June is team opt out month for ACC: word is

[arbitragegls]

presume movement--not necessarily bad. This is from a relative in senior adminstrative position at NCState (cousin who gets me tickets for whatever ACC game I want to go to).
The problem and opportunity is for the ACC to find way to combat the negative PR that has been taking place around the ACC and its lack of "big ideas" for football such as SEC/Big 12 bowl game. The question is will the NC bowl championship come down to four teams...conference winners. If so, ACC maybe good way for a good team to make the championship game; however, that depends on which teams are in the ACC (could lose team (s) could gain team (s).
Importantly, the ACC will survive, but at what loss in football prestige? And if there is a loss in football powers, what effect does it have on media rights and dollars. It is going to be a rocky 45 days. Out of change does come opportunity...so I believe 'Cuse is going to be fine!

 

[44PRIDE]

SU is in a much better place even in a weakened ACC than it would be rotting in the Big East.

 

[arbitragegls]

SU is in a much better place even in a weakened ACC than it would be rotting in the Big East.

I agree with you...the ACC is a better place. As indicated above, there is opportunity still there...so it has to play out. But if team (s) are leaving, June is the timetable...also, doesnt mean some teams are not coming.
It will be good to get this over with soon so we can get back to having fun and enjoying 'Cuse's new conference.

 

[JJReddawg]

presume movement--not necessarily bad.

Not necessarily bad? BC and Wake leaving is not necessarily bad. Any mix of FSU, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Va Tech, or Miami would be bad. Very bad. Especially when the replacement canidates are UConn, Rutgers, and Louisville. Notre Dame is a pipe dream. The only chance they'd have with Notre Dame is while the conference is still together as it currently is. After that, just forget about it. We'll be fine in the sense that we'll still be playing football, but at what level.

 

[Guinness]

The ACC is going to be more of basketball conference with schools who happen to play football. I am okay with that. It will still be 1,000,000 times better than the CF that is the big east.

 

[MikeSU02]

Unless we are trading FSU and Clemson for ND and PSU, we need to hope that everyone stays put.

I have faith in Swofford, half for what he has done until this point and half just me hoping the best for SU.

 

[omniorange]

If the ACC loses FSU and Clemson, this is a bigger deal than some on this board are making it out to be since the playoffs will have a SOS component to it.

Without a SOS component, the ACC as currently comprised would have a difficult time making a 4-team playoff. With it added and losing FSU and Clemson, the odds just went even further south.

Yes, it will still be better than the Big East, but is that really saying much?

Cheers,
Neil

 

[KaiserUEO]

bottom line is we were all happy as a pig is shlit because Syracuse got out of the gawdaweful bigeast and into the much stronger ACC. but at the end of the day, all we really were happy about was that we didnt get left holding the bag if/when the ACC was annointed the 5th best and allowed to sit at the big boy table, while we sat at the kiddie table in the bigeast.

if the big boys decide that they only want 4, then so be it.

Syracuse is not usc, texas, okla, mich, osu, penn st, lsu, bama or fla...and nor should they think they could be.

im happy to be in the preeminent conference along the Atlantic Coast, playing football and basketball with like minded schools and where if someone goes 12-0 they have a shot to be one of the Final 4.

doomsday scenario is the ACC loses 6, i cant see it. but if it does the 8 left will be fine adding a few bigeast leftovers. 1-3 being Temple, rut and storz.

 

[Guinness]

Without a SOS component, the ACC as currently comprised would have a difficult time making a 4-team playoff. With it added and losing FSU and Clemson, the odds just went even further south.

Yes, it will still be better than the Big East, but is that really saying much?

Cheers,
Neil

Totally fair point. That said outside of VT what are the chances of any of the left behind ACC teams actually competing for a NC? Most are basketball schools who happen to play football.

 

[NKR1978]

Unless we are trading FSU and Clemson for ND and PSU, we need to hope that everyone stays put.

I have faith in Swofford, half for what he has done until this point and half just me hoping the best for SU.

The only thing that frightens me is that there are ACC schools that would naturally fit in the Big 12, SEC and B1G.

