JJ Starling Transferring to Syracuse

[two3zone]

If he was 10 inches taller, he would have been starting.

He was playing behind Mintz, Starling and Copeland.

Im just saying if he was a scoring threat he would've played.

 

[littlereg]

Think I’m gonna take up drinking again

 

[Niastri]

Think I’m gonna take up drinking again

No better time than 2 o'clock on a Saturday

 

[syrBossHogg]

I sorta wonder if the potential move of JJ to PG is defense related too.

 

[721Comstock]

Think I’m gonna take up drinking again

 

[sufandu]

DC played with Seikaly, Douglas, Thompson, Monroe, etc. if Freeman’s supporting cast is as good, 11 and 7 would be reasonable. But I don’t see two other starters likely to have 10 year NBA careers, do you?

Two ways to think about that. 1) Coleman had those numbers despite being the third option on the team. 2) Because of all the talent and balance we had, defenses couldn't focus on him, allowing him more opportunity to get his numbers. It's hard to say if the other great players on the team hurt or helped Coleman's numbers. If Freeman is our #1 option, he'll probably also be the primary defensive focus of the other team.

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

We'll see how this plays out at least the schedule is pretty easy and the best way to avoid losing to teams like Colgate is to score a lot. JJ as starting PG is fine for that portion of the schedule.

Just not sure he's the best option on the roster for that position particularly when the competition picks up. And if hes not what then? But yeah just have to see how it plays out and how some of our newcomers do.

 

[SuFTW]

Fairmount Wegmans.

 

[kcsu]

JJ is a baller and he's going to have a heck of a year. It took him half the season or more to regain his natural shooting stroke coming off the injury. His handle is fine dont forget Joe played point and didn't have the best left either.
If in fact JJ is at the 1 are they going with Chris at the 2?

 

[Cusefan0307]

JJ is a baller and he's going to have a heck of a year. It took him half the season or more to regain his natural shooting stroke coming off the injury. His handle is fine dont forget Joe played point and didn't have the best left either.
If in fact JJ is at the 1 are they going with Chris at the 2?

Joe was a better player to this point. JJ has
a lot of improving to do to get to his level.

 

[5OutFred]

JJ is going to be given first shot to drive the Orange bus surrounded by shooters.

If he struggles, we’ll turn to Carlos.

Mike and Donna have alluded to as much in recent podcasts. This appears to be the plan.

 

[Cappy3]

Mike and Donna have alluded to as much in recent podcasts. This appears to be the plan.

Hope not. That way lies disaster. For one thing, unless we’re starting Moore, we don’t have a “shooter” to start at the 2. Not Taylor, not Davis, not Westry, not Cuffe. Carlos is probably as good a shooter as any of them, and a much better point than Starling.

 

[Niastri]

Hope not. That way lies disaster. For one thing, unless we’re starting Moore, we don’t have a “shooter” to start at the 2. Not Taylor, not Davis, not Westry, not Cuffe. Carlos is probably as good a shooter as any of them, and a much better point than Starling.

I don't agree, I think we have some decent shooting with that lineup... If you have Starling, Lucas Taylor, Bell and Freeman starting with Lampkin in the middle, that's probably our best shooting lineup.

Lucas Taylor shot .354 from 3 pt on high attempts (5.8/game) last season.. Also, when playing in the ACC with Wake Forest the year before, he shot 5-12 (.417) against the better competition. By contrast, Carlos shot .344 from 3 last year, and was worse before that. There is a reason Carlos shot so many fewer 3s per game (3.9 vs 5.8)

Moore is the wildcard here. He might beat Lucas Taylor out for minutes by the end of the season, or even before it starts for that matter.

Edit: wrong low level ACC team in original

 

[kcsu]

Joe was a better player to this point. JJ has
a lot of improving to do to get to his level.

Joe was a good 2 an average point JJ can't be compared yet as he has never played pg for syracuse

 

[Cappy3]

I don't agree, I think we have some decent shooting with that lineup... If you have Starling, Lucas Taylor, Bell and Freeman starting with Lampkin in the middle, that's probably our best shooting lineup.

Lucas Taylor shot .354 from 3 pt on high attempts (5.8/game) last season.. Also, when playing in the ACC with Georgia Tech the year before, he shot 5-12 (.417) against the better competition. By contrast, Carlos shot .344 from 3 last year, and was worse before that. There is a reason Carlos shot so many fewer 3s per game (3.9 vs 5.8)

Moore is the wildcard here. He might beat Lucas Taylor out for minutes by the end of the season, or even before it starts for that matter.

A) He never played for Georgia Tech, he played for Wake.
B) Most of his 11 minutes per game for WF came in garbage time.
C) Last year with Georgia State he played against exactly one P5 opponent, so I’m not overly impressed with 35%.
D) The difference in 35% and 34% is one made basket per 100 shots.

