Notre Dame To ACC is right strategy

[orange79]

Nobody does right now. I was just asking peoples thoughts.

Got it. Seems risky to me, especially if I was a lower-tier bowl.

 

[kingottoiii]

ND and the ACC will no doubt decide what makes sense from their perspective. The ACC has been around the block with ND in 2003 and no doubt recently.

Why should the ACC offer ND a conditional option to join full time in "2024-2026" or a "10 year ultimatum": ND will probably counter and ask for a 50 year ultimatum.

How does adding ND for BB help FSU in football? (Of course, FSU has already lost this year to Wake and Clemson.)

If ND joins the ACC and agrees to play 3-5 games, how will the other ACC teams feel when ND picks and chooses the games it wants to play???????

I don't see the harm in offering ND the following...

-You can join in all sports but FB as soon as you can get out of the BE (27 months or sooner).

-Once you join the ACC, after 10 years your FB team will join as well. But that certainly can be sooner.

-You can leave at any time for the exit fee of $20 million. If you do not bring the FB team after 10 years you must leave the conference for all sports and owe $20 million.

-You must play 4 games a year vs ACC teams in FB OOC. You can play Pitt and BC every year. The rest have to be home and home games not to exceed two games per team. That means over the 10 year period, 10 or the 12 other ACC teams will get a home and home with ND. So most likely Clemson and VT will be left out.

-Since the ACC TV contract is for all sports and isn't broken down by FB vs BBall, the ACC will pay ND a flat fee.

-ND will not have voting rights until they are a full member. They can offer input but have to leave the room when a vote happens.

There really isn't much risk to this offer for the ACC. Having a stronger tie with ND will make them more likely to one day join in FB. If ND declines then the ACC can keep communication open with ND until they finally decide to join a conference.

ND needs a home for BBall, Lax, Baseball, and Soccer. The best spot for those is the ACC. And FB is the best end spot as well since ND will have an easier time competing vs the B1G. There isn't a risk to joining the ACC for 10 years. If they don't like it, they can opt out for $20 million, which is chump change to them. Sure beats going to the B12 for all but FB.

 

[Chip]

Could a bowl, or bowls, not set up an agreement with 2 conferences? Say the Champs Bowl. Could they have a contract with the ACC to take their #2 team while leaving the opponent TBD thus allowing them to take anyone including an indie such as ND?

I sometimes wish more bowls would go back to this, could generate more interest in lower tier bowls because your conference affiliation doesn't limit you to the same few choices each year.

But then at the same time I think that, barring some incredibly exciting offense that locals would come out to see and TVs would tune in to watch, SU would always be one of the last schools picked.

The end of Big East Football does raise that interesting question though when it comes to ND. How does a non BCS bowl get access to them? Maybe those losing the Big East who already have the ACC (Champs, Charlotte) or Big 12 (Pinstripe), just swap to the other league? But those leagues aren't going to allow ND to take their bid.

 

[SmilinBob]

ND can't go indy in basketball so they have to have a home. Right now the BE makes decent money and if they can get the football schools to stay and add some they will continue to make money and ND will have no reason to leave. I'd like to know how behind this expansion ND is and if they are a major player in this negotiation.

 

[rrlbees]

I don't see the harm in offering ND the following...

-You can join in all sports but FB as soon as you can get out of the BE (27 months or sooner).

-Once you join the ACC, after 10 years your FB team will join as well. But that certainly can be sooner.

-You can leave at any time for the exit fee of $20 million. If you do not bring the FB team after 10 years you must leave the conference for all sports and owe $20 million.

-You must play 4 games a year vs ACC teams in FB OOC. You can play Pitt and BC every year. The rest have to be home and home games not to exceed two games per team. That means over the 10 year period, 10 or the 12 other ACC teams will get a home and home with ND. So most likely Clemson and VT will be left out.

-Since the ACC TV contract is for all sports and isn't broken down by FB vs BBall, the ACC will pay ND a flat fee.

-ND will not have voting rights until they are a full member. They can offer input but have to leave the room when a vote happens.

There really isn't much risk to this offer for the ACC. Having a stronger tie with ND will make them more likely to one day join in FB. If ND declines then the ACC can keep communication open with ND until they finally decide to join a conference.

ND needs a home for BBall, Lax, Baseball, and Soccer. The best spot for those is the ACC. And FB is the best end spot as well since ND will have an easier time competing vs the B1G. There isn't a risk to joining the ACC for 10 years. If they don't like it, they can opt out for $20 million, which is chump change to them. Sure beats going to the B12 for all but FB.

