my only issue with the staff (offense)

[orangenauburn]

they do not shape the O to the talent they have ... they try to force the talent into the system.

successful up and coming programs shape the offense around the talent they have ... we seem to be doing the opposite

 

[orangepassion]

I hate that between our 2 different types of TE's and FB, we tie up about 9 scholarships.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I hate that between our 2 different types of TE's and FB, we spend 8 or 9 scholarships.

That's defensible depending on how those guys get used, but I've been really underwhelmed with how we've used our fullbacks. I have higher hopes for the tight ends.

 

[44PRIDE]

What is it that you are looking for them to do? They've recruited players for this system....taught the game plan for this system...practiced with this system...and played with this system. Should they switch to the spread option now? Maybe run the wishbone?

I'm being serious. What changes would you make? Insinuating that coaches should "fit the system to the players" is such a cop-out. They've recruited the players to fit their system. Eventually the players need to make plays.

 

[orangepassion]

What is it that you are looking for them to do? They've recruited players for this system....taught the game plan for this system...practiced with this system...and played with this system. Should they switch to the spread option now? Maybe run the wishbone?

I'm being serious. What changes would you make? Insinuating that coaches should "fit the system to the players" is such a cop-out. They've recruited the players to fit their system. Eventually the players need to make plays.

Get our most explosive players on the field and try to get them the ball. For example, last year was too much TE, not enough WR (particularly Graham IMO)

 

[SWC75]

We have a system?

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

they do not shape the O to the talent they have ... they try to force the talent into the system.

successful up and coming programs shape the offense around the talent they have ... we seem to be doing the opposite

I dont think that's really the case. I am not really an X's and O's guy, but it seems to me that the offense is constipated by its complexity, or burdened with "thought." It reminds me of GRobs defense, where everyone was constantly thinking assignment and reading before reacting.

Over the last few years, I have felt that the offense has been forced to play way too "fine," and that really hampers any chance of being dynamic or even efficient. WVU was the ultimate example of what the pro style, multiple offense can do when everything aligns perfectly. But that game really is the lone exception. More games have resembled Rhode Island, where we struggle to move the ball against inferior talent.

I keep hearing that Northwestern's offense is the prototype SU aspires to, which makes sense. They have been putting up yards and numbers with inferior talent, and the offense is pretty balanced. And although the recruiting seems to be shaped to build a Northwestern like offense (mobile QBs, quick backs, big receivers, fast lineman), there does not seem to be any signs of implementation on the horizon. I hope that is a function of paranoid Marrone and CO not wanting to show its cards with this past week of open practice.

 

[BORZAK]

Get our most explosive players on the field and try to get them the ball. For example, last year was too much TE, not enough WR (particularly Graham IMO)

How do you complete down field pass without time for the plays to develop? Educate me!

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

How do you complete down field pass without time for the plays to develop? Educate me!

I know we all rag on the oline here ( i do too because i think there are a few guys that are/were major liabilities), but the realty is, most teams' olines suck in college. Defensive linemen just tend to be way ahead of olineman at this age. Hell, we beat the out of the Rutgers and West Virginia QBs to name a few. SU had one less sack then its opponents last year, and only threw the ball 3 more times. Olines are consistently bad across the nation. It's really not an excuse.

 

[BORZAK]

I know we all rag on the oline here ( i do too because i think there are a few guys that are/were major liabilities), but the realty is, most teams' olines suck in college. Defensive linemen just tend to be way ahead of olineman at this age. Hell, we beat the **** out of the Rutgers and West Virginia QBs to name a few. SU had one less sack then its opponents last year, and only threw the ball 3 more times. Olines are consistently bad across the nation. It's really not an excuse.

I don't rag on this team but we rarely have time for things to develop

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

I don't rag on this team but we rarely have time for things to develop

That's fine, but my point really was, neither does anyone else. Olines are just shitty at this level, and a well developed pocket providing ample time to throw is a rarity.

 

[SWC75]

That's fine, but my point really was, neither does anyone else. Olines are just shitty at this level, and a well developed pocket providing ample time to throw is a rarity.

We've run into a few good ones in recent years, mostly in November games.

 

[BORZAK]

That's fine, but my point really was, neither does anyone else. Olines are just shitty at this level, and a well developed pocket providing ample time to throw is a rarity.

How long do you think we had last season, and how long is ample time?

