Just balance the HCDM scales a little bit...

[Cuse'91]

The way Doug left was crappy but pales in comparison to guys like Rodriguez, Kiffen, etc.
I never like the Bills, and still don't. DM doesn't change that
I love Cuse and still do. DM doesn't change that either.

Here are the things that happened under DM:

SU was in ESPN's bottom 10, now they are 2-0 in bowl games since Doug got here
SU hadn't had a QB drafted since McNabb until Nassib this year
SU hadn't had back to back years with a 1st round draft pick since 2002(Chandler last year, Justin this year
SU dominated WV under DM
2012 Co-BE Champs

Regarding Nassib's so called slide down the draft boards:
Doug Hogue and Delone Carter were selected in the 4th and 5th rounds
Art Jones was selected in the 5th round
Mike Williams was selected in the 4th round
Adam Terry and Anthony Smith were the only 2 players selected higher than the 4th round from Freeney in 2001 until last year when Chandler went in the 1st.

You may or may not like exactly how Doug handled his departure, or how he handled the draft, or undrafted free agents but DM owes us nothing. He resurrected this program to almost McNabb era levels. Doug...Thank you for saving this program, I'd wish you good luck but I still hope Schwartz kicks your ass!

You almost got a tee out of me until the very end... - "almost McNabb era"
2 Pinstripe Bowls and 7-5 do not come close to Fiesta Bowls and drubbings of Miami...

 

[Pyle]

You almost got a tee out of me until the very end... - "almost McNabb era"
2 Pinstripe Bowls and 7-5 do not come close to Fiesta Bowls and drubbings of Miami...

I'm not completely defending my statement, it was a reach and I said almost. Just consider though...we were probably 1 or 2 turnovers away from an Orange bowl(see Rutgers), and what we did to top 10 UL in the Dome was better than beating up a sanctioned Miami team IMO.

 

[CusefanATL]

"In one sense, you study all the quarterbacks and you get the one you believe is the best one, and you're happy. You're ecstatic,'' Marrone said. "In another sense, you're hurting about Ryan. And it did hurt. You're hurting in a different way for the other quarterbacks too, because you spent a lot of time with them too, and there was a lot to like about all of them. But with Ryan, it was very difficult after what we did together. It hurts. It definitely hurts. He's a special kid. Unbelievable worker. So smart. Very, very good quarterback with all the intangibles. He will win games in this league.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-nfl-draft/news/20130429/nfl-draft-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2RyraYolU

If he just said something similar to that from the beginning, no one would have been mad at him.

Instead he said something to the effect of: I'm not sure why people thought i would pick on relationships and my history. end.

Seriously... what the hell is wrong with him?

 

[kingtidge]

"In one sense, you study all the quarterbacks and you get the one you believe is the best one, and you're happy. You're ecstatic,'' Marrone said. "In another sense, you're hurting about Ryan. And it did hurt. You're hurting in a different way for the other quarterbacks too, because you spent a lot of time with them too, and there was a lot to like about all of them. But with Ryan, it was very difficult after what we did together. It hurts. It definitely hurts. He's a special kid. Unbelievable worker. So smart. Very, very good quarterback with all the intangibles. He will win games in this league.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-nfl-draft/news/20130429/nfl-draft-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2RyraYolU

If he just said something similar to that from the beginning, no one would have been mad at him.

Instead he said something to the effect of: I'm not sure why people thought i would pick on relationships and my history. end.

Seriously... what the hell is wrong with him?

Those are some nice comments he didn't have to make... I think your question would be more appropriate if he made no comment whatsoever.

I get that you think the timing is poor (I don't necessarily disagree) but it obviously was not a priority for him on draft day (as much as we might want it to have been)...

He had work to do for the Bills, and justifying Manuel over Nassib in interviews on draft day would have likely eaten into time used planning/discussing your next picks and contingency scenarios, no? He was likely pow-wowing with Nix & Brandon non-stop during the draft day cycle... He can't really tell his Buffalo bosses " You guys keep discussing and I'll be back later, I have to go make a statement about Ryan Nassib."

