Secondary is a hot mess

[Crusty]

I actually believe it is the scheme more than the players. We have good athletes back there they just seem to be confused and/or playing soft/off the receiver. Bend don't break. In SS agressive blitzing scheme you cannot have the corners and safeties playing soft (off 8-10 yds) because they are almost always bringing the weak side LB up to the line and leaving the middle or short route exposed. #15 and #80 for WF killed us today.

To some extent


Sure, every scheme is vulnerable to something.

 

[tep624]

Where are those posters who, post Rhode Island, proclaimed that this defense is amazing?! Rhode Island! That being said, Wake clearly has a few playmakers on offense. Their frosh RB and a couple of their receivers are NICE.

Probably waiting until the game is actually over before making proclamations so they don't look like clowns.

Exhibit A why I don't post during games.

 

[longtimefan]

We can agree to disagree. He threw across his body, without much zip, and Estime came back for the ball. Missed tackle. A better corner picks that off.

I saw it differently.

Dungey side-armed the pass with more than a little zip. In fact, I think the reason the DB played the ball the way he did is that he misjudged just how quickly the ball was getting to Estime.

 

[Toga]

I saw it differently.

Dungey side-armed the pass with more than a little zip. In fact, I think the reason the DB played the ball the way he did is that he misjudged just how quickly the ball was getting to Estime.

The pass to Ish also got there in a hurry.

 

[JSOrange97]

When? I saw Rodney Williams get beat over the top on that first td. They were playing cover 2. Whig made a nice break on one throw. Easily or best cb today.

I thought he got beat on at least the first TD and then all game he was giving way too much of a cushion. I'll have to look at the game again on replay, but in person it looked like Whigham was not having his best day out there.

 

[GoSU96]

There is serious work to be done in the secondary. I thought the safeties played especially poorly today and I was falbergated that they and the CB's kept giving WF that stupid 6-10 yd. up and out route over and over and over. I thought Williams was out of position several times and Scissum was really bad. Cordy can play but bit on the play fake too much and plays off of the receiver. Too much standing around and watching instead of pressing, reacting to the play and closing, hitting and tackling the receiver. We are really going to struggle against accurate throwers like the UVA QB. I watched them play ND and he is very good. This group is young but they are going to have to be coached up to play with the big boy or else.

You think it's the players that determine how deep they play? Really?

They play zone behind their pressures for a reason.

And for all the yards and all the completions wake still only ended up with 17.

Got beat over the top once.

Giving up a lot of yards in the air is nothing new, and when they did get to the QB good things happened.

And the run defense was lights out.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

You think it's the players that determine how deep they play? Really?

They play zone behind their pressures for a reason.

And for all the yards and all the completions wake still only ended up with 17.

Got beat over the top once.

Giving up a lot of yards in the air is nothing new, and when they did get to the QB good things happened.

And the run defense was lights out.

It's pretty much who we are and have been. Stop run, pressure qb, if we don't get pressure we have problems. LAst year we were in pretty good shape because Reddish had just a tremendous year.

 

[GoSU96]

It's pretty much who we are and have been. Stop run, pressure qb, if we don't get pressure we have problems. LAst year we were in pretty good shape because Reddish had just a tremendous year.

Yep, its the basic design of the defense. Stop the run, get the other team behind the sticks, and make a play on third down eventually.

 

[weedsportwarriors]

Conversely, the front 7 are tres impressive.

This is the key to our defense. If we can pressure the QB it makes up for the play of the secondary. This is the reason why we ruled the second half.

 

[Crusty]

You think it's the players that determine how deep they play? Really?

They play zone behind their pressures for a reason.

And for all the yards and all the completions wake still only ended up with 17.

Got beat over the top once.

Giving up a lot of yards in the air is nothing new, and when they did get to the QB good things happened.

And the run defense was lights out.

Of course you're right, but just we have to play zone correctly. Corey makes a lot of mistakes, but he is a true soph so it is understandable. However, Whigham screws up more than he should at this stage. We'll get better as the season progresses, but we need to get used to other coaches taking what we give them. It's nerve racking to be sure.

 

[Finwad32]

Our coach is known for playing Cover 0 and Pressing in the Red Zone. Playing off the WR's everywhere else is a mechanism for the unique pressure we try to bring. If our blitzes, which are notorious for being crazy and non typical, don't reach the QB along with our front 4 the secondary is playing soft so as to not get beat over the top in 1-on-1 situations.

Sometimes you're willing to give up a medium level pass completion to risk bringing your blitz. Risk/reward, it's a gamble.

 

[44oranges]

Is there something about how the secondary is setup that allows for Wolford to make a lot of completions?
I don't know what I'm talking about here - just wondering if the defensive scheme provides the opportunity for these completions.

yes, I beleive it is for some reason the coaches strategy.

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

Yep, its the basic design of the defense. Stop the run, get the other team behind the sticks, and make a play on third down eventually.

I think you are right. It's tough to watch sometimes though. We make every team's quarterback look like Peyton Manning. And its exaggerated in today's game with all the short quick hitters. I think I have been hoping that with better talent in the secondary, we would tighten up a bit. Apparently that is not the case.

 

[RICuse44]

The secondary starts a redshirt sophomore (Winfield), a redshirt freshman (Williams), and a true sophomore (Cordy). Whig and Morgan are the only two with game experience. Scissum is the third safety and is seeing his first meaningful experience.

I think we are seeing glimpses. Good breaks by Whig and Winfield to deflect balls. Plus wake isn't that bad- wolford has some brass bees and is pretty accurate with a decent deep ball. Add into the fact that we send the house 30-40% of the time and you'll see this outcome. I do expect the unit to improve this year.

 

[Orangello]

You think it's the players that determine how deep they play? Really?

They play zone behind their pressures for a reason.

And for all the yards and all the completions wake still only ended up with 17.

Got beat over the top once.

Giving up a lot of yards in the air is nothing new, and when they did get to the QB good things happened.

And the run defense was lights out.

Where did I say the players determine how deep to play ? Try rereading my post and the follow on post where I very clearly say its the SCHEME more than our athletes. Jeebus.

Giving up a lot of yards in the air is never a good thing. We were lucky they only got 17 points and dodged a bullet today IMHO. You can spin this however you want but the secondary did not play well.

 

[upperdeck]

the long TD was a mistake when both safeties get beat on the same play. sometimes we got beat by a big cushion.. other times the corners just got turned around. thats on technique

 

[GoSU96]

Our coach is known for playing Cover 0 and Pressing in the Red Zone. Playing off the WR's everywhere else is a mechanism for the unique pressure we try to bring. If our blitzes, which are notorious for being crazy and non typical, don't reach the QB along with our front 4 the secondary is playing soft so as to not get beat over the top in 1-on-1 situations.

Sometimes you're willing to give up a medium level pass completion to risk bringing your blitz. Risk/reward, it's a gamble.

You would think after 7 years people would know this.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

You would think after 7 years people would know this.

and after 7 years people may figure that we do give up some big plays on D, we also make a lot. Risk/ reward.

 

[retro44]

I thought Wolford played a great game until we changed our blitzing and brought more pressure. Wolford is going to give other team fits for the rest of the year. He was spot on on most throws.

I am going to watch this kids numbers for the year.He improved a ton from last year,but I still will take Dungey over him.Dungey has so much upside for a freshmen that has got to have other teams thinking about that for the next few years.

 

[Finwad32]

I thought Wolford played a great game until we changed our blitzing and brought more pressure. Wolford is going to give other team fits for the rest of the year. He was spot on on most throws.

I am going to watch this kids numbers for the year.He improved a ton from last year,but I still will take Dungey over him.Dungey has so much upside for a freshmen that has got to have other teams thinking about that for the next few years.

Wolford got banged up in the 3rd. We may have only had 4 sacks, but he got hit a lot. After one hit, it may have even been the roughing the passer, he was noticeably dinged up. After that play, he wasn't the same for the remainder of the game. He started playing a lot more hesitant and got happy feet.

The kid can play though.

 

[Alsacs]

I got no problem with the philosophy but coaches need to coach the secondary to guard the sticks on 3rd down.
On a 3rd and 4 we can't play the CBs with a cushion or hell a 3rd and 11 we and yesterday the Wake WR caught the ball 2 yards and short and we couldn't tackle the guy.

Tackling must improve by these CBs and Safeties.

 

[K Otto XLIV]

This is mostly scheme. Personally I am not a fan of it. In realty it is blitz but don't break. Our coverage is extremely conservative which is why SU is always low on the passer efficiency scale. The long pass plays will more often than not be a player issue where the safeties are caught cheating. The cushions though are all on the scheme. We play a lot of zone which you almost have to do when you have 1 DB and a shaded LB lined up over 3 WR/TEs.

Personally I prefer the Schiano style blitzing D. You will see shorter drives and more turnovers. However you will also concede a lot more big plays. I am willing to risk that for the rewards. The Shafer/Bullough D you will see a lot of long drives. It helps keep the score low but it can hurt field position and momentum. Plus I don't like seeing QBs get into rhythms, especially bad ones.

Our D coaches are good. Our scheme will never cause us to lose games. However IMO the scheme will never be one that can let you be a D first team. This type of D would be a good fit for the McNabb teams but a bad one for the 2001 squad.

 

[Chip]

We are making the bet that VT has made over the years. We'll keep sending people and eventually that wins.

It can be frustrating watching the soft coverage at times. That one throw from Wolford from the opposite hash mark that looked like it was in the air for a week and a half but took Whigham 2 weeks to get there.

Just have to live with that frustration and have faith that the system keeps points off the scoreboard.

 

[TheCusian]

I think you are right. It's tough to watch sometimes though. We make every team's quarterback look like Peyton Manning. And its exaggerated in today's game with all the short quick hitters. I think I have been hoping that with better talent in the secondary, we would tighten up a bit. Apparently that is not the case.

30% scheme 30% inexperience 30% good QB play 10% talent IMHO

 

[PhatOrange]

The corners don't decide how much cushion to give the WR. The coaches do.

I'll tell ya what, Winfield played lights out as the game went on.