My thoughts (sorry for the length)

[Goin' Deep]

What I want to see...
Should Dino be fired... we've seen these threads

Dino has a press conference in preparation for the BC game.
It's time for the media to take the gloves off.
Fans deserve to know just what the hell is going on with the team.
"Coach, can you expound on what/how practices were like last week leading to the team's performance?"
"Coach you went to Purdue and beat them by 14 pts. You go to VATECH and lose by 27..a team that LOST TO PURDUE. Why is this team playing so poorly for such an extended period?"
"Coach, several football playing alums have been critical of your team. Are they right or how do you explain the team's level of competence the last 5 weeks?"

I want to hear Dino address just where things are at right now. I don't want to hear about Ohana and owies.
I want to hear a FOOTBALL coach explain to fans why we are where we are. THIS will tell me if Babers is worth keeping.

 

[Chip]

I’m pretty sure a potential bowl game result won’t be a factor in Dino’s future. A school like ours has to make a go/no-go decision on their HC right as the regular season concludes. Waiting beyond that means you miss out on HC candidates and staff.

We did that in 2004 and it was an epic disaster.

To add to that, most of the non playoff, non NY6 bowl games are just chances to build on the following year. Too many opt out players to weigh the result against a coaching decision.

 

[cusefan88]

I come back to the sad realization that the team always gets worse each year at the season goes on. That to me is an indictment of coaching.

 

[Cheriehoop]

We could win the 2 games without Dino. Actually would probably have a better chance at it. End this now & start a well publicized national search. Beat everyone else to the punch. Get the best young up and Comer. And, win the 2 games.

That young and comer doesn’t have a job too? Would leave their current position to finish our season? I would think that would be tough unless you just elevate a current coach to interim here but not hire them - that is tough too.

 

[Chip]

That young and comer doesn’t have a job too? Would leave their current position to finish our season? I would think that would be tough unless you just elevate a current coach to interim here but not hire them - that is tough too.

I don’t think he’s saying to bring the new guy in now. Just spend more time trying to identify him and rip off the Dino band aid now.

 

[3rdRecon]

Very hard to imagine that Babers would still be here even if the team becomes bowl eligible. There is an eight year record of his program building. If the program was going to rise to a consistent a level of a bowl eligibility - it would have happened by now. The flame on his hype machine went out a long time ago- no one is buying.

Overall, he has not recruited at a competent ACC level, He has been annihilated by the portal ( Even a small private school like Tulane has been able to use the portal to replace losses with equal talent), he cannot build and maintain continuity within his staff, often appears to be in over his head when game day adjustments are needed, and is invisible within the community which he coaches. I witnessed his lack of interaction with local high school players during his summer camps - relationships matter!

For decades I could not wait for Saturday to watch the Orange play. After 34 years as a season ticket holder through thick and thin I did not renew this year. I could no longer watch this team under Babers leadership; the misery index was just to high.

In the big picture a couple of more wins is meaningless. From an ACC standpoint Babers has the program on life support and in jeopardy of being left out in the cold with further conference realignments. Nationally, the program has no pulse.
No Excuses. Dino's tenure as Football Coach of Syracuse University- needed to be over yesterday.

 

[anomander]

"Dino was a journeyman assistant coach. He got hired as a head coach at two low level programs. At each one, he had two nice years, largely with guys he didn’t recruit (sound familiar?), and moved on before ever establishing that he was capable of building a program."

EIU was 2-9 the last two years under Bob Spoo, then went 7-5 in Dino's first eyar and 12-2 in his second. That's pretty good. They went 5-7 the year after he left. BG was 8-5 and 10-4 the last two years under Clawson, then 8-6 and 10-4 under Dino. The year after he left they were 4-8, then 2-10. They haven't had a winning record since. That suggests that Dino did a good job coaching those teams.

I think his problems here have to do with not developing good offensive lines or accumulating depth. The latter may have more to do with the school. Doug Marrone showed that you can build a good offensive line at this school. Dino hasn't done it.

Marrone gets unfair criticism for many things, one of them was recruiting. Sure we didn’t always have the top ranked classes, and maybe he didn’t like it, but the fans knew he had a strategy that was going to take time to implement since Gerg almost totally went away from recruiting the NE. We also knew he had certain metrics he used for recruiting kids. He had a plan and wasn’t just throwing darts as I think Babers and Shafer before him did. Plus, I think his strategy was just about to start paying dividends with guys like Gus Edwards committed. No matter how they turned out, no other HC has come anywhere near as close as landing blue chip recruits like Ebo and Ishaq (#45 nationally). Not to mention the amount of under recruited northeast guys he and his staff identified. The offensive line alone had guys like Justin Pugh, Mackey, Sean Hickey, Ivan Foy, Rob Trudo, Nick Robinson. A mix of those guys formed some of the best OL’s we’ve had. He even had under recruited playmakers like Jerome Smith, Alec Lemon, Marcus Sales, Jarrod West, Ryan Nassib, Nick Provo, Beckett Wales, PTG. Not even including highly rated recruits like Wayne Morgan, Marcus Spruill, and a host of under recruited defensive standouts like Keon Lyn, Jay Bromley, Shamarko Thomas, Cam Lynch, Durrel Eskridge, Phillip Thomas, Chan Jones. Hell he even recruited Riley Dixon, and Terrell Hunt who won our 2013 bowl game mostly because of what Marrone left and the offensive line he instilled. Before he left he had one of his best recruiting classes lined including Gus Edwards who i mentioned before . I think if you look back, take the emotions out of it, and take a serious look at the under recruiter players he identified, you could easily argue he and his staff had the most success recruiting the area because his familiarity with it. That’s the type of HC we need. Someone who can identify under recruited talent, implement a plan, and stick with it.

