred to a conference rival is treated with higher regard than some former and current players?

Depends who the some are we’re talking about, I suppose.

 

[Sherman20]

Exactly and I will add... Joe got tons of criticism here. Some warranted and some way overboard considering the guy gave everything he had for 4 years at SU. There were silly comments about how Joe can't play at this level, how Joe should only get 15 a game etc. Well, he's actually playing 30 a game for a top 20 team and we miss him.

People view Joe differently because Joe didn't chase the $ like Jesse. He had the discussion with Autry and the best decision was made for both SU and for him. At least for this year, the decision has worked out better for him.

Cuse!

We don’t know what that conversation was like between Autry, the coaching staff and Joe but a lot of assumptions have been made about what was said. I suspect little of it is accurate.

 

[Sherman20]

Because roughly 97% of this board would have to swallow their pride and that’s a hard thing to do. When Joe hit the portal and we grabbed JJ…..the entire summer was filled with “We got a 5 star!! Now we have the Best backcourt in the ACC/Country! Joe should go to Siena, good riddance.”

Reasons? Seems like you might have some not so hidden agenda here

Why can't everyone just admit. The exchange of Joe for JJ is one side in favor of Joe at this point. At the same time, JJ has two more years to develop and that certainly matters for the long term. I can only speak for myself but I hold Joe in higher regard than Jesse. Joe would have stayed but was de prioritized. Therefore, he sought out a new home. You may think it's the same but I don't

Cuse

I like Joe and he did take some unfair criticism during his time at Cuse. I still think most fans loved what he gave us, appreciated his elite shooting skills and understood his limitations. But I’m confident that JJ Starling will have a better overall career at Syracuse over the next three years than Joe had over his four seasons. Remember, everything that Joe is doing this season at Clemson is in the additional 5th year that was added because of Covid. Joe is a highly seasoned and smart player and learned a ton in his four years at Cuse.

 

[Sherman20]

What is it about our pace that he couldn’t keep up with?

Are you kidding? Joe was not great on the fast break. He’s not an elite ball handler and struggled to finish at the rim against quicker, better athletes. This was also an issue in the half court, though he did improve over four years.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I like Joe and he did take some unfair criticism during his time at Cuse. I still think most fans loved what he gave us, appreciated his elite shooting skills and understood his limitations. But I’m confident that JJ Starling will have a better overall career at Syracuse over the next three years than Joe had over his four seasons. Remember, everything that Joe is doing this season at Clemson is in the additional 5th year that was added because of Covid. Joe is a highly seasoned and smart player and learned a ton in his four years at Cuse.

This is all true and so is the fact that JJ’s first two years in college have been worse than Girards. I got in a big debate with friends over this, but JJ is having the worst season at the 2 since Louis McCroskey was here and been arguably on the same level as Chris Bell and Justin Taylor for the season. He needs to improve and he needs to do it quickly because I’m ready for Elijah Moore/Chance Westry to compete with him for minutes.

 

[Cheriehoop]

247Sports' college basketball Midseason All-Transfer team

These 15 transfers have been outstanding.

247sports.com

This list also gives us some insight as to what type of player(s) from a production stand point that we will need to look to grab for next year!

Javian McCollum is another Siena transfer who is planning to go the Jalen Pickett route to the NBA.

 

[Brooky03]

Are you kidding? Joe was not great on the fast break. He’s not an elite ball handler and struggled to finish at the rim against quicker, better athletes. This was also an issue in the half court, though he did improve over four years.

We don’t run the break much or well right now, was my point

 

[Sherman20]

This is all true and so is the fact that JJ’s first two years in college have been worse than Girards. I got in a big debate with friends over this, but JJ is having the worst season at the 2 since Louis McCroskey was here and been arguably on the same level as Chris Bell and Justin Taylor for the season. He needs to improve and he needs to do it quickly because I’m ready for Elijah Moore/Chance Westry to compete with him for minutes.

JJ was injured for the majority of last year at ND. You know that. Joe never had a serious injury as a freshman. He had all of his freshman season to develop. And I didn’t realize the book on this season for JJ has already been written the first week of January. I have a ton of confidence in the player that Starling can become—though it might take an off-season of getting his shot back to where it was in HS before the injury.

And I don’t even know what to say about this: “JJ is having the worst season at the 2 since Louis McCroskey was here.”
Red and the coaching staff would laugh you out of the room with that comment. Starling needs time to get his groove back. McCroskey was a head case.

 

[Sherman20]

We don’t run the break much or well right now, was my point

Lol. Ok, good night. Game after game, the analysts show the stats and discuss how points off turnovers and scoring in transition is the strength of this year’s team. Outside shooting is not. We try to get steals and create turnovers and get out in transition. That’s how Red wants to play. Is it elite yet? No. But that is this team’s clear stength. A previous poster showed how we’re in the top 50 in the country in pace of play per KenPom, when we’ve been mostly a slow paced team for almost decade now. Good grief.

