Marrone venting

[Cuseman78]

Ah well, forget him. I'm all behind Shafer now. If Shafer does well, I'd expect Marrone's transgressions will be forgotten.

I'm with you here. I think Marrone's legacy will ultimately be dependent upon the success of Shafer.

If Shafer is a rousing success, Dougie will be looked upon as the guy who took us out of the Grob years and made us somewhat relevant again. Not sure he will ever be beloved because of the way he exited, but I also don't think history will be unkind in that scenario.

However, If Shafer flops, HCDM will be enemy #1 because of the way he left, his pillaging of the staff, etc.

 

[NineOneSeven]

The hands down best posts in this thread belong to TheCusian.

Give it up people. Go outside, take a walk, get some air. By next year we'll be laughing at most of these threads.

 

[CusefanATL]

When I read this title, I honestly was hoping that Marrone had opened up and gone after Syracuse. Now that would be fun.

thought the same thing

 

[erog78]

I'm with you here. I think Marrone's legacy will ultimately be dependent upon the success of Shafer.

If Shafer is a rousing success, Dougie will be looked upon as the guy who took us out of the Grob years and made us somewhat relevant again. Not sure he will ever be beloved because of the way he exited, but I also don't think history will be unkind in that scenario.

However, If Shafer flops, HCDM will be enemy #1 because of the way he left, his pillaging of the staff, etc.

Exactly. If three years from now we are toiling at the bottom of the ACC the Marrone defenders will change their tune.

 

[tep624]

I'm with you here. I think Marrone's legacy will ultimately be dependent upon the success of Shafer.

If Shafer is a rousing success, Dougie will be looked upon as the guy who took us out of the Grob years and made us somewhat relevant again. Not sure he will ever be beloved because of the way he exited, but I also don't think history will be unkind in that scenario.

However, If Shafer flops, HCDM will be enemy #1 because of the way he left, his pillaging of the staff, etc.

That's more or less how I feel as well. Most people have short memories.

I dont have an issue with him leaving for a higher paying job that was a clear progression for his career. I don't have an issue with him taking as many people as he wants from his past because he enjoys working with them and trusts them. I completely understand the work landscape of 2013 and this is not uncommon whatsoever. Trust lies not with your employer, but with whom you work with - those are the real relationships. If your company has an economic downturn, practically everyone can be on the chopping block. I've been in those meetings - and it's the truth. Maybe there is still some of that company/employee trust in smaller companies or family owned businesses, but not in the corporate/large company world.

I just wish he would have handled the situation better. I don't care about him not being completely open about interviewing with everyone that wanted to listen - that's pretty common. I don't care about him accepting a new role. I just wish he had done it without saying one thing and doing another in regards to the assistants.

If he had just been up front with the administration and said "I'm leaving for a new role and I may take some of my assistants depending on the landscape when I get there" rather than "I'm not going to take any assistants with me", then I think a lot of the lingering anger we're seeing would be gone by now. You'd still have some people acting like he shot their dog and knocked up their daughter, but that's life, you're always going to have those people.

 

[Todd Gack]

Can we all agree that we have no idea whether any of the assistants (outside Hackett) would've stayed in the absence of Marrone, a promotion, and/or pay raise. I think coaching takes a weird personality -- one that wouldn't take well to being passed over for a promotion. McDonald wasn't coming here as a lateral move.

And Nirvana's post is spot on for me -- he didn't have to come here. Call him a liar for all I care, but I remember how he said that the Saints would wear their college gear on Friday (Saturday, whenever) and he became embarrassed to wear "Syracuse."

Point to one game where you think he mailed it in. Even with a foot out the door, he developed a game plan that decimated a talented West Virginia team.

 

[TheCusian]

I'll move on when the asswhole stops poaching SU.

He is offering them jobs. I wish he wasn't - but it is what it is. They could turn him down...

