Class of 2023 PG Garwey Dual (TX) TRANSFERRING TO SYRACUSE (4/11/26)

[Cusefan0307]

The thing with our guards is they are versatile. Dual and Tobiason can play point. Do I LOVE them playing point? No. I want a true lead guard. But we had some good combo guards play point. Gbinije, MCW, Triche, Mintz, Girard etc….thats just recently. I wouldn’t call them lead guards or true PGs like an Ennis, Pearl, Sherm, etc….you can win with a combo guard at point. You can have Dual and Tobiason playing the 1 and 2. Hell in a 3 guard system Tobiason can play the 1-3. Doty can play the 2 and 3. Anthony is really the only one where I’m strictly playing him at the 2 and Moesch at the 1. Dual, Tobiason and Doty can play multiple guard spots. I still want to see us get a lead guard though

I think Dual is a pure point. I don’t see him as a 2 at all.

 

[althea]

The thing with our guards is they are versatile. Dual and Tobiason can play point. Do I LOVE them playing point? No. I want a true lead guard. But we had some good combo guards play point. Gbinije, MCW, Triche, Mintz, Girard etc….thats just recently. I wouldn’t call them lead guards or true PGs like an Ennis, Pearl, Sherm, etc….you can win with a combo guard at point. You can have Dual and Tobiason playing the 1 and 2. Hell in a 3 guard system Tobiason can play the 1-3. Doty can play the 2 and 3. Anthony is really the only one where I’m strictly playing him at the 2 and Moesch at the 1. Dual, Tobiason and Doty can play multiple guard spots. I still want to see us get a lead guard though

I know this is out there - do you see Anthony ever playing the 1 ?

 

[Scotch]

I know this is out there - do you see Anthony ever playing the 1 ?

Good god no

 

[Mr. M]

The thing with our guards is they are versatile. Dual and Tobiason can play point. Do I LOVE them playing point? No. I want a true lead guard. But we had some good combo guards play point. Gbinije, MCW, Triche, Mintz, Girard etc….thats just recently. I wouldn’t call them lead guards or true PGs like an Ennis, Pearl, Sherm, etc….you can win with a combo guard at point. You can have Dual and Tobiason playing the 1 and 2. Hell in a 3 guard system Tobiason can play the 1-3. Doty can play the 2 and 3. Anthony is really the only one where I’m strictly playing him at the 2 and Moesch at the 1. Dual, Tobiason and Doty can play multiple guard spots. I still want to see us get a lead guard though

Where does MMM fit? Deep bench?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I know this is out there - do you see Anthony ever playing the 1 ?

I know it sounds nuts but I wonder about this.

 

[DomeHolmes]

Dual had 16 games with at least 5 assists and only 9 games with more than two turnovers. He had zero turnovers in 6 games. In those 6 games he totaled 30 assists. Elite ball security.

Sounds like a dual threat

 

[CuseMan4]

I know this is out there - do you see Anthony ever playing the 1 ?

Hellllllll no lol

 

[CuseMan4]

Where does MMM fit? Deep bench?

He could play the 3 or 2. Honestly it’s hard to gauge where he is at because of where he played and there’s just minimal high light reels on him. But the way respected scouts and NBA draft scouts talk about him. He’s a very good shooter and scorer. So tbh if he rolled out as our opening day starter at 3. Wouldn’t shock me. He’s really an unknown but he has a niche on this team as a really good scorer and shooter. As of right now this team needs that. A shooter and scorer. Tobiason is really good scorer but he need more than that obviously. MMM could be that second scorer. I’m sure Sadiq and Anthony will make a leap as well. And Doty can be a spark off the bench. I just really think we need a lead PG that can run an offense, get you assists and 10ppg. If we get that and a solid defensive starting center I’ll be happy

 

[althea]

I know it sounds nuts but I wonder about this.

I will die on this hill!

 

[Niastri]

The thing with our guards is they are versatile. Dual and Tobiason can play point. Do I LOVE them playing point? No. I want a true lead guard. But we had some good combo guards play point. Gbinije, MCW, Triche, Mintz, Girard etc….thats just recently. I wouldn’t call them lead guards or true PGs like an Ennis, Pearl, Sherm, etc….you can win with a combo guard at point. You can have Dual and Tobiason playing the 1 and 2. Hell in a 3 guard system Tobiason can play the 1-3. Doty can play the 2 and 3. Anthony is really the only one where I’m strictly playing him at the 2 and Moesch at the 1. Dual, Tobiason and Doty can play multiple guard spots. I still want to see us get a lead guard though

I accept everything you said as true. However, I'll also add a counter point. The decline of Syracuse as a program from elite to mediocre to bad coincided with JB deciding that we didn't need point guards.

Maybe Dual is good enough, but if we go into the season with essentially three combo guards and an unheralded freshman point guard (I've heard Moesch described as a combo), we are asking for trouble.