That's the type of thing the BE should have arranged with ND. I agree, the ACC should give some thought to something like that, and my gut feel is they have.

 

[JOC44]

The best thing for ND is to stay an independent until forced into a conference. ND avoids being forced into a conference by playing the ACC and B1G off agtainst each other, leaking interest in both. The potential for adding ND down the road keeps the B1G and ACC from finalizing expansion to 16.

The best thing for Syracuse is for ND to stay independent for a few years. That will keep the ACC and B1G from expanding to 16. That leaves northeast recruiting rivals, such as UConn nad Rutgers, with an uncertain future and helps us get back to where we once were recruiting-wise in the northeast.

 

[buffalorange]

...here's the deal...if we believe super conferences of 16 teams are wave of future...then a good strategy would be:
Invite Nortre Dame into ACC and have it come with either Uconn or Rutgirls or whichever other school chosen...allow Notre Dame to keep its NBC contract through 2015 (believe that is the date) while holding independence in football through that contract...after that contract Notre Dame must join in football also within one year of other conferences becoming super also.

Why is this the strategy good for both ACC and ND:

This gets ND to ACC...brings the ACC to its 16 teams and no doubt holds all members of present ACC--no departures for other conferences--and brings ND all sports within a year of the super conference era.

Notre Dame should do this rather than going to B1G because of demographics, alumns, rivalries, and recruiting. The northeast/southeast is growing population while midwest is declining...ND has significant alumns in the footprint of the ACC...recruits strongly in this area...and several of its long-time rivalries are in ACC as well....

it seems to me to be a good strategy for both the ACC and ND. What do you think?

As long as we're dreaming, how about inviting ND & Penn State instead of the girls or the conns?

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I don't see the harm in offering ND the following...

-You can leave at any time for the exit fee of $20 million. If you do not bring the FB team after 10 years you must leave the conference for all sports and owe $20 million.

You're allowing ND to "rent" a conference for 10 years, for only $2 million a year.

Get the first year and the last year's rent in advance.

 

[arbitragegls]

You're allowing ND to "rent" a conference for 10 years, for only $2 million a year.

Get the first year and the last year's rent in advance.

TOUCHE!

 

[sutomcat]

ND to the ACC as oppossed to the B1G?

Well at least you tried to be logical. But your supporting points don't really hold water.

Demographics? You are right that the ACC States have grown faster then the B1G rust belt ones. But there are still more of people in the rust belt. And if you really wanted to chase growth ... the real growth has been in TX, AZ, CA.

Alums? Most ND alumni are in the Midwest and the East and it isn't even close.

Long term rivals? You must be kidding. Which rivals are you talking about? Pitt? Well maybe Pitt. But the B1G dominates this. MSU, MICH, Purdue/ These are the schools that are ND long-time rivals.

Recruiting? ND recruits nationally and plays nationally. Joining the ACC and becoming more of a Southeastern school probably hurts ND's recruiting efforts.

The overwhelmingly obvious home for ND --- if they join a conference --- is the B1G. The only person I know of that thought ND would go to the ACC was the clueless Maryann Fox, who left ND to be the Pres of NCSU back during the first ACC raid of the Big East.

You are aware that they (ND) have already been down the application process to the Big 10 and declined the invitation at the last minute.

Townie, I don't think you read very much. This is a link from the Boneyard. It is from one of the beat writers that covers ND.

Link

Again, I am not saying ND is joining the ACC. But I think if the BE football conference implodes or breaks away from the hoops schools, and ND is left with only the hoops schools in the BE, they will likely leave. If they leave, the ACC will be strongly considered.

 

[SU2NASA]

Screw ND. They've long been on the road to irrelevance. No special deals, go pound sand.

 

[Scooch]

FWIW (not much), in my conversations with ND alums they all acknowledge that they may "have" to drop independence eventually. Almost all of them said they'd prefer the ACC to the Big Ten, for all the reasons we'd expect (similar institutions, east coast, etc).

But I don't see them being forced into doing anything for a while.

 

[WoadBlue]

...here's the deal...if we believe super conferences of 16 teams are wave of future...then a good strategy would be:
Invite Nortre Dame into ACC and have it come with either Uconn or Rutgirls or whichever other school chosen...allow Notre Dame to keep its NBC contract through 2015 (believe that is the date) while holding independence in football through that contract...after that contract Notre Dame must join in football also within one year of other conferences becoming super also.

