My Take | Syracusefan.com

My Take

sutomcat

Co 2020-21 Iggy Award Winner MPG (special again)
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
21,988
Like
91,587
My wife and I sat courtside last night. Great treat. Much thanks to the always awesome cto for that gift.

Some miscellaneous stuff first...

When you have courtside seats, one of the additional benefits for years was that you could enter the dome through stadium control. There was a side door next to the big door where cars and trucks could enter. That side door opened to a small room with another door that led to a dome hallway where you could get under the stands, gain access to the locker rooms or get to the floor level of the facility (where the field is).

It was a nice perk to not have to climb up all the steps to Gate B, enter there and immediately descend back to field level.

That access ended with COVID. We were hoping it would be opened up these days but access to that entrance was still restricted. We were told to walk to Gate A. So we started. But near the staircase that leads to Gate B, we saw a new entrance for high roller court side seating beautiful people.

I had not heard about this. We went in that way. It gets you right outside where the original setup for food was for the courtside folks, under the stands where the students sit (for football and basketball). Cool. We are already seeing benefits from getting rid of the air supported dome, where now they are open up new entrances and exits to the building.

My wife was surprised by a visit from the daughter and grand daughter yesterday afternoon and was so busy with them that she did not have time to get anything to eat. We looked to the concession stands, praying that there was food and drink available. Yay, there was. They even had the fryer stuff; chicken tenders and sandwiches and french fries. This made my wife very happy.

My wife got her food, we got drinks and eventually made our way to the courtside seats. First thing we noticed was a huge improvement. They have added covers over the individual chairs that clearly identify each chair with the row and chair number. For years, you needed to awkwardly turn chairs around to look on the back to find out what number they were. Or count from the end. The covers were professionally done and look nice. Seems minor but the high rollers deserve this kind of consideration. Good move.

The dome looks very shiny and new from the courtside seats. All the new scoreboards, the new lights...it really is quite impressive. If they can figure out how to get the center hung scoreboard to hang over the basketball court for hoops games, we will really be cooking with gas. Hope this is not a dream never to be realized. Is this something that is on the back burner that might be realized some day? Anyone know for sure? I suspect the answer is yes but am not sure.

My granddaughter is 20 months old. She doesn't know about of the players on the team but I already know her favorite player. It is Peter Carey. Why? His sneakers. They are pink and have a lot of sparkles and shiny stuff on them. It is right up her alley.

Indiana was well coached. They were disciplined, worked the ball around nicely, worked hard on defense, hustled and scrapped on the boards and seemed fundamentally solid. If they shot the ball from the outside better, they might have won. They missed a lot of quality looks from the 3 point circle.

They had one big, who was maybe their best passer in the half court offense, and maybe their best outside shooter. He was really good at getting the ball inside and finding the open man on the perimeter for an open jumper. If they had 2 of him, we really would have been in trouble. Anyway, I think this was a good team to play early in the season and playing them should help us get better.

We opened in man to man defense. I think we stayed with it the whole first half, except for a few plays where IU was inbounding it on their side. Our man was not good. We didn't get anyone out extended into the grill of the IU players. We were pretty passive and got beat regularly on the dribble. There was a lot of cheating to help out and leaving a guy open and IU was able to take advantage of this regularly in the first half. I think the IU players were on average 3 or 4 inches shorter than the SU players covering them and the one advantage they might have had was that they were more agile and quicker than our guys. But JB stayed with it the whole first half.

I was wondering if he was going to stick with it the whole second half too and use it as a learning experience like that LeMoyne game years ago. But this was not the case.

I missed the start of the second half due to more feeding requirements for my hungry wife but when we got to our seats early in the second half, SU was pressing. Indiana was pretty quick and they looked experienced and continued to look well coached and beat our press badly early and often. They had guys release early and get uncontested layups a couple of times, got easy 2 on 1s, etc and we had to call it off pretty quickly. Not sure we have practiced it much. It didn't look like it. I was bummed because I thought we had the personnel to be a good pressing team.

Anyway, after we called the press off, I think we finally started to use the 2-3 and once we did that, the game changed. IU was able to hang with us for a while longer but they had a lot harder time getting quality looks and points in the paint became scarce. They did hurt us some with offensive rebounding, which was disturbing given their lack of size. We need to box out better.

Benny started the game kind of loafing under the boards and getting beat for rebounds by a smaller IU player. JB yelled at him and he got the message. Was by far our best rebounder the rest of the game and played harder than I have ever seen him play. He looked to score when he got the ball in scoring positions and just looked like a confident, solid player. Out of all the things I saw last night, this was the thing that got me most excited. Benny looked good.

We got into our first good groove somewhere around the middle of the second half with a 3 guard lineup. But not the lineup we were thinking. It was JG3, Judah, Benny, Jesse and Quadir Copeland..

I think Symir was going to be the 3rd guard for this extended sequence but shortly after he came in, he went down in a lot of pain. Close to us. I could hear him cry out and I was really concerned his had blown out his knee. But it looked like he just banged it on the court and after a while, was able to walk off the court with no limp. He didn't play again until the game was almost over. QC came in for him and that was when things really started to happen for Syracuse.

Judah is an interesting player. He was able to beat his guy and get deep into the paint seemingly whenever he wanted. Had some quality looks but missed a bunch of time and maybe forced a couple of questionable shots as well. I didn't see him penetrate and kick out once. Didn't even see him look to possibly pass once he got in the lane.

Also didn't see him even try to work a pick and roll with Jesse a single time. JG3 got Jesse going with one around the mid point of the second half. So Judah was very shoot first in his first game as an Orangeman. Hopefully he will look to get his teammates more involved in future games.

That said, Judah is a terrific athlete. Our first really athletic kid in a while. He was at his best when we were down in the second half and really needed to respond. I think IU got up by 7 or so around the 13 minute mark and it was looking bad for us. Judah took a tough 3 (it was around the top of the key, might have been just inside the 3) when we really didn't have a good shot and made it. Thought that clutch shot was a key moment in the game. We got on a run after that.

That wasn't long after Judah tried a long 3 and awkwardly kicked his legs out to draw a foul. It was a blatant kick out and the refs rightly didn't go for it. They actually called the foul on Judah (was there a rule change on kick outs this off season?) and IU got the ball. Judah looked very confused and unhappy. And then proceeded to largely take over the game with a series of nice baskets.