 

[Ozone!]

One thing about Dual is that he seems to make more plays with being long and athletic as a guard more than great defensive position. I watched some the extended Vanderbilt highlights and he seems to roam a lot on defense. Obviously defending the Vandy guards is a tall order but he was out of position a number of times and several he was able to recover or make a play. Very interesting player. He had his hands down a lot on defense too for such a good defender so the fact he is so good in advanced metrics as a defender while needing to be a bit more fundamentally sound is impressive at least.

Offensively he’s good in the break and hard to guard taking it to the rim. Decent looking outside shot when open.. nothing textbook but it works. Unselfish and a distributor although some of his passes look too weak and soft to me even if Vandy didn’t get there hands on them.

Oh and he didn’t make any real concerted effort to attack the glass either. That definitely bothered me as being 6-5 200 with a 6-10 wingspan there is no excuse not to use that advantage on the glass as a guard.

Those issues can be addressed with good coaching!

 

[EnviroSciGuy]

I will die on this hill!

Easy there; you've already been granted one resurrection.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

I know this is out there - do you see Anthony ever playing the 1 ?

I’ve seen him play the 1 vs 5.

 

[letsgorange]

I accept everything you said as true. However, I'll also add a counter point. The decline of Syracuse as a program from elite to mediocre to bad coincided with JB deciding that we didn't need point guards.

Maybe Dual is good enough, but if we go into the season with essentially three combo guards and an unheralded freshman point guard (I've heard Moesch described as a combo), we are asking for trouble.

How do you define combo guard?

I think of the definition of a combo guard as someone who has scoring and shooting attributes that exceed their playmaking abilities but can handle the ball well enough to initiate the offense and handle vs pressure when needed. More of scorer than pg.

I don't see Dual or Moesch fitting this bill. Their primary attributes are ball handling and play making for others not scoring, definitely not shooting, so I wouldn't define either as combos.

Sure Dual has the size the guard big guards and forwards (wings as some say) but view his best attributes on offense as ball handling and distributing the ball.

Dual is your starting PG with Tobiason or Moesch (if ready) as the backups

 

[Cusefan0307]

How do you define combo guard?

I think of the definition of a combo guard as someone who has scoring and shooting attributes that exceed their playmaking abilities but can handle the ball well enough to initiate the offense and handle vs pressure when needed. More of scorer than pg.

I don't see Dual or Moesch fitting this bill. Their primary attributes are ball handling and play making for others not scoring, definitely not shooting, so I wouldn't define either as combos.

Sure Dual has the size the guard big guards and forwards (wings as some say) but view his best attributes on offense as ball handling and distributing the ball.

Dual is your starting PG with Tobiason or Moesch (if ready) as the backups

It’s how I see it too. Some of the other guys we are after like Wilkins are more of a combo than Dual.

 

[PeteCalvin]

I accept everything you said as true. However, I'll also add a counter point. The decline of Syracuse as a program from elite to mediocre to bad coincided with JB deciding that we didn't need point guards.

Maybe Dual is good enough, but if we go into the season with essentially three combo guards and an unheralded freshman point guard (I've heard Moesch described as a combo), we are asking for trouble.

Not exactly true about JB. He wanted PGs, but from what many on here have eluded to, he procrastinated in offering some top kids in the 2010’s to go after other top kids and got burned. You would think he’d learned after the Stephon Marbury debacle. He should have offered Brunson. And remember, he did get Kadary but botched the whole rotation thing.

 

[RF2044]

I don't think that Dual is a pure point, but I think he has a lot of lead guard skills. Need to see more of his handle / facilitation in half-court offensive sets [vs. handling the ball in the open floor] to make that determination.

But playing alongside versatile guys who can create themselves off of the bounce like Doty / Tobiason ease this concern for me. I think you can have a defensive specialist PG who can do a lot of other things but isn't a big scorer / shooter playing alongside guys like that.

 

[boog7]

I don't think that Dual is a pure point, but I think he has a lot of lead guard skills. Need to see more of his handle / facilitation in half-court offensive sets [vs. handling the ball in the open floor] to make that determination.

But playing alongside versatile guys who can create themselves off of the bounce like Doty / Tobiason ease this concern for me. I think you can have a defensive specialist PG who can do a lot of other things but isn't a big scorer / shooter playing alongside guys like that.

Solid points and I agree with most. But from what I've seen and learned about him, I actually do think Dual is a "pure point" and his scoring stats kinda attest to it.

He scored 15 vs Michigan, had 16 vs another high-major they played so he can score when needed. But the fact that he only averaged 8+ points a game shows that he is clearly a past-first point guard, which by my definition is what differentiates a "pure point" from a "lead guard" which by my definition is a player with point guard skills but plays with a score-first mentality. Allen Iverson is probably the ultimate example and maybe Jalen Brunson is the modern day example of a shoot-first lead guard.