Why is this the strategy good for both ACC and ND:

This gets ND to ACC...brings the ACC to its 16 teams and no doubt holds all members of present ACC--no departures for other conferences--and brings ND all sports within a year of the super conference era.

Notre Dame should do this rather than going to B1G because of demographics, alumns, rivalries, and recruiting. The northeast/southeast is growing population while midwest is declining...ND has significant alumns in the footprint of the ACC...recruits strongly in this area...and several of its long-time rivalries are in ACC as well....

it seems to me to be a good strategy for both the ACC and ND. What do you think?

The ACC wants ND and will wait for ND to see the light. #16 really does not matter.

And yes, ND will be better served for sports overall with ACC membership than with Big Ten membership.

 

[tbonezone]

No special deals...all in or nothing. Take it or leave it.

screw the ND deals.all or nothing.

 

[omniorange]

FWIW (not much), in my conversations with ND alums they all acknowledge that they may "have" to drop independence eventually. Almost all of them said they'd prefer the ACC to the Big Ten, for all the reasons we'd expect (similar institutions, east coast, etc).

But I don't see them being forced into doing anything for a while.

That's basically what you see from Irish posters as well. If football is "forced" to join conference most seem to prefer the ACC to the BiG. They just want every avenue explored before doing so. And the Big East football schools leaving behind just a Catholic League is fine with them.

They only will accept giving up football indy if the BCS NC rules change to only include conference champions in the mix.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[KaiserUEO]

I'd like to take credit, but I plagiarized that point from a kingotto post. I just wanted him to know I was paying attention.

i believe kingotto stole that and a nd scheduling freeze out from some one else.....

ahem.

 

[MaxwellCuse]

I've been thinking this over for the past 24 hours. I'll go with my first inclination. The ACC needs to avoid bringing in Notre Dame as a partial member at all costs. Marinatto's quotes today about the Domers just reinforced that they have been a cancer on the Big East. I want nothing to do with them unless they are all in and operate under the same terms as everybody else. If they can't live with that I can't live with them!

 

[kingottoiii]

i believe kingotto stole that and a nd scheduling freeze out from some one else.....

ahem.

Craig Littlepage?

 

[KaiserUEO]

Craig Littlepage?

dont know who he is, but my guess is he reads my stuff... :noidea:
actually, now i remember that article.

we did piggyback that.

Oh Lord

 

[OrangeXtreme]

That's basically what you see from Irish posters as well. If football is "forced" to join conference most seem to prefer the ACC to the BiG. They just want every avenue explored before doing so. And the Big East football schools leaving behind just a Catholic League is fine with them.

They only will accept giving up football indy if the BCS NC rules change to only include conference champions in the mix.

Cheers,
Neil

10 BCS slots ... only 6 Conference Champions.

They'll have to come up with 4 more teams one way or another.

 

[kingottoiii]

dont know who he is, but my guess is he reads my stuff... :noidea:
actually, now i remember that article.

we did piggyback that.

Oh Lord

UVA's AD (Littlepage) mentioned it. You followed with how non BCS teams and ND would be frozen out of OOC games as a result if the other BCS leagues followed suit.

 

[Chip]

i believe kingotto stole that and a nd scheduling freeze out from some one else.....

ahem.

nycfan?

I can't keep you guys straight.

 

[omniorange]

10 BCS slots ... only 6 Conference Champions.

They'll have to come up with 4 more teams one way or another.

You're assuming there will be no change whatsoever in the BCS format. I'm thinking a possible PlusOne is down the road and the 4 highest ranked conference champions will be paired in 2 BCS Bowl games and the winners facing each other in an NC game two weeks later.

That still leaves 4-6 other bids that an ND or a Boise could take, but they would be frozen out of an NC game in this type of set-up.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[OrangeXtreme]

If ND goes 12-0, they won't be frozen out of the NC.

Boise is a toss-up.

 

[Toga]

You're assuming there will be no change whatsoever in the BCS format. I'm thinking a possible PlusOne is down the road and the 4 highest ranked conference champions will be paired in 2 BCS Bowl games and the winners facing each other in an NC game two weeks later.

That still leaves 4-6 other bids that an ND or a Boise could take, but they would be frozen out of an NC game in this type of set-up.

Cheers,Neil

I think this is a likely scenario. Not that that would impact the Domers in real life terms. When's the last time they were in the top 4-5 at the end of the season? But I'm pretty sure that's not how their fans would view it.