Kline exposes Autry's flaws

[Scooch]

I was thinking... we can't judge Kline's prowess as GM/Head of Scouting/Director of Schmoozing/Keeper of the NIL Budget since he's only been on the job since August.

However... the point of having him in those roles is, presumably, to let the staff focus primarily on coaching during the season, and not be distracted with running all of those other functions.

Well... is there any evidence that this focus on coaching has led to any tangible results? I'm hard pressed to say that any player on this roster has improved since November. Lampkin's production has improved, but that's because he's healthier.

It's concerning.

 

[RF2044]

I had no recollection of Tyler playing for Boeheim’s Army. Fun kid to watch play. We seemed to finish every half with a pick and pop three from Tyler.

he was a solid contributor on the team that won the title.

Was playing on one leg [essentially], because he needed surgery right after the TBT tournament to correct an issue, but still managed to make some important plays.

Best of all, Lydon indicated afterwards that donning the Orange again helped smooth over some of the bad juju from our fanbase, he felt from when he declared early for the NBA draft. So it was nice to see that not only did he help us win the championship, but put the negativity squarely behind him with the excitement and enthusiasm that the fanbase showed him during that TBT run.

 

[Newhouser]

Lydon is one of the more under appreciated players in this programs history.

Thx for the spell check. Fat thumbs.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I don’t think that works, imo. If you bring in a guy like JJ, he can score and get to the basket and knock down some 3s, but he can’t defend well.

JJ went from being the 9th best defender out of 10 guys last year, to the 5th best out of 10 this year. So, he's gotten better.

Taylor is a better defender but he’s not that athletic and cant get to the rim or score as well as JJ so he hurts you on offense. Carlos is the only pure PG but he’s small and slower, doesn’t shoot 3s well, and is not great at defense (though he tries). Cuffe is athletic and quick and a decent defender but can’t pass, run the team and has struggled shooting 3s. He’s also not as good as JJ at getting to the rack. Choppa works hard but is a one dimensional shooter right now.

You're agreeing that all these guys have holes in their games, right?

Playing mediocre players fewer minutes doesn’t help, imo. Since you can only play 2 or 3 guards, whoever you have out there at any one time is going to have serious limitations in important facets of the game.

So, does playing a guy like Eddie Lampkin work better if he plays 35 minutes (with his back) or 25 minutes? Is it better for Naheem McLeod to play zero minutes, or 5-10 minutes in the middle of the zone, just to change the momentum of the game? You shouldn't play EITHER of those guys too much, because they have big weaknesses in their games.

If JJ isn't good at setting up others, then you can't play him 35 minutes with the ball in his hands the whole time. You do have to play another guy at PG. Should Carlos have played 35 minutes, or 15? Should Moore have played 35 minutes when he was "defense optional"? You just can't do that. Right?

How much should Petar play? How much should Donnie have played? Neither is a finished product, but they bring different things to the table. Petar at least challenges shots. Donnie was a matador interior defender, just like Eddie for most of the year. But Donnie could score and got rebounds with just his athleticism.

If Eddie and Donnie don't defend the rim, the other 2 guys have to see some minutes. Not be starters, but it helps the team, and can change the energy and flow of a game to change things up.

When people say Autry lacks feel for coaching the game, this is exactly what you should consider. Situational substitutions. Changing up defenses masks deficiencies, and make an offense that has been torching you adjust and attack differently. Even if it's only for a few minutes. Use the press as a weapon, not out of desperation. There is so much strategy to coaching that he just failed to grasp this year.

 

[orangefog]

Lyndon is one of the more under appreciated players in this programs history.

The only beef I have with Lydon is that he didn't shoot enough his sophomore year. He pump faked himself out of so many great shots. His shot was so smooth, I wanted him shooting every time he had even the smallest window.

 

[W'boro'Cuse315]

Lyndon is one of the more under appreciated players in this programs history.

