Practice versus games

[OmahaCuse]

Everyone knows some guys are gamers and can play on adrenalin, under different conditions against different players. It seems like Jesse would not be a great practice player as he is playing shorter guys who know all his tendencies, strengths and weaknesses. Hard to simulate practice versus games against new opponents. Think we see this with QBs who are great in practice but can't play in games. Could be why Jessie is not great in practice

 

[two3zone]

Everyone knows some guys are gamers and can play on adrenalin, under different conditions against different players. It seems like Jesse would not be a great practice player as he is playing shorter guys who know all his tendencies, strengths and weaknesses. Hard to simulate practice versus games against new opponents. Think we see this with QBs who are great in practice but can't play in games. Could be why Jessie is not great in practice

This practice thing is so blown out of proportion. Scoop flat out said that Dion didn’t allow Triche to score for a month and he still never started a game. I chalk the practice talk up to “JB says things”.

 

[rrlbees]

This practice thing is so blown out of proportion. Scoop flat out said that Dion didn’t allow Triche to score for a month and he still never started a game. I chalk the practice talk up to “JB says things”.

lol. And I don’t believe that story for a minute.

 

[maxxyz]

lol. And I don’t believe that story for a minute.

Me neither. That's a cousin talking up his cousin. These stories grow like weeds.

 

[upperdeck]

Its not also about how well you play in practice its often about how hard you play and how much you listen.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Personally, it would seem to me you always want guys that would potentially play a meaningful role at all to get some live action, if for no other reason so that you can get tape on the player against opponents. Then you can give real feedback on where they could improve, and what they did well and should keep doing.

 

[Briancuse]

Wasn't Joe Montana awful in practice?

 

[Scooch]

I find the whole “gamers” concept to almost always be nonsense. There is an immensely tight correlation between being good in practice and being good in a game.

So I find it completely logical that any coach would not want to give meaningful time to a player that is subpar in practice. Not only does it mean that player is highly likely to stink in a game, it’s also a lousy message to send to the team.

The complicating factor in terms of SU basketball, is that I’m not sure I believe JB’s public pronouncements about the quality of his players practice habits. JB says things.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

lol. And I don’t believe that story for a minute.

Well, it was February, so it was a short month.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Wasn't Joe Montana awful in practice?

My St John’s friend used to tell me a story about seeing Pearl in high school, and how in the warmup lines, Pearl looked like he was so uncoordinated and couldn’t even make a layup—clanging shots off the bottom of the backboard. And then in the game, he was Pearl. I always regarded that as somewhat of an exaggeration, but I can believe Pearl either dogged it or was just messin’ with some folks.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I find the whole “gamers” concept to almost always be nonsense. There is an immensely tight correlation between being good in practice and being good in a game.

So I find it completely logical that any coach would not want to give meaningful time to a player that is subpar in practice. Not only does it mean that player is highly likely to stink in a game, it’s also a lousy message to send to the team.

The complicating factor in terms of SU basketball, is that I’m not sure I believe JB’s public pronouncements about the quality of his players practice habits. JB says things.

I agree it's overblown, and we joke about it, but the minutes distribution suggests a disparity in practice performance that boggles the mind and presents a statistical absurdity.

Assuming that how players do in practice is what truly does dictate playing time.

 

[Newhouser]

This practice thing is so blown out of proportion. Scoop flat out said that Dion didn’t allow Triche to score for a month and he still never started a game. I chalk the practice talk up to “JB says things”.

I chalk that story up to Scoop days things. However I agree with your point.

 

[orangepassion]

This is required for any thread of this type

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

I chalk that story up to Scoop days things. However I agree with your point.

Actually, Scoop’s uncle told that story in the dining hall to distract people.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

JB has said, and I believe more than once, that David Johnson did a 360 dunk from the FT line in practice one day: JB immediately ended practice.
IDK that such a thing would be humanly possible.

 

[OmahaCuse]

I find the whole “gamers” concept to almost always be nonsense. There is an immensely tight correlation between being good in practice and being good in a game.

So I find it completely logical that any coach would not want to give meaningful time to a player that is subpar in practice. Not only does it mean that player is highly likely to stink in a game, it’s also a lousy message to send to the team.

The complicating factor in terms of SU basketball, is that I’m not sure I believe JB’s public pronouncements about the quality of his players practice habits. JB says things.

