NCAA again investigating UNC

[Gotothehole]

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/s...investigation-academic-scandal-north-carolina

 

[Deano]

Think you are a little late with this

http://syracusefan.com/threads/ncaa-will-re-open-north-carolina-investigation.77608/#post-1075433

 

[AlaskaSU]

For those that do not have the time to go to a N Carolina board and read page after page, these are the main themes.

This is an academic scandal not an athletic scandal. Not to worry.
Reinvestigation is a result of NCState advocacy against N Carolina.
It is a result of Duke jealousy.
Everyone cheats. If they rule against N Carolina they would have to rule against everyone.
The renewed investigation is good news because they will find no wrong doing and this will bring closure.
N Carolina should join the SEC to get away from the evil ACC.
The investigation is taking place because N Carolina is less adept at covering their tracks than other schools.
The investigation is taking place because N Carolina is supplying the NCAA with voluntary information as part of a death wish

I did come across one lone poster that was willing to fess up to N Carolina transgressions and accept consequences.

I have a few questions: N Carolina is proud of their academic standards. When was the last time that a N Carolina football or basketball player was ever declared academically ineligible? Answer, as far as I know - never. Has a N Carolina player ever even flunked a course?

 

[Dave85]

For those that do not have the time to go to a N Carolina board and read page after page, these are the main themes.

This is an academic scandal not an athletic scandal. Not to worry.
Reinvestigation is a result of NCState advocacy against N Carolina.
It is a result of Duke jealousy.
Everyone cheats. If they rule against N Carolina they would have to rule against everyone.
The renewed investigation is good news because they will find no wrong doing and this will bring closure.
N Carolina should join the SEC to get away from the evil ACC.
The investigation is taking place because N Carolina is less adept at covering their tracks than other schools.
The investigation is taking place because N Carolina is supplying the NCAA with voluntary information as part of a death wish

I did come across one lone poster that was willing to fess up to N Carolina transgressions and accept consequences.

I have a few questions: N Carolina is proud of their academic standards. When was the last time that a N Carolina football or basketball player was ever declared academically ineligible? Answer, as far as I know - never. Has a N Carolina player ever even flunked a course?

I think I read somewhere a player submitted a three sentence paper and got an A.

 

[SmilinBob]

There are a lot of schools where athletes never fail classes. This is what annoys the living hell out of me and teams that "graduate" or keep them eligible at an amazingly high rate. Having athlete friendly professors/courses in the fold at 100% or close is what makes some of these factories what they are.

 

[SmilinBob]

I think I read somewhere a player submitted a three sentence paper and got an A.

"I love lamp."

 

[Dave85]

"I love lamp."

That's about it.

 

[Briancuse]

There are a lot of schools where athletes never fail classes. This is what annoys the living hell out of me and teams that "graduate" or keep them eligible at an amazingly high rate. Having athlete friendly professors/courses in the fold at 100% or close is what makes some of these factories what they are.

Which makes fab melo's academic suspension all the more embarrassing. You really have to try if you are a big time athlete to fail out of school.

 

[AlaskaSU]

if you want to flunk out it helps not to know the difference between a barroom and a classroom.

 

[cuseinseattle]

I believe they also demoted the women that was the whistle blower which is against the law in state of North Carolina. She apparently is on record saying she went to Roy Williams and he said it wasn't his place to get involved. There is no way Duke or NC will ever be put on probabation for doing anything but this still is really entertaining. If nothing else one of my good friends is a NC fan and it has been fun messing with him. I learned when Corey Maggette admited to getting money while at Duke and the NCAA did nothing that it's never going to happen on Tobacco Road. The NCAA will open this thing drag their feet and hope that something happens to take the spot light off of it and then close it and hope nobody says anything.

 

[itsbotime]

I think I read somewhere a player submitted a three sentence paper and got an A.

That never happened.

http://www.cracked.com/quick-fixes/4-b.s.-viral-news-stories-that-fooled-your-friends-part-20/

 

[itsbotime]

I believe they also demoted the women that was the whistle blower which is against the law in state of North Carolina. She apparently is on record saying she went to Roy Williams and he said it wasn't his place to get involved. There is no way Duke or NC will ever be put on probabation for doing anything but this still is really entertaining. If nothing else one of my good friends is a NC fan and it has been fun messing with him. I learned when Corey Maggette admited to getting money while at Duke and the NCAA did nothing that it's never going to happen on Tobacco Road. The NCAA will open this thing drag their feet and hope that something happens to take the spot light off of it and then close it and hope nobody says anything.