In the first half, IU kind of bodied Judah and knocked him around some in the lane and he missed a bunch of shots. We also got burned for a series of transition scores after Judah went into the paint for a shot, missed it, IU got the rebound and no one on Syracuse rotated back to play safety. I think this is more on guys like Taylor and Girard who are playing the 2.

Anyway, Judah learned from his mistakes early and played much better in the second half, getting better as the game progressed. You can see he is a competitor and why he is going to be good in clutch situations.

But I still want him looking for his teammates more.

Copeland is a really interesting player. He had a couple great rebounds from unlikely places (one was called a foul; bad call). He can jump and has that knack for getting 50-50 balls some players are born with that I love. He is a tough kid who is not afraid and has confidence in himself. That can be bad and it was in the first half when he took some outside shots he probably shouldn't have. But it was good a lot too. He is maybe the only player on the team who can slash to the basket and consistently find the open man for an easy basket. He did that a couple of times, wish he did it more. And he made a huge basket with time running down from almost on the end line in the corner on a play IU played great defense for 22 seconds. That was a killer basket that was a big moment in the game (when it was still in doubt).

JG3 was his normal self. Liked that he got into the paint and drew some fouls more in the second half. He actually played more point in the second half with Judah playing more 2G I thought. It is good to have a senior guard who has been through the wars.

Jesse didn't play much in the first half. I think JB was mad at him for not being a factor on the boards or in the paint. We aren't the same with him out and I think his getting benched for so long played a big role in why we were losing most of the first half. Thought he played better in the second half. Much better. Really wish we tried to get the ball to him down low more. He was mostly up at the top of the key, looking to set a pick and roll to the basket but our guards weren't working with him on it. And he rarely tried to set up down low to get it in scoring position that way. When he did, we didn't make good entry passes. Benny missed one, I think Joe did too. Still want him more assertive. He must demand the ball more. And the guards need to get it to him more. We need to get opposing big men in foul trouble and get easy baskets down low.

Chris Bell just stood around the perimeter and jacked 3s every time he touched the ball. 9 shots in 13 minutes is a little out of control. IU let him shoot and I don't blame them based on the results. He needs to do more than this.

Justin Taylor was the opposite. He rarely took a shot when he was in and didn't even look at the basket most of the time he had the ball. His form on his jumper is nice. Kind of wish he would take more shots and be more aggressive.

Maliq is another guy who seemed kind of tentative. I liked his defense and he rebounded well in limited minutes but he seems like he is content to be a role player. One of the interesting battles still undetermined is who will be the backup center. I think he is in the mix here. Benny came out in the first half playing flat and JB subbed Maliq in very early. But he didn't get a lot of playing time and the jury is still out on him for me.

Pete Carey also didn't play much and when he did, didn't do much. Mounir Hima played even less but he did get the ball in the paint and made a nice 8 footer for a basket. He also had a nice block.

Symir didn't play much either. I think I missed most of his PT which was late in the game (had to work the next day). Happy he made a 3 and as usual, he made a number of good passes.

You have to be cautious making judgements based on these early games. We have had players who turned out to be really bad look great in these games and great players look really bad.

Overall, I thought we looked impressive in the second half. The zone was solid, the half court offense was good and we played very hard.
 
Last edited:

OrangeXtreme

The Mayor of Dewitt
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
185,637
Like
301,002
My wife and I sat courtside last night. Great treat. Much thanks to the always awesome cto for that gift.

Some miscellaneous stuff first...

When you have courtside seats, one of the additional benefits for years was that you could enter the dome through stadium control. There was a side door next to the big door where cars and trucks could enter. That side door opened to a small room with another door that led to a dome hallway where you could get under the stands, gain access to the locker rooms or get to the floor level of the facility (where the field is).

It was a nice perk to not have to climb up all the steps to Gate B, enter there and immediately descend back to field level.

That access ended with COVID. We were hoping it would be opened up these days but access to that entrance was still restricted. We were told to walk to Gate A. So we started. But near the staircase that leads to Gate B, we saw a new entrance for high roller court side seating beautiful people.

I had not heard about this. We went in that way. It gets you right outside where the original setup for food was for the courtside folks, under the stands where the students sit (for football and basketball). Cool. We are already seeing benefits from getting rid of the air supported dome, where now they are open up new entrances and exits to the building.

I always thought that was the "Weitsman Entrance" where the elevator would whisk him directly to the 300 level suites.
 

Newhouser

All American
Joined
Jan 20, 2015
Messages
6,622
Like
11,713
My wife and I sat courtside last night. Great treat. Much thanks to the always awesome cto for that gift.

Some miscellaneous stuff first...

When you have courtside seats, one of the additional benefits for years was that you could enter the dome through stadium control. There was a side door next to the big door where cars and trucks could enter. That side door opened to a small room with another door that led to a dome hallway where you could get under the stands, gain access to the locker rooms or get to the floor level of the facility (where the field is).

It was a nice perk to not have to climb up all the steps to Gate B, enter there and immediately descend back to field level.

That access ended with COVID. We were hoping it would be opened up these days but access to that entrance was still restricted. We were told to walk to Gate A. So we started. But near the staircase that leads to Gate B, we saw a new entrance for high roller court side seating beautiful people.

I had not heard about this. We went in that way. It gets you right outside where the original setup for food was for the courtside folks, under the stands where the students sit (for football and basketball). Cool. We are already seeing benefits from getting rid of the air supported dome, where now they are open up new entrances and exits to the building.

My wife was surprised by a visit from the daughter and grand daughter yesterday afternoon and was so busy with them that she did not have time to get anything to eat. We looked to the concession stands, praying that there was food and drink available. Yay, there was. They even had the fryer stuff; chicken tenders and sandwiches and french fries. This made my wife very happy.

My wife got her food, we got drinks and eventually made our way to the courtside seats. First thing we noticed was a huge improvement. They have added covers over the individual chairs that clearly identify each chair with the row and chair number. For years, you needed to awkwardly turn chairs around to look on the back to find out what number they were. Or count from the end. The covers were professionally done and look nice. Seems minor but the high rollers deserve this kind of consideration. Good move.

