OT - Vince Young files for bankruptcy... | Page 2 | Syracusefan.com

OT - Vince Young files for bankruptcy...

I'm not talking pension - I'm saying you take 50% or more of their salary and put in a trust fund where they have access to it over time. some players self-impose this sort of thing and have good financial advisors who take care of it - but I think if the unions cared about their members they would look at the outcomes and say we need to do something about it.
The union is made up of the players. If this was ever proposed, they would vote it down. Guys like VY don't want someone telling them what they have to do with their money. These guys make more than enough money to find sound financial consultants, and I'm sure they are given suggestions during their orientation period that they all go through now.
 
The union is made up of the players. If this was ever proposed, they would vote it down. Guys like VY don't want someone telling them what they have to do with their money. These guys make more than enough money to find sound financial consultants, and I'm sure they are given suggestions during their orientation period that they all go through now.
You are probably right that short term thinking would get the batter of analyzing the data and fighting for contractual stipulations that have the long-term interests of the membership in mind...but clearly whatever they are doing now in terms of counseling etc is not good enough. And it makes the leagues look exploitative and makes the unions look like they aren't doing a very good job. Sure these guys are adults and can do what they want...but when you have a large number of athletes falling into the same situation something should be done to correct it. Professional athletes are unique in that you quite often have someone coming from no money to having an overwhelming amount of money when they are still young. Now I know some 20-something investment bankers who have had $800k years - but those guys have the knowledge to deal with it. there is just really no comparison and no excuse for this happening to so many of these guys, something needs to change.
 
I'm not talking pension - I'm saying you take 50% or more of their salary and put in a trust fund where they have access to it over time. some players self-impose this sort of thing and have good financial advisors who take care of it - but I think if the unions cared about their members they would look at the outcomes and say we need to do something about it.

I have a problem beginning with the word "take."
 
You are probably right that short term thinking would get the batter of analyzing the data and fighting for contractual stipulations that have the long-term interests of the membership in mind...but clearly whatever they are doing now in terms of counseling etc is not good enough. And it makes the leagues look exploitative and makes the unions look like they aren't doing a very good job. Sure these guys are adults and can do what they want...but when you have a large number of athletes falling into the same situation something should be done to correct it. Professional athletes are unique in that you quite often have someone coming from no money to having an overwhelming amount of money when they are still young. Now I know some 20-something investment bankers who have had $800k years - but those guys have the knowledge to deal with it. there is just really no comparison and no excuse for this happening to so many of these guys, something needs to change.
I agree that it would be in the best interest of all to change, but now we're talking about what should happen versus what can happen. If it's up to the union to include something, the membership has to agree to it. It's one of the same problems they're having with regard to getting benefits for the old timers now. The current players are unwilling to sacrifice some of their money for the benefit of the guys that came before them, and, as a union, they can vote on that stuff. The NFL already provides a pension, so as a company they're doing their part. At some point adults have to grow up and take responsibility for their own actions, and that's not something that can be mandated. Also, there is nothing keeping these guys from getting real jobs and living like the rest of us.
 
I'm not talking pension - I'm saying you take 50% or more of their salary and put in a trust fund where they have access to it over time. some players self-impose this sort of thing and have good financial advisors who take care of it - but I think if the unions cared about their members they would look at the outcomes and say we need to do something about it.

Isnt this what MCW did?
 
So VY reportedly blew 26 million in 6 years. Just for fun, let's play with some numbers. Let's say that $26 million was his gross income (I have no idea how accurate this is, but it's the number I saw). If he loses 50% to taxes, he's left with $13 million. Let's say he takes half of that and tells a respected financial consultant he wants it invested so that he can live off of his returns, leaving enough over every year to account for inflation. If his investments yield 5% (any piss poor financial advisor should be able to get him this), he can leave 3% for inflation. The remaining 2% would then give him $130,000 for the first year. That number would of course go up annually due to the 3% set aside to account for inflation. How many of us would love to live off of $130,000+ for the rest of our lives for doing nothing?
 
So VY reportedly blew 26 million in 6 years. Just for fun, let's play with some numbers. Let's say that $26 million was his gross income (I have no idea how accurate this is, but it's the number I saw). If he loses 50% to taxes, he's left with $13 million. Let's say he takes half of that and tells a respected financial consultant he wants it invested so that he can live off of his returns, leaving enough over every year to account for inflation. If his investments yield 5% (any piss poor financial advisor should be able to get him this), he can leave 3% for inflation. The remaining 2% would then give him $130,000 for the first year. That number would of course go up annually due to the 3% set aside to account for inflation. How many of us would love to live off of $130,000+ for the rest of our lives for doing nothing?