 

[CusefanATL]

Those are some nice comments he didn't have to make... I think your question would be more appropriate if he made no comment whatsoever.

I get that you think the timing is poor (I don't necessarily disagree) but it obviously was not a priority for him on draft day (as much as we might want it to have been)...

He had work to do for the Bills, and justifying Manuel over Nassib in interviews on draft day would have likely eaten into time used planning/discussing your next picks and contingency scenarios, no? He was likely pow-wowing with Nix & Brandon non-stop during the draft day cycle... He can't really tell his Buffalo bosses " You guys keep discussing and I'll be back later, I have to go make a statement about Ryan Nassib."

Unfortunately you are mistaken.

He took the time to do a national radio interview where he was asked about his selection/nassib.

He chose to answer his way. Had nothing to do with taking a single second out of his day.

You can defend Marrone all you want, even with false info. I dont really care. I lost respect for him and its not coming back.

And it has nothing to do with who he drafted or going to the Bills. So don't tell me I am a pathetic whiner.

 

[OrangeDW]

With the insane amount of HCDM hate flying around this board the last few weeks I thought it would only be fair to point out that this weeks MMQB column on CNN has a section entirely devoted to Marrone and his taking Manuel over Nassib: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-n...monday-morning-quarterback/?sct=uk_t11_a3#all

Please just stop with all the hate... the man saved this program. Did he leave in a really shitty way? Yup sure did, but that doesn't erase the previous 3 or 4 years. Football both in the NFL and in college is a big business and one thing I've learned is that in today's business world there is no room for loyalty or sentimentality. You take the money and better opportunity when it's there because there is no guarantee it will be there the next day.

Now we can argue whether coaching the Buffalo Bills is a better opportunity than coaching the Syracuse Orange but at the end of the day it's a matter of personal choice.

What's funny is after the 5 game losing streak to end 2011, there were a decent number of Syracuse fans who wanted Marrone to be on the hot seat and wanted him fired if we had a bad 2012. Now some of those same people are whining about Marrone leaving, loyalty, etc.

 

[OrangeDW]

"In one sense, you study all the quarterbacks and you get the one you believe is the best one, and you're happy. You're ecstatic,'' Marrone said. "In another sense, you're hurting about Ryan. And it did hurt. You're hurting in a different way for the other quarterbacks too, because you spent a lot of time with them too, and there was a lot to like about all of them. But with Ryan, it was very difficult after what we did together. It hurts. It definitely hurts. He's a special kid. Unbelievable worker. So smart. Very, very good quarterback with all the intangibles. He will win games in this league.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-nfl-draft/news/20130429/nfl-draft-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2RyraYolU

If he just said something similar to that from the beginning, no one would have been mad at him.

Instead he said something to the effect of: I'm not sure why people thought i would pick on relationships and my history. end.

Seriously... what the hell is wrong with him?

Given that there were still 6 more rounds to the draft, maybe he didn't feel comfortable talking about prospects that were still on the board at that point.

 

[orangenirvana]

Unfortunately you are mistaken.

He took the time to do a national radio interview where he was asked about his selection/nassib.

He chose to answer his way. Had nothing to do with taking a single second out of his day.

You can defend Marrone all you want, even with false info. I dont really care. I lost respect for him and its not coming back.

And it has nothing to do with who he drafted or going to the Bills. So don't tell me I am a pathetic whiner.

It doesn't have to do with who he drafted or going to the Bills for you to be a pathetic whiner.

