Class of 2019 PG Dakota Leffew (GA) Portal to Georgia

[OttoinGrotto]

History tells us the board will curse or commend the decision for 3 weeks after the kid announces.

What do you mean "or?"

 

[baggerbob]

What do you mean "or?"

If he decides to come he is a Syracuse Player, and hope he does well.

 

[Windyfly]

Just a thought on the NIL / for Dakota Leffew in particular

I’ve been thinking about this and heard Devo say something similar on Cuse radio earlier..

But maybe the staff is trying to tread carefully on how much they’re offering to players from the portal…for example if they give DL, X amount of $$ and it’s quite a bit more than the rest of the players on the team are getting…then people might look around and say Hey Why Did He Get X Amount and I’m Getting Y, I’ve Been Here Longer and I Think I’m Better… This stuff really happens and the portal/NIL game is a real juggling act and is not as easy as some make it out to be. Overpaying for players has potential to make the guys we already have on the roster feel undervalued or potentially then seek to get themselves more $$ (that we may not have) or seek to go transfer elsewhere for more money.

There’s certainly many factors that have to be accounted for with all this and I don’t envy any of the coaches trying to navigate this game now. By NO means is it easy building a high level functioning roster while also keeping everyone happy, on a budget.

At the very least there has to be reasonable negotiations and enough forethought to account for every possibility.

 

[dasher]

Just a thought on the NIL / for Dakota Leffew in particular

I’ve been thinking about this and heard Devo say something similar on Cuse radio earlier..

But maybe the staff is trying to tread carefully on how much they’re offering to players from the portal…for example if they give DL, X amount of $$ and it’s quite a bit more than the rest of the players on the team are getting…then people might look around and say Hey Why Did He Get X Amount and I’m Getting Y, I’ve Been Here Longer and I Think I’m Better… This stuff really happens and the portal/NIL game is a real juggling act and is not as easy as some make it out to be. Overpaying for players has potential to make the guys we already have on the roster feel undervalued or potentially then seek to get themselves more $$ (that we may not have) or seek to go transfer elsewhere for more money.

There’s certainly many factors that have to be accounted for with all this and I don’t envy any of the coaches trying to navigate this game now. By NO means is it easy building a high level functioning roster while also keeping everyone happy, on a budget.

At the very least there has to be reasonable negotiations and enough forethought to account for every possibility.

That is 100% on target. That is why they somewhat have to hold the line. If you give DL 400k and other guys on the team are getting less, you can bet that after this season. those guys are going to want a bump.

 

[CLTCuse]

Well market rate is market rate. DL seems interested in maximizing his value, as well he should. If Syracuse can’t keep up, the talent drain will continue.

 

[Cuse1055]

That is 100% on target. That is why they somewhat have to hold the line. If you give DL 400k and other guys on the team are getting less, you can bet that after this season. those guys are going to want a bump.

Definitely makes sense. You think Jaquan Carlos commits if Leffew picks elsewhere? Or do you think staff makes a push for Elijah Hawkins?

 

[grepal]

Just a thought on the NIL / for Dakota Leffew in particular

I’ve been thinking about this and heard Devo say something similar on Cuse radio earlier..

But maybe the staff is trying to tread carefully on how much they’re offering to players from the portal…for example if they give DL, X amount of $$ and it’s quite a bit more than the rest of the players on the team are getting…then people might look around and say Hey Why Did He Get X Amount and I’m Getting Y, I’ve Been Here Longer and I Think I’m Better… This stuff really happens and the portal/NIL game is a real juggling act and is not as easy as some make it out to be. Overpaying for players has potential to make the guys we already have on the roster feel undervalued or potentially then seek to get themselves more $$ (that we may not have) or seek to go transfer elsewhere for more money.

There’s certainly many factors that have to be accounted for with all this and I don’t envy any of the coaches trying to navigate this game now. By NO means is it easy building a high level functioning roster while also keeping everyone happy, on a budget.

At the very least there has to be reasonable negotiations and enough forethought to account for every possibility.

That is why non union work places strongly discouraged employees discussing salary with each other.

 

[dasher]

Definitely makes sense. You think Jaquan Carlos commits if Leffew picks elsewhere? Or do you think staff makes a push for Elijah Hawkins?

I am not thinking about anything until DL makes his decision.

