OT: Pros and Cons of joining a Greek house at SU...

[andyw715]

"It's not a frat, it's a fraternity...just like it's a country not a... "

Sorry.

That's all I heard around UB.

 

[Forza Azzurri]

don't be so sensitive. I didn't say 100% of frat kids are that way. I said frats are full of them. just like this board is seemingly full of idiots. doesn't mean im an idiot.

don't be so sensitive. I didn't say 100% of frat kids are that way. I said frats are full of them. just like this board is seemingly full of idiots. doesn't mean im an idiot.

Not being sensitive.

But if you post a sweeping generalization like you did, I'm going to call you on it...

Plenty of self-entitled brats that are both greek and non-greek.

 

[dilligaf]

don't be so sensitive. I didn't say 100% of frat kids are that way. I said frats are full of them. just like this board is seemingly full of idiots. doesn't mean im an idiot.

Following your logic:

I wouldn't say that 100% of guys in college who didn't pledge a fraternity are ; just plenty of them.

For a non-idiot you have an overly simplistic way of looking at things.

 

[CusefanATL]

The sorority girls I knew at SU seemed to have a more "normal" support system. But from the horror stories I heard about frat hazing, I wouldn't want my son anywhere near it. It's dangerous and humiliating. And I'm getting this straight from the stories my buddies in frats told me about what they had to go through.

A. eh... this is kind of a non-frat guy kind of thing to say. I went through it and laugh to this day about it. Nothing too humiliating - mostly all in good fun. Probably a little more dangerous that it needed to be - but most fun things in college life tend to be a bit more dangerous.
B. most frats are moving fast and far away from anything close to resembling hazing. It would be on the bottom of my list of concerns as a parent in 2015. I pledged in 2004 and it got increasingly easier year over year. It is a shell of what it was as recently as 2012. Probably all for the better, especially legally.

 

[jgeorge322]

Following your logic:

I wouldn't say that 100% of guys in college who didn't pledge a fraternity are ; just plenty of them.

For a non-idiot you have an overly simplistic way of looking at things.

bro, go lift. you need to get some pent up energy out.

 

[KaiserUEO]

i loved being greek. have a few brothers on here even. back in the day, my fraternity had a rep for being tough hazers, basically it was more of a smoke screen than anything else. also enjoyed playing up the superstition by telling lies to the simple minded folk just to get a reaction out of them.

it was a tremendous experience that continues to provide dividends to this day with friendships, reunions and even business connections.

yes, everybody makes friends and gets connections and has 'reunions' blah blah blah...but when you make 100s of friends and have a bond, its just different.

 

[CusefanATL]

Theres plenty of other and better ways to network imho. I prefer people who do things on their own merits anyways. Frats are full of self entitled rich brats.

Jeeze. 2 posts in and we get it, you hate frats. And you have very generalized opinions of them.

 

[realorange]

One of the wildest hazing incidents I ever heard of occurred to my buddies dad. I guess he was a bit of a wise azz so the brothers took him and two other pledges about 5 miles out of town. They were stripped naked, had plaster put under their arm pits so the arms were out to the side and then dosed heavily with Ex Lax. Then left by the road to figure out how to get back to town.

 

[Forza Azzurri]

bro, i told you. im not into that. that's frat stuff. just kidding. sorry man. i was having a bit of fun. (quite honestly, i didn't think it was so important to some.) obviously, if your frat means that much to you, then embrace it. im just saying i find it unnecessary.

Apology accepted.

The irony is that my experience wasn't that great. If I had it to do over again, I wouldn't pledge. Being in a house didn't really fit my personality.

But there were some really great guys, both in my house and in others (along with a some real d-bags)...

There were guys in my house, and others, who were filthy rich (think Trust fund, brought to school in private plane etc..) and kids who didn't have two nickels to rub together.

Some of the wealthiest kids were some of the nicest, most down-to-earth guys you would want to meet while some of the poorer ones were complete a$$holes - and vice-versa, of course.

