Private School Attendance Numbers

[DownTheField]

I don't believe that Miami number at all. I lived in South Florida for a bit and had Miami season tickets in '09 (they have the $100 welfare tickets too) and other than the game against Oklahoma, the place was never very full. I have a picture that I'll try to find of the crowd right before the start of the Clemson game. There might have been 10k in the seats, and that was supposed to be a pretty big game.

Here it is. 10 minutes before the game and Miami was ranked #8 playing against a Clemson team with CJ Spiller that finished 9-5 and won the ACC Atlantic division. It ended up being a great game with Clemson winning in 3 OT. Maybe it really is just a private school thing...

 

[OrangeCrush22]

Temple is a public school.

 

[DaveR52]

For those who think there is nothing wrong with the community support here, and equally important student support, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. There have been recruits visit here and go on tours where the student tour leader tells them, 'Oh, no one goes to football games.' End of story for those recruits. When it comes to recruiting blue-chippers, it is a huge barrier.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

For those who think there is nothing wrong with the community support here, and equally important student support, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. There have been recruits visit here and go on tours where the student tour leader tells them, 'Oh, no one goes to football games.' End of story for those recruits. When it comes to recruiting blue-chippers, it is a huge barrier.

Again Dave, I agree with you but Syracuse has never hauled in a large amount of bluechippers so same old same old

 

[All4SU]

So Northwestern averages 36000 despite a huge Chicago market and a B10 schedule?

 

[SmilinBob]

Who's saying a large amount of blue chippers and we all know that the basketball team does so why not the football team? I just want Marrone to be able to recruit a decent amount of kids he has targeted and really wants for this program, not every one but a decent amount and especially kids from NY. I think the fans play a big part in that and can always help.

The past is the past and I'd like to see the crowd learn from that. Everyone could see that Jake and P were on cruise control and Shaws comments did not help at all. Then we were g-robbed and it hit rock bottom. I really don't think it's asking for the world to have at least 45K people at every game and too many just put up excuses why they don't go. SU can not play 12 AQ teams each year and flourish but yet when they play a Maine or RI people complain that it's not an attractive enough team to watch and even when an ECU or Toledo are on the schedule the names just don't bring the fans like the Oklahoma or Tennessee's would but ask anyone that knows football and they'll tell you those ECU and Toledo teams are pretty tough teams.

I understand people don't want to go for whatever reason and it may just be me but don't complain when SU just misses with top recruits or losses at home if you're not there giving them the support they deserve. You just can't have it both ways, one helps the other.

 

[SmilinBob]

So Northwestern averages 36000 despite a huge Chicago market and a B10 schedule?

Schools in NFL markets often struggle to draw. Also, NW has a losing tradition (yes they are greatly improved) and that is a tough thing to get over.

 

[Millhouse]

Just doing 2010 because I don't wanna do that much work, but here are the attendance numbers for private schools (I included the academies). Capacity is in parentheses.

Notre Dame - 80,795 (80,795, 100%)
USC - 79,907 (92,572, 86%)
BYU - 61,381 (64,045, 96%)
Miami - 52,575 (76,500, 69%)
TCU - 42,466 (44,088, 96%)
Air Force - 40,093 (52,480, 76%)
Syracuse - 40,064 (49,250, 81%)
Baylor - 40,043 (50,000, 80%)
Stanford - 40,042 (50,000, 80%)
Boston College - 38,369 (44,500, 86%)
Northwestern - 36,449 (47,130, 77%)
Vanderbilt - 33,269 (39,790, 84%)
Navy - 32,653 (34,000, 96%)
Army - 31,667 (40,000, 79%)
Wake Forest - 30,474 (31,500, 97%)
Duke - 28,750 (33,941, 85%)
Rice - 25,571 (70,000, 37%)
SMU - 23,515 (32,000, 73%)
Tulane - 23,220 (69,703, 33%)
Temple - 20,515 (68,532, 30%)
Tulsa - 20,379 (30,000 68%)

I think Rice is only expandable to 70000. They're at 50000

Only reason I mention it is because I was checking on capacities for the non-pro stadiums on that list.

