Question about recruiting ethics

[Caboose]

In the last minute, Coach K dropped in and stole Jordan Tucker. Many thought that was unbecoming of coach K- to swoop in and "steal" a recruit like that, especially since he's supposedly friends w JB. Calipari and WW Wes swooping in and doing their illegal thing on QG. Now you have this Hopkins situation which has more to it, a former coach who did everything he could to recruit this kid and bring him to Syracuse. Fast forward 3-4 years, he Iands a different job and uses his personal influence w the kid to woo him over to UW. I want to be clear here... I'm not whining I'm not b!tching, just curious what ppl here think. Was what Hopkins did a slight to Syracuse fans, JB and his staff and the program? Or is this an "all's fair in love and war" situation? Personally I think Hopkins sold him on our program only to use his personal influence and possibly some Syracuse pot-shots to get him to come there. I'm a bit perturbed by this I'll admit.

 

[orange79]

Nobody 'swooped in'.

We were never the favorite.

 

[reedny]

He didn't say Hop swooped in. He said K/PP swooped in, and Hop used his "personal influence" at SU - over time - to talk the kid into going out west. It could have been worse - a bag of $ like Bazely. Or the silly Duh-k oversell like Tucker. At least this was OOC (waaaaayyy OOC). Part of it - maybe all of it - is that the kid liked Hop or others at W. That's how the cookie crumbles sometimes. I'll admit it does feel a bit weird to have someone use his position at SU to leverage a recruit. But I'm sure it's not the first or last time for that. BOL. OOS OOM.

 

[Tobias Funke]

He didn't say Hop swooped in. He said K swooped in, and Hop used his position at SU to talk the kid- over time - into going out west. It could have been worse - a bag of $ like Bazely. Or the silly Duh-k oversell like Tucker. At least this was OOC (waaaaayyy OOC). Part of it - maybe all of it - is that the kid liked Hop or others at W. That's how the cookie crumbles sometimes. I'll admit it does feel a bit weird to have someone who forged a relationship with a recruit at (using) SU leveraging a recruit away. But I'm sure it's not the first or last time for that. BOL. OOS OOM.

To me it is no different than being in Sales. If you are working a client and you change companies provided that company didn’t sign a contract with you they are free game. It may feel icky but in reality he probably sold IS in playing for him as head coach of Syracuse since that was the expectation. Same coach different venue.

 

[reedny]

To me it is no different than being in Sales. If you are working a client and you change companies provided that company didn’t sign a contract with you they are free game. It may feel icky but in reality he probably sold IS in playing for him as head coach of Syracuse since that was the expectation. Same coach different venue.

I agree with both points: 1) he built a relationship and used it at another venue (which happens); and 2) it feels "icky" .. because it really stung. I support Hop, sure. But not against SU, and certainly not at this level of cost.

 

[Caboose]

A friend of mine helped me understand something I missed. SU screwed Hopkins and he has every right to do what he did. I guess I didn't see it that way. Maybe he was justified?

 

[PauliePeppas]

Considering SU finished about 4th on his list I cant be mad at all

 

[Caboose]

Considering SU finished about 4th on his list I cant be mad at all

I heard it was between Cuse and UW. Cuse supposedly supplanted MSU according to an MSU insider and he wasn't going to Duke because of their situation next year.

 

[Fat tire 13]

In a couple years this will be a moot point, as anyone who falls under the Hopkins/Cuse combo will be long past college age. This one doesn't really bother me, and the sales analogy is fitting. The guy liked Hop, and is going to follow him. It was more about the person than the school. The Duke/UK/etc swooping in last minute bothers me 10x more. But yes it is a dirty business, and doesn't reward anyone who plays fair

 

[Caboose]

In a couple years this will be a moot point, as anyone who falls under the Hopkins/Cuse combo will be long past college age. This one doesn't really bother me, and the sales analogy is fitting. The guy liked Hop, and is going to follow him. It was more about the person than the school. The Duke/UK/etc swooping in last minute bothers me 10x more. But yes it is a dirty business, and doesn't reward anyone who plays fair

This is the perspective I'm starting to lean toward more and more.

 

[AZOrange]

A friend of mine helped me understand something I missed. SU screwed Hopkins and he has every right to do what he did. I guess I didn't see it that way. Maybe he was justified?

SU didn’t screw Hopkins. That’s the dumbest drivel posted on these boards.

 

[Cuseball]

SU didn’t screw Hopkins. That’s the dumbest drivel posted on these boards.

Wow, there is so much dumb drivel on these boards this would really be something

Cuse!

 

[Trueblue25]

At no point were we favorites. Glad he’s going to the pac rather than MSU or Duke

 

[Caboose]

SU didn’t screw Hopkins. That’s the dumbest drivel posted on these boards.

Lol dumb. Nah, Hop wasn't given a timetable, stayed here, bided his time, then suddenly was told nevermind. The fact that you completely dismiss that whole scenario as dumb shows which post is dumb. Try staying somewhere for a couple years after you're promised a promotion only to be told sorry, you get nothing. Let me know how you feel after that.

 

[AZOrange]

Lol dumb. Nah, Hop wasn't given a timetable, stayed here, bided his time, then suddenly was told nevermind. The fact that you completely dismiss that whole scenario as dumb shows which post is dumb. Try staying somewhere for a couple years after you're promised a promotion only to be told sorry, you get nothing. Let me know how you feel after that.

Except for the fact that none of what you said is true about what happened. Like I said...

 

[cuse10]

Ethics in recruiting don't exist. Some people get paid. Some people's parents are promised jobs. Some people's parents are taking money while in high school and have to hold their end of the deal. Nothing shocks me, nor should it you. It all comes out in the end.

 

[GoCuse14]

At no point were we favorites. Glad he’s going to the pac rather than MSU or Duke

Thats funny...didn't insiders just say yesterday that we were the favorites after the visit? When did that narrative change?

 

[GoCuse14]

SU didn’t screw Hopkins. That’s the dumbest drivel posted on these boards.

Maybe "screwing him" isn't necessarily the most accurate term...and maybe it was more JB, than it was Cuse. But, I mean...how long was he the "head coach in waiting"? How many opportunities were turned away due to him believing he was the next head coach at Syracuse? I am not bitter and doubt that Hop is, and dont care so much...just playing devils advocate a little.

 

[Trueblue25]

Thats funny...didn't insiders just say yesterday that we were the favorites after the visit? When did that narrative change?

When was that said? I never heard anything better than “50/50 at the very best”

 

[GoCuse14]

When was that said? I never heard anything better than “50/50 at the very best”

I will see if I have the time to go back and look but it was in the Zay thread...but I am pretty sure it was said yesterday that Cuse was the favorite after his visit and that we just couldn't close.

 

[orangecuse]

To me it is no different than being in Sales. If you are working a client and you change companies provided that company didn’t sign a contract with you they are free game. It may feel icky but in reality he probably sold IS in playing for him as head coach of Syracuse since that was the expectation. Same coach different venue.

Except that in your persuasion you fooled your client to 'buy in' that the product itself (UW & the PAC12) that your new employer is selling was comparable to the quality of SU's program & the ACC.

 

[AZOrange]

Maybe "screwing him" isn't necessarily the most accurate term...and maybe it was more JB, than it was Cuse. But, I mean...how long was he the "head coach in waiting"? How many opportunities were turned away due to him believing he was the next head coach at Syracuse? I am not bitter and doubt that Hop is, and dont care so much...just playing devils advocate a little.

JB was set to retire. Mike got a job offer he felt he couldn’t pass up and took it. JB was then extended. JB and JW were very clear about the timeline with Hop. He had different plans. The rest are just misstatements of what happened

 

[GoCuse14]

JB was set to retire. Mike got a job offer he felt he couldn’t pass up and took it. JB was then extended. JB and JW were very clear about the timeline with Hop. He had different plans. The rest are just misstatements of what happened

I guess I am foggy on the time line then for sure. I thought that JB decided to stay and thats when Hop went to Wash.

 

[AZOrange]

I guess I am foggy on the time line then for sure. I thought that JB decided to stay and thats when Hop went to Wash.

Jim Boeheim gets extension to stay as Syracuse basketball coach beyond 2017-18 season

 

[Caboose]

Except for the fact that none of what you said is true about what happened. Like I said...

Hop turned down USC and probably other jobs because he liked Lights on the Lake, Dinosaur Bbq and Winterfest so much.