This is an ironically perfect post.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Jerami Grant was a good player for us. He didn't stick around long enough to be a great player for us. Same with Lydon and Brissett, who I forgot about.

Yeah, I feel the same way. One more year, and they could have left legends. But instead, I felt like they left just as they were getting good.
That was kind of when I started falling out of love with SU basketball, to be honest, when we couldn't keep good kids - BEFORE the portal.

 

[CU44SE]

Kline can be great and bring in all the perfect pieces. But at the end of the day, you need a coach to put those pieces in the correct spot.

I don’t believe we have a coach to put those pieces in the right spot. The offense is stagnant and iso drive. The defense is, well I don’t even know what you call that. So you may get the right analytics pieces. But if you ask those pieces to do things they can’t, your back at square one.

 

[Newhouser]

This is an ironically perfect post.

Ha I just noticed that. Too funny

 

[atlanticuse]

Kline can be great and bring in all the perfect pieces. But at the end of the day, you need a coach to put those pieces in the correct spot.

I don’t believe we have a coach to put those pieces in the right spot. The offense is stagnant and iso drive. The defense is, well I don’t even know what you call that. So you may get the right analytics pieces. But if you ask those pieces to do things they can’t, your back at square one.

I'm not even sure he can "bring in" those pieces.
The pieces have to want to come here. He can identify the pieces. But if they demand too much NIL$$$, or don't like the cold, then... all for naught.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Kline can be great and bring in all the perfect pieces. But at the end of the day, you need a coach to put those pieces in the correct spot.

I don’t believe we have a coach to put those pieces in the right spot. The offense is stagnant and iso drive. The defense is, well I don’t even know what you call that. So you may get the right analytics pieces. But if you ask those pieces to do things they can’t, your back at square one.

Also depends on who is deciding who the perfect pieces are. Red’s “perfect” player may not be the right one (e.g., JJ, Chance, Carlos, Leffew, etc.). If he’s looking for guys to play the same old Syracuse basketball then it probably won’t work no matter who is coaching.

 

[powdersmack]

JJ went from being the 9th best defender out of 10 guys last year, to the 5th best out of 10 this year. So, he's gotten better.

Has he, or is more that we just brought in a bunch of players even worse than he played with last year?

 

[AngryOtto]

I know a lot of people will continue to argue it was lack of nil but to me it is coaching. I watch this team and I see no real game plan on the offensive or defensive side. It seems they got a group of guys together to play pickup at the Y. It’s depressing to know it will continue next year with a rise and repeat. Even with Melo’s son and white the coaching will not change. We may win a few more games but the overall product will be the same

 

[IthacaMatt]

Has he, or is more that we just brought in a bunch of players even worse than he played with last year?

His advanced metrics have improved compared to last year.

 

[sufandu]

Yeah, I feel the same way. One more year, and they could have left legends. But instead, I felt like they left just as they were getting good.
That was kind of when I started falling out of love with SU basketball, to be honest, when we couldn't keep good kids - BEFORE the portal.

The NBA philosophy of drafting based on potential the exact player we used to develop over the course of a career really killed us in that era.

 

[tbonezone]

JB in his glory years had a number of all BE 1st/2nd team players. we currently don't.

 

[sufandu]

JB in his glory years had a number of all BE 1st/2nd team players. we currently don't.

In the glory years we had conference and national POY candidates on a regular basis.

 

[2B20Again]

Agreed.

The notion that some are suggesting that we need a bigger war chest just to offset the obvious and glaring coaching limitations is telling.

NIL might be AN issue, but it isn't THE issue.

Improve our $$$, and get a coaching staff that knows what the heck they are doing, and things would improve immensely.

I hate to disagree but $$$$$ is the issue. Not defending coaching staff. They clearly have not been perfect, however, is SU cannot compete in the buying process, Pitino, Calapari, Oats doesn’t matter. You have to have players. Nuff said

 

[2B20Again]

You and me both. If this is what the state of college ball is going forward then count me out.