It really is tough to generalize.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

don't be so sensitive. I didn't say 100% of frat kids are that way. I said frats are full of them. just like this board is seemingly full of idiots. doesn't mean im an idiot.

hmmmm, and it makes me wonder...

 

[jgeorge322]

Apology accepted.

The irony is that my experience wasn't that great. If I had it to do over again, I wouldn't pledge. Being in a house didn't really fit my personality.

But there were some really great guys, both in my house and in others (along with a some real d-bags)...

There were guys in my house, and others, who were filthy rich (think Trust fund, brought to school in private plane etc..) and kids who didn't have two nickels to rub together.

Some of the wealthiest kids were some of the nicest, most down-to-earth guys you would want to meet while some of the poorer ones were complete a$$holes - and vice-versa, of course.

It really is tough to generalize.

you are right. and i should say i had a bunch of friends in frats. im sure they would not support my opinions.

also, i would say the houses seemed like pos but my house on Euclid was a pos. i had norm roth as a slumlord.

 

[jgeorge322]

hmmmm, and it makes me wonder...

that was a gift for you Fairfax. I at first was going to write the person I was responding to is not an idiot, but I figured id tee one up for him.

 

[teamco]

First things first, I went to SU in the mid to late 70s, 1970s not 1870s wise guy, so who knows if any of this is at all relevant any more.

I was a transfer my junior year. I lived in a split-double my first semester, Brewster-Boland, but quickly found a room for let at a frat house, ATO, because I couldn't take it any more listening to my theater-major roommate singing scales every night. I never joined a frat, but renting an available room in one my second semester at school made me a defacto member- hey, I liked to party, I was relatively normal, and I had less than average flatulence- stuff my wife, whom I met at SU, would deny was ever the case, but oh baby could I bust a move back then. Here is a clip of me dancing at the Orange on Thursday night, back in the day as they say-


Senior year I lived off-campus.

In any case, my point is that by not joining a frat and centering my social life around one dominant group I was able to make friends with several diverse groups of friends. There were probably four or five I was able to float among and hang with depending on what my mood was. I had my ATO friends when I wanted to party hard, I had friends from from my membership in the Outting Club- ahh, I don't know if that is even around any more, or if it is what it's main purpose is, but back then the Outing Club meant you liked to rock climb, go on bike trips, hike, back pack, etc; I had a bunch of friends from the Stumpy school when I wanted to be like laid back man; then I had my jock friends from participating in club sports- etc. It was great fun and a good time was had by all! One man's experience.

 

[KaiserUEO]

i had to give teamco a like just for the video.

 

[andyw715]

I didn't pledge at UB but did witness "bid" night for SUNY Geneseo P.I.G.S. fun night...from what I remember.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

that was a gift for you Fairfax. I at first was going to write the person I was responding to is not an idiot, but I figured id tee one up for him.

Okay, fair enough. FWIW, I wouldn't trade my fraternity experience for anything. Sorry you feel the way you do about it. But to each his own.

 

[mark79]

One more thing about fraternities and sororities that I think hasn't been covered in this discussion is that I believe the friendships that are formed are deeper than most friendships. Why? Because most of the time you all eat dinner together, you attend (in my case I had to run them) weekly meetings together, you hang out together, and you do this for multiple years (in my case it was 2.5 years). Even if you stayed in the same dorm for 2.5 years it would probably not be the same, as most times in a dorm a whole group of the same people would not eat together or attend parties together every single day as is the case in a fraternity or sorority. By doing that you become more like a family than friends. And the fact that you become a family of many diverse people and backgrounds is what I believe may be most valuable of all.

That said, I'm not advocating that it's right for everyone. Just pointing out that it truly does become more like a family than just "friends". Obviously in families you very intimately share both the good and bad, and that sure was the case in my fraternity, but that also helps prepare you for life.