 

[cuseinchina]

Per the post standard this AM, Nassib has yet to hear a peep out of either Hackett or Marrone. Not even a 'good luck in NY text'. So the reaction to his failure to comment on Nassib during that initial post first round interview was bad enough to shame him into putting out a tweet and tell the media how tough it was not to select him - but was not enough to get him to pick up the phone. The worst part about Marrone is that he does feel a little bad about the way he does things, because you can detect a note of shame in his approach - he knows what he's doing, regrets it and then does it anyway. It's so easy to do things correctly and still have the same outcome, and to say that it's business does not reflect how business really gets done on a high level - the guy is just not even close to classy in the way he conducts his affairs. How many examples of his piss-poor behavior are required before we acknowledge he was the right guy at the right time, but admit that he is also basically a jerk and not someone you really want to root for given the way he treated the program in departure and beyond. The whole thing just makes me like Shafer that much more. This is a guy who conducts himself honorably AND will WIN - the two are not mutually exclusive. Looking forward to the new era!!

 

[kingtidge]

Unfortunately you are mistaken.

He took the time to do a national radio interview where he was asked about his selection/nassib.

He chose to answer his way. Had nothing to do with taking a single second out of his day.

You can defend Marrone all you want, even with false info. I dont really care. I lost respect for him and its not coming back.

And it has nothing to do with who he drafted or going to the Bills. So don't tell me I am a pathetic whiner.

Not really... He certainly didn't choose to answer it your preferred way... and I didn't call you any names.

Also, I'm not defending Marrone or claiming I have mucho repsect for him either... I just think some (including yourself) are taking it WAY too personally.

 

[orangenirvana]

Per the post standard this AM, Nassib has yet to hear a peep out of either Hackett or Marrone. Not even a 'good luck in NY text'. So the reaction to his failure to comment on Nassib during that initial post first round interview was bad enough to shame him into putting out a tweet and tell the media how tough it was not to select him - but was not enough to get him to pick up the phone.

Really?

http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2013/05/01/marrone-called-nassib-on-day-2-of-draft/

“On day 2 of the draft I called Ryan and said, ‘I’m sorry things worked out the way they did and I think you’re a great player and I can’t tell you how much I appreciate everything you’ve done for me.’ And I kind of went down the list and he responded to that,” said Marrone. ”I was really pulling for him and Shamarko (Thomas) and obviously Justin Pugh who was taken in the first round.
“Those guys play their butts off and they play their hearts out for you and they’re why you’re successful to a certain degree and you have a great appreciation for them, but at the end of the day you have a different job and different responsibility. So I’m in the draft room and I’m doing my job there and in the back of my mind I’m thinking it’s taking a long time, somebody has got to take him soon because he’s a heck of a quarterback.”

 

[cuseinchina]

Really?

http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2013/05/01/marrone-called-nassib-on-day-2-of-draft/

“On day 2 of the draft I called Ryan and said, ‘I’m sorry things worked out the way they did and I think you’re a great player and I can’t tell you how much I appreciate everything you’ve done for me.’ And I kind of went down the list and he responded to that,” said Marrone. ”I was really pulling for him and Shamarko (Thomas) and obviously Justin Pugh who was taken in the first round.
“Those guys play their butts off and they play their hearts out for you and they’re why you’re successful to a certain degree and you have a great appreciation for them, but at the end of the day you have a different job and different responsibility. So I’m in the draft room and I’m doing my job there and in the back of my mind I’m thinking it’s taking a long time, somebody has got to take him soon because he’s a heck of a quarterback.”

Well you can believe Marrone's quote, or you can believe the Post Standard's '(Nassib) also said he has not heard from Marrone, Hackett or anyone else in the Buffalo organization since before the draft.' My reaction was to this tidbit in their article on Nassib and the Giants today. So either one of these sources is accidentally incorrect or one of the two involved lied. Not sure why Ryan would say he hadn't heard from anyone if he indeed had, in fact that's almost inconceivable. But maybe the reporter misunderstood.

 

[GoSU96]

Given that there were still 6 more rounds to the draft, maybe he didn't feel comfortable talking about prospects that were still on the board at that point.

Ding

 

[CusefanATL]

Not really... He certainly didn't choose to answer it your preferred way... and I didn't call you any names.

Also, I'm not defending Marrone or claiming I have mucho repsect for him either... I just think some (including yourself) are taking it WAY too personally.

You said he didnt time to talk about it. I simply said he did answer the question - in a way that I didnt respect.