The dome looks very shiny and new from the courtside seats. All the new scoreboards, the new lights...it really is quite impressive. If they can figure out how to get the center hung scoreboard to hang over the basketball court for hoops games, we will really be cooking with gas. Hope this is not a dream never to be realized. Is this something that is on the back burner that might be realized some day? Anyone know for sure? I suspect the answer is yes but am not sure.

My granddaughter is 20 months old. She doesn't know about of the players on the team but I already know her favorite player. It is Peter Carey. Why? His sneakers. They are pink and have a lot of sparkles and shiny stuff on them. It is right up her alley.

Indiana was well coached. They were disciplined, worked the ball around nicely, worked hard on defense, hustled and scrapped on the boards and seemed fundamentally solid. If they shot the ball from the outside better, they might have won. They missed a lot of quality looks from the 3 point circle.

They had one big, who was maybe their best passer in the half court offense, and maybe their best outside shooter. He was really good at getting the ball inside and finding the open man on the perimeter for an open jumper. If they had 2 of him, we really would have been in trouble. Anyway, I think this was a good team to play early in the season and playing them should help us get better.

We opened in man to man defense. I think we stayed with it the whole first half, except for a few plays where IU was inbounding it on their side. Our man was not good. We didn't get anyone out extended into the grill of the IU players. We were pretty passive and got beat regularly on the dribble. There was a lot of cheating to help out and leaving a guy open and IU was able to take advantage of this regularly in the first half. I think the IU players were on average 3 or 4 inches shorter than the SU players covering them and the one advantage they might have had was that they were more agile and quicker than our guys. But JB stayed with it the whole first half.

I was wondering if he was going to stick with it the whole second half too and use it as a learning experience like that LeMoyne game years ago. But this was not the case.

I missed the start of the second half due to more feeding requirements for my hungry wife but when we got to our seats early in the second half, SU was pressing. Indiana was pretty quick and they looked experienced and continued to look well coached and beat our press badly early and often. They had guys release early and get uncontested layups a couple of times, got easy 2 on 1s, etc and we had to call it off pretty quickly. Not sure we have practiced it much. It didn't look like it. I was bummed because I thought we had the personnel to be a good pressing team.

Anyway, after we called the press off, I think we finally started to use the 2-3 and once we did that, the game changed. IU was able to hang with us for a while longer but they had a lot harder time getting quality looks and points in the paint became scarce. They did hurt us some with offensive rebounding, which was disturbing given their lack of size. We need to box out better.

Benny started the game kind of loafing under the boards and getting beat for rebounds by a smaller IU player. JB yelled at him and he got the message. Was by far our best rebounder the rest of the game and played harder than I have ever seen him play. He looked to score when he got the ball in scoring positions and just looked like a confident, solid player. Out of all the things I saw last night, this was the thing that got me most excited. Benny looked good.

We got into our first good groove somewhere around the middle of the second half with a 3 guard lineup. But not the lineup we were thinking. It was JG3, Judah, Benny, Jesse and Quadir Coleman.

I think Symir was going to be the 3rd guard for this extended sequence but shortly after he came in, he went down in a lot of pain. Close to us. I could hear him cry out and I was really concerned his had blown out his knee. But it looked like he just banged it on the court and after a while, was able to walk off the court with no limp. He didn't play again until the game was almost over. QC came in for him and that was when things really started to happen for Syracuse.

Judah is an interesting player. He was able to beat his guy and get deep into the paint seemingly whenever he wanted. Had some quality looks but missed a bunch of time and maybe forced a couple of questionable shots as well. I didn't see him penetrate and kick out once. Didn't even see him look to possibly pass once he got in the lane.

Also didn't see him even try to work a pick and roll with Jesse a single time. JG3 got Jesse going with one around the mid point of the second half. So Judah was very shoot first in his first game as an Orangeman. Hopefully he will look to get his teammates more involved in future games.

That said, Judah is a terrific athlete. Our first really athletic kid in a while. He was at his best when we were down in the second half and really needed to respond. I think IU got up by 7 or so around the 13 minute mark and it was looking bad for us. Judah took a tough 3 (it was around the top of the key, might have been just inside the 3) when we really didn't have a good shot and made it. Thought that clutch shot was a key moment in the game. We got on a run after that.

That wasn't long after Judah tried a long 3 and awkwardly kicked his legs out to draw a foul. It was a blatant kick out and the refs rightly didn't go for it. They actually called the foul on Judah (was there a rule change on kick outs this off season?) and IU got the ball. Judah looked very confused and unhappy. And then proceeded to largely take over the game with a series of nice baskets.

In the first half, IU kind of bodied Judah and knocked him around some in the lane and he missed a bunch of shots. We also got burned for a series of transition scores after Judah went into the paint for a shot, missed it, IU got the rebound and no one on Syracuse rotated back to play safety. I think this is more on guys like Taylor and Girard who are playing the 2.

Anyway, Judah learned from his mistakes early and played much better in the second half, getting better as the game progressed. You can see he is a competitor and why he is going to be good in clutch situations.

But I still want him looking for his teammates more.

Coleman is a really interesting player. He had a couple great rebounds from unlikely places (one was called a foul; bad call). He can jump and has that knack for getting 50-50 balls some players are born with that I love. He is a tough kid who is not afraid and has confidence in himself. That can be bad and it was in the first half when he took some outside shots he probably shouldn't have. But it was good a lot too. He is maybe the only player on the team who can slash to the basket and consistently find the open man for an easy basket. He did that a couple of times, wish he did it more. And he made a huge basket with time running down from almost on the end line in the corner on a play IU played great defense for 22 seconds. That was a killer basket that was a big moment in the game (when it was still in doubt).

JG3 was his normal self. Liked that he got into the paint and drew some fouls more in the second half. He actually played more point in the second half with Judah playing more 2G I thought. It is good to have a senior guard who has been through the wars.

Jesse didn't play much in the first half. I think JB was mad at him for not being a factor on the boards or in the paint. We aren't the same with him out and I think his getting benched for so long played a big role in why we were losing most of the first half. Thought he played better in the second half. Much better. Really wish we tried to get the ball to him down low more. He was mostly up at the top of the key, looking to set a pick and roll to the basket but our guards weren't working with him on it. And he rarely tried to set up down low to get it in scoring position that way. When he did, we didn't make good entry passes. Benny missed one, I think Joe did too. Still want him more assertive. He must demand the ball more. And the guards need to get it to him more. We need to get opposing big men in foul trouble and get easy baskets down low.

