Pickup Game - Forth or Chukwu?

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OttoMets

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#26
We don’t have a trophy in 2003 without Forth. He had his best game of the season in NO on the night we needed every point. He had a key dunk late in the game off a feed from Edelin. Chukwu doesn’t catch that pass or finish that play.
That's not entirely fair. Give Chukwu ten of those and I bet he finishes at least one or two. We've seen it happen before. And on the flip side, I don't know that Forth's percentage would be much different. I'm just glad he picked the right one to catch and throw down.
 

OrangeDW

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#27
Chukwu committed 40 TO compared to Craigs 39 for a full season.
But Chukwu played over 50% more minutes.

Chukwu is a much better FT shooter. He improved dramatically after a dismal first year.
Craig never improved hovering around 60%..
Chukwu will finish his SU career with more made FT than Craig despite playing fewer seasons.
He is only 25 behind as of now ( 101 vs 76 ).
He improved...up to 65%. Which is what he is this year too. Which is about what Forth was in his best years(since we’re cherry picking their best).

TO’s...1.1 in 20.4 mpg vs 0.9 in 18.9 mpg. Same thing basically.
 
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#29
He improved...up to 65%. Which is what he is this year too. Which is about what Forth was in his best years(since we’re cherry picking their best).

TO’s...1.1 in 20.4 mpg vs 0.9 in 18.9 mpg. Same thing basically.
The most objective way to score this is by total career minutes
Craig Forth: 2,778
Pascal Chukwu: 1371 (basically half as many minutes)

We'll just divide those minutes by the total TOs and FT made for each player to
arrive at minutes between TOs (MBTO) and minutes between FTM (MBFTM).

Craig Forth: Turned the ball over every 19 minutes
Pascal Chukwu: Turned the ball over every 21.7 minutes (about 10% less often)

Craig Forth: Made a FT every 27.5 minutes
Pascal Chukwu: Made a FT every 18 minutes (at a 50% higher rate)

PC > CF in both categories



PC was playing blind in the early part of his career.
PC is currently the best FT shooting big on the team aside from OB.
 
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OrangeDW

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#31
They never threw the ball to Craig because he was a stiff.

PC was playing blind in the early part of his career.
PC is the best FT shooting big on the team aside from OB.
65% is 65%.

Not sure why you’re still talking about that. It is what it is...basically the same.

They’re both stiffs on offense.
 

timkay99

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#39
Forth was a fine defender and a good dude. But the "he was an excellent screener" compliment always cracks me up, it's like the "he's a great blocker" praise for the wide receiver who can't catch the ball or get open. It's another way of saying 'this kid's really not so good at the game, but he's nice people and we shouldn't crap on him, so here's something he does well.'
Man, in this offense we would kill for just an average screener. Forth screening in this offense would actually let our guys turn the corner consistently.

I think this offense would look significantly better with a 5 that can actually set a good screen consistently w/ size.

But, to the OP, Forth wins a pick-up game. He shot 1 three in his Cuse career, so he's comfortable launching from deep since neither one of them can dribble.
 

jgeorge322

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#40
i was going to point out that chewy's numbers last year are actually considerably better than forth's senior year, aside from turnovers. more points, better percentage, way more rebounds, way more block shots... then i realized chewy had almost double the minutes. someone should normalize those for us for steals blocks and to's. looks pretty close.
 

Capt. Tuttle

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#41
It is amazing the number of people here who are basketball "experts" who continually under value the contribution and abilities of Forth.
Guy was very key, and rarely tried to play outside of his role, despite ability to do so. (I think it was the Mizzou game where he played so well.)
Edit. I am good. Scored 18 vs Missouri. 7-10 from the floor. 4-4 from the line.
 
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#43
i think a melo v billy owens comparo would have a lot more positives.
Many board members lately cry "We can't win big with PC."

My assertion is that PC is at least as effective as CF;
And if we can win an NC with CF, we can win with PC.

More accurately, PC won't be the reason we do not win a National Championship this year.
We have inconsistency issues up and down the roster but we are more forgiving of other team members.
 

OrangeDW

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#44
Many board members lately cry "We can't win big with PC."

My assertion is that PC is at least as effective as CF;
And if we can win an NC with CF, we can win with PC.

More accurately, PC won't be the reason we do not win a National Championship this year.
We have inconsistency issues up and down the roster but we are more forgiving of other team members.
You can win with a lot of guys as your 7th/8th best player when you have an NBA Hall of famer and another 10 year NBA veteran.

When you don’t have the same top level talent as your best players, you need a more balanced team. For example, 2010 had a chance at an NC with only one NBA veteran level guy...but there were no weak spots in the rotation.
 
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#45
We don’t have a trophy in 2003 without Forth. He had his best game of the season in NO on the night we needed every point. .
Craig was efficient shooting 3 of 4
His FT defense was outstanding.
But Kansas bigs crushed us in rebounds and scoring.

su_vs_kansas_2003_title_game_box_score.jpg
 
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#46
You can win with a lot of guys as your 7th/8th best player when you have an NBA Hall of famer and another 10 year NBA veteran.
.
Agree that this year's team is not at same talent level as 2003.

Assertion is that PC is not any more of a weak link than CF was even though popular opinion seems to be swinging that way.
 
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#49
chukwu or danny devito? is a better question, in my humble opinion - makes you think more...

or, no - 2019 jim boeheim @ center or 2019 chukwu? that's a tough one!

before you blow that off - at least jim could catch the ball (i'm assuming)
 
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