The article posted said it was 26 million after taxes..
 
$600 shots. That's SIX HUNDRED DOLLARS...EACH. If I ever spend $600 on a one-ounce shot of cognac, it better be made from grapes that were squished between Marilyn Monroe's breasts.

joeysaved-20090914124059-champagne1955-original.jpg

Kinda makes my buying a bottle of Johnny Blue for my groomsmen to toast at my bachelor party seem pretty cheap.
 
Saw him at XS in Vegas when it first opened. He was with Keith Bullock among other Titans and about 100 women. I remember thinking seeing the bottles this dude was ordering and thinking that he better hope he's good for awhile...AND there ya go.
 
I have a problem beginning with the word "take."
Ok change that word to allocate. It's essentially like delayed compensation - you know the full amount of the contract but don't get all of it until a certain date. I mean you can call it whatever you want and structure it however you want - but clearly there are serious problems with how things work now. Structuring contracts in a way that enhances likely long-term economic outcomes for players and incentivizes good fiscal behavior (you could give a bonus if they contribute more than mandatory to the trust) is positive for all parties as long as it doesn't harm the value of the overall contract. Assuming it's invested in something that outpaces inflation there is no harm to contract value under what I am describing.
 
Yup - because he had well informed educated parents who are deeply involved in his young life and career. Many of these guys don't really have that.

very true
 
You are probably right that short term thinking would get the batter of analyzing the data and fighting for contractual stipulations that have the long-term interests of the membership in mind...but clearly whatever they are doing now in terms of counseling etc is not good enough. And it makes the leagues look exploitative and makes the unions look like they aren't doing a very good job. Sure these guys are adults and can do what they want...but when you have a large number of athletes falling into the same situation something should be done to correct it. Professional athletes are unique in that you quite often have someone coming from no money to having an overwhelming amount of money when they are still young. Now I know some 20-something investment bankers who have had $800k years - but those guys have the knowledge to deal with it. there is just really no comparison and no excuse for this happening to so many of these guys, something needs to change.

You can't force it. Imagine the public backlash if everyone was told they were mandated to transfer 10% of all earnings to a 401k retirement plan. Bottom line, it's a free country and....

Because-You-Cant-Fix-Stupid.jpg
 
Ok change that word to allocate. It's essentially like delayed compensation - you know the full amount of the contract but don't get all of it until a certain date. I mean you can call it whatever you want and structure it however you want - but clearly there are serious problems with how things work now. Structuring contracts in a way that enhances likely long-term economic outcomes for players and incentivizes good fiscal behavior (you could give a bonus if they contribute more than mandatory to the trust) is positive for all parties as long as it doesn't harm the value of the overall contract. Assuming it's invested in something that outpaces inflation there is no harm to contract value under what I am describing.

What you're doing is structuring a contract to protect them from themselves because you don't trust them with their own money.
 
These idiots would be better to invest in the stock market as opposed to all these business ventures. But it is more s e x y to own a franchise or night club than a mutual fund. Also, put a hood on that thing before playing around.

I can actually speak on this subject as an investment guy; it is impossible to get many of these athletes to remain committed to a financial plan. "My buddy has this great opportunity.../I have to get in on this deal.../I'll put all the money back once this other thing works out..." are just a few examples some of these guys say. Next thing you know, they have NOTHING to show for it. Being a semi-successful professional athlete allows you to take care of your kids' kids for years to come... if you play your cards right. It also opens up the doors to a lucrative analyst career afterwards (see Ray Lewis, Mike Strahan, Terry Bradshaw, etc). You can still party and have fun, just not in an egregious manner like VY and Mike Tyson.

We don't even bother with athletes anymore, it is way too skewed to actually find any of them that turn out to be good clients. Their agents make all of their investment decisions and most of the guys are jackasses. We had quite a few of them down in DC for awhile and the same 'ol story happened with all of them.
 
You can file a Chapter 14 two years after the discharge of a previous Chapter 13 filing.

Certain assets such as those obtained by fraud cannot be discharged and certain assets are excluded (determined by each state). ERISA assets such as qualified pension funds are not attachable. As I mentioned earlier, OJ was living comfortably on his pension and the Goldman judgment could not attach it.

VY filed for Chapter 11. You are correct that certain assets are not attachable.
 
One word: entourage. You can't support yourself and 30 of your family/friends expecting to be financially solvent at the end of your career. These star athletes need to ditch the freeloaders on day one of their contracts. Once the gravy train starts, it's hard to throw people off.
 

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