 

[kingtidge]

Ding

^^^this...

Not to mention, his media interview was to talk about Bill's picks... you know, cause he's the head coach of the bills...

Not to talk about other players he knows personally that are still on the board that he didn't pick.

The post-draft nice comments he made about Nassib are adequate... You don't open that pandora's box during the draft if you don't have too... it's not a narrative that you want to get involved with mid-draft if you are the Bills HC.

There's a number of reasons to not like how DM has conducted himself when leaving or after leaving syracuse, but I don't think this is one of them.

It's clearly obvious that the media overhyped the speculation of Nassib to Buffalo...

 

[KingOtis]

There's nothing wrong with Marrone taking the Bills job or selecting Manuel over Nassib. There is something wrong with the way he chose to go about it.

We've talked about the Bills job ad nauseum. In the case of Manuel and Nassib, Marrone wasn't the first coach to pass on his own quarterback. The Titans took Vince Young over Matt Leinart, even though Leinart's OC, Norm Chow, was the new OC in Tennessee (and Jeff Fisher is a USC alum). So that's not the issue. The issue is that Marrone used Nassib as a smokescreen. And drafting Manuel, in turn, hurt Nassib's draft stock.

So once again, Marrone could have been more up front about his intentions. If you want to argue that his interests are now with the Bills and not Syracuse, that's fine. You're absolutely right. But that doesn't mean fans shouldn't take exception with Marrone's behavior. Our interests remain with Syracuse.

 

[Pyle]

There's nothing wrong with Marrone taking the Bills job or selecting Manuel over Nassib. There is something wrong with the way he chose to go about it. The issue is that Marrone used Nassib as a smokescreen. And drafting Manuel, in turn, hurt Nassib's draft stock.

So once again, Marrone could have been more up front about his intentions. If you want to argue that his interests are now with the Bills and not Syracuse, that's fine. You're absolutely right. But that doesn't mean fans shouldn't take exception with Marrone's behavior. Our interests remain with Syracuse.

Smokescreen? Please elaborate. As for hurting his draft stock, Geno Smith was considered by most to be the best QB in the draft and didn't go until round 2. Matt Barkley was supposed to be a first round pick last year and was higher on most QB lists than Nassib as well. DM didn't hurt his draft position, the media simply made it seem like Ryan was a 1st round lock for Buffalo when he clearly was not. That is not DM's fault, or Nassib's, or the Bills, etc. As for this notion that Marrone could have been more upfront with his intentions? Show me one NFL coach in the draft that spilled the beans before draft day and I might consider that statement to have some validity. I have never seen an NFL coach show his hand before draft day, not unless it's the #1 pick overall and the team is negotiating a contract before the draft even happens. But again that is when you have the #1 pick, I don't believe I have ever seen an NFL coach say 'Nah, we are going to pass on these guys and go after these guys'. NFL coaches don't show their hand, so please answer why you think he should have been more upfront.

One last thing about NFL teams. If Nassib went through the combine, pro-day, interviews, etc and some team was in love with him, do you think Doug not drafting him would have made them say 'wait a minute here', a rookie NFL coach didn't take this guy, we better not either. No that didn't happen. NFL types are arrogant and think they are smarter than the rest of the league, if someone wanted Nassib before day 3, then Doug's actions did not affect that. The only way I think DM's actions could have had any type of real leverage was if he badmouthed Ryan but he didn't.

 

[KingOtis]

Smokescreen? Please elaborate. As for hurting his draft stock, Geno Smith was considered by most to be the best QB in the draft and didn't go until round 2. Matt Barkley was supposed to be a first round pick last year and was higher on most QB lists than Nassib as well. DM didn't hurt his draft position, the media simply made it seem like Ryan was a 1st round lock for Buffalo when he clearly was not. That is not DM's fault, or Nassib's, or the Bills, etc. As for this notion that Marrone could have been more upfront with his intentions? Show me one NFL coach in the draft that spilled the beans before draft day and I might consider that statement to have some validity. I have never seen an NFL coach show his hand before draft day, not unless it's the #1 pick overall and the team is negotiating a contract before the draft even happens. But again that is when you have the #1 pick, I don't believe I have ever seen an NFL coach say 'Nah, we are going to pass on these guys and go after these guys'. NFL coaches don't show their hand, so please answer why you think he should have been more upfront.