 

[Niastri]

A) He never played for Georgia Tech, he played for Wake.
B) Most of his 11 minutes per game for WF came in garbage time.
C) Last year with Georgia State he played against exactly one P5 opponent, so I’m not overly impressed with 35%.
D) The difference in 35% and 34% is one made basket per 100 shots.

Thanks for correcting me on the school.

Other than that, we are trying to guess future outcomes based on limited data.

The fact that Taylor, compared to Carlos, shot at a higher percentage, on higher volume and in a better conference is absolutely a relevant data point.

Carlos is a very good passer and offense manager. Taylor is a scorer and shooter. It's what they were recruited to be for Syracuse.

The fact that Taylor is a better shooter shouldn't be surprising.

 

[Cappy3]

Thanks for correcting me on the school.

Other than that, we are trying to guess future outcomes based on limited data.

The fact that Taylor, compared to Carlos, shot at a higher percentage, on higher volume and in a better conference is absolutely a relevant data point.

Carlos is a very good passer and offense manager. Taylor is a scorer and shooter. It's what they were recruited to be for Syracuse.

The fact that Taylor is a better shooter shouldn't be surprising.

Again, you put a lot of value in making one more shot out of 100 tries. I’m pretty sure that Taylor won’t wind up anything more than a 7th or 8th man.

 

[Niastri]

Again, you put a lot of value in making one more shot out of 100 tries. I’m pretty sure that Taylor won’t wind up anything more than a 7th or 8th man.

I said better shooting percentage, on more attempts, in a better conference. You are discounting a lot of information that suggests Taylor is a better three point shooter. And focusing on the one data point that is ambiguous.

Taylor might wind up being a low rotation guy, as he has a ton of competition for his role. Carlos has none. He's the only true point on the team. Their position in the rotation will have little to do with raw shooting ability, and everything to do with how the roster puzzle pieces fit together.

If Westry hits his 90th percentile projection, both Taylor and Carlos might be getting extremely limited minutes by mid season.

I personally hope we don't need to rely heavily on either of them. If Carlos and Taylor play a lot of ACC minutes, it means a few things went wrong, principally that Starling's point guard experiment didn't go well, and Westry's return wasn't as triumphant as we hoped. That's the benefit and problem with taking senior transfers, you know their upside and floor with small error bars. They will be solid, but not spectacular.

We know it's deep in the off season, as we're arguing the relative merits of deep bench players.

 

[Cappy3]

I said better shooting percentage, on more attempts, in a better conference. You are discounting a lot of information that suggests Taylor is a better three point shooter. And focusing on the one data point that is ambiguous.

Taylor might wind up being a low rotation guy, as he has a ton of competition for his role. Carlos has none. He's the only true point on the team. Their position in the rotation will have little to do with raw shooting ability, and everything to do with how the roster puzzle pieces fit together.

If Westry hits his 90th percentile projection, both Taylor and Carlos might be getting extremely limited minutes by mid season.

I personally hope we don't need to rely heavily on either of them. If Carlos and Taylor play a lot of ACC minutes, it means a few things went wrong, principally that Starling's point guard experiment didn't go well, and Westry's return wasn't as triumphant as we hoped. That's the benefit and problem with taking senior transfers, you know their upside and floor with small error bars. They will be solid, but not spectacular.

We know it's deep in the off season, as we're arguing the relative merits of deep bench players.

You’re putting a lot into a guy shooting 1% better in a conference ranked one spot higher (Sun Belt 17, Coastal 18). Not enough difference to say he’s clearly a better shooter. I’d say they’re probably pretty even, and in every other aspect (ball handling, passing, assist/to ratio, defense) Carlos is clearly better. So making one more shot in 100 attempts doesn’t impress me. But I agree that hopefully both will play minor bench roles.

 

[Orangezoo]

You’re putting a lot into a guy shooting 1% better in a conference ranked one spot higher (Sun Belt 17, Coastal 18). Not enough difference to say he’s clearly a better shooter. I’d say they’re probably pretty even, and in every other aspect (ball handling, passing, assist/to ratio, defense) Carlos is clearly better. So making one more shot in 100 attempts doesn’t impress me. But I agree that hopefully both will play minor bench roles.

Honestly does it matter who gets what role? If we get good production and guys come in better than they were expected or better than the previous year and we win I could care less if it’s a random walk on who wins more minutes than expected.

I think the most basic thing is we need guys to improve on their weaknesses and being more consistent while working well with their teammates. We have the things they didn’t excel at or there are questions about litigated at length. The odds of improvement are usually high for many kids especially those with the highest ceilings and odds of consistency with some improvement higher for the kids coming in as 4th and 5th year guys. So at this point lace em up so we can see how this is going to work out.