 

[CLTCuse]

I hope they have been on the phone with Hawkins today. I get the impression he was committed to coming back to Minnesota… until suddenly he wasn’t (kinda like Maliq) which may imply he has his destination picked. He seems like a great fit.

 

[SUFan44]

I hope they have been on the phone with Hawkins today. I get the impression he was committed to coming back to Minnesota… until suddenly he wasn’t (kinda like Maliq) which may imply he has his destination picked. He seems like a great fit.

Hawkins is going to be out of line with the rest of them, too.

If that’s what is happening, SU is always going to be limited. In my opinion, that strategy is not going to work in this new world.

 

[cuseattle]

Refresh... Nope...Repeat...& so forth

 

[albanycuse]

If everyone doesn’t cash app Coach Red $250 by Friday then we’re done competing in the ACC as we know it. We’re going to be going head to head with Gmac for MAAC level players. Do your due diligence and press send.

 

[pwong]

That is 100% on target. That is why they somewhat have to hold the line. If you give DL 400k and other guys on the team are getting less, you can bet that after this season. those guys are going to want a bump.

I mean thats how the job force operates though. Like you always make more money jumping to an external job (except the NIL market went up higher than expected). And for the guys who stay, you either have to give them enough of a raise to not want to dip or prepare for a replacement. Agents and coaches have a general idea of how much market is, just how theres glassdoor for the workforce.

 

[SUFan44]

I mean thats how the job force operates though. Like you always make more money jumping to an external job (except the NIL market went up higher than expected). And for the guys who stay, you either have to give them enough of a raise to not want to dip or prepare for a replacement. Agents and coaches have a general idea of how much market is, just how theres glassdoor for the workforce.

Exactly.

That strategy is a losing proposition if we're going to be a player for talent at the highest level.

Doesn't mean we can't win a decent number of games, but if we want to be a Top 15 program again, not sure that's gonna work.

 

[Lukeyloo]

This is taking too long, I’m rescinding my offer to be a fan of his. If only he knew what he just missed out on..

 

[PeteCalvin]

I am "jordoo" at those other places and have been for years...

No. I’m Lavander Williams.

 

[Orangefan1]

Maybe Dan Mullen is available?

 

[Sbucketball]

Exactly.

That strategy is a losing proposition if we're going to be a player for talent at the highest level.

Doesn't mean we can't win a decent number of games, but if we want to be a Top 15 program again, not sure that's gonna work.

Unfortunately this is spot on. I understand why they feel they have to keep things in the same ballpark, but that means we're not in the market for those special types of players who can carry a team. Making sure you don't pay a high salary to a superstar to keep guys like Bell, Starling and Cuffe happy means we'll be aiming for middle of the ACC finishes. And don't think they wouldn't leave anyways the second they get wind of double the money somewhere else.

That strategy makes sense like 90% of the time, but it remains to be seen whether it works in college basketball today. Better strategy might be to embrace the complete rebuild every year and aim for one or two superstars and backfill role guys.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think Red has a plan and we need to trust it. I get as frustrated as anyone(look at my posts in the Maliq situation), but he clearly has an idea of what type of player he wants to fill what role. I think we need to take a step back here with Leffew. He’s not a make or break player. There’s not a reason to overpay if we can move to someone else of similar capabilities.

 

[Orangezoo]

I think Red has a plan and we need to trust it. I get as frustrated as anyone(look at my posts in the Maliq situation), but he clearly has an idea of what type of player he wants to fill what role. I think we need to take a step back here with Leffew. He’s not a make or break player. There’s not a reason to overpay if we can move to someone else of similar capabilities.

There will be a solid option no matter what that wants to start for an ACC program. Even with Leffew taking so much time- you also have the higher bidding programs stepping back away from the portal as they land guys or having tighter budgets too. Outside of Reynolds to an extent there isn’t anyone who really is coming in and covering up for guys that need to improve. Several players need to make a jump in their overall game and we need to get some good fortune with Westry- then also have our solid starting PG whoever that ends up being.

I’ll also add if the final two players to fill out the roster includes someone who can contribute right away off the bench and the financial approach of not over paying at PG allows for that then that’s a plus too.

 

[kingtidge]

That is 100% on target. That is why they somewhat have to hold the line. If you give DL 400k and other guys on the team are getting less, you can bet that after this season. those guys are going to want a bump.

OK, but I think we need to be realistic about "overpaying" vs. "overvalued"

Paying market rate isn't overpaying.

