Notre Dame / ACC
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Minus that ESPN part, that was exactly the argument ND fans made against playing in bowls. And the vast, vast, vast majority were opposed to playing in bowls. They were so opposed to bowls, that a group formed to demand the head of Ara Parseghian should be speak publicly for ND to play in bowls. And that within 2 years of the '66 National Championship.
I got to see and hear it up close because of the ND grad (about 1938 or so) who ran my town's youth sports. He swore that ND football fans would never accept plating in bowls. By the time ND beat Texas in its 2nd Cotton, he no longer made such claims. By the time ND upset Bama in the Sugar to win another National Title, he acted as if he always had loved the idea of ND playing in bowls.
The last I heard of him was in the late 1980s. It was clear that ND basketball had fallen precipitously, and many were saying that ND must join either the BT or the BE to save its basketball from utter irrelevance. Mr. D was reported to me as swearing that ND would never join any league for basketball, because that was the precedent that would render absurd ND football claims to remain utter independent.
Of course.
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I say that because somewhere between 95 and 99% of alleged experts said the same thing right up until ND became a 5/8ths member of ACC football.
I have been asserting the exact opposite since 2003, when ND first talked seriously with the ACC.
And that same guy is almost certain to have sworn that ND would never be part of conference for football, not in the sense that the conference would schedule 5 games per year for ND, rotating equally across the conference.
I say that because somewhere between 95 and 99% of alleged experts said the same thing right up until ND became a 5/8ths member of ACC football.
I have been asserting the exact opposite since 2003, when ND first talked seriously with the ACC.
Their other problem which you are forgetting is that they played a very weak ACC schedule.
So you think ND will join the ACC for football?
TheCusian
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bpo57 said:
A very easy route to the playoffs. Compare that to going undefeated as an independent (the only realistic route to a playoff spot). I'd rather be assured of 13 games and a shot at a conference title. It's called wiggle room. And ND has none.
That's the point, has been the point in all of these threads.
Uncle.
WickedOrange
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ND's non-football sports in the ACC is not a minor detail. All things being the same (and of course it will not be), at the end of the current contract, hypothetically the ACC could tell ND all-in or all-out
If ND opts to move on, they will be making concessions for almost every other sport in the name of football independence. Big 10, Catholic 7, AAC... there are serious downsides to all the options not named ACC.
It would make the school and its fan's look like a bunch of d-bags.
If ND opts to move on, they will be making concessions for almost every other sport in the name of football independence. Big 10, Catholic 7, AAC... there are serious downsides to all the options not named ACC.
It would make the school and its fan's look like a bunch of d-bags.
TerryD
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That is part of the price of business for being an independent. That is a price that ND is willing to pay, despite your "better" judgment.
TerryD
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Why? It would be the ACC making the first move in your scenario.
If it is being a by yanking the other sports out of the ACC, it is just as much the conference for being a for forcing the choice.
But, I don't think that you will ever see the ACC do that, because it is not strong enough to take that stance.
ForCuseSake
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Let's be honest - ND doesn't have to pull Olympic sports out of the ACC for it (and its fans) to "look like a bunch of d-bags."
They do a pretty good job with that already.
wooddoc
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lol okEverybody play nice - or this thread is going to get a lot shorter
WickedOrange
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Yanking? No longer providing ND and its entitled fanbase special treatment (that no other conference member has) should always be on the table. You just proved my point.
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ND has already joined ACC football - 5/8ths worth.
When a conference schedules league games for you, you are a member of that league. The ACC schedules games for ND football every year.
The issue is whether ND will remain at 5/8ths forever or go full. Eventually, the latter will be done. It is just a matter of when.
You have hit on something that is essential to the equation that was not applicable in 1970 or even 1980: the status of of non-revenue sports with the administration. The ND administration sees NR sports the way UNC, Dook, and UVA do, the way Ivy League schools do: very important and worth being promoted a great deal. ND's administration is never going to make what would amount to a football-factory decision. ND's basketball and non-revenues will never be placed in a non-Major conference, even if the football boosters were unanimous in demanding just that so football could go back to being independent.
So when? I say never.
Got a lotta wood to chop before that happens. Right now I'd say the ACC is in 5th place amongst the P5. They're not that far off that they couldn't jump up a few spots but right now there are only two schools that are rock solid perennial top 25 contenders- Clemson and FSU.
Who's to say that the ACC would feel that dumping ND would be preferred to the current arrangement? I highly doubt that it would.
TheCusian
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bpo57 said:
You're in a fantasy land. We are the only conference with 3 teams in the top 10, the #1 seed in the playoffs - and for the very specific purpose of getting more credit - our pseudo member (who plays in the ACC for all sports +5 games) would make it 4 in the top ten.
You could make and probably should make the case that we are 1 or 2.
Easy there, Tiger.
Hilarious how you include ND when it suits your purposes.
Go back over the last five final polls (including 2015). The ACC is CLEARLY behind the other other four power conferences. #1 or #2? You're out of your mind.
Hilarious how you include ND when it suits your purposes.
Go back over the last five final polls (including 2015). The ACC is CLEARLY behind the other other four power conferences. #1 or #2? You're out of your mind.