 

[cto]

I started this thread...but the responses here prompt me also to reply to it. As I said in the original post, I enjoyed my Greek (sorority) experience) because it gave me a sense of family/community on a much larger campus. However, I had the same experience ( even more so) via my four years on the Daily Orange. Many of the SU folks I remain friends with decades later are the ones with whom I shared the DO highs and lows... which is hard to explain to anyone who has never worked on a daily newspaper.

 

[Ghost]

One more thing about fraternities and sororities that I think hasn't been covered in this discussion is that I believe the friendships that are formed are deeper than most friendships. Why? Because most of the time you all eat dinner together, you attend (in my case I had to run them) weekly meetings together, you hang out together, and you do this for multiple years (in my case it was 2.5 years). Even if you stayed in the same dorm for 2.5 years it would probably not be the same, as most times in a dorm a whole group of the same people would not eat together or attend parties together every single day as is the case in a fraternity or sorority. By doing that you become more like a family than friends. And the fact that you become a family of many diverse people and backgrounds is what I believe may be most valuable of all.

That said, I'm not advocating that it's right for everyone. Just pointing out that it truly does become more like a family than just "friends". Obviously in families you very intimately share both the good and bad, and that sure was the case in my fraternity, but that also helps prepare you for life.

Do many people live in dorms for four years? I think most people have a similar experience - it's just not so Hogwarts(y).

Is diversity really a strength of Fraternities/Sororities? That seems like a weird thing to highlight. I'm sure it exists, but overwhelmingly across the country it seems to be sort of an issue. Especially in the South. They do studies, campuses do diversity task forces, etc...to deal with how segregated they are.

A. eh... this is kind of a non-frat guy kind of thing to say. I went through it and laugh to this day about it. Nothing too humiliating - mostly all in good fun. Probably a little more dangerous that it needed to be - but most fun things in college life tend to be a bit more dangerous.
B. most frats are moving fast and far away from anything close to resembling hazing. It would be on the bottom of my list of concerns as a parent in 2015. I pledged in 2004 and it got increasingly easier year over year. It is a shell of what it was as recently as 2012. Probably all for the better, especially legally.

Probably all for the better...I always feel like this is the "brotherhood" part talking on public forums.....I mean each semester we all get a bunch of hazing stories in the news, the national chapter feigns shock, that one gets kicked off campus, and the story ends. We obviously would only ever hear about the deaths, hospitalizations, etc...considering the amount of peer pressure involved to never report an incident, I would guess hazing might still be an issue worth concerning yourself with if you have a child. Obviously it varies a bit by college/frat/sorority, and there a plenty of ones that observe the rules, but it doesn't mean it doesn't still attract the same sociopaths it always did. Just look at the link above with all the politicians that were in frats - proooof!

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Do many people live in dorms for four years? I think most people have a similar experience - it's just not so Hogwarts(y).

Is diversity really a strength of Fraternities/Sororities? That seems like a weird thing to highlight. I'm sure it exists, but overwhelmingly across the country it seems to be sort of an issue. Especially in the South. They do studies, campuses do diversity task forces, etc...to deal with how segregated they are.



Probably all for the better...I always feel like this is the "brotherhood" part talking on public forums...I mean each semester we all get a bunch of hazing stories in the news, the national chapter feigns shock, that one gets kicked off campus, and the story ends. We obviously would only ever hear about the deaths, hospitalizations, etc...considering the amount of peer pressure involved to never report an incident, I would guess hazing might still be an issue worth concerning yourself with if you have a child. Obviously it varies a bit by college/frat/sorority, and there a plenty of ones that observe the rules, but it doesn't mean it doesn't still attract the same sociopaths it always did. Just look at the link above with all the politicians that were in frats - proooof!