UNC, Virginia and Maryland to the B1G. Then it would be up to Notre Dame to join them to make it 16, otherwise Duke gets the nod.
GT, FSU, Miami and Clemson to the Big 12 to get to 16.
NC State and Virginia Tech to the SEC to get to 16.

We'd be stuck with Wake, BC, Pitt, Duke, UConn, Rutgers, Louisville, USF, UCF, Cincy, Memphis and Temple.

Fortunately, I don't see this happening as I think the core of the ACC truly loves the ACC and wouldn't want to see it die out. I also have faith in Swofford not to allow this to happen.

 

[omniorange]

Totally fair point. That said outside of VT what are the chances of any of the left behind ACC teams actually competing for a NC? Most are basketball schools who happen to play football.

Any ACC's teams chances at making a Final Four playoff are better with FSU and Clemson in the league than without them, right? You do get that, don't you?

Cheers,
Neil

 

[billsin01]

Unless we are trading FSU and Clemson for ND and PSU, we need to hope that everyone stays put.

I have faith in Swofford, half for what he has done until this point and half just me hoping the best for SU.

I guarantee you this conference will look different in the next 5 years than it does today. I mean, I have zero inside info, so my guarantee means nothing at all, but my point is programs that see dollar signs elsewhere are going to take the best deal they can get. The ACC, thanks to the downfall of the BE, is now the least attractive football conference (probably ending up behind the Big 12 again, as crazy as that seems). That puts it in a bad spot in terms of ensuring loyalty.

At the end of the day we made the right move to get to the ACC but we are in no way shape or form on super solid footing and primed for huge advantages over other programs, most of which will land on their feet somewhere.

 

[omniorange]

The only thing that frightens me is that there are ACC schools that would naturally fit in the Big 12, SEC and B1G.

UNC, Virginia and Maryland to the B1G. Then it would be up to Notre Dame to join them to make it 16, otherwise Duke gets the nod.
GT, FSU, Miami and Clemson to the Big 12 to get to 16.
NC State and Virginia Tech to the SEC to get to 16.

We'd be stuck with Wake, BC, Pitt, Duke, UConn, Rutgers, Louisville, USF, UCF, Cincy, Memphis and Temple.

Fortunately, I don't see this happening as I think the core of the ACC truly loves the ACC and wouldn't want to see it die out. I also have faith in Swofford not to allow this to happen.

Exactly, which is the ACC Armageddon scenario that has been out there for months now.

As for faith in Swofford, people might want to read this piece by Chadd Scott who until this weekend thought FSU to the Big 12 wasn't going to happen.

http://dev.chuckoliver.net/2012/05/...h-lead-to-my-missing-the-fsu-to-big-12-story/

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Guinness]

Any ACC's teams chances at making a Final Four playoff are better with FSU and Clemson in the league than without them, right? You do get that, don't you?

Cheers,
Neil

I totally get it. I guess I am a realist about most of the teams left behind not really playing football at a level to compete for NC anyway.

 

[omniorange]

I guarantee you this conference will look different in the next 5 years than it does today. I mean, I have zero inside info, so my guarantee means nothing at all, but my point is programs that see dollar signs elsewhere are going to take the best deal they can get. The ACC, thanks to the downfall of the BE, is now the least attractive football conference (probably ending up behind the Big 12 again, as crazy as that seems). That puts it in a bad spot in terms of ensuring loyalty.

At the end of the day we made the right move to get to the ACC but we are in no way shape or form on super solid footing and primed for huge advantages over other programs, most of which will land on their feet somewhere.

Agreed. But this notion of the Big 12 >>> ACC is puzzling to me.

Pac-12 wanted Texas and OU, so was willing to take TTU, OSU, and Baylor to get them.
Pac-12 didn't want OU and OSU by themselves without Texas
BiG wanted Texas with or without Texas A&M, but wouldn't budge on TTU.

But according to the ACC Armageddon scenario:

SEC covets NC State and VT
Big 12 wants FSU, Clemson, Miami, and GT
BiG has an interest in Maryland, UNC, and UVa
Big 12 if Miami and GT don't come with FSU and Clemson supposedly wants Pitt, a team they coveted before WVU only to lose them to the ACC.