Chris Bell just stood around the perimeter and jacked 3s every time he touched the ball. 9 shots in 13 minutes is a little out of control. IU let him shoot and I don't blame them based on the results. He needs to do more than this.

Justin Taylor was the opposite. He rarely took a shot when he was in and didn't even look at the basket most of the time he had the ball. His form on his jumper is nice. Kind of wish he would take more shots and be more aggressive.

Maliq is another guy who seemed kind of tentative. I liked his defense and he rebounded well in limited minutes but he seems like he is content to be a role player. One of the interesting battles still undetermined is who will be the backup center. I think he is in the mix here. Benny came out in the first half playing flat and JB subbed Maliq in very early. But he didn't get a lot of playing time and the jury is still out on him for me.

Pete Carey also didn't play much and when he did, didn't do much. Mounir Hima played even less but he did get the ball in the paint and made a nice 8 footer for a basket. He also had a nice block.

Symir didn't play much either. I think I missed most of his PT which was late in the game (had to work the next day). Happy he made a 3 and as usual, he made a number of good passes.

You have to be cautious making judgements based on these early games. We have had players who turned out to be really bad look great in these games and great players look really bad.

Overall, I thought we looked impressive in the second half. The zone was solid, the half court offense was good and we played very hard.
According to the announcers point of emphasis for the stripes this year is flopping on the charge and flopping/kicking out on the 3 point shot - don't think Judah was aware of the new emphasis.
 

billsin01

All American
Joined
Aug 29, 2011
Messages
5,031
Like
6,952
My wife and I sat courtside last night. Great treat. Much thanks to the always awesome cto for that gift.

Some miscellaneous stuff first...

When you have courtside seats, one of the additional benefits for years was that you could enter the dome through stadium control. There was a side door next to the big door where cars and trucks could enter. That side door opened to a small room with another door that led to a dome hallway where you could get under the stands, gain access to the locker rooms or get to the floor level of the facility (where the field is).

It was a nice perk to not have to climb up all the steps to Gate B, enter there and immediately descend back to field level.

That access ended with COVID. We were hoping it would be opened up these days but access to that entrance was still restricted. We were told to walk to Gate A. So we started. But near the staircase that leads to Gate B, we saw a new entrance for high roller court side seating beautiful people.

I had not heard about this. We went in that way. It gets you right outside where the original setup for food was for the courtside folks, under the stands where the students sit (for football and basketball). Cool. We are already seeing benefits from getting rid of the air supported dome, where now they are open up new entrances and exits to the building.

My wife was surprised by a visit from the daughter and grand daughter yesterday afternoon and was so busy with them that she did not have time to get anything to eat. We looked to the concession stands, praying that there was food and drink available. Yay, there was. They even had the fryer stuff; chicken tenders and sandwiches and french fries. This made my wife very happy.

My wife got her food, we got drinks and eventually made our way to the courtside seats. First thing we noticed was a huge improvement. They have added covers over the individual chairs that clearly identify each chair with the row and chair number. For years, you needed to awkwardly turn chairs around to look on the back to find out what number they were. Or count from the end. The covers were professionally done and look nice. Seems minor but the high rollers deserve this kind of consideration. Good move.

The dome looks very shiny and new from the courtside seats. All the new scoreboards, the new lights...it really is quite impressive. If they can figure out how to get the center hung scoreboard to hang over the basketball court for hoops games, we will really be cooking with gas. Hope this is not a dream never to be realized. Is this something that is on the back burner that might be realized some day? Anyone know for sure? I suspect the answer is yes but am not sure.

My granddaughter is 20 months old. She doesn't know about of the players on the team but I already know her favorite player. It is Peter Carey. Why? His sneakers. They are pink and have a lot of sparkles and shiny stuff on them. It is right up her alley.

Indiana was well coached. They were disciplined, worked the ball around nicely, worked hard on defense, hustled and scrapped on the boards and seemed fundamentally solid. If they shot the ball from the outside better, they might have won. They missed a lot of quality looks from the 3 point circle.

They had one big, who was maybe their best passer in the half court offense, and maybe their best outside shooter. He was really good at getting the ball inside and finding the open man on the perimeter for an open jumper. If they had 2 of him, we really would have been in trouble. Anyway, I think this was a good team to play early in the season and playing them should help us get better.

We opened in man to man defense. I think we stayed with it the whole first half, except for a few plays where IU was inbounding it on their side. Our man was not good. We didn't get anyone out extended into the grill of the IU players. We were pretty passive and got beat regularly on the dribble. There was a lot of cheating to help out and leaving a guy open and IU was able to take advantage of this regularly in the first half. I think the IU players were on average 3 or 4 inches shorter than the SU players covering them and the one advantage they might have had was that they were more agile and quicker than our guys. But JB stayed with it the whole first half.

I was wondering if he was going to stick with it the whole second half too and use it as a learning experience like that LeMoyne game years ago. But this was not the case.

I missed the start of the second half due to more feeding requirements for my hungry wife but when we got to our seats early in the second half, SU was pressing. Indiana was pretty quick and they looked experienced and continued to look well coached and beat our press badly early and often. They had guys release early and get uncontested layups a couple of times, got easy 2 on 1s, etc and we had to call it off pretty quickly. Not sure we have practiced it much. It didn't look like it. I was bummed because I thought we had the personnel to be a good pressing team.

Anyway, after we called the press off, I think we finally started to use the 2-3 and once we did that, the game changed. IU was able to hang with us for a while longer but they had a lot harder time getting quality looks and points in the paint became scarce. They did hurt us some with offensive rebounding, which was disturbing given their lack of size. We need to box out better.

Benny started the game kind of loafing under the boards and getting beat for rebounds by a smaller IU player. JB yelled at him and he got the message. Was by far our best rebounder the rest of the game and played harder than I have ever seen him play. He looked to score when he got the ball in scoring positions and just looked like a confident, solid player. Out of all the things I saw last night, this was the thing that got me most excited. Benny looked good.

We got into our first good groove somewhere around the middle of the second half with a 3 guard lineup. But not the lineup we were thinking. It was JG3, Judah, Benny, Jesse and Quadir Coleman.