One last thing about NFL teams. If Nassib went through the combine, pro-day, interviews, etc and some team was in love with him, do you think Doug not drafting him would have made them say 'wait a minute here', a rookie NFL coach didn't take this guy, we better not either. No that didn't happen. NFL types are arrogant and think they are smarter than the rest of the league, if someone wanted Nassib before day 3, then Doug's actions did not affect that. The only way I think DM's actions could have had any type of real leverage was if he badmouthed Ryan but he didn't.

You didn't read the entire third paragraph of my post.

 

[Pyle]

You didn't read the entire second paragraph of my post.

I did, that's why i quoted it asking you to elaborate. How did Marrone use Nassib as a smokescreen? How could he have been more upfront without showing his hand? How did it hurt Nassib's draft stock that a rookie NFL coach passed on him? I will repeat what I said because it seems like you missed a a few of my points. NFL guys don't care what rookie coaches are doing. They care what their own scouts, and draft boards tell them to do.

 

[KingOtis]

I did, that's why i quoted it asking you to elaborate. How did Marrone use Nassib as a smokescreen? How could he have been more upfront without showing his hand? How did it hurt Nassib's draft stock that a rookie NFL coach passed on him? I will repeat what I said because it seems like you missed a a few of my points. NFL guys don't care what rookie coaches are doing. They care what their own scouts, and draft boards tell them to do.

My bad, I was typing on my phone and meant third paragraph. I didn't miss any of your points. I'm just not responding until you read the third paragraph in its entirety.

 

[FAL]

You didn't read the entire second paragraph of my post.

I don't ever recall Marrone mentioning Nassib as a possible candidate for the Bill's QB. Poof! Smokescreen gone... The firestorm and subsequent billows of smoke were create by the media. Don't feel too bad about it though... all of us get sucked in by it at one time or another.

 

[Pyle]

My bad, I was typing on my phone and meant third paragraph. I didn't miss any of your points. I'm just not responding until you read the third paragraph in its entirety.

Ok I've read it 5 times now to make sure I'm not misunderstanding. You said Doug needed to be more upfront about his intentions. NFL coaches don't do that before draft day. Never have and never will.

Also you said " that doesn't mean fans shouldn't take exception with Marrone's behavior. Our interests remain with Syracuse."

This one I really don't get. What behavior? Not telling the world he wasn't drafting Nassib? See all my posts above.

 

[KingOtis]

Ok I've read it 5 times now to make sure I'm not misunderstanding. You said Doug needed to be more upfront about his intentions. NFL coaches don't do that before draft day. Never have and never will.

Also you said " that doesn't mean fans shouldn't take exception with Marrone's behavior. Our interests remain with Syracuse."

This one I really don't get. What behavior? Not telling the world he wasn't drafting Nassib? See all my posts above.

My response to any of that would be to copy and paste what I already wrote in that paragraph.

 

[orangenirvana]

The issue is that Marrone used Nassib as a smokescreen. And drafting Manuel, in turn, hurt Nassib's draft stock.

So once again, Marrone could have been more up front about his intentions.

Just when I think syracusefan.com posts couldn't possibly get any dumber...

 

[Pyle]

My response to any of that would be to copy and paste what I already wrote in that paragraph.

I asked you to elaborate on what you already posted, that's obviously not going to happen. You said DM used him as a smokescreen, he didn't, the media made something out of nothing. You asked him to be more upfront about his intentions but that's not something NFL coaches do, ever. So basically you are upset with Doug for acting like an NFL coach and not addressing a media frenzy that he had no part in creating. Not fair IMO but I've made my feelings on the matter clear, if you don't agree then I respect that, I just don't understand it.