Dual does not appear to be all that interested in scoring unless called upon but does seem instinctually more focused on passing to his teammates which is a pass-first, "pure point" mentality, imho.

 

[Niastri]

How do you define combo guard?

I think of the definition of a combo guard as someone who has scoring and shooting attributes that exceed their playmaking abilities but can handle the ball well enough to initiate the offense and handle vs pressure when needed. More of scorer than pg.

I don't see Dual or Moesch fitting this bill. Their primary attributes are ball handling and play making for others not scoring, definitely not shooting, so I wouldn't define either as combos.

Sure Dual has the size the guard big guards and forwards (wings as some say) but view his best attributes on offense as ball handling and distributing the ball.

Dual is your starting PG with Tobiason or Moesch (if ready) as the backups

There are two theories about what makes a combo guard. Many people will sometimes define a combo guard as a player that can play both point guard and shooting guard.

However, usually, by calling them a combo guard what they really mean is that they aren't good enough at point guard to play that as their primary position… But they don't score well enough to be a true shooting guard either. Sometimes it means that a really good shooting guard can play point guard in a pinch, but you don't want them as your starter.

Almost always, it comes back to this: you want a real point guard running your offense. Starting two combo guards is a little bit like having two quarterbacks… What it really means is you don't have any.

If you had a point guard, like a Johnny Flynn, who happened to be a very good point guard, but also would be your best scorer, you don't call him a combo guard just because he's great at scoring. That title will be reserved for the Joe Girards of the world, forced to play point guard when it's not really their position.

We've mostly done that the last 12 years, usually because we failed to recruit an actual point guard that was good (as RF2044 pointed out above).

 

[RF2044]

Solid points and I agree with most. But from what I've seen and learned about him, I actually do think Dual is a "pure point" and his scoring stats kinda attest to it.

He scored 15 vs Michigan, had 16 vs another high-major they played so he can score when needed. But the fact that he only averaged 8+ points a game shows that he is clearly a past-first point guard, which by my definition is what differentiates a "pure point" from a "lead guard" which by my definition is a player with point guard skills but plays with a score-first mentality. Allen Iverson is probably the ultimate example and maybe Jalen Brunson is the modern day example of a shoot-first lead guard.

Dual does not appear to be all that interested in scoring unless called upon but does seem instinctually more focused on passing to his teammates which is a pass-first, "pure point" mentality, imho.

I agree with your definition with one minor distinction -- sometimes, a "lead guard" isn't a big scorer, just an off-ball guard / wing with versatility and the requisite ball handling to chip in and spell or play the point.

That's what I think Dual might be, although I think he has upside.

Again, I don't have a great feel for his ability to lead half-court offensive sets, which is the true value of a point guard. I do think he's got some versatility. I worry that his handle might be just a bit too loose from the clips I've seen of him playing half court. In transition, I think he'll be lethal.

Also, a lot will depend on what type of offense we run. If it is a full out spread, then Dual paired with two versatile WGs will work, and it will minimize the traditional "need" for a point guard setting the table for everybody else. Lots of unknowns right now.

But I enjoy the point guard discussion, and your thought provoking / insightful post.

 

[boog7]

I agree with your definition with one minor distinction -- sometimes, a "lead guard" isn't a big scorer, just an off-ball guard / wing with versatility and the requisite ball handling to chip in and spell or play the point.

That's what I think Dual might be, although I think he has upside.

Again, I don't have a great feel for his ability to lead half-court offensive sets, which is the true value of a point guard. I do think he's got some versatility. I worry that his handle might be just a bit too loose from the clips I've seen of him playing half court. In transition, I think he'll be lethal.

Also, a lot will depend on what type of offense we run. If it is a full out spread, then Dual paired with two versatile WGs will work, and it will minimize the traditional "need" for a point guard setting the table for everybody else. Lots of unknowns right now.

But I enjoy the point guard discussion, and your thought provoking / insightful post.

Same. It's kinda tomAto/tomato on the "pure point/lead guard" definitions but we're basically in the same ball park so...

But if Dual's handle was a problem, he'd likely have a high turnover rate. He doesn't. In fact, he's very good with ball security - one of his appealing traits - which would certainly be an upgrade from last year's starting PG, who was a turnover machine and rarely seemed to make the right pass at the right time or set the table for his teammates to score easy buckets.

Overall though, I do agree that Dual is a bit of mystery and I wouldn't be against bringing in one more starting caliber PG. But I've also gotta trust GMac and his staff's evaluations and if they think Dual is capable of being their starting PG, I have to defer to their judgement. After all, it's their butts on the line if things go left - which I seriously doubt they will. I'm a big fan of their team building thus far. Keep it coming.