 

[Brooky03]

lol. Ok, good night. You’re clearly not watching the games or understanding what happens on the court. Game after game, the analysts show the stats and discuss how points off turnovers and scoring in transition is the strength of this year’s team. Outside shooting is not. Good grief.

I understand what a fast break is. I don’t think there is anybody who doesn’t. I don’t get the opportunity to watch many early season games against the bad teams. I have watched all of the games against the good ones, except Pitt.

Nobody was walking away from those games thinking we did well in transition. Early offense and transition are two different things.

 

[djcon57]

Lol. Ok, good night. Game after game, the analysts show the stats and discuss how points off turnovers and scoring in transition is the strength of this year’s team. Outside shooting is not. We try to get steals and create turnovers and get out in transition. That’s how Red wants to play. Is it elite yet? No. But that is this team’s clear stength. A previous poster showed how we’re in the top 50 in the country in pace of play per KenPom, when we’ve been mostly a slow paced team for almost decade now. Good grief.

NCAA College Men's Basketball DI current team Stats | NCAA.com

Discover the current NCAA Division I Men's Basketball leaders in every stats category, as well as historic leaders.

www.ncaa.com

42nd in the ncaa.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Because he’s hurt.

True and WVU even before Jesse was hurt and playing, was pretty bad. WVU was 4-5 with Jesse and are now 5-8 without him.

 

[two3zone]

JJ was injured for the majority of last year at ND. You know that. Joe never had a serious injury as a freshman. He had all of his freshman season to develop. And I didn’t realize the book on this season for JJ has already been written the first week of January. I have a ton of confidence in the player that Starling can become—though it might take an off-season of getting his shot back to where it was in HS before the injury.

And I don’t even know what to say about this: “JJ is having the worst season at the 2 since Louis McCroskey was here.”
Red and the coaching staff would laugh you out of the room with that comment. Starling needs time to get his groove back. McCroskey was a head case.

Joe was ranked in the 200s, JJ was a top guy and Joe as a freshman was light years better than sophomore JJ.

What you should say about the mccrosky thing is find someone who’s started since then that JJ is better than.

 

[Sherman20]

I understand what a fast break is. I don’t think there is anybody who doesn’t. I don’t get the opportunity to watch many early season games against the bad teams. I have watched all of the games against the good ones, except Pitt.

Nobody was walking away from those games thinking we did well in transition. Early offense and transition are two different things.

I revised my previous comment, so I’ll repeat what I said again. Game after game, the analysts show the stats and discuss how points off turnovers and scoring in transition is the strength of this year’s team, and that’s clear to anyone who watches the games. Outside shooting is not. We try to get steals and create turnovers and get out in transition. That’s how Red wants to play. Is it elite yet? No. But that is this team’s clear stength. A previous poster showed how we’re in the top 50 in the country in pace of play per KenPom, when we’ve been mostly a slow paced team for almost decade now.

You said: “Nobody was walking away from those games thinking we did well in transition.”
Is this an elite transition team or one of the vintage run and gun Syracuse teams from the 80s, 90s and 2000s? No. But it doesn’t need to be. My original point is that Joe isn’t a great player in the fast break. That’s not his game.

You commented that pace of play wouldn’t be an issue for Joe and that we don’t fast break much or that well. Which isn’t true.

If you missed the Pitt game, then you missed how well this team can excel in transition. We also proved that against Oregon, Gtown, LSU and others.

We also haven’t played any “bad” teams aside from maybe Niagara. It sounds like maybe you only watch the games against top 25 teams and Virginia. No wonder you have a skewed opinion of this team.

 

[Sherman20]

Joe was ranked in the 200s, JJ was a top guy and Joe as a freshman was light years better than sophomore JJ.

What you should say about the mccrosky thing is find someone who’s started since then that JJ is better than.

I don’t agree with this at all.
“Joe as a freshman was light years better than sophomore JJ.”

You acknowledged that Joe proved you wrong. I can’t wait for Starling to do the same in his Syracuse career. Why can’t fans try to have a little more patience and let these kids develop? JJ’s Syracuse career is all of 8 weeks old at this point.

 

[two3zone]

I don’t agree with this at all.
“Joe as a freshman was light years better than sophomore JJ.”

You acknowledged that Joe proved you wrong. I can’t wait for Starling to do the same in his Syracuse career. Why can’t fans try to have a little more patience and let these kids develop? JJ’s Syracuse career is all of 8 weeks old at this point.

Joe didn’t prove me wrong, he proved me right for three years, he had zero business running the point.

I have plenty of patience, I just don’t think he’s that good, there’s not much I like about his game.

 

[UpstateSM]

JG3 going 1-10 the first time I bet on Clemson this season is so poetic I cannot bring myself to get mad about it