 

[OrangePA]

Didn't Marrone basically beg for this job? (I know that's overstating, but I always thought he approached us, not the other way around)

He didn't come here as a favor to SU.

I can't compare Chip Kelly to Marrone. Chip Kelly is leaving Oregon in the rear view mirror, he might care about how they do for a year or 2, but I doubt much after that. Doug was one of us, he's supposed to care about the long term health of the program.

I think he was either desperate, or maybe the NFL experienced OCs he talked to were interested but wanted more control than Marrone was willing to give them.

Either way, I find myself siding with Mad's take. But I'm excited about Shafer getting a shot.

Chip Kelly did not leave Oregon in a precarious position at all.

He left the program in a dominant position - lots of money, lots of players - stability in the Pac 12.

Marrone left Syracuse University at a crucial moment - this recruiting season and the transition to the ACC were vital to the progression of the program.

So, yes I am hopeful that Shafer will create a solid staff and carry on the progression.

But I'm also with Mad and others - I'm really ticked at Doug. They say that character is truly demonstrated when the person is required to do something that is hard. Foregoing the Bills job or other NFL HC job would have demonstrated true character in my opinion.

I don't think Chip Kelly was faced with that kind of decision.

 

[kcsu]

Can we all agree that we have no idea whether any of the assistants (outside Hackett) would've stayed in the absence of Marrone, a promotion, and/or pay raise. I think coaching takes a weird personality -- one that wouldn't take well to being passed over for a promotion. McDonald wasn't coming here as a lateral move.

And Nirvana's post is spot on for me -- he didn't have to come here. Call him a liar for all I care, but I remember how he said that the Saints would wear their college gear on Friday (Saturday, whenever) and he became embarrassed to wear "Syracuse."

Point to one game where you think he mailed it in. Even with a foot out the door, he developed a game plan that decimated a talented West Virginia team.

Todd i dont think anyone is questioning that Doug did a good job and worked his tail off each day to make Syracuse better. What has many of us disapointed is simply that Doug went on record with the administration and told them one thing relative to his not taking staff members and than turned around and did the exact opposite. Do your homework and read some of the older post. Hack was actually at the point of inking his contract when Doug changed his mind at the 12th hour. If Doug had been upfront with Doc about his intentions i dont think that anyone would have anything but praise for Doug and what he did for the program. I have always been about Syracuse the program. The coach is one rung below that in my mind. Doug did a good job but lets be clear. Doug wanted this job, Doug pursued this job, and he did well after a rocky start. How he left leaves much to be desired and much to question relative to his integrity.

 

[Todd Gack]

First off, I love how our butthurt -- thank you, Syracusefan.com, for teaching me that term -- has gone from Marrone promised not to take Shafer or Hackett to promising not to take anyone from the staff. You want me to read history -- I suggest you read your own.

Also, I love -- as in, I think it fits the CNY mindset / the self-indulgence on this board -- that people feel personal animus to what they think / know Marrone promised someone else. I hate to break it to you, but Marrone isn't making life decisions -- for him or particularly his family -- based on how you might feel.

Just as you cannot say whether the coaches who left wouldn't have left regardless of Marrone's interest in them, you cannot express the totality of what Marrone told Gross. You simply can't. And even if you could, if Syracuse football isn't big enough to overcome the loss of these coaches, God help us.

I think Marrone was wound too tight and is better suited for the NFL -- but the sense of personal disappointment in how he left is, to me, an embarrassment to this fan base. Grow up, move on, and Go Orange.

 

[orangenirvana]

That's more or less how I feel as well. Most people have short memories.

I dont have an issue with him leaving for a higher paying job that was a clear progression for his career. I don't have an issue with him taking as many people as he wants from his past because he enjoys working with them and trusts them. I completely understand the work landscape of 2013 and this is not uncommon whatsoever. Trust lies not with your employer, but with whom you work with - those are the real relationships. If your company has an economic downturn, practically everyone can be on the chopping block. I've been in those meetings - and it's the truth. Maybe there is still some of that company/employee trust in smaller companies or family owned businesses, but not in the corporate/large company world.