 

[littlereg]

Honestly does it matter who gets what role? If we get good production and guys come in better than they were expected or better than the previous year and we win I could care less if it’s a random walk on who wins more minutes than expected.

I think the most basic thing is we need guys to improve on their weaknesses and being more consistent while working well with their teammates. We have the things they didn’t excel at or there are questions about litigated at length. The odds of improvement are usually high for many kids especially those with the highest ceilings and odds of consistency with some improvement higher for the kids coming in as 4th and 5th year guys. So at this point lace em up so we can see how this is going to work out.

Yeah as much as I don’t like the look right now, I don’t give a rats behind if come the season we’re balling. That’s all it comes down to to me, are we performing well? It could be a team full of all Boston sports fans and I’d be happy if we are winning.

 

[Orangezoo]

Yeah as much as I don’t like the look right now, I don’t give a rats behind if come the season we’re balling. That’s all it comes down to to me, are we performing well? It could be a team full of all Boston sports fans and I’d be happy if we are winning.

I am warming up to the look right now. I think we have a bunch of kids who can ball including a true big man, guys who can do multiple things on the court, some high end talent guys and experienced guys. Semantics matter a ton until we see it live but right now there are questions how this team will defend and how the positions will work out. That said there is a lot to work with here. Unless something wild happens not going to be pressing on top 15 conversations but overall a solid team with intriguing pieces that can win enough games to make the tournament in my view.

 

[MikeSU02]

If JJ gets the first shot, so be it. Two things:

1) I'd like to know what Red's ideal lead guard is/does (who is the doppelganger for what he wants). What is his definition / expectations? I think that matters a lot with who we are looking at, how he'd want to change it up when second unit comes in, etc.

2) I think this team isn't going to be a tournament team. Just my 0.02. Hope I'm wrong. But if you look at it through that lens, I mean, giving JJ a shot at lead guard, cool. Give him a shot. Honestly, we don't have a perfect answer at lead guard for my personal definition, but that and $2 gets you a bad cup of coffee, so who cares.The team is a combination of being flawed and unproven.

People were listing what was our biggest problem, ACC-level PG, rebounding, defense, etc, and the truth is we need it all and we didn't answer the bell, really.

My hope is that Bell gets like 10-15% better and can hit a shot off the curl consistently, JJ's shooting is back to being second-nature, Chance can stay healthy and Donnie is solid. But who knows. It's the hope that kills you.

 

[althea]

If JJ gets the first shot, so be it. Two things:

1) I'd like to know what Red's ideal lead guard is/does (who is the doppelganger for what he wants). What is his definition / expectations? I think that matters a lot with who we are looking at, how he'd want to change it up when second unit comes in, etc.

2) I think this team isn't going to be a tournament team. Just my 0.02. Hope I'm wrong. But if you look at it through that lens, I mean, giving JJ a shot at lead guard, cool. Give him a shot. Honestly, we don't have a perfect answer at lead guard for my personal definition, but that and $2 gets you a bad cup of coffee, so who cares.The team is a combination of being flawed and unproven.

People were listing what was our biggest problem, ACC-level PG, rebounding, defense, etc, and the truth is we need it all and we didn't answer the bell, really.

My hope is that Bell gets like 10-15% better and can hit a shot off the curl consistently, JJ's shooting is back to being second-nature, Chance can stay healthy and Donnie is solid. But who knows. It's the hope that kills you.

My concerns are more on defense. I know many posters love metrics, well according to the metrics we brought in an elite defensive coach. Let’s hope so!!

 

[Orangezoo]

If JJ gets the first shot, so be it. Two things:

1) I'd like to know what Red's ideal lead guard is/does (who is the doppelganger for what he wants). What is his definition / expectations? I think that matters a lot with who we are looking at, how he'd want to change it up when second unit comes in, etc.

2) I think this team isn't going to be a tournament team. Just my 0.02. Hope I'm wrong. But if you look at it through that lens, I mean, giving JJ a shot at lead guard, cool. Give him a shot. Honestly, we don't have a perfect answer at lead guard for my personal definition, but that and $2 gets you a bad cup of coffee, so who cares.The team is a combination of being flawed and unproven.

People were listing what was our biggest problem, ACC-level PG, rebounding, defense, etc, and the truth is we need it all and we didn't answer the bell, really.

My hope is that Bell gets like 10-15% better and can hit a shot off the curl consistently, JJ's shooting is back to being second-nature, Chance can stay healthy and Donnie is solid. But who knows. It's the hope that kills you.

It’s the b2b2b disappointments paired with weak regular seasons under JB in the last 10 yrs that is the killer of expectations. I think we are a tournament team and part of that is because of Red. He won 20 games with that mess last year.

The goodwill to be a faith without evidence fan base is withered. We just need to see it again. I think we will but it’s not here till we see it.