And yet the Big 12 is the better conference? Really?

Makes no sense to me.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[omniorange]

I totally get it. I guess I am a realist about most of the teams left behind not really playing football at a level to compete for NC anyway.

Just going strictly by a Top 4 rankings the following teams in the past three years would have competed for an NC under a 4-team playoff model.

2011 - Oklahoma State and Stanford
2010 - TCU and Stanford
2009- Cincinnati and TCU

Who would have thought that back in 2005?

Just saying.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Chip]

bottom line is we were all happy as a pig is shlit because Syracuse got out of the gawdaweful bigeast and into the much stronger ACC. but at the end of the day, all we really were happy about was that we didnt get left holding the bag if/when the ACC was annointed the 5th best and allowed to sit at the big boy table, while we sat at the kiddie table in the bigeast.

if the big boys decide that they only want 4, then so be it.

Syracuse is not usc, texas, okla, mich, osu, penn st, lsu, bama or fla...and nor should they think they could be.

im happy to be in the preeminent conference along the Atlantic Coast, playing football and basketball with like minded schools and where if someone goes 12-0 they have a shot to be one of the Final 4.

doomsday scenario is the ACC loses 6, i cant see it. but if it does the 8 left will be fine adding a few bigeast leftovers. 1-3 being Temple, rut and storz.

Pretty much how I feel. I think the ACC teams will come to their senses and stay put. But I'll have to admit, it's kind of scary when academic leaders are making business decisions that are the result of them reading the newspaper.

Who knows where this ends, but life will go on. At some point, there will be dirty battles involving state politicians when it comes to one state school being included and one left out. Certain members of Congress (like it or not, whether anyone considers them powerless or not) will make plenty of noise and threats. Probably going to get ugly if doomsday takes over.

Powers that be would like college football to include no more than about 48 schools. They'll probably be forced to compromise at 64 at the minimum, but even that is going to be a dogfight.

At some point maybe someone at the table will stand up and say why exactly are we completely destroying the history and tradition of this sport? What are we really getting out of it?

 

[Janner]

presume movement--not necessarily bad. This is from a relative in senior adminstrative position at NCState (cousin who gets me tickets for whatever ACC game I want to go to).
The problem and opportunity is for the ACC to find way to combat the negative PR that has been taking place around the ACC and its lack of "big ideas" for football such as SEC/Big 12 bowl game. The question is will the NC bowl championship come down to four teams...conference winners. If so, ACC maybe good way for a good team to make the championship game; however, that depends on which teams are in the ACC (could lose team (s) could gain team (s).
Importantly, the ACC will survive, but at what loss in football prestige? And if there is a loss in football powers, what effect does it have on media rights and dollars. It is going to be a rocky 45 days. Out of change does come opportunity...so I believe 'Cuse is going to be fine!

As always, thank you for posting your insight into these matters. It is always great to have someone with some knowledge on the situation providing views and information on such an important topic. My questions for you concern the "not necessalily bad" and "could gain teams" statements. As some have discussed losing FSU and Clemson, could hurt significantly perception and power wise with regard to football (which drives the bus in revenue/expansion) how could this sitiation potentially not be bad? The only tam I could see leaving that would not hurt the conference financially would be NC St given the NC market is already supersaturated with ACC viewership. Adding another market in their place could actually be a "good thing". Outside of that I am not sure how there could be positives involved in lost membership.

Which leads me to the second question, when you say ACC could gain teams. Is this reactionary in nature due to losing a team(s), or is there something more to this? The only other way I could see this being benificial in some form would be similar to what had happend to the Big 12 when they originally lost teams a hand full of teams. Would the contract signed with ESPN allow the leage to sit at, lets say 12 with the loss of 2 ACC teams, and allow for the league to divide those dollars up to the remaining 12 schools thereby increaseing each schools alotment?

Regardless of your response, again, thank you for posting your information it is greatly appreciated!

 

[Moontan]

I have a hard time believing that a school ranked 34th overall by US News & World Report, and 4th for its primary programs of study, would leave the ACC to join the XII. Its "natural" conference affiliation is clearly the ACC.

That said, losing its 2 of its closest conference members (even if they are in another division) could make them at least do their due diligence.