I think Symir was going to be the 3rd guard for this extended sequence but shortly after he came in, he went down in a lot of pain. Close to us. I could hear him cry out and I was really concerned his had blown out his knee. But it looked like he just banged it on the court and after a while, was able to walk off the court with no limp. He didn't play again until the game was almost over. QC came in for him and that was when things really started to happen for Syracuse.

Judah is an interesting player. He was able to beat his guy and get deep into the paint seemingly whenever he wanted. Had some quality looks but missed a bunch of time and maybe forced a couple of questionable shots as well. I didn't see him penetrate and kick out once. Didn't even see him look to possibly pass once he got in the lane.

Also didn't see him even try to work a pick and roll with Jesse a single time. JG3 got Jesse going with one around the mid point of the second half. So Judah was very shoot first in his first game as an Orangeman. Hopefully he will look to get his teammates more involved in future games.

That said, Judah is a terrific athlete. Our first really athletic kid in a while. He was at his best when we were down in the second half and really needed to respond. I think IU got up by 7 or so around the 13 minute mark and it was looking bad for us. Judah took a tough 3 (it was around the top of the key, might have been just inside the 3) when we really didn't have a good shot and made it. Thought that clutch shot was a key moment in the game. We got on a run after that.

That wasn't long after Judah tried a long 3 and awkwardly kicked his legs out to draw a foul. It was a blatant kick out and the refs rightly didn't go for it. They actually called the foul on Judah (was there a rule change on kick outs this off season?) and IU got the ball. Judah looked very confused and unhappy. And then proceeded to largely take over the game with a series of nice baskets.

In the first half, IU kind of bodied Judah and knocked him around some in the lane and he missed a bunch of shots. We also got burned for a series of transition scores after Judah went into the paint for a shot, missed it, IU got the rebound and no one on Syracuse rotated back to play safety. I think this is more on guys like Taylor and Girard who are playing the 2.

Anyway, Judah learned from his mistakes early and played much better in the second half, getting better as the game progressed. You can see he is a competitor and why he is going to be good in clutch situations.

But I still want him looking for his teammates more.

Coleman is a really interesting player. He had a couple great rebounds from unlikely places (one was called a foul; bad call). He can jump and has that knack for getting 50-50 balls some players are born with that I love. He is a tough kid who is not afraid and has confidence in himself. That can be bad and it was in the first half when he took some outside shots he probably shouldn't have. But it was good a lot too. He is maybe the only player on the team who can slash to the basket and consistently find the open man for an easy basket. He did that a couple of times, wish he did it more. And he made a huge basket with time running down from almost on the end line in the corner on a play IU played great defense for 22 seconds. That was a killer basket that was a big moment in the game (when it was still in doubt).

JG3 was his normal self. Liked that he got into the paint and drew some fouls more in the second half. He actually played more point in the second half with Judah playing more 2G I thought. It is good to have a senior guard who has been through the wars.

Jesse didn't play much in the first half. I think JB was mad at him for not being a factor on the boards or in the paint. We aren't the same with him out and I think his getting benched for so long played a big role in why we were losing most of the first half. Thought he played better in the second half. Much better. Really wish we tried to get the ball to him down low more. He was mostly up at the top of the key, looking to set a pick and roll to the basket but our guards weren't working with him on it. And he rarely tried to set up down low to get it in scoring position that way. When he did, we didn't make good entry passes. Benny missed one, I think Joe did too. Still want him more assertive. He must demand the ball more. And the guards need to get it to him more. We need to get opposing big men in foul trouble and get easy baskets down low.

Chris Bell just stood around the perimeter and jacked 3s every time he touched the ball. 9 shots in 13 minutes is a little out of control. IU let him shoot and I don't blame them based on the results. He needs to do more than this.

Justin Taylor was the opposite. He rarely took a shot when he was in and didn't even look at the basket most of the time he had the ball. His form on his jumper is nice. Kind of wish he would take more shots and be more aggressive.

Maliq is another guy who seemed kind of tentative. I liked his defense and he rebounded well in limited minutes but he seems like he is content to be a role player. One of the interesting battles still undetermined is who will be the backup center. I think he is in the mix here. Benny came out in the first half playing flat and JB subbed Maliq in very early. But he didn't get a lot of playing time and the jury is still out on him for me.

Pete Carey also didn't play much and when he did, didn't do much. Mounir Hima played even less but he did get the ball in the paint and made a nice 8 footer for a basket. He also had a nice block.

Symir didn't play much either. I think I missed most of his PT which was late in the game (had to work the next day). Happy he made a 3 and as usual, he made a number of good passes.

You have to be cautious making judgements based on these early games. We have had players who turned out to be really bad look great in these games and great players look really bad.

Overall, I thought we looked impressive in the second half. The zone was solid, the half court offense was good and we played very hard.
Yeah agree on almost all of this stuff. Bell was freshman year BJ Johnson -- looks athletic but mostly just hoists and misses threes. JB didn't seem concerned about it and my assumption is he is a much better shooter than he showed, but he's going to have to do more to be on the floor regularly.

Thought we didn't see Carey/Hima more in part because it was a game where we had a height advantage at most spots even in a 3-guard lineup and we were playing to win as opposed to simply subbing and treating it like a true scrimmage.

I have some more observations I'll throw in a more general season outlook type thread but I thought generally that none of the freshmen looked 'great' in the way that a melo/gmac/lydon/johnny flynn did the first time i saw them, which makes me nervous. Edwards is by far the best player on the team, I'd say Joe easily second best. Benny looked better, which is good and we have some depth, which is good, but I think this team is still a ways away from being a finished product that is talking NCAA. Obviously early and IUPUI -- even if this annoys people -- was tough, but wouldn't be shocked if there are some rocky stretches ahead.
 

721Comstock

2022 Iggy Awards: Leading Scorer/Game/Buddy 3s
Joined
Sep 1, 2015
Messages
19,596
Like
77,721
Yeah agree on almost all of this stuff. Bell was freshman year BJ Johnson -- looks athletic but mostly just hoists and misses threes. JB didn't seem concerned about it and my assumption is he is a much better shooter than he showed, but he's going to have to do more to be on the floor regularly.

Thought we didn't see Carey/Hima more in part because it was a game where we had a height advantage at most spots even in a 3-guard lineup and we were playing to win as opposed to simply subbing and treating it like a true scrimmage.