 

[bigmike]

What I want to see...
Should Dino be fired... we've seen these threads

Dino has a press conference in preparation for the BC game.
It's time for the media to take the gloves off.
Fans deserve to know just what the hell is going on with the team.
"Coach, can you expound on what/how practices were like last week leading to the team's performance?"
"Coach you went to Purdue and beat them by 14 pts. You go to VATECH and lose by 27..a team that LOST TO PURDUE. Why is this team playing so poorly for such an extended period?"
"Coach, several football playing alums have been critical of your team. Are they right or how do you explain the team's level of competence the last 5 weeks?"

I want to hear Dino address just where things are at right now. I don't want to hear about Ohana and owies.
I want to hear a FOOTBALL coach explain to fans why we are where we are. THIS will tell me if Babers is worth keeping.

Love all these questions, but the answers will likely be Ohana, or a derivative form of it.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Marrone gets unfair criticism for many things, one of them was recruiting. Sure we didn’t always have the top ranked classes, and maybe he didn’t like it, but the fans knew he had a strategy that was going to take time to implement since Gerg almost totally went away from recruiting the NE. We also knew he had certain metrics he used for recruiting kids. He had a plan and wasn’t just throwing darts as I think Babers and Shafer before him did. Plus, I think his strategy was just about to start paying dividends with guys like Gus Edwards committed. No matter how they turned out, no other HC has come anywhere near as close as landing blue chip recruits like Ebo and Ishaq (#45 nationally). Not to mention the amount of under recruited northeast guys he and his staff identified. The offensive line alone had guys like Justin Pugh, Mackey, Sean Hickey, Ivan Foy, Rob Trudo, Nick Robinson. A mix of those guys formed some of the best OL’s we’ve had. He even had under recruited playmakers like Jerome Smith, Alec Lemon, Marcus Sales, Jarrod West, Ryan Nassib, Nick Provo, Beckett Wales, PTG. Not even including highly rated recruits like Wayne Morgan, Marcus Spruill, and a host of under recruited defensive standouts like Keon Lyn, Jay Bromley, Shamarko Thomas, Cam Lynch, Durrel Eskridge, Phillip Thomas, Chan Jones. Hell he even recruited Riley Dixon, and Terrell Hunt who won our 2013 bowl game mostly because of what Marrone left and the offensive line he instilled. Before he left he had one of his best recruiting classes lined including Gus Edwards who i mentioned before . I think if you look back, take the emotions out of it, and take a serious look at the under recruiter players he identified, you could easily argue he and his staff had the most success recruiting the area because his familiarity with it. That’s the type of HC we need. Someone who can identify under recruited talent, implement a plan, and stick with it.

Mostly agree with what he tried to do. It created a very nice strong core. But he failed to bring in any real playmakers. Also I think his QB and WR recruiting were pretty weak. Nassib was already there. I doubt we even see Hunt if Marrone had stayed. Lemon and Sales were GRob recruits. As was Chandler Jones.

I think the metrics was a good idea but it also would have kept someone like Estime away from here. You can't have a bunch of undersized kids like Shafer tried to do, but you can't also ignore good players at a school like SU. That is where we can find under recruited guys.

 

[swish7]

Just

That young and comer doesn’t have a job too? Would leave their current position to finish our season? I would think that would be tough unless you just elevate a current coach to interim here but not hire them - that is tough too

Not to fill his role now, but to start searching for him now. Work with an interim HC in the interim.

Hire him as soon as we are legally allowed to.

Maybe fantasy or naive, but it seems like the big boys make bold moves like this.

The most SU thing ever would be to squeak to bowl eligibility, lose that bowl, lose LA & OG to some other school, but still have some reason to keep Dino around.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I come back to the sad realization that the team always gets worse each year at the season goes on. That to me is an indictment of coaching.

I have so little faith in Dino at this point that I've convinced myself he gets more involved in things once the conference schedule hits, and that's why we start looking stale and different from how we looked earlier in the year. It's not all just difference in level of competition.