 

[SoBristol]

they do not shape the O to the talent they have ... they try to force the talent into the system.
......

Not so sure about that. Last year, the best guys were Bailey, Lemon (a possession receiver) and Provo (TE, best for possession passes). So, the Marrone O used those guys a lot.
The problem, last year and again now, is the lack of skill-posiiton talent to force into any system. We aren't blessed with speedy WRs or RBs who make defenders miss. With Lemon sitting out, the best player on offense was Stevens - a TE. The younger QBs should be making more plays.

 

[orangenauburn]

What is it that you are looking for them to do? They've recruited players for this system....taught the game plan for this system...practiced with this system...and played with this system. Should they switch to the spread option now? Maybe run the wishbone?

I'm being serious. What changes would you make? Insinuating that coaches should "fit the system to the players" is such a cop-out. They've recruited the players to fit their system. Eventually the players need to make plays.

last year they should have used Bailey more like they did in the bowl year instead of 'pound it up the middle' guy. (screens, quick outs, change of pace)

or the RI game where they 'were determined to get the ground game going' to the point it nearly cost us a W.

They had speed to use, they just kept it on the sidelines ... players can not grow if they do not play and learn from their mistakes.

They could have used a 4 WR set with Lemon, Graham or Kobena, Wales or Fleming, and Provo to spread things out instead of bunching everyone to one part of the field. Open things up, utilize the space and spread it out - create space that the talent cannot create on its own.

 

[Hoov50]

We do not and have not (since probably 1998) had any consistent playmakers on offense. We have guys look like playmakers for a quarter, a half or a few for a game, but none for a season. Broyld could be a playmaker, but regardless of his ability it is very rare to see a freshman come in and be a consistent playmaker. Until we have a guy who defenses have to consistently worry about every time they are on the field, we are going to have to live with what we have.

 

[OrangePA]

they do not shape the O to the talent they have ... they try to force the talent into the system.

successful up and coming programs shape the offense around the talent they have ... we seem to be doing the opposite

No.

I don't think that's right.

I think the coaches have shaped the offense to match the talent.

That is why Nassib has tended to throw quick, short passes rather than long passes.

That is why the TEs and Alec Lemon were the targets last year - there was no effort made to throw to streaking WRs.

We did not have game breaking RBs so we rarely ran outside - we ran mostly between the tackles.

Either Nassib could not run or a decision was made not to allow him to run - to prevent injury - so we didn't see much option or read option.

I think it's pretty clear that the coaches adapted to the players.

 

[Millhouse]

they do not shape the O to the talent they have ... they try to force the talent into the system.

successful up and coming programs shape the offense around the talent they have ... we seem to be doing the opposite

Lets get specific. What should they do?i contend that this offense is tailored to the talent. Its just lousy chicken salad

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[OrangePA]

Lets get specific. What should they do?i contend that this offense is tailored to the talent. Its just lousy chicken salad

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The more chicken salad, the more points and the more wins.

Hopefully there is more chicken salad this year than last year.

 

[AZOrange]

That's fine, but my point really was, neither does anyone else. Olines are just shitty at this level, and a well developed pocket providing ample time to throw is a rarity.

There are plenty of good o-lines at the college level. Wait until you see USCs...

 

[Aweart23]

There are plenty of good o-lines at the college level. Wait until you see USCs...

U$C is not really a college team...

 

[SWC75]

No.

I don't think that's right.

I think the coaches have shaped the offense to match the talent.

That is why Nassib has tended to throw quick, short passes rather than long passes.

That is why the TEs and Alec Lemon were the targets last year - there was no effort made to throw to streaking WRs.

We did not have game breaking RBs so we rarely ran outside - we ran mostly between the tackles.

Either Nassib could not run or a decision was made not to allow him to run - to prevent injury - so we didn't see much option or read option.

I think it's pretty clear that the coaches adapted to the players.

We didn't have a power running back like we did with Carter. So they took a guy who did his best work in space- Bailey- and ran him as if he were Carter. he didn't do too badley but not as good as Carter did. The defense didn't have to focus on him to stop him, which is what you need. I agree that we had no reliable deep threat and so were limited to a short passing game.

 

[Czar]

There are plenty of good o-lines at the college level. Wait until you see USCs...

It's really not that amazing. College lines have, at best, one pro, maybe two. And they really do not reach potential until after college. The exception here is Wisconsin.

I swear to god people around here don't pay attention to the college game as a whole.