I just wish he would have handled the situation better. I don't care about him not being completely open about interviewing with everyone that wanted to listen - that's pretty common. I don't care about him accepting a new role. I just wish he had done it without saying one thing and doing another in regards to the assistants.

If he had just been up front with the administration and said "I'm leaving for a new role and I may take some of my assistants depending on the landscape when I get there" rather than "I'm not going to take any assistants with me", then I think a lot of the lingering anger we're seeing would be gone by now. You'd still have some people acting like he shot their dog and knocked up their daughter, but that's life, you're always going to have those people.

The statement I've bolded above has evolved into fact on this forum. It's for this reason that so many have hatred for Marrone. And it's kind of funny, because I think we can all agree that no one on this forum was explicitly told by Marrone that he would never take any assistants with him to the Bills.

The way I see it, he told Gross "I'm going to do everything I can to not take any assistants with me," and I'm sure he was telling the absolute truth when he said it. Gross then told people that "He said he would try not to take any assistants." To which are own insiders on this forum were told "He said he wouldn't take any assistants with him." And when he did, then suddenly he's a liar here on this forum.

I don't have much of an issue with people venting and being pissed off about the situation. But vilifying the guy, putting "FU Marrone" in subject titles, saying he'll never be welcome at SU again, etc...all because of interpretations and assumptions that have been twisted into fact...some people need to get a freakin' grip.

 

[MadNY3]

But I'm also with Mad and others - I'm really ticked at Doug. They say that character is truly demonstrated when the person is required to do something that is hard. Foregoing the Bills job or other NFL HC job would have demonstrated true character in my opinion.

Clarifying on my end, I am not really ticked that he left. Didn't want him to, but not ticked. Really. It is the manner of how he handled it that I had issue with.

 

[Ghost]

LOL - come on. The only other newly hired NFL coach to come from college is Chip Kelly. And he was hired a mere three days ago.

Marrone has taken five assistant coaches from Syracuse. Kelly is reportedly taking four from Oregon. Odds are good that Kelly will take more from that school as the days/weeks go by.

Wanting to coach with people you've worked with before and trust is part of the business.

I'm thankful for Marrone because he didn't have to come to Syracuse. He had a great job in New Orleans, they knew they would be very good to great in 2009. He was already on short lists of some franchises. It was a tremendous risk for him to come to Syracuse. He did an unbelievable job of turning the program around and he didn't have to do that.

Not that it matters, but out of those four coaches, one is an intern (Todd Lyght - formerly an NFL player), and other than Azzinarro I can't even figure out what the other two do at UOregon. One I think is an Admin Asst. from what turned up via Google search.

Eh, just starting checking when the replies all seemed oblivious to who any of them were....He didn't really pillage the staff judging by those names. lol

 

[tep624]

But vilifying the guy, putting "FU Marrone" in subject titles, saying he'll never be welcome at SU again, etc...all because of interpretations and assumptions that have been twisted into fact...some people need to get a freakin' grip.

That stuff is just stupid, regardless of the circumstances. It's as much a situation of trying to draw attention to themselves as it is being upset with Marrone.

 

[rrlbees]

That stuff is just stupid, regardless of the circumstances. It's as much a situation of trying to draw attention to themselves as it is being upset with Marrone.

Here's the way I look at it. I can have my own opinions as can everyone else. Our opinions are based upon our own perceptions, realities and our own known facts. But there are 3 people on this board, whom I know very very well, that I not only respect as posters but as people and who are also well respected members of the Syracuse University community. When they are unanimously dissapointed (actually more than dissapointed) on how this all went down and was handled by Marrone, that says something to me because unlike most of us, they have a real connection to the University (and I don't know kcsu, so he doesn't count ).

