Matt Park coming up on Sirius ACC Channel

[Alsacs]

I am not sure I am following your logic here. In a prior post you said we didn't need the money from the Meadowlands games thanks to bb scheduling so many home games. But you complain here about the money spent on Luke Jensen (2006), Gary Gait (2007), Chris Fox (2005 - you specifically mentioned cross country in the other post), and I assume the fourth was either Q (2006), Ange Bradley (2007), or Leigh Ross (2006). I assume, like many, you feel the excess money spent on these coaches (all of whom had some to great success except for Luke Jensen - the absolute worse hire ever, imho) could have gone to get a better football coach and/or increase assistant coaches salaries. This I get, but all that money spent on Olympic sports coaches well preceded the Meadowlands games. There is no real correlation between the two.

You also admit that the windfall (so called cash grab) we got from the Meadowland games (because they were most definitely WAY overpaying us for those games - which is why it was *cough**cough* a so-called "mutual agreement" to nix the rest of what was a 10 games in 20 years contract - since they too realized they were not getting any bang for their bucks) also wasn't spent on the things many fans, including myself, felt like that money should have been spent on - which was FOOTBALL, since that was what was generating that particular windfall. This, if true, I also get - although I think money was started to be spent by this time - not as much as we would have liked, but more than prior to TGD. And if it wasn't it obviously should have been. But still, doesn't that have more to do with the man in charge than the actual games being played in the Meadowlands?

So I am not seeing how that less money from those three games being at the Dome somehow gets that lesser amount of money spent on football than the more money made at the Meadowlands did? Or are you assuming that had those games been played in the Dome, somehow we would have won each of those three games and that our new record of 9-4 in 2012 would have kept Marrone around or gotten a better replacement despite the horrible timing of Marrone's departure? How precisely does a new record of 4-8 in 2014 or 5-7 in 2016 change the perception of our football being in purgatory? I am not seeing this at all and that is while being extremely generous in giving us wins in all three of those games if they were played at the dome.

Seems to me you are mixing and mismatching valid complaints (Gross spending too much money on Olympic sports and not enough on football) while not making the point you seem to think they make - that playing those games at the Meadowlands despite making more money than they would have as home games somehow made us look mid-majorish - which I see, unfortunately, that many outside our bubble already seen us as this as a result of playing in a perceived mid-major league (after the losses of Miami and VT but even before there was this stigma on the conference, especially when Miami was on probation), our on the field record, our subpar home stadium which was grossly neglected well before Gross was even hired, and a lack of quality facilities which hindered recruiting and hiring of coaches. While I sympathize with the desire to have seen those games played at the dome I don't see how playing the Meadowlands games had this huge impact you want to assign them. (For the record, we both appear to be excluding the PSU series which was a 1-1-1 deal as not being part of this discussion.)

Cheers,
Neil

I never said football spending was poor. Where did I?
I said the MetLife deal wasn’t necessary to keep us in the black financially. I said Gross used the deal to increase profits because it was a cash grab and raised profits that should have been higher if not for his high spending.
Basketball bailed Gross out. The spending in the AD was out of control it doesn’t mean we were in big time debt.
The financial mess came when we left the Big East and had to pay a 7.5 million dollar exit fee. That required a loan from the University schools bailing out the AD but again that Notre Dame deal wasn’t used to pay the exit fee. Gross took a cash grab from Notre Dame that was a mid major move pure and simple.
High major schools don’t do 0-2-2 deals.

If Gross fires GRob after year 3 instead of 4 he could have possibly needed the cash flow.
He kept GRob that extra year thus the argument he needed the money isn’t true. Marrone didn’t get the support sure but the AD wasn’t in deep debt. After the loan for the exit fee the University BOT tightened the purse strings for the AD but we never in red.

 

[Alsacs]

Well let's look at this way...ain't no way Babers is leaving the Dome for any "home" game in NYC. The past is what it is. Plus, Wildhack knows what he's doing, we're in good shape here Cuse fans.

This is true. It’s good Babers said what he did publicly. The 2016 comments were outstanding.

 

[omniorange]

I never said football spending was poor. Where did I?
I said the MetLife deal wasn’t necessary to keep us in the black financially. I said Gross used the deal to increase profits because it was a cash grab and raised profits that should have been higher if not for his high spending.
Basketball bailed Gross out. The spending in the AD was out of control it doesn’t mean we were in big time debt.
The financial mess came when we left the Big East and had to pay a 7.5 million dollar exit fee. That require a loan from the University schools bailing out the AD but again that Notre Dame deal wasn’t used to pay the edit fee. Gross took a cash grab from Notre Dame that was a mid major move pure and simple.
High major schools don’t do 0-2-2 deals.

Alsacs, you are overall a good poster, but you have this habit of throwing a lot of different things out that again have no connection with the point you appear to be trying to make. Example, what does the Big East exit fee have to do with the Meadowlands games? The Notre Dame series was set up in 2009, the Penn State 1-1-1 deal was done in 2010 and the USC series was signed in that same year. The Meadowlands 10 games in 20 years deal was signed in the Spring of 2011 and that is when the SU home game against the Trojans was folded into that contract. All of this was done well before our being invited to the ACC in September of 2011. And the first game of the contract in 2012 against USC, if the figures I was told were accurate, would have covered about two thirds of that exit fee (since as I was told we were WAY overpaid on that contract).