I have some more observations I'll throw in a more general season outlook type thread but I thought generally that none of the freshmen looked 'great' in the way that a melo/gmac/lydon/johnny flynn did the first time i saw them, which makes me nervous. Edwards is by far the best player on the team, I'd say Joe easily second best. Benny looked better, which is good and we have some depth, which is good, but I think this team is still a ways away from being a finished product that is talking NCAA. Obviously early and IUPUI -- even if this annoys people -- was tough, but wouldn't be shocked if there are some rocky stretches ahead.

I was gonna come in hot and dispute your BJ taek, but - yeah, he was that guy as a Frosh.
(although he was a pretty solid rebounder for a skinny dude)
Shot 2-16 from 3 in the 10 games/55 minutes he appeared was wasted in.
(he did shoot 4/8 on his 2's)

I mean - pretty much all our great shooters struggled mightily as Frosh:
Southy, D-Nic, Shump, etc.

While Mintz may not have looked 'great', he was certainly very, very good in spots.
Dude can get to his spot and get a shot off at will.

That said - I'm not sure he's a "PG" at all, yet.
But with JGIII and maybe also QC on the floor, that's enough passing and playmaking to go around.
And Sy had 4 dimes in just 10 minutes - dude is just so solid.
 

Cheriehoop

Moderator/ 2019-20 Iggy Winner Reg Season Rcd
Joined
Aug 17, 2011
Messages
13,808
Like
40,050
Thanks Tomcat for your take. I’m hoping that with 4 players - Mintz, Sy, Copeland and Joe who all have point guard experience that we see better, crisp, play making, entry passes for easy buckets. Sy had 4 assists in only 10 minutes of play with no turnovers - that caught my eye.

Having better athletes with more speed, jumping ability won’t matter if we can’t rebound. I believe we had just one more rebound than the smaller UIP team - you can’t run, show off that athleticism if you don’t have the ball and it certainly hampers getting easy buckets.(Glad to see Benny’s contribution on the boards)
 

sutomcat

Co 2020-21 Iggy Award Winner MPG (special again)
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
21,988
Like
91,587
Thanks Tomcat for your take. I’m hoping that with 4 players - Mintz, Sy, Copeland and Joe who all have point guard experience that we see better, crisp, play making, entry passes for easy buckets. Sy had 4 assists in only 10 minutes of play with no turnovers - that caught my eye.

Having better athletes with more speed, jumping ability won’t matter if we can’t rebound. I believe we had just one more rebound than the smaller UIP team - you can’t run, show off that athleticism if you don’t have the ball and it certainly hampers getting easy buckets.(Glad to see Benny’s contribution on the boards)
Agree with all of this. There was quite a bit of standing around and passing it around the perimeter with our half court offense. Mintz was the only guy who was able to get a shot off consistently in the half court offense.

Rebounding has been a problem for years and it doesn't look like it is going to change. No one hit the offensive boards much and only Benny was hitting the defensive boards hard.

Only outrebounding a much smaller IU team by 1 is not good. It is very worrisome to think about how we are going to do playing against physical teams with size inside.

A good way for one of the wings fighting for playing time to differentiate themselves from the rest of the pack would be to hit the boards hard every game. That would get JB's attention.
 

stuckinbig11

All American
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
4,000
Like
6,177
Thanks, Tom, good points. I am also concerned that Judah did not feed the other players well. Our point guard had one assist. Joe needs to teach him how to feed Jesse.
 

Niastri

2022 Iggy Award winner for Leading Rebounder
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
1,490
Like
3,422
Thanks, Tom, good points. I am also concerned that Judah did not feed the other players well. Our point guard had one assist. Joe needs to teach him how to feed Jesse.
I wonder if part of the reason Mintz seemed so out of it the first half is because he wasn't doing what he's born to do: score points.

Being a scorer first, looking to pass might be hard for him. If he passes only after getting cut off from the basket, he might be more natural.

Having two point guards that can score is great, having two shooting guards pretending to play point might not be so great.
 

Orangezoo

In the wind
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
31,797
Like
68,801
I think people get way too hung up on having a true PG. It's less about the role and more about keeping the game simple- make a play. Judah gets into the lane and he is a massive threat to score. He will be difficult for everyone to keep out of the lane. The biggest issues were when he forced a couple runners and then had that jump pass turnover. That said, his skillset puts a defense on its heels. You coach him up to pass more but you take the imbalance he creates because it will translate into buckets.

Joe is a good shooter and can attack a closeout. That is where he is good. He also does well off set action with Jesse. That's a nice half court wrinkle.

Quadir and Benny both showed off attacking and making a pass or getting a bucket. We know Symir can do that as well. That's 5 guys who without a scripted play that get the defense off balance and made something happen getting a bucket for themselves or someone else. It's not always pretty or within the flow of a scripted offense. It also is at times selfish or missing out on feeding Jesse. All that youth means less efficiency as well.

I will trade the above for the restrictive offense that requires a very specific set of scenarios to score even when you can score a lot. Ultimately there is a ceiling you can't break in today's game when you play that way.

So before veering too far off course- we don't need someone who is the PG by default. We need guys who can make plays to put a defense on its heels whether they are selfish plays or setting up teammates and coach them up to become more efficient and making better decisions.
 

Niastri

2022 Iggy Award winner for Leading Rebounder
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
1,490
Like
3,422
I think people get way too hung up on having a true PG. It's less about the role and more about keeping the game simple- make a play. Judah gets into the lane and he is a massive threat to score. He will be difficult for everyone to keep out of the lane. The biggest issues were when he forced a couple runners and then had that jump pass turnover. That said, his skillset puts a defense on its heels. You coach him up to pass more but you take the imbalance he creates because it will translate into buckets.

Joe is a good shooter and can attack a closeout. That is where he is good. He also does well off set action with Jesse. That's a nice half court wrinkle.

Quadir and Benny both showed off attacking and making a pass or getting a bucket. We know Symir can do that as well. That's 5 guys who without a scripted play that get the defense off balance and made something happen getting a bucket for themselves or someone else. It's not always pretty or within the flow of a scripted offense. It also is at times selfish or missing out on feeding Jesse. All that youth means less efficiency as well.

I will trade the above for the restrictive offense that requires a very specific set of scenarios to score even when you can score a lot. Ultimately there is a ceiling you can't break in today's game when you play that way.