There is a case going on right now in Albany where they just arrested a bunch of fraternity brothers who had one of their pledges die last year from drinking 64 (or more) 0z. of vodka if I remember the story correctly. I pledged over 35 years ago and we did nothing like that at all. Yes, we had some minor chugging contests but there was no way any of us would have drank 64 oz of a liquor. I really hate to say this, but the pledge who drank that much, isn't he somewhat at fault as well (unless he was being held down with his hands tied behind his back). When you are 18, you still need to know the difference between right and wrong. It's a sad, sad situation and I would hate to be the kids parents.

 

[dilligaf]

bro, go lift. you need to get some pent up energy out.

You're probably right. Thanks.

 

[dilligaf]

..isn't he somewhat at fault as well (unless he was being held down with his hands tied behind his back). When you are 18, you still need to know the difference between right and wrong. It's a sad, sad situation and I would hate to be the kids parents.

After the first several shots not in position to use good judgment.
You need help in that situation.
Was everybody in the room a flocking moron?

excitable boy they all said, well he's just an ...

Perhaps so. But this is an occasion where you should shout What

 

[Ghost]

There is a case going on right now in Albany where they just arrested a bunch of fraternity brothers who had one of their pledges die last year from drinking 64 (or more) 0z. of vodka if I remember the story correctly. I pledged over 35 years ago and we did nothing like that at all. Yes, we had some minor chugging contests but there was no way any of us would have drank 64 oz of a liquor. I really hate to say this, but the pledge who drank that much, isn't he somewhat at fault as well (unless he was being held down with his hands tied behind his back). When you are 18, you still need to know the difference between right and wrong. It's a sad, sad situation and I would hate to be the kids parents.

I think the difference is probably the amount of pressure exerted by the group, and felt by the pledge. You throw the dangers of group mentality, with no apparent code of honor, and mix it with a kid trying out for friendship - it's a recipe for disaster. It could happen amongst the general population too, and likely has in incidents, but the pressures aren't so extreme so it's probably less likely . it's a weird issue as many groups are obviously perfectly safe - I guess it's on the kid to make good choices.

 

[realorange]

I think the difference is probably the amount of pressure exerted by the group, and felt by the pledge. You throw the dangers of group mentality, with no apparent code of honor, and mix it with a kid trying out for friendship - it's a recipe for disaster. It could happen amongst the general population too, and likely has in incidents, but the pressures aren't so extreme so it's probably less likely . it's a weird issue as many groups are obviously perfectly safe - I guess it's on the kid to make good choices.

No. I think it's on the group. They are supposed to be the one's mentoring a new (naïve?) pledge. They are the older and ostensibly, more mature person(s).

 

[CusefanATL]

Do many people live in dorms for four years? I think most people have a similar experience - it's just not so Hogwarts(y).

Is diversity really a strength of Fraternities/Sororities? That seems like a weird thing to highlight. I'm sure it exists, but overwhelmingly across the country it seems to be sort of an issue. Especially in the South. They do studies, campuses do diversity task forces, etc...to deal with how segregated they are.



Probably all for the better...I always feel like this is the "brotherhood" part talking on public forums...I mean each semester we all get a bunch of hazing stories in the news, the national chapter feigns shock, that one gets kicked off campus, and the story ends. We obviously would only ever hear about the deaths, hospitalizations, etc...considering the amount of peer pressure involved to never report an incident, I would guess hazing might still be an issue worth concerning yourself with if you have a child. Obviously it varies a bit by college/frat/sorority, and there a plenty of ones that observe the rules, but it doesn't mean it doesn't still attract the same sociopaths it always did. Just look at the link above with all the politicians that were in frats - proooof!

This is a guess, but per capita I would bet there are more campus murders or campus accidental deaths or campus od/drinking deaths than campus hazing deaths. There is plenty to be worried about as a parent - your kid joining a frat isn't overly dangerous. I would be more scared about my son/daughter living in brewster/boland or on the south side, west side, north side, and now east side of campus than I would having them live on Walnut.

Trust me, my frat did not follow any of the rules. And btw, we got kicked off campus for the dumbest "hazing" event ever that made the front page of the DO and it didnt involve hospitalization or a death.