As for high major football schools not scheduling 0-2-2 deals, well high major football schools also don't average less than 35K in attendance, which is what SU was faced with the previous two years to the ND deal being signed either. They also don't have subpar facilities and shouldn't lose to the likes of UConn (3 of 4) and Rutgers (4 of 4) in the preceding four years to the deal being signed. But all of those things occurred. Maybe the Meadowland games, as distasteful as they were, were an out-of-the-box idea to try and help turn things around? It failed, but it just wasn't the overwhelming disaster you seem to think it was and also it was far, far, far from being the primary reason our perception in football took a nosedive.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Alsacs]

Alsacs, you are overall a good poster, but you have this habit of throwing a lot of different things out that again have no connection with the point you appear to be trying to make. Example, what does the Big East exit fee have to do with the Meadowlands games? The Notre Dame series was set up in 2009, the Penn State 1-1-1 deal was done in 2010 and the USC series was signed in that same year. The Meadowlands 10 games in 20 years deal was signed in the Spring of 2011 and that is when the SU home game against the Trojans was folded into that contract. All of this was done well before our being invited to the ACC in September of 2011. And the first game of the contract in 2012 against USC, if the figures I was told were accurate, would have covered about two thirds of that exit fee (since as I was told we were WAY overpaid on that contract).

As for high major football schools not scheduling 0-2-2 deals, well high major football schools also don't average less than 35K in attendance, which is what SU was faced with the previous two years to the ND deal being signed either. They also don't have subpar facilities and shouldn't lose to the likes of UConn (3 of 4) and Rutgers (4 of 4) in the preceding four years to the deal being signed. But all of those things occurred. Maybe the Meadowland games, as distasteful as they were, were an out-of-the-box idea to try and help turn things around? It failed, but it just wasn't the overwhelming disaster you seem to think it was and also it was far, far, far from being the primary reason our perception in football took a nosedive.

Cheers,
Neil

The Big Exit fee was brought up to explain the Only time the AD had major financial problems.
Football wasn’t getting the budget it could have but I never said it could have been higher.
All I said was the MetLife deal was a midmajor deal.
I explained why I have said what I have. I liked Gross overall but the MetLife deal was bad. He spent crazy thus because football wasn’t basketball he tried to get more dollars which he got from MetLife. The deal wasn’t necessary but he wanted the money.

 

[billsin01]

You don’t get what?
Gross sold a home game at the Carrier Dome with USC to MetLife.
It was a pure cash grab.
Second he agreed to a 4 game series with Notre Dame that 2 games would be in South Bend and our 2 “home” games would be at MetLife. The 2 MetLife games ended up being games with more Notre Dame fans than Syracuse fans.
If the ACC 5 games series didn’t happen the South Bend games would have happened already and we would have had a 0-2-2 series. This what midmajor schools do. It was Gross low point IMO.

Also the status of the AD was overblown JB and basketball picked up the slack bigtime for the AD with basketball revenue. To OrangePA we didn’t need the revenue badly. It was revenue needed to bailout Gross spending which was out of control.

I just mean why do we care so much that a home game against a good team is played at a bigger location with potentially more attention paid to it? I'm fine with the Dome but, if we're being honest, it's small, a little dumpy, the crowd is, eh, decent and there is zero tailgate scene/other stuff to do.

I grew up in the Cuse but I generally try to catch the cuse in other locales partially b/c I'm now displaced but also partially b/c it's just generally more fun. Love seeing hoops in NYC (garden or Barclays), caught both road ND football games, go whenever they play G'town down here in hoops, I'm going to the Bronx for this one on Saturday, etc.

I don't know if I'm unique in this way, but I don't really think people actually care about SU football outside of us on this board and a relatively small percentage of people in upstate NY. I'm not trashing the cuse per se -- no one gives two s---ts about BC football in Boston or otherwise, no one cares about Rutgers at all, no one around me cares in the least about Pitt (maybe closer to Pittsburgh but certainly not in MD where there is a ton of love for PedSt for some odd reason). Even Maryland football (I'm just north of DC) -- sure, people will throw on a t-shirt, tailgate for a couple hours and go to a game once a year or every couple years, but do they really know a thing about that program? Do they even really care that much that the administration thoroughly botched the DJ Durkin thing? I don't think so.

But honestly, I'm on a text chain with 8 buddies from college who gamble a lot and love sports and it took until last week before someone said, 'hey, I guess cuse doesn't suck now?' And that pretty much sums up their interest level.

My point is that I get that we aren't a mid-major but we also aren't a program that moves the needle and when we're struggling, generating some cash and some interest in a game can be a good thing. And I really, really, really doubt anyone outside the fan base cares enough to say 'OMG, Cuse sold a game?!?!?!? They're a mid-major for christ's sake!!!'

I don't know -- at the end of the day I'm excited to head up on Friday, get a weekend in NYC and hopefully see a great game. I know I won't think a single time about the fact that it's not played in the dome and I don't get to pee in trough and fight through sea of humanity to try and get a beer at halftime.