So before veering too far off course- we don't need someone who is the PG by default. We need guys who can make plays to put a defense on its heels whether they are selfish plays or setting up teammates and coach them up to become more efficient and making better decisions.
I would like a scripted play or two, or at least organized offensive sets, before the freelancing goes into play.

The pick and roll, motion offense off double screens, a pick to get Edwards into post position, even the weave up top before going hero ball isolation would be nice.
 

Orangezoo

In the wind
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
31,797
Like
68,801
I would like a scripted play or two, or at least organized offensive sets, before the freelancing goes into play.

The pick and roll, motion offense off double screens, a pick to get Edwards into post position, even the weave up top before going hero ball isolation would be nice.

I don't mean it's all freelancing. You need some bread and butter plays and some go to stuff you can run. The point is you have to have guys who can make plays for themselves and others. The more the merrier. That includes the ability to shoot the rock. Thus a true PG gets over emphasized the way its being discussed. Last year we had 1.5 guys who could make a play as such. Symir and the limited scenarios for Joe and then Buddy. Everything else was scripted including 1 on 1s for Buddy.
 

Sbucketball

2nd String
Joined
Mar 31, 2022
Messages
566
Like
1,656
I wonder if part of the reason Mintz seemed so out of it the first half is because he wasn't doing what he's born to do: score points.

Being a scorer first, looking to pass might be hard for him. If he passes only after getting cut off from the basket, he might be more natural.

Having two point guards that can score is great, having two shooting guards pretending to play point might not be so great.
Copeland is a true PG. I'm guessing he plays a little wild at this point and JB isn't ready to put the ball in his hands, but I'd like to see them experiment when they have the Joe-Judah-Copeland-Benny-Jesse lineup by playing Copeland as the 1 on offense and put him on the backline of the zone on defense. Then you'd have an incredibly crafty passer creating for 2 natural-born scorers, an offensively-talented center, and you'd have Benny to clean it all up.
 

Nicknack

All Conference
Joined
Sep 2, 2011
Messages
2,682
Like
7,238
My wife and I sat courtside last night. Great treat. Much thanks to the always awesome cto for that gift.

Some miscellaneous stuff first...

When you have courtside seats, one of the additional benefits for years was that you could enter the dome through stadium control. There was a side door next to the big door where cars and trucks could enter. That side door opened to a small room with another door that led to a dome hallway where you could get under the stands, gain access to the locker rooms or get to the floor level of the facility (where the field is).

It was a nice perk to not have to climb up all the steps to Gate B, enter there and immediately descend back to field level.

That access ended with COVID. We were hoping it would be opened up these days but access to that entrance was still restricted. We were told to walk to Gate A. So we started. But near the staircase that leads to Gate B, we saw a new entrance for high roller court side seating beautiful people.

I had not heard about this. We went in that way. It gets you right outside where the original setup for food was for the courtside folks, under the stands where the students sit (for football and basketball). Cool. We are already seeing benefits from getting rid of the air supported dome, where now they are open up new entrances and exits to the building.

My wife was surprised by a visit from the daughter and grand daughter yesterday afternoon and was so busy with them that she did not have time to get anything to eat. We looked to the concession stands, praying that there was food and drink available. Yay, there was. They even had the fryer stuff; chicken tenders and sandwiches and french fries. This made my wife very happy.

My wife got her food, we got drinks and eventually made our way to the courtside seats. First thing we noticed was a huge improvement. They have added covers over the individual chairs that clearly identify each chair with the row and chair number. For years, you needed to awkwardly turn chairs around to look on the back to find out what number they were. Or count from the end. The covers were professionally done and look nice. Seems minor but the high rollers deserve this kind of consideration. Good move.

The dome looks very shiny and new from the courtside seats. All the new scoreboards, the new lights...it really is quite impressive. If they can figure out how to get the center hung scoreboard to hang over the basketball court for hoops games, we will really be cooking with gas. Hope this is not a dream never to be realized. Is this something that is on the back burner that might be realized some day? Anyone know for sure? I suspect the answer is yes but am not sure.

My granddaughter is 20 months old. She doesn't know about of the players on the team but I already know her favorite player. It is Peter Carey. Why? His sneakers. They are pink and have a lot of sparkles and shiny stuff on them. It is right up her alley.

Indiana was well coached. They were disciplined, worked the ball around nicely, worked hard on defense, hustled and scrapped on the boards and seemed fundamentally solid. If they shot the ball from the outside better, they might have won. They missed a lot of quality looks from the 3 point circle.

They had one big, who was maybe their best passer in the half court offense, and maybe their best outside shooter. He was really good at getting the ball inside and finding the open man on the perimeter for an open jumper. If they had 2 of him, we really would have been in trouble. Anyway, I think this was a good team to play early in the season and playing them should help us get better.

We opened in man to man defense. I think we stayed with it the whole first half, except for a few plays where IU was inbounding it on their side. Our man was not good. We didn't get anyone out extended into the grill of the IU players. We were pretty passive and got beat regularly on the dribble. There was a lot of cheating to help out and leaving a guy open and IU was able to take advantage of this regularly in the first half. I think the IU players were on average 3 or 4 inches shorter than the SU players covering them and the one advantage they might have had was that they were more agile and quicker than our guys. But JB stayed with it the whole first half.

I was wondering if he was going to stick with it the whole second half too and use it as a learning experience like that LeMoyne game years ago. But this was not the case.

I missed the start of the second half due to more feeding requirements for my hungry wife but when we got to our seats early in the second half, SU was pressing. Indiana was pretty quick and they looked experienced and continued to look well coached and beat our press badly early and often. They had guys release early and get uncontested layups a couple of times, got easy 2 on 1s, etc and we had to call it off pretty quickly. Not sure we have practiced it much. It didn't look like it. I was bummed because I thought we had the personnel to be a good pressing team.

Anyway, after we called the press off, I think we finally started to use the 2-3 and once we did that, the game changed. IU was able to hang with us for a while longer but they had a lot harder time getting quality looks and points in the paint became scarce. They did hurt us some with offensive rebounding, which was disturbing given their lack of size. We need to box out better.

Benny started the game kind of loafing under the boards and getting beat for rebounds by a smaller IU player. JB yelled at him and he got the message. Was by far our best rebounder the rest of the game and played harder than I have ever seen him play. He looked to score when he got the ball in scoring positions and just looked like a confident, solid player. Out of all the things I saw last night, this was the thing that got me most excited. Benny looked good.