Now, we can certainly claim the market rate is "overvalued" for a particular player (as far as we value that player.) If we can't or won't meet that valuation as not worth our expected ROI with that player, so be it.

On the other hand, if other programs can and will meet the market value on our # 1 portal target players and also deal with the "bump" scenarios with existing players when bringing them on, it's also hard to claim we are operating competitively if competing teams can do it and we cannot.

At the end of the day, "Too rich for me, I'm out" is a fold.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

I think Red has a plan and we need to trust it. I get as frustrated as anyone(look at my posts in the Maliq situation), but he clearly has an idea of what type of player he wants to fill what role. I think we need to take a step back here with Leffew. He’s not a make or break player. There’s not a reason to overpay if we can move to someone else of similar capabilities.

And especially someone who might be a team player and leader in the locker room. Red inherited way too many headaches last year.

 

[kcsu]

OK, but I think we need to be realistic.

Paying market value isn't overpaying.

Now, we can certainly claim the market rate is "overvalued" for a particular player (as far as we value that player.) If we canI't or won't meet that valuation as not worth ROI, so be it.

On the other hand, if other programs can and will meet the market value on such players and also deal with the "bump" scenarios with existing players when bringing them on, it's also hard to claim we are operating competitively.

At the end of the day, "Too rich for me, I'm out" is a fold.

What is market value? In my world I look at the ROI. I'm sure Red is doing the same but as others have posted what any new player gets for NIL is going to affect the existing NIL structure in a few ways. One current players. Two future players, Three the use of the funds needs to pay off otherwise the availability of future funds could be affected. Bottom line is what is the player worth given SUs current situation.
Does Red know for instance that Chance and or Cuffe are solid and ready to go. Does he know that Bell is on the verge of leaving and if he pays the new guy significantly more money than Bell that he either has to pony up for Bell or risk losing him... So, yes market value is what the individual can obtain for themselves, but any business should always set their own level when it comes to capital allocation.

 

[Sbucketball]

OK, but I think we need to be realistic about "overpaying" vs. "overvalued"

Paying market value isn't overpaying.

Now, we can certainly claim the market rate is "overvalued" for a particular player (as far as we value that player.) If we can't or won't meet that valuation as not worth our expected ROI, so be it.

On the other hand, if other programs can and will meet the market value on our # 1 portal target players and also deal with the "bump" scenarios with existing players when bringing them on, it's also hard to claim we are operating competitively if competing teams can do it and we cannot.

At the end of the day, "Too rich for me, I'm out" is a fold.

I was beating this drum last year. The best evidence of fair market value typically is the amount a purchaser pays in an arms' length transaction (i.e. what someone pays on the market for it who isn't getting an inside deal). When a couple programs offer around $750k to a center, that becomes the best evidence of his market value, despite whether we think anything over 350 is overpaying. I think we spend a lot of time on this site claiming the market value is what Syracuse offers and other programs are overpaying. Now, maybe we're in a bubble, but that doesn't change the current fair market value for these players. If a couple programs offer Leffew $400k and we want him for $250k, seems like we're trying to get him under market value. Doesn't mean a player is worth their market value to us, but we need to at least call it what it is.

 

[kingtidge]

What is market value? In my world I look at the ROI. I'm sure Red is doing the same but as others have posted what any new player gets for NIL is going to affect the existing NIL structure in a few ways. One current players. Two future players, Three the use of the funds needs to pay off otherwise the availability of future funds could be affected. Bottom line is what is the player worth given SUs current situation.
Does Red know for instance that Chance and or Cuffe are solid and ready to go. Does he know that Bell is on the verge of leaving and if he pays the new guy significantly more money than Bell that he either has to pony up for Bell or risk losing him... So, yes market value is what the individual can obtain for themselves, but any business should always set their own level when it comes to capital allocation.

Market rate is probably the more apt term, sorry (corrected) - the value the market will pay for a commodity.

Like anything else, every purchase/player/situation is different and you have to have your own top-end max value for a player based on expected ROI.

Also, you need to look at portal performance trends over time for a program and we're still in early days with the portal and how it's evolving.

My worry is programs with a majority of misses on their plan A's and that are getting mostly plan B's, C's, or lower, etc... That sort of portal performance is really going to ensure mediocrity or worse for a program over the longterm (unless you can somehow savant "Moneyball" odd-faced pieces that collectively perform better than their individual talent - and that is really hard to do in b-ball.)

To be or not to be competitive...