 

[RF2044]

Same. It's kinda tomAto/tomato on the "pure point/lead guard" definitions but we're basically in the same ball park so...

But if Dual's handle was a problem, he'd likely have a high turnover rate. He doesn't. In fact, he's very good with ball security - one of his appealing traits - which would certainly be an upgrade from last year's starting PG, who was a turnover machine and rarely seemed to make the right pass at the right time or set the table for his teammates to score easy buckets.

Overall though, I do agree that Dual is a bit of mystery and I wouldn't be against bringing in one more starting caliber PG. But I've also gotta trust GMac and his staff's evaluations and if they think Dual is capable of being their starting PG, I have to defer to their judgement. After all, it's their butts on the line if things go left - which I seriously doubt they will. I'm a big fan of their team building thus far. Keep it coming.

Agreed -- no doubt, he is a plus defender and versatile [although not a "great" shooter]. He can do a lot of things well. I am just not sure whether he can be a STARTING point guard, versus maybe being better suited for a Guard/Forward type of role in reserve.

And like I mentioned in the earlier post, I think he can do enough that with the other two likely starters on the wing, it should be good enough.

Otherwise, it seems like we are pretty close on the rest.

 

[Niastri]

I agree with your definition with one minor distinction -- sometimes, a "lead guard" isn't a big scorer, just an off-ball guard / wing with versatility and the requisite ball handling to chip in and spell or play the point.

That's what I think Dual might be, although I think he has upside.

Again, I don't have a great feel for his ability to lead half-court offensive sets, which is the true value of a point guard. I do think he's got some versatility. I worry that his handle might be just a bit too loose from the clips I've seen of him playing half court. In transition, I think he'll be lethal.

Also, a lot will depend on what type of offense we run. If it is a full out spread, then Dual paired with two versatile WGs will work, and it will minimize the traditional "need" for a point guard setting the table for everybody else. Lots of unknowns right now.

But I enjoy the point guard discussion, and your thought provoking / insightful post.

I thought our roster would have lent itself well to pressing last season. Long, twitchy athletes at virtually every position.

Next season would be even more suited, based on roster composition so far. Sibi, White, Tobiason, Dual and anybody else could be a great pressing team.

I don't know if GMAC loves, hates or is indifferent to pressing. I hope he at least Trunk Monkeys when we need to get back into a game.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[CbusCuse]

Dual talk starts @ 29:30. Some rando NBA draftniks pretty high on him, fwiw.

I really like this pick-up. I do think he can be a really good starting PG. He's killer on D, but is not necessarily all defense as his offensive metrics are efficient, just not high volume. He's just not going to score a ton or shoot the 3 much. On offense he needs to be a driver and facilitator getting more scoring out of the rest of the roster. He can really take care of the ball, not getting turnovers (1.6) but also will get a good amount of assists (4.4) and should only improve on that more next year. He continues to make improvements. Looks like he's gained some weight from HS, solidly built with super long arms for his size, and his size is 6'-5". Fantastic length. Got better in rebounding (2.9) but could be even better there with more determination. The fact that his FT% jumped to 76.4% is excellent. He should be driving all the time. He just needs to learn to be more aggressive on offense. His dog mentality needs to kick in and realize he can be the man. He doesn't turn it over much and he is long and can take it to the rack. If he gets fouled, its points. If the D collapses and he can kick it to the wings, easily with that length.

Dual should be driving all the time and have our Forwards drift to the wings clearing space. If that defender collapses to help, the SF's and PF's should be getting a lot of good looks at 3's. The Centers won't be threat their with their current abilities. Would love it if we had a great 3Pt shooting PF. Sadiq was 37% but only hit 7 of them all year and assuming we get Folifac, he was 38% but also only hit 6 of them. They were freshman PF's though, so at least they showed potential in their efficiency. I think they will both get a lot more open 3's this season and they will be good enough in that regard to take the open looks, but it would be great if we had someone more automatic. I think Dual is going to get a lot of players open shots this season, we need players to knock them down. Doty and Tobiason were not all that efficient at 3's, 32.8% and 33.8% respectively, but both were just Sophomores. Hopefully they are still improving in that regard.

at SG/SF I suspect 3M should be money at 3's despite being a freshman, as his stats playing against some solid competition back that up. I think Tobiason likely gets the most PT with 3M/Doty being next and then Kiyan should see the least with his poor productivity thus far that only got worse as the season went on against better competition. Despite having Anthony on his jersey, and his pretty high recruit ranking, he shouldn't get too many minutes until he proves to be more efficient. I don't see how he isn't a better 3pt shooter (25.4%) and FT shooter (62.8%). He has to have been throwing up shots all day for his entire life right? That combo is not good, especially when he is a kid who is crafty and can get to the FT line. That seems to be his bread and butter. Over his last 8 games he was 13-15 in FT's so that is a positive trend at least.