We got into our first good groove somewhere around the middle of the second half with a 3 guard lineup. But not the lineup we were thinking. It was JG3, Judah, Benny, Jesse and Quadir Copeland..

I think Symir was going to be the 3rd guard for this extended sequence but shortly after he came in, he went down in a lot of pain. Close to us. I could hear him cry out and I was really concerned his had blown out his knee. But it looked like he just banged it on the court and after a while, was able to walk off the court with no limp. He didn't play again until the game was almost over. QC came in for him and that was when things really started to happen for Syracuse.

Judah is an interesting player. He was able to beat his guy and get deep into the paint seemingly whenever he wanted. Had some quality looks but missed a bunch of time and maybe forced a couple of questionable shots as well. I didn't see him penetrate and kick out once. Didn't even see him look to possibly pass once he got in the lane.

Also didn't see him even try to work a pick and roll with Jesse a single time. JG3 got Jesse going with one around the mid point of the second half. So Judah was very shoot first in his first game as an Orangeman. Hopefully he will look to get his teammates more involved in future games.

That said, Judah is a terrific athlete. Our first really athletic kid in a while. He was at his best when we were down in the second half and really needed to respond. I think IU got up by 7 or so around the 13 minute mark and it was looking bad for us. Judah took a tough 3 (it was around the top of the key, might have been just inside the 3) when we really didn't have a good shot and made it. Thought that clutch shot was a key moment in the game. We got on a run after that.

That wasn't long after Judah tried a long 3 and awkwardly kicked his legs out to draw a foul. It was a blatant kick out and the refs rightly didn't go for it. They actually called the foul on Judah (was there a rule change on kick outs this off season?) and IU got the ball. Judah looked very confused and unhappy. And then proceeded to largely take over the game with a series of nice baskets.

In the first half, IU kind of bodied Judah and knocked him around some in the lane and he missed a bunch of shots. We also got burned for a series of transition scores after Judah went into the paint for a shot, missed it, IU got the rebound and no one on Syracuse rotated back to play safety. I think this is more on guys like Taylor and Girard who are playing the 2.

Anyway, Judah learned from his mistakes early and played much better in the second half, getting better as the game progressed. You can see he is a competitor and why he is going to be good in clutch situations.

But I still want him looking for his teammates more.

Copeland is a really interesting player. He had a couple great rebounds from unlikely places (one was called a foul; bad call). He can jump and has that knack for getting 50-50 balls some players are born with that I love. He is a tough kid who is not afraid and has confidence in himself. That can be bad and it was in the first half when he took some outside shots he probably shouldn't have. But it was good a lot too. He is maybe the only player on the team who can slash to the basket and consistently find the open man for an easy basket. He did that a couple of times, wish he did it more. And he made a huge basket with time running down from almost on the end line in the corner on a play IU played great defense for 22 seconds. That was a killer basket that was a big moment in the game (when it was still in doubt).

JG3 was his normal self. Liked that he got into the paint and drew some fouls more in the second half. He actually played more point in the second half with Judah playing more 2G I thought. It is good to have a senior guard who has been through the wars.

Jesse didn't play much in the first half. I think JB was mad at him for not being a factor on the boards or in the paint. We aren't the same with him out and I think his getting benched for so long played a big role in why we were losing most of the first half. Thought he played better in the second half. Much better. Really wish we tried to get the ball to him down low more. He was mostly up at the top of the key, looking to set a pick and roll to the basket but our guards weren't working with him on it. And he rarely tried to set up down low to get it in scoring position that way. When he did, we didn't make good entry passes. Benny missed one, I think Joe did too. Still want him more assertive. He must demand the ball more. And the guards need to get it to him more. We need to get opposing big men in foul trouble and get easy baskets down low.

Chris Bell just stood around the perimeter and jacked 3s every time he touched the ball. 9 shots in 13 minutes is a little out of control. IU let him shoot and I don't blame them based on the results. He needs to do more than this.

Justin Taylor was the opposite. He rarely took a shot when he was in and didn't even look at the basket most of the time he had the ball. His form on his jumper is nice. Kind of wish he would take more shots and be more aggressive.

Maliq is another guy who seemed kind of tentative. I liked his defense and he rebounded well in limited minutes but he seems like he is content to be a role player. One of the interesting battles still undetermined is who will be the backup center. I think he is in the mix here. Benny came out in the first half playing flat and JB subbed Maliq in very early. But he didn't get a lot of playing time and the jury is still out on him for me.

Pete Carey also didn't play much and when he did, didn't do much. Mounir Hima played even less but he did get the ball in the paint and made a nice 8 footer for a basket. He also had a nice block.

Symir didn't play much either. I think I missed most of his PT which was late in the game (had to work the next day). Happy he made a 3 and as usual, he made a number of good passes.

You have to be cautious making judgements based on these early games. We have had players who turned out to be really bad look great in these games and great players look really bad.

Overall, I thought we looked impressive in the second half. The zone was solid, the half court offense was good and we played very hard.

As usual, I really enjoyed your recap. Also, glad you got great seats for the game - sounds like it was a blast. A few things after reading your post...

I really thought we were going to lose, and I had those thoughts early in the 2nd half. I love the guys we have, but we are far from being a gelled team. I give Boeheim credit for so many guys he put into the game early, but that was part of the problem too (if you're just looking at winning the game).

I agree, our pressure D was very disappointing. With such a new team, maybe that's to be expected. I hope so because it was really bad. The only pressure we really had was on ourselves after getting beat over and over and having to defend the hoop on the other end.

I might be in the minority here, but I HATE the new flop rule. While I despise flops, I detest calls from refs on what are incredibly subjective. I don't get how you can call a personal foul on a guy for lunging backwards. Seems like a dumb call and an over correction just because for years Duke got rewarded for flops.

Judah is money. I also love his intense competitiveness. We may not have him long so I'm going to try to enjoy watching his wear orange as long as we can. Love the player.

I also love what Cope brought today. I expect he will also have games which will be really frustrating too - he seems like that kind of player. That said, his energy and willingness to go after balls was great to see. I hope he keeps earning minutes because that kind of play is contagious.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
161,821
Messages
4,420,737
Members
5,679
Latest member
Lamizana43

Online statistics

Members online
33
Guests online
357
Total visitors
390




Top Bottom