New Chad Ford Big Board...NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

[jekelish]

Ennis doesn't seem the type to jump early unless he's a lock for the lottery, but I feel like his stock probably worsens the longer he stays here, so I'm starting to get a little worried now, even if I think Ennis would be a reach in the lottery.

See I feel the opposite. If he stays, he can work on his jumper and become a consistent 40+ percent three point shooter (I realize he's around there now, but with fairly limited attempts), get stronger so that he finishes through contact around the hoop better, etc. I think he would really benefit from sticking around another year, and not just from a selfish standpoint.

 

[OttoMets]

I'll be the negative nancy here... I predict Ennnis does not do so well in pre-draft workouts and pulls his name out. I think his lack of explosive athleticism and inability to finish at the hoop gets exposed in the 1:1 drills and he will laso get knocked because he isn't going to be able to defend some of the quicker guards out there 1:1. Additionally I think his set shot is a pretty big liability as he needs to be WIDE open before he is willing to shoot it. I know people like to compare Ennis to Andre Miller but Miller had a much more fluid offensive game than people remember. He could finish at the hoop at will and had a great midrange game and could shoot the three coming out of college. Again not saying Ennis won't get there but he's a long way from there now.

Look I love Ennis and I think he is one of the best we have ever had at executing a half court offense but I think some folks need to take off the orange colored glasses. Give him another year to fix some of the holes in his game and he probably will deserve all the hype he is getting. Of course he can develop those skills in the league as well.

Ennis doesn't seem the type to jump early unless he's a lock for the lottery, but I feel like his stock probably worsens the longer he stays here, so I'm starting to get a little worried now, even if I think Ennis would be a reach in the lottery.

I agree that he might not wow anyone in workouts, but that might be all the more reason to jump - those aren't things that would improve with another year of college.

I still think he stays, but reputable rumors about Ennis in the lottery do make it seem less likely.

 

[The General]

If he's lottery, why stay? I hope he's a Laker.

 

[Melancer46]

See I feel the opposite. If he stays, he can work on his jumper and become a consistent 40+ percent three point shooter (I realize he's around there now, but with fairly limited attempts), get stronger so that he finishes through contact around the hoop better, etc. I think he would really benefit from sticking around another year, and not just from a selfish standpoint.

Yeah, we just don't agree lol. I agree that if he improves on those things, it probably helps his stock, but I don't think he'll ever be a good finisher, and I think NBA teams will look at his 3 point percentage and think he's a better shooter than he is, so even if he became a better shooter in reality, it might not be a big enough difference to NBA scouts.

 

[Knicks411]

This might seem counterintuitive, but I also think you can improve as a college player and hurt, or at the least not improve, your draft stock.
Just as an example, making up numbers, on 1 -10 as an NBA player, Tyler might be a 3.5 right now, with a possible upside of an 8 or something. (like i said, totally making these up) He might come back next year and improve to a 4 or something, but maybe the scouts were expecting a larger jump from year 1-2 and now his NBA potential is only a 7.5. So he gets better as a player, but he might be less attractive to an NBA team.
it also wouldn't surprise me if teams would liek to especially get SU players out of school sooner than later to get them playing man to man

 

[ClamOtto]

If they both came back, we'd probably be starting two All-American candidates. At the very least, two first team all-ACC. Hard to imagine that happening, but we might as well dream now while we still can.

 

[jdubs30]

I'll be the negative nancy here... I predict Ennnis does not do so well in pre-draft workouts and pulls his name out. I think his lack of explosive athleticism and inability to finish at the hoop gets exposed in the 1:1 drills and he will laso get knocked because he isn't going to be able to defend some of the quicker guards out there 1:1. Additionally I think his set shot is a pretty big liability as he needs to be WIDE open before he is willing to shoot it. I know people like to compare Ennis to Andre Miller but Miller had a much more fluid offensive game than people remember. He could finish at the hoop at will and had a great midrange game and could shoot the three coming out of college. Again not saying Ennis won't get there but he's a long way from there now.

Look I love Ennis and I think he is one of the best we have ever had at executing a half court offense but I think some folks need to take off the orange colored glasses. Give him another year to fix some of the holes in his game and he probably will deserve all the hype he is getting. Of course he can develop those skills in the league as well.

Ennis' stock will not get hurt at the combine, unless he's a completely unathletic stiff (which he isn't). Scouts know his MO, he's not overly explosive and won't wow you with his athleticism or quickness. Unlike most lotto picks, it seems that athleticism isn't the main source of everyone being so high on him, so they know what to expect. Again, unless he is the slowest PG with the worst vertical, I can't see the combine hurting him.

 

[two3zone]

I predict Ennis stays, Grant goes.

This is the boat I'm on.

 

[bballbeadle]

What is CJ now? Chopped liver?

 

[Melancer46]

What is CJ now? Chopped liver?

2nd round pick. Some predict he'll be undrafted, but I feel like he'll get taken late just because he was a great college player.

 

[Ragman2000]

In fairness, I was probably just high on peyote yesterday.

Might explain the little pickle that many of us interjected ourselves into.

 

[Full_Rebar]

Smart's draft status is falling with his flopping and on-court outbursts. It's possible that after Exum, Ennis will be considered the next best pure PG in this class. He won't need to worry about combine numbers if he keeps playing with the poise he's shown so far.