Among teams at non pro stadiums, we're 7th in capacity (3rd through 10th bunched between 49 and 52) and 5th in attendance (7rd through 7th are pretty much tied). We're only far behind ND and BYU in attendance (edit TCU too). Air Force has us by less than 30 people. Obviously attendance numbers aren't perfect, we all had our doubts about people actually in seats recently

It's pretty interesting how a lot of these stadiums are just about the right size.

Thanks for this post

 

[OrangeMojo]

Just doing 2010 because I don't wanna do that much work, but here are the attendance numbers for private schools (I included the academies). Capacity is in parentheses.

Notre Dame - 80,795 (80,795, 100%)
USC - 79,907 (92,572, 86%)
BYU - 61,381 (64,045, 96%)
Miami - 52,575 (76,500, 69%)
TCU - 42,466 (44,088, 96%)
Air Force - 40,093 (52,480, 76%)
Syracuse - 40,064 (49,250, 81%)
Baylor - 40,043 (50,000, 80%)
Stanford - 40,042 (50,000, 80%)
Boston College - 38,369 (44,500, 86%)
Northwestern - 36,449 (47,130, 77%)
Vanderbilt - 33,269 (39,790, 84%)
Navy - 32,653 (34,000, 96%)
Army - 31,667 (40,000, 79%)
Wake Forest - 30,474 (31,500, 97%)
Duke - 28,750 (33,941, 85%)
Rice - 25,571 (70,000, 37%)
SMU - 23,515 (32,000, 73%)
Tulane - 23,220 (69,703, 33%)
Temple - 20,515 (68,532, 30%)
Tulsa - 20,379 (30,000 68%)

I wonder what USC was drawing after several down years before Pete Carroll got there - bet it was much lower. And I believe Stanford is in the process of trying to expand their stadium - or did they give up on that due to the environmentalists?

 

[Tornado91]

Not sure if Stanford is trying to expand. In 2005, they demolished their antiquated 85,000 seat stadium and rebuilt it as a more intimate, modern 50,000 seat facility. Maybe their recent success increased attendance.

 

[Millhouse]

For those who think there is nothing wrong with the community support here, and equally important student support, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. There have been recruits visit here and go on tours where the student tour leader tells them, 'Oh, no one goes to football games.' End of story for those recruits. When it comes to recruiting blue-chippers, it is a huge barrier.

That's a problem with the knucklehead tour leader, not the community support. we could look at the numbers or we could go by what some work study nerd says

 

[SmilinBob]

That's a problem with the knucklehead tour leader, not the community support. we could look at the numbers or we could go by what some work study nerd says

But that's the perception of how SU attendance is and that's something we can control. We can't make the plays or coach the team, although many think they can do it better on message boards, but we can support the team.

 

[Moontan]

Thanks for the info.
I've updated my Private Colleges and Universities Fielding Division 1A Football Teams page reflecting these numbers.

It's interesting to note that a few more schools have their reduced stadium capacity.
With the addition of TCU next year, there will be 12 private BCS programs.
Villanova would make 13. BYU to the Big XII would get it to 14.

 

[BlackKnight76]

I think Rice is only expandable to 70000. They're at 50000

Only reason I mention it is because I was checking on capacities for the non-pro stadiums on that list.

Among teams at non pro stadiums, we're 7th in capacity (3rd through 10th bunched between 49 and 52) and 5th in attendance (7rd through 7th are pretty much tied). We're only far behind ND and BYU in attendance (edit TCU too). Air Force has us by less than 30 people. Obviously attendance numbers aren't perfect, we all had our doubts about people actually in seats recently

It's pretty interesting how a lot of these stadiums are just about the right size.

Thanks for this post

Rice has tarps covering seats, a la the Florida Marlins. I left the number at 70k because if they could get that, obviously those seats would be available.

Good catch on Temple whoever that was above.

 

[BlackKnight76]

For those who think there is nothing wrong with the community support here, and equally important student support, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. There have been recruits visit here and go on tours where the student tour leader tells them, 'Oh, no one goes to football games.' End of story for those recruits. When it comes to recruiting blue-chippers, it is a huge barrier.

I completely agree that there's a problem, if only evidenced by the fact that we've been able to average like 45k in the past. I just wanted to see what the situation was with other schools. The ones who do markedly better than us are those with Cult-like religious followings (ND/BYU), and have had great success on the field (USC/TCU).