 

[billsin01]

Agreed. But this notion of the Big 12 >>> ACC is puzzling to me.

Pac-12 wanted Texas and OU, so was willing to take TTU, OSU, and Baylor to get them.
Pac-12 didn't want OU and OSU by themselves without Texas
BiG wanted Texas with or without Texas A&M, but wouldn't budge on TTU.

But according to the ACC Armageddon scenario:

SEC covets NC State and VT
Big 12 wants FSU, Clemson, Miami, and GT
BiG has an interest in Maryland, UNC, and UVa
Big 12 if Miami and GT don't come with FSU and Clemson supposedly wants Pitt, a team they coveted before WVU only to lose them to the ACC.

And yet the Big 12 is the better conference? Really?

Makes no sense to me.

Cheers,
Neil

Maybe they aren't. I don't follow it that closely but what I thought I understood was that FSU and Clemson felt there was a chance they could make more money in the Big 12. And, in terms of legions of fans, I'm always under the impression that midwest/texas/plains states, etc. have much stronger fan followings than east/mid-atlantic/pac nw.

But you may be right. My general point is simply that I think the days of conferences meaning anything other than a loose affiliation that could be altered or perhaps even unexpectedly blow up at any minute are gone. This is why I think all the conference jumping/raiding is laughable. At the end of the day, the idea of a conference affiliation, IMO, is to belong to something that makes the whole greater than simply the sum of its parts (BE hoops, SEC/Big 10 Fball) due to a variety of factors (regional rivalries, fan interest, competition level, etc.). If teams are looking for the best deal financially and are no longer concerned about geographical proximity then there is zero loyalty and very little benefit to belonging a specific conference -- simply belonging to a conference is all that matters.

I'm not trying to cling to the past of BE hoops (well, maybe I am a little) but I very much believe at the very least we shouldn't get too used to the idea of the current configuration of the ACC.

 

[arbitragegls]

it is sort of like employment and corporations. The loyalty of one to the other has been blown apart over the past 10-15 years. So in a way, college athletics is doing the same...money is king. Maybe the Ivy League and others have it right...athletics is the tail wagging the dog..and that seems sad.

 

[tipphill]

Any ACC's teams chances at making a Final Four playoff are better with FSU and Clemson in the league than without them, right? You do get that, don't you?

Cheers,
Neil

fsu maybe,clemson is the most overated football team in america---consistantly mediocre at best----the attaction is the fan base and venue---winners they have not been and ae not

 

[NKR1978]

Exactly, which is the ACC Armageddon scenario that has been out there for months now.

As for faith in Swofford, people might want to read this piece by Chadd Scott who until this weekend thought FSU to the Big 12 wasn't going to happen.

http://dev.chuckoliver.net/2012/05/...h-lead-to-my-missing-the-fsu-to-big-12-story/

Cheers,
Neil

Two years ago the media got together with the conferences and saved the Big 12, or more specifically: to save Kansas, KSU, Iowa State and Baylor. The ACC has a far richer history and tradition that the 16 year old Big 12. I just have a really difficult time imagining that everyone is going to pull the trigger to make the doomsday happen.

 

[orangecuse]

it is sort of like employment and corporations. The loyalty of one to the other has been blown apart over the past 10-15 years. So in a way, college athletics is doing the same...money is king. Maybe the Ivy League and others have it right...athletics is the tail wagging the dog..and that seems sad.

Sad indeed. College & professional athletics are out of control...fueled by our society that glamorizes it in such a way...more emphasis than education & academics. No suprise why our culture has fallen behind so many other countries when it comes to global rankings in math, science, etc.

 

[44PRIDE]

Two years ago the media got together with the conferences and saved the Big 12, or more specifically: to save Kansas, KSU, Iowa State and Baylor. The ACC has a far richer history and tradition that the 16 year old Big 12. I just have a really difficult time imagining that everyone is going to pull the trigger to make the doomsday happen.

I agree...but the more I read, the more inevitable it sounds. Who would have thought Anheuser-Busch could ever have been bought out, or that GM would have filed for bankruptcy...

This is a new world we're in where the past just doesn't matter anymore.