I’m on the same ledge. I am a fan of Syracuse basketball. Each year looked forward to new pieces, retiring players and watch their improvement. Gone, over. Now it’s can I afford the shiniest new toy. It’s not Syracuse basketball it’s unknown players in Syracuse uniforms only here for $$$ available. Getting closer to the edge everyday. Peace

 

[RF2044]

I hate to disagree but $$$$$ is the issue. Not defending coaching staff. They clearly have not been perfect, however, is SU cannot compete in the buying process, Pitino, Calapari, Oats doesn’t matter. You have to have players. Nuff said

No, not "nuff said."

There are countless examples of teams out there that are exponentially better than us, with the same or less NIL funds.

NIL is being used as an excuse to mask Red's awful performance as a head coach. Sure, he'd "coach" a little better if he had some better players, but NIL is the symptom of the problem, not the actual problem.

And you are 100% wrong about those coaches -- if we had Pitino, Oats, etc. with this same exact roster, we'd have double the wins. Why? Because those guys can actually coach. Because they would implement effective systems on BOTH sides of the ball. Because they would demand high level of defensive effort, and the results would ensue.

The roster is flawed, no argument there. The approach toward the portal last year was in a word, stupid. But good coaches maximize what they get out of the team -- especially coaches like Pitino and Oats. We're seeing the opposite with this coaching staff -- the players are getting worse under their tutelage.

 

[hoopsupstate]

No, not "nuff said."

There are countless examples of teams out there that are exponentially better than us, with the same or less NIL funds.

NIL is being used as an excuse to mask Red's awful performance as a head coach. Sure, he'd "coach" a little better if he had some better players, but NIL is the symptom of the problem, not the actual problem.

And you are 100% wrong about those coaches -- if we had Pitino, Oats, etc. with this same exact roster, we'd have double the wins. Why? Because those guys can actually coach. Because they would implement effective systems on BOTH sides of the ball. Because they would demand high level of defensive effort, and the results would ensue.

The roster is flawed, no argument there. The approach toward the portal last year was in a word, stupid. But good coaches maximize what they get out of the team -- especially coaches like Pitino and Oats. We're seeing the opposite with this coaching staff -- the players are getting worse under their tutelage.

We would not be 24-6 with them coaching. We’d be ranked top ten. Wow!

 

[RF2044]

We would not be 24-6 with them coaching. We’d be ranked top ten. Wow!

Rick Pitino is one of the greatest college coaches of all time -- maybe even arguably THE best, if not in the top handful.

He would absolutely have this team positioned to capitalize on such a down year in the ACC. All of those games where we came close, but botched execution down the stretch leading to losses? Most of those would flip. We also wouldn't have struggled playing the Le Moyne's and Youngstown State's of the world, we wouldn't have lost to last place Miami, etc. Why? Because he's that good.

 

[albanycuse]

Rick Pitino is one of the greatest college coaches of all time -- maybe even arguably THE best, if not in the top handful.

He would absolutely have this team positioned to capitalize on such a down year in the ACC. All of those games where we came close, but botched execution down the stretch leading to losses? Most of those would flip. We also wouldn't have struggled playing the Le Moyne's and Youngstown State's of the world, we wouldn't have lost to last place Miami, etc. Why? Because he's that good.

Facts , we’re easily -5 games in the loss column solely based on Reds inability to coach.

 

[hoopsupstate]

Rick Pitino is one of the greatest college coaches of all time -- maybe even arguably THE best, if not in the top handful.

He would absolutely have this team positioned to capitalize on such a down year in the ACC. All of those games where we came close, but botched execution down the stretch leading to losses? Most of those would flip. We also wouldn't have struggled playing the Le Moyne's and Youngstown State's of the world, we wouldn't have lost to last place Miami, etc. Why? Because he's that good.

Twice as many wins = 24 with a chance for 25. You lost all credibility with saying we would win twice as many games.

 

[MSOrange]

Clown I mean Kline better leave with Autry. Don't want him interfering with the next hire.

Why do you say that?