That tour guide thing pisses me off. I might actually send an e-mail to whoever runs the U100 and complain about that. The process to become a member of that group is really tedious, and aims to get some of our best students giving those tours, so if they're hurting our school in some way (even if they don't realize it), that's bullshit.

 

[Millhouse]

Rice has tarps covering seats, a la the Florida Marlins. I left the number at 70k because if they could get that, obviously those seats would be available.

Good catch on Temple whoever that was above.

Ha, yeah, i thought expandable meant building stuff, not removing garbage bags. Sorry about that. I don't know much about rice aside from their huge endowment, according to CTO.

 

[BlackKnight76]

Ha, yeah, i thought expandable meant building stuff, not removing garbage bags. Sorry about that. I don't know much about rice aside from their huge endowment, according to CTO.

I only found that out when finding info for this post. I was shocked to see 70k, then thought it was funny that they reduce it to like 45k and only fill half of that.

They're not very good.

 

[All4SU]

Schools in NFL markets often struggle to draw. Also, NW has a losing tradition (yes they are greatly improved) and that is a tough thing to get over.

I only point it out because many folks here think that a Big10 schedule is the answer to our attendance problems. If Northwestern can't do it in Chicago, with Ohio State, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin et al, who bring scads of fans to away games, you've got to wonder if it makes that big of a difference. The Wildcat fan support must be very light if 8,000 of those 36,000 fans are visiting fans.

 

[BlackKnight76]

I only point it out because many folks here think that a Big10 schedule is the answer to our attendance problems. If Northwestern can't do it in Chicago, with Ohio State, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin et al, who bring scads of fans to away games, you've got to wonder if it makes that big of a difference. The Wildcat fan support must be very light if 8,000 of those 36,000 fans are visiting fans.

Northwestern is a smaller school than SU as well, which doesn't help. They're just under 8500 undergrads now, while SU has grown a ton just since I've been here. We eclipsed 14k this year I believe (for better or worse).

 

[SmilinBob]

I only point it out because many folks here think that a Big10 schedule is the answer to our attendance problems. If Northwestern can't do it in Chicago, with Ohio State, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin et al, who bring scads of fans to away games, you've got to wonder if it makes that big of a difference. The Wildcat fan support must be very light if 8,000 of those 36,000 fans are visiting fans.

Gotcha.

 

[All4SU]

Northwestern is a smaller school than SU as well, which doesn't help. They're just under 8500 undergrads now, while SU has grown a ton just since I've been here. We eclipsed 14k this year I believe (for better or worse).

Even still... they are in a HUGE market compared to Syracuse. Even if it is a pro town, and even if their alumni output is smaller than ours, their potential fan base is significantly larger than ours, and they are geographically closer to a number of those large school opponents who bring tons of fans.

 

[BlackKnight76]

Even still... they are in a HUGE market compared to Syracuse. Even if it is a pro town, and even if their alumni output is smaller than ours, their potential fan base is significantly larger than ours, and they are geographically closer to a number of those large school opponents who bring tons of fans.

Absolutely

 

[OttoMets]

Even still... they are in a HUGE market compared to Syracuse. Even if it is a pro town, and even if their alumni output is smaller than ours, their potential fan base is significantly larger than ours, and they are geographically closer to a number of those large school opponents who bring tons of fans.

And I wouldn't be surprised if Chicago has significantly more Northwestern alumni than Syracuse has Syracuse alumni - seems like the kind of town where more young grads stick around and look for jobs.

This is why I don't see the Big Ten as any kind of panacea; we'll be an academically weaker - and more geographically distant - Northwestern. Albeit with a much stronger football tradition.

 

[Moontan]

I've updated my Private Colleges and Universities Fielding Division 1A Football Teams page reflecting these numbers.

I've now added endowment info as well.
I had some stuff ready as part of Big East expansion research that I did a little while ago.

Syracuse is near the bottom of the endowment race when it come to this category of schools. There are seven schools with sub-$1B endowments (as of 2010). All of these are dwarfed by Stanford's endowment.

 

[BlackKnight76]

I've now added endowment info as well.
I had some stuff ready as part of Big East expansion research that I did a little while ago.

Syracuse is near the bottom of the endowment race when it come to this category of schools. There are seven schools with sub-$1B endowments (as of 2010). All of these are dwarfed by Stanford's endowment.

We got crushed when the recession hit IIRC.