Not so sure, some guys dont get motivated by practice saw it in high school sports and college baseball. Some guys go hard all the time and what they do in practice is the same as the game. Playing golf can tell you many guys play way better if a “game” is on. Competition versus practice.

 

[dasher]

Not so sure, some guys dont get motivated by practice saw it in high school sports and college baseball. Some guys go hard all the time and what they do in practice is the same as the game. Playing golf can tell you many guys play way better if a “game” is on. Competition versus practice.

That is fine. But I play the guys that give it to me 100% of the time. Practice included.

 

[CU44SE]

That is fine. But I play the guys that give it to me 100% of the time. Practice included.

I understand what your saying. But sometimes the guys that are more talented get bored in practice and don’t need to go 100%. Talent always wins out.

 

[CuseChat23]

I don't know if any of us can figure out what JB was telling us compared to what we were seeing with our own eyes. He continued to tell us that Richmond was not ready when every one of us and every ESPN announcer questioned why this kid was not playing more. Then he was not in good enough condition to play more than 20 minutes? Yesterday he didn't take him out until the kid couldn't walk on his banged up knee. Same with Jesse he is not ready but to me he sure looks like he is getting much better to me and the live game action is maybe one of the keys to his development. Kinda like playing zone 100% of the time wether it's working or not. I stopped trying to figure the guy out because none of will.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I chalk that story up to Scoop days things. However I agree with your point.

If anyone should have come off the bench in that team it should have been Scoop anyway.

 

[dasher]

I understand what your saying. But sometimes the guys that are more talented get bored in practice and don’t need to go 100%. Talent always wins out.

if you have the talent and are not playing because you don't give it in practice, and you still don't give it in practice, there is something mentally wrong with you.

 

[Cusefan0307]

While I agree with the overall fact that guys need minutes I do think starting sometimes is overrated. There’s plenty of examples of guys who’ve come off the bench to for strategic reason to stagger lineups at both the college and pro level.

 

[CousCuse]

Edwards hasn't played much in games until yesterday and when he did play, he looked marginal. So when he showed up big against UNC you would have to attribute that to practice and getting coached up and NOT from getting some game PT. So the playing time argument does not hold water.

 

[SBU72]

So freshman comes in and doesn't show much in practice, a coach then is suppose to play the kid in real games because why? And suppose the kid does get in for few minutes and looks bad? The coach is suppose to let that go? Practice has GOT to mean something.

Everyone knows some guys are gamers and can play on adrenalin, under different conditions against different players. It seems like Jesse would not be a great practice player as he is playing shorter guys who know all his tendencies, strengths and weaknesses. Hard to simulate practice versus games against new opponents. Think we see this with QBs who are great in practice but can't play in games. Could be why Jessie is not great in practice

 

[CU44SE]

if you have the talent and are not playing because you don't give it in practice, and you still don't give it in practice, there is something mentally wrong with you.

The same could be said for playing guys that try hard all the time but have a mental block and can not compete in high pressure situations right?

Bottom line is I think you can look at it both ways. There are some players that just do not get amped up about practice. Repetitive, going up against the same guys, there is not winner or loser, nothing to push you. It takes a lot of self motivation to go hard in practice.

It is easy to get that motivation in a game. You are competing against other players, to win (some people hate losing, in front of fans, there is a lot of adrenaline to push you and get you going. You don’t need to create that self motivation.

The he opposite can also be said for some players. They can self motivate and go harder then everyone at practice. But ultimately practice doesn’t matter so they play free’er. They don’t have that pressure of winning and losing or the crowd going bonkers or silent. They have none of that pressure going against them and it is easy to perform without any of these distractions. These same players could absolutely fold in game situations. The pressure feels overwhelming. They are constantly tense, do not make the proper decisions. Thinking too much when they shoot which affects there release.

Really people can spin this every which way and everyone will believe they are right. I can honestly say that I have seen every single one of these types of players growing up playing sports and watching sports. I may not see practice but you hear someone is lightning it up in practice or doing well in preseason and then it never transfers over to the games. Or the guy that doesn’t practice well that shines when he gets playing time. Bottom line is every player is different and there are players that are poor practicers no matter what buttons you push (for example Allen iverson). Not everyone is an Allen iverson obviously, but as I said. There is examples of every type of these players.