Mary Willingham isn't a whistleblower. The media likes to refer to her as one, but she didn't disclose anything new about the AFAM classes...UNC already self-reported the AFAM classes. Willingham made the news for making sensationalist claims about the literacy levels of UNC's student athletes, claims that were subsequently found by three independent researchers to be meritless. Her partner, Jay Smith, has admitted to potentially violating FERPA data with Willingham so that he can make money off of a book (he made these comments on his website and subsequently deleted them, but not before screenshots were taken). But, Willingham doesn't get whistleblower protection because she wasn't a whistleblower. Which means her questionable claims (and outright lies, in some cases-see the link above) will continue to be a problem for her.

 

[rrlbees]

Mary Willingham isn't a whistleblower. The media likes to refer to her as one, but she didn't disclose anything new about the AFAM classes...UNC already self-reported the AFAM classes. Willingham made the news for making sensationalist claims about the literacy levels of UNC's student athletes, claims that were subsequently found by three independent researchers to be meritless. Her partner, Jay Smith, has admitted to potentially violating FERPA data with Willingham so that he can make money off of a book (he made these comments on his website and subsequently deleted them, but not before screenshots were taken). But, Willingham doesn't get whistleblower protection because she wasn't a whistleblower. Which means her questionable claims (and outright lies, in some cases-see the link above) will continue to be a problem for her.

Keep trying.

 

[Dave85]

That never happened.
http://www.cracked.com/quick-fixes/4-b.s.-viral-news-stories-that-fooled-your-friends-part-20/

How do you know that story wasn't the result of a damage control press release by a media savvy school representative. It's not like they tell you who gave that information.

 

[itsbotime]

How do you know that story wasn't the result of a damage control press release by a media savvy school representative. It's not like they tell you who gave that information.

Because Willingham herself admitted as such, after she was pressed.

 

[DeGrozz]

Mary Willingham isn't a whistleblower. The media likes to refer to her as one, but she didn't disclose anything new about the AFAM classes...UNC already self-reported the AFAM classes. Willingham made the news for making sensationalist claims about the literacy levels of UNC's student athletes, claims that were subsequently found by three independent researchers to be meritless. Her partner, Jay Smith, has admitted to potentially violating FERPA data with Willingham so that he can make money off of a book (he made these comments on his website and subsequently deleted them, but not before screenshots were taken). But, Willingham doesn't get whistleblower protection because she wasn't a whistleblower. Which means her questionable claims (and outright lies, in some cases-see the link above) will continue to be a problem for her.

The "whistleblowers" may suck, but there was still a situation where the majority of UNC athletes were majoring in a field where there was significant academic fraud going on. No-show classes, changed grades, admission of wrong-doing, etc.

My question is, are you trying to deny that there was wrong-doing that went on, or are you solely trying to discredit Willingham? I guess I am just missing your angle here.

 

[itsbotime]

The "whistleblowers" may suck, but there was still a situation where the majority of UNC athletes were majoring in a field where there was significant academic fraud going on. No-show classes, changed grades, admission of wrong-doing, etc.

My question is, are you trying to deny that there was wrong-doing that went on, or are you solely trying to discredit Willingham? I guess I am just missing your angle here.

Was there wrongdoing by the university? Absolutely. The independent studies classes, grade changes, etc...all of that stuff was very sketchy. Now, were the independent studies courses part of a broad plan to keep athletes eligible? I don't believe so, but that is what the NCAA and Wainstein are looking at. I for one am glad that the NCAA is reviewing what Wainstein pulls up, because I'm ready for this saga to be over with.

The problem with Willingham is that her "findings" have been suspect from the beginning, and, in some case, have been outright lies. Her initial claim to fame was her insistence that up to 70% of UNC's athletes were illiterate, or couldn't read beyond a fourth grade level. That information got her on CNN. It turned out that information was false, but instead of apologizing, Willingham doubled down. She released the infamous "paper", which at first she implied was a final exam paper that earned an A minus, but then she was forced to backtrack and state that the paper wasn't a final, was a part of a rough draft, did not in fact earn an A minus, was not turned in for an "independent studies" course, was over 8 years old, and she couldn't say who wrote it. Then, her IRB application is released, showing that she lied on her application and very likely committed fraud. Not to mention she is writing a for-profit book about her "experiences", that she once wrote to President Obama asking him to outlaw bracketology, and that she is employed by a Drake Group, an organization whose goal is to eliminate college athletics entirely. All of those things together don't look too good for her. You would think that if her information had any merit, she wouldn't have to fabricate it or lie about it.