 

[LennX6]

I think I might be more concerned with Ennis now...

I think JB and Grant's family could make a case that he moves up by coming back. Improved range, putting it on the floor more, etc.

However, with Tyler, if the iron is truly that hot, he might have to strike. JB said he knew Tyler was this good all along and I 'm holding out hope that he is not a 1 and done, as JB said.

If somehow Tyler and JG stay, next year would truly be a once a decade or longer team. What a deadly duo that would be, esp. with Cooney keeping everyone honest at the arc and improved Rak. Whatever Roberson and McCullough then do is gravy.

The feeling I get thinking about this are 2 different ones. One is sadness. Our offense looks like we know what we are doing and in control ALL game long. In 40 years of watching us,, I have never felt like we were in as control with the rock in our hands are we are this year. I will miss that. That is truly special.
The other part is: Good luck Tyler, you were great! Next!!!! Seriously, in the past, even when the cupboard was bare, we somehow had an amazing season (year after Pearl , Title Game,
year after Moten, Title game, The year after the Year of Me-Shawn, Win the Title. ) But we are loaded and will keep loaded.
However it ends up, I will sleep nicely

 

[CorduroyG]

its simple. if we win it all ennis is gone. if we dont he comes back for some unfinished business.

 

[bballbeadle]

I feel sad for CJ. He came back so he could improve his stock and help him team, Coach B was ecstatic, and now no one is talking about him. That's got to be hard to swallow, and I wonder what the team dynamics are like?

 

[LennX6]

I feel sad for CJ. He came back so he could improve his stock and help him team, Coach B was ecstatic, and now no one is talking about him. That's got to be hard to swallow, and I wonder what the team dynamics are like?

All it's going to take is one real good game, he'll be OK. He made key shots in a few earlier games, particularly in Maui when it mattered, and I'm sure it will happen again.

 

[SUbear]

I feel sad for CJ. He came back so he could improve his stock and help him team, Coach B was ecstatic, and now no one is talking about him. That's got to be hard to swallow, and I wonder what the team dynamics are like?

CJ will be just fine. Needs to have fewer turnovers though.

 

[Full_Rebar]

CJ is going to get a decent look as a bench guy, or he'll make six figures playing ball overseas. Returning has helped him because, like Ennis, if SU makes a deep run he'll get a lot of credit.

 

[Melancer46]

I got a response from Chad Ford during one of his chats today, so basically, we have a new article to be on the lookout for:

Matt (Upstate New York)


I watch Tyler Ennis play in every game, but seeing his lack of athleticism, finishing ability, and just being a solid shooter, I have a hard time envisioning him being a starting point guard in the NBA. Can you convince me otherwise?

Chad Ford
(1:38 PM)


I think we can. Kevin Pelton and I working on our next Eyes, Ears and Numbers column on him. Some very interesting things to look at with Ennis. His NBA statistical comps are very impressive. You are right that he doesn't have elite size or explosiveness -- but he's a solid athlete, as steady as any point guard in the NCAA and has a nice blend of scoring the ball and seeing the floor. I think he's going to be a Mike Conley type in the NBA.

 

[phillydad]

I predict Ennis stays, Grant goes.

I agree.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Smart's draft status is falling with his flopping and on-court outbursts.

He's falling, but he'll likely be a great pick for somebody. It seems like guys that are expected to go high, come back and their stock slips but still land lottery end up doing well. I'm thinking like Joakim Noah.

 

[Alsacs]

I got a response from Chad Ford during one of his chats today, so basically, we have a new article to be on the lookout for:

Matt (Upstate New York)


I watch Tyler Ennis play in every game, but seeing his lack of athleticism, finishing ability, and just being a solid shooter, I have a hard time envisioning him being a starting point guard in the NBA. Can you convince me otherwise?

Chad Ford
(1:38 PM)


I think we can. Kevin Pelton and I working on our next Eyes, Ears and Numbers column on him. Some very interesting things to look at with Ennis. His NBA statistical comps are very impressive. You are right that he doesn't have elite size or explosiveness -- but he's a solid athlete, as steady as any point guard in the NCAA and has a nice blend of scoring the ball and seeing the floor. I think he's going to be a Mike Conley type in the NBA.

That is whom I compared Ennis too in the other thread.

 

[baggerbob]

How many NBA championships do all these athletic fast Point Guards have? None its about the other players, like Lebron, Durant, Kobe, Wade, Shag, its a myth you have to have a great point guard. What you need is someone who can get the ball to people in the right places, and run an offense.

 

[McNabb2Brominski]

How many NBA championships do all these athletic fast Point Guards have? None its about the other players, like Lebron, Durant, Kobe, Wade, Shag, its a myth you have to have a great point guard. What you need is someone who can get the ball to people in the right places, and run an offense.

I agree wholeheartedly. Having a LEGIT pg is hard to come by. There are alot of hybrid guards in the NBA playing PG that really shouldnt. You need a guy who can operate an offense and create flow. He doesnt need to be overly athletic and explosive. Ennis will probably be the best true PG in this years draft.

Also, people constantly fail to understand that being "NBA ready" doesnt mean much in NBA draft world. There are some holes in Ennis' game but to be this good at age 18/19 is few and far in between.