 

[OrangePA]

Clarifying on my end, I am not really ticked that he left. Didn't want him to, but not ticked. Really. It is the manner of how he handled it that I had issue with.

I agree with your post.

And, I'm ticked at Doug for leaving - and for the way he did it.

 

[AluminNV]

It's not Dougie leaving that has me pissed off. It's the fact that he keeps coming back like a thief in the night to grab another assistant coach or staff member or whatever ain't nailed down.

I agree completely.

But we need to get back to having mobile QBs so I don't mind a new offensive staff.

Any Syracuse fan would be livid with how things transpired a couple weeks ago. And all Syracuse fans will stop caring about Marrone and likely will wish him well after we beat Ped St to open next season.

 

[Todd Gack]

I'm a Syracuse fan. I daydream that we'll beat 'Bama for the national championship next year (and believe we most certainly would've beat this years' Notre Dame). For the record, I'm not upset by how Marrone left. He owes me nothing -- and this program is bigger than Nathaniel Hackett. Or so I'll daydream.

 

[tep624]

Here's the way I look at it. I can have my own opinions as can everyone else. Our opinions are based upon our own perceptions, realities and our own known facts. But there are 3 people on this board, whom I know very very well, that I not only respect as posters but as people and who are also well respected members of the Syracuse University community. When they are unanimously dissapointed (actually more than dissapointed) on how this all went down and was handled by Marrone, that says something to me because unlike most of us, they have a real connection to the University (and I don't know kcsu, so he doesn't count ).

Difference is, the 3 people that you know (and I'm assuming cto is one of them) that are unanimously dissapointed conduct themselves with class and don't make the type of posts we're referring to.

For the record, I believed that Marrone said one thing and did another when cto posted that and not before then. I let the situation play itself out until I had a good feeling of what I was reading was the truth. When I read what she posted and knew it was reliable, I was pretty disappointed as well.

I guess for me, when situations like this occur, my way of coping is to focus on how to correct the situation and move forward. I don't find a lot of value in lashing out because it doesn't accomplish anything. Like I said, I'm disappointed too but I'm not going to dwell on it.

 

[UBSU]

I am not responding to this thread to "beat a dead horse" as I agree with most of the posts I have read so far. However, I wanted to comment on Marrone as a person; a person hired to be a leader of the SU football program, challenged to resurrect a program in a tail-spin from the previous coaching staff. Remembering the premise of how he came into the program - H.S. kid from the Bronx - Mac's staff brings him here on a scholorship, all the way around to interviews for the HC position back at his alma mater - we all know the story. It seemed like the perfect coach, dedicated to the university, respected by alums, athletic department and trustees, etc. etc...

However, what we witnessed during the past several weeks, more than anything else during the his past 4 1/2 years at SU, uncovers Marrone as a person and his character and role model for 85 football players between the ages of 18 - 22. Having said that, one of the things I was most impressed with this summer was SU taking the team and staff up to Fort Drum for a week. Knowing the US Army and as a military veteran myself, I am certain the military leaders up there, through discussions with the team, had an opportunity to share personal values and leadership skills with the players including Teamwork, Dedication, Character, Commitment, and the Army values of Loyalty, Service, Duty, Respect, Honor and Integrity and your Word is your Bond - great life lessons for young men. I thought is was a great idea and hope they have the opportunity again.

However, during the past two weeks, I believe, we witnessed the opposite from Marrone. He stated in his e-mail to his players after he was hired by the Bills: " I will do everything in my power to ensure that your next head coach will continue on the path toward making Syracuse University a national football powerhouse. I will always support Syracuse University Football." I suspect Marrone has already forgotten about SU as he has bigger fish to fry in the NFL now. Secondly, the fact that Marrone pillaged the SU coaching staff for his own benefit and against his own word is evidence to this fact that Marrone - who allegedly bleeds Orange - feels no conscience about leaving the program in disarray for the new head coach by ransacking the remaining staff.

He did it - it happens, I get that. But when you say one thing and do the exact opposite for personal and financial gain and at the mercy of your previous employer - in this case the university who gave him his start as an 18-year old scholarship FB player and again with his first start as a first-time head coach, your character certainly comes into question. Where are those core values of integrity, character and dedication? I view it as a significant level of disrespect and a slap in the face. I believe, for me, that what disappoints me the most about the Marrone situation. For impressionable young student athletes - Marrone leaves a message behind that not only is life about getting ahead, but don't need to have a conscience about running over people who trusted you while you do it.

At the end of the day, I think the team will definitely benefit from new leadership with Shafer and his staff and I really look forward to a new season for SU Football.

 

[rrlbees]

Difference is, the 3 people that you know (and I'm assuming cto is one of them) that are unanimously dissapointed conduct themselves with class and don't make the type of posts we're referring to.

For the record, I believed that Marrone said one thing and did another when cto posted that and not before then. I let the situation play itself out until I had a good feeling of what I was reading was the truth. When I read what she posted and knew it was reliable, I was pretty disappointed as well.

I guess for me, when situations like this occur, my way of coping is to focus on how to correct the situation and move forward. I don't find a lot of value in lashing out because it doesn't accomplish anything. Like I said, I'm disappointed too but I'm not going to dwell on it.

i agree witth your point about the way over the top postings. some, not all, got deleted if the title had Fluck you marrone or something akin.

 

[Todd Gack]

I would love for someone to provide evidence -- outside of Hackett -- that this staff would've stayed together in Marrone's absence. I'd also like to see any evidence of players bad-mouthing Marrone after Sunday. Maybe this forum has beaten them to the punch.

 

[bevosu]

It would have been nice (probably) if the staff had been able to stay together, but I think the point most posters are making about disappointment with Marrone has to do with his character.

I was a big Marrone backer right from the beginning. The things he said about his dream job and the way he left reflect a level of integrity that we all too often see in our politicians.

People who say one thing and do another..whether it's undying love for their alma mater or campaign promises that are for their self interests only..people who are a little too casual about the sincerity of what they say..it's a trait that I don't admire.

Marrone has proven to me that he isn't what I thought he was. A good coach with a diametrically opposed character than I previously gave him credit for.

I just as soon he never be invited back. Shafer's success will have no bearing on my opinion of Marrone.

 

[Todd Gack]

It would have been nice (probably) if the staff had been able to stay together, but I think the point most posters are making about disappointment with Marrone has to do with his character.

I was a big Marrone backer right from the beginning. The things he said about his dream job and the way he left reflect a level of integrity that we all too often see in our politicians.

People who say one thing and do another..whether it's undying love for their alma mater or campaign promises that are for their self interests only..people who are a little too casual about the sincerity of what they say..it's a trait that I don't admire.

Marrone has proven to me that he isn't what I thought he was. A good coach with a diametrically opposed character than I previously gave him credit for.

I just as soon he never be invited back. Shafer's success will have no bearing on my opinion of Marrone.

Can you appreciate that this was his "dream job" until he came here and it wasn't? To paraphrase Rahme, "Knowing what I know, I would never hold him to the 'dream job' comment."

 

[SUbear]

It would have been nice (probably) if the staff had been able to stay together, but I think the point most posters are making about disappointment with Marrone has to do with his character.

I was a big Marrone backer right from the beginning. The things he said about his dream job and the way he left reflect a level of integrity that we all too often see in our politicians.

People who say one thing and do another..whether it's undying love for their alma mater or campaign promises that are for their self interests only..people who are a little too casual about the sincerity of what they say..it's a trait that I don't admire.

Marrone has proven to me that he isn't what I thought he was. A good coach with a diametrically opposed character than I previously gave him credit for.

I just as soon he never be invited back. Shafer's success will have no bearing on my opinion of Marrone.

I appreciate the improved play of the team from the GROB years. However, Marrone is now dead to me and I will be okay if he is never mentioned again.