 

[pearl31]

she is employed by a Drake Group

the Drake?

 

[retro44]

Was there wrongdoing by the university? Absolutely. The independent studies classes, grade changes, etc...all of that stuff was very sketchy. Now, were the independent studies courses part of a broad plan to keep athletes eligible? I don't believe so, but that is what the NCAA and Wainstein are looking at. I for one am glad that the NCAA is reviewing what Wainstein pulls up, because I'm ready for this saga to be over with.

The problem with Willingham is that her "findings" have been suspect from the beginning, and, in some case, have been outright lies. Her initial claim to fame was her insistence that up to 70% of UNC's athletes were illiterate, or couldn't read beyond a fourth grade level. That information got her on CNN. It turned out that information was false, but instead of apologizing, Willingham doubled down. She released the infamous "paper", which at first she implied was a final exam paper that earned an A minus, but then she was forced to backtrack and state that the paper wasn't a final, was a part of a rough draft, did not in fact earn an A minus, was not turned in for an "independent studies" course, was over 8 years old, and she couldn't say who wrote it. Then, her IRB application is released, showing that she lied on her application and very likely committed fraud. Not to mention she is writing a for-profit book about her "experiences", that she once wrote to President Obama asking him to outlaw bracketology, and that she is employed by a Drake Group, an organization whose goal is to eliminate college athletics entirely. All of those things together don't look too good for her. You would think that if her information had any merit, she wouldn't have to fabricate it or lie about it.

ABSOLUTELY A CORRUPT UNIVERSITY...

While they are at it why don't they investigate all the rides players are receiving like Hairston did,if there is one there is more with everything that is starting to add up.

UNC has been lucky that the NCAA doesn't know how to add 1+1

 

[itsbotime]

ABSOLUTELY A CORRUPT UNIVERSITY...

While they are at it why don't they investigate all the rides players are receiving like Hairston did,if there is one there is more with everything that is starting to add up.

UNC has been lucky that the NCAA doesn't know how to add 1+1

Huh? Not sure what you are talking about...I don't know if you follow sports or not, but the NCAA ruled that Hairston was ineligible his last year at UNC and made him sit on the bench. It was a pretty big deal when it happened.

 

[Briancuse]

the Drake?

Hate the Drake.

 

[DeGrozz]

Was there wrongdoing by the university? Absolutely. The independent studies classes, grade changes, etc...all of that stuff was very sketchy. Now, were the independent studies courses part of a broad plan to keep athletes eligible? I don't believe so, but that is what the NCAA and Wainstein are looking at.

You gotta see why people are skeptical, right? Major college athletics throw a ton of resources at revenue generating sports to make sure that their athletes are eligible. Significant portions of UNC athletes took these AFAM majors and all of the tutors and academic progress monitors never saw trends of poor work/no work required to pass these classes? It just seems bizarre from a neutral fan perspective.

 

[itsbotime]

You gotta see why people are skeptical, right? Major college athletics throw a ton of resources at revenue generating sports to make sure that their athletes are eligible. Significant portions of UNC athletes took these AFAM majors and all of the tutors and academic progress monitors never saw trends of poor work/no work required to pass these classes? It just seems bizarre from a neutral fan perspective.

Can certainly understand how it would seem bizarre. At this point, I'm content to let Wainstein and the NCAA do their thing. If they uncover some bad stuff, so be it. However, I will continue to criticize those seeking to create their own facts in an attempt to disgrace the University in order to line their own pockets (namely, Mary Willingham and Rashad McCants). McCants gave an interview last Friday in which he stated that he has two checks in the mail...one for $10 million from UNC and one for $300 million from the NCAA. The more he opens his mouth, the more damage he does to his own credibility.

 

[AlaskaSU]

"Now, were the independent studies courses part of a broad plan to keep athletes eligible? I don't believe so,"
LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL

 

[itsbotime]

"Now, were the independent studies courses part of a broad plan to keep athletes eligible? I don't believe so,"
LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL

Laugh all you want, but there have been 8 investigations done so far (we are in our 9th one), and none have found any link between the athletic department and the aberrant courses. Now, will the Wainstein/NCAA investigation turn up dirt? I don't know. But whatever the case, I'm willing to accept whatever they say and let this whole thing be over with.