Starting Line for Next Year

[IthacaBarrel]

I think we will see improved athtleticism at WR but less acumen.. The thing about Sales and Lemon they are both great technicians out there, if you focus on one the other will beat you, if you try to shut them both down West is open. We will miss both a lot. That said, I think we have some horses there. Foster, Kobena, Flemming, and Lewis will be in quite a battle

 

[IthacaBarrel]

What is Allen's true skill set? How good of an athlete is he? I truly have no idea just curious to hear thoughts here. I still say Loeb starts. Is Allen a poor man's Johnny football? I have no idea

 

[kcsu]

My two cents.

Justin is gone. He gains nothing by staying another year especially given his injury. Unless something drastic happens he will be taken in the first three rounds and he should go. Hicky slides to the LT or RT spot depending on who starts at QB. Plenty of guards to pick from i think that Palmer will be hard to keep off the field not sure who steps up at tackle. I fully expect a Juco or two to find there way to the cuse this Jan.

If not Loeb under center than Hunt. He would be our first true duel threat QB in a long time. He knows the system and is supposed to be a smart player who can make all of the throws. He messed up with the shop lifting but that is over and i expect him to be our QB if Charlie falters.

George Morris is according to all sources the best all around back we have had on the Hill in years. I dont see how he stays off the field.

Funder is also turning heads. Big fast great hands strong. There is a reason he was a 4-5 star in HS and he will start along with West. Plenty of depth behind these guys.

Ashton what to do with these great athlete. The Paul Harris of our football team. I think that if he doesnt get a run at QB and i doubt he will based on what im hearing than he may be moved to or more of a Provo role Hybrid WR/TE/FB. I doubt they move him to D.

LB I say we end up going with either Spruil or Lynch in the middle. I dont know much about Washington or the other young guys and i think it would be hard for a Juco to step into the middle unless they were here in Jan.

The secondary will be fine we are going to miss Shambang big time but Esk Wilkes and some of the young guys will step up and i believe this will be one of the strenghts of our team.

DL is going to be lights out. If Jay comes back we will be as strong as we have been up front in a very long time. Everyone is back and you add in Raymon and Williams and we are going to be something.

All in all if Loeb or Hunt can step up and if we can find another good tackle this team has a chance to crack the top 20 and make a strong opening statement in the ACC. Lets hope that we make a bowl so that we get the extra practice time .

 

[SmilinBob]

The rb position is as deep as I can remember, I think Moore is a heck of a back and if he had more snaps could get some serious yardage as well. I have no idea how Marrone can work the rotation next year if Morris is really that good.

 

[CIL]

Funderburk is already the best WR on the team. Foster, if healthy, will give us another horse.

If we successfully replace Nassib, we can put a damn good team on the field.

 

[RMH44]

What is Allen's true skill set? How good of an athlete is he? I truly have no idea just curious to hear thoughts here. I still say Loeb starts. Is Allen a poor man's Johnny football? I have no idea

IB, have you watched Allen's video? