So what is up with Lydon?

[FrancoPizza]

If Lydon is hampered by injury then this will be noticeable during the workouts, yes? Let's hope SU makes it to MSG meaning he'll have less time to heal up. Finally, we have an incentive to play these NIT games...

 

[kirbivore]

If Lydon is hampered by injury then this will be noticeable during the workouts, yes? Let's hope SU makes it to MSG meaning he'll have less time to heal up. Finally, we have an incentive to play these NIT games...

 

[br801]

Something you might be overlooking is the difference in defensive attention. Last year, Lydon was cast in a complimentary role and thrived not being the focal point of defensive attention. The offense went through Gbinije, Cooney, and Richardson primarily last year, which enabled Lydon to camp out at the three point line and spot up.

As more of a main cog this year, he's getting more concerted defensive focus, and hasn't been as efficient.

Very similar to what happened with CJ Fair -- who like Lydon, was the ultimate complimentary offensive threat, but struggled as the main guy. Fair had an incredible season in terms of advanced metrics in 2013, when the offense ran through MCW and Triche, but those percentages plummeted the following year when he was the main guy. It wasn't a knock on his talent, it just highlighted that the role he was best suited for was complimentary scorer. Lydon's the same way.

The thing is, he pretty much is the same player he was last year on a per 40 minute basis, with his rebounding and assists numbers up slightly, and his blocked shots down a bit. And if you look at advanced metrics like PER, TS%, eFG% and Win Shares, his numbers are almost identical. And he has accomplished this, as you say, with increased attention from opposing teams, and while dealing with a nagging physical issue. That's why I think much of the criticism he has received for a supposedly "poor" season is off the mark.

Tyler Lydon College Stats | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

 

[RF2044]

The thing is, he pretty much is the same player he was last year on a per 40 minute basis, with his rebounding and assists numbers up slightly, and his blocked shots down a bit. And if you look at advanced metrics like PER, TS%, eFG% and Win Shares, his numbers are almost identical. And he has accomplished this, as you say, with increased attention from opposing teams, and while dealing with a nagging physical issue. That's why I think much of the criticism he has received for a supposedly "poor" season is off the mark.

reference.com/cbb/players/tyler-lydon-1.html

Great data--I'd have expected the numbers to go down more. Presumably, the reason it hasn't dropped off is that he plays within himself. I.E., he doesn't take bad shots, he doesn't try to do too much. Which is why the criticism of him pump faking, etc. is totally off the mark.

He isn't a guy who can create off of the dribble, and he isn't a guy who does a ton of damage inside. He picks his spots. If he was forced to do too much [or if he started taking bad shots just to get the ball up more], his efficiency would plummet, like it did for CJ.

All of which comes back to the original point -- he is what he is, a terrific complimentary player, not a transcendent offensive talent who is going to go high lottery.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Great data--I'd have expected the numbers to go down more. Presumably, the reason it hasn't dropped off is that he plays within himself. I.E., he doesn't take bad shots, he doesn't try to do too much. Which is why the criticism of him pump faking, etc. is totally off the mark.

He isn't a guy who can create off of the dribble, and he isn't a guy who does a ton of damage inside. He picks his spots. If he was forced to do too much [or if he started taking bad shots just to get the ball up more], his efficiency would plummet, like it did for CJ.

All of which comes back to the original point -- he is what he is, a terrific complimentary player, not a transcendent offensive talent who is going to go high lottery.

If we had 5 of him, we'd have the best passing team in the NCAA.

 

[two3zone]

It's amazing the excuses being made for a guy who literally has 5-6 wide open shots a game that he doesn't take. There may be other issues but that's the glaring issue with him this year. I don't think people would complain if he went 2 for 5 from three added onto all his totals the last month or so.

 

[jdubs30]

He was sensational in December...especially against G-town.
Calling for the ball, getting it and delivering.
Shortly thereafter getting him the ball in the post seemed to become a low priority.
If it happened it was an accident.

It does seem though that to play in the NBA he needs to improve his strength, quickness and handle.
And lose the mandatory pump fake.

For some odd reason (at least odd to me) - Lydon and the perimeter guys both were not all on in the same game. It seemed that if Lydon was playing well, we wouldn't get much from the outside - and if AW3/Battle were playin gwell, Lydon won't do much offensively. I don't know if that's because we would lock in on one level or what.

I'd be curious how many games where we had AW3 over 20, Battle/Lydon both over 15 each.

 

[GardenOrange]

I'd say I could count the amount of times Gillon didn't bother even looking towards the basket when Lydon was open/mismatched in good position facing the hoop within 10 feet, but I don't care to count past 50. They aren't excuses, our guard play was very limited, it is what it is.

Say what you want about Frank, but he will look to feed the post and/or Lydon, but too many problems with too many other things I guess

 

[Trueblue25]

Say what you want about Frank, but he will look to feed the post and/or Lydon, but too many problems with too many other things I guess

If we land Ayala for 2017 or, god wills it Waters, Franks as good as gone.

It's infuriating that we've left ourselves this vulnerable.

 

[two3zone]

Last night's quote by Lydon "I love playing with Frank," SU forward Tyler Lydon said. "I love playing with all our guys, but Frank is a great playmaker. He sees the court really well. He's one of those guys that is always trying to make the right play, whether it's getting it to a big or to a guard. He's just trying to make the right play."

tells me everything I need to know about what has been going on this year. He consistently has not been getting the ball this year from Gillon who clearly favors White and Battle over Lydon. Lydon has been so wide open on a number of plays and it must be frustrating for him not to get the ball. Not sure why Gillon would play favorites but it is so obvious to me. Lydon clearly favors Howard. If you don't believe me go back to the games and count how many times they haven't passed Lydon the ball.

What should tell you something are Frank's numbers. Our record when Frank plays more than garbage minutes. His stats against any team that isn't a cupcake.

Dude isn't good.

 

[skurey]

Our player flat out says he likes playing with Frank.

But Frank is disliked by most of the board so clearly the player on the team doesn't know what he's talking about.

Joke posting.

 

[skurey]

Numbers do lie when they aren't framed in the proper context.

 

[orangenirvana]

Not everyone can have the passion and intensity that Jacori Williams for Middle Tennessee has. That kid has no skill but he is all over the floor. This team has no one like that.

 

[Oráiste]

If Lydon is hampered by injury then this will be noticeable during the workouts, yes? Let's hope SU makes it to MSG meaning he'll have less time to heal up. Finally, we have an incentive to play these NIT games...

why don't you just Gillooly him

 

[newmexicuse]

I don't know why, but Tyler seems to be having trouble with his hands and his ball handling.

In terms of his hands there were any number of less than stellar passes that should have been catchable, but instead resulted in TOs. This is ironic because his hands seem to be OK when he rebounds.

His ball handling was always a weakness, but seems to have regressed. He has zero moves to get his own shot off the dribble. Contrast that to White, who can take the two dribble drive and pull up. Why can't Lydon do that ?

I really like a lot of what Lydon does, but it has been a long time since I have watched a Cuse game and not felt that Tyler should have and could have done more.

If he believes he will get drafted in the first round he would be foolish to stay, but if he does go and get drafted I hate to say it, but i see bust written over over. If he wants an NBA career as opposed to an NBA paycheck, he needs to stay and develop some kinds of moves to free himself and also get that pseudo pump fake out of his game.

 

[Oráiste]

Agree. Been disappointing. Lacking stamina for the minutes played perhaps and too many minutes at center, not his position.

He did have a double/double, so a pretty good performance.

I would argue that center is, in fact, his best position. He can't defend on the wing of the zone.

He might need to be a stretch 4 to make it at the next level, but at this level & this system, he's best suited to be a stretch 5

 

[TinyManInside]

Not everyone can have the passion and intensity that Jacori Williams for Middle Tennessee has. That kid has no skill but he is all over the floor. This team has no one like that.

We had a guy like that in Roberson, but Boeheim mentally demolished him.

 

[orangenirvana]

We had a guy like that in Roberson, but Boeheim mentally demolished him.

Roberson would play like that one game and we'd never see it again until three or four games later. Not sure that can be blamed on Boeheim, although I realize that's the board consensus.

 

[Ghost]

We had a guy like that in Roberson, but Boeheim mentally demolished him.

Notably, he seemed a little looser yesterday - maybe he just doesn't care now. He seemed like a Frosh Roberson. lol He's progressed back to being a Freshman!

 

[OrangeDW]

Notably, he seemed a little looser yesterday - maybe he just doesn't care now. He seemed like a Frosh Roberson. lol He's progressed back to being a Freshman!

Roberson's per 40 minute stats were basically the same his entire career. Roughly 10 points and 10 boards per 40 all 4 years. Blocks are at their highest this year.

FG% went up every year while attempts went down, FT% went down every year. Maybe he lost confidence in his shot (that was never good) because of Boeheim but his overall play didn't change much. He's always been a pretty good rebounder and defender who can't do much on offense outside of use his athleticism and finish around the rim. His numbers are down this year mainly because he played less...because Boeheim likes Thompson's scoring.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

What should tell you something are Frank's numbers. Our record when Frank plays more than garbage minutes. His stats against any team that isn't a cupcake.

Dude isn't good.

That's a refreshing new take from you.

You like SU hoops, right?

 

[two3zone]

That's a refreshing new take from you.

You like such hoops, right?

Do the numbers lie? I don't want him as our point guard and for many good on the court reasons. Has nothing to do with any off the court things.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Do the numbers lie? I don't want him as our point guard and for many good on the court reasons. Has nothing to do with any off the court things.

You are bordering on being redundant. Repetitive. Saying the same thing over and over again. Redundant.

And boring.

 

[two3zone]

You are bordering on being redundant. Repetitive. Saying the same thing over and over again. Redundant.

And boring.

It's boring and redundant hearing over and over how great he is.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

It's boring and redundant hearing over and over how great he is.

I'm still not sure you ever showed us who said he was great. I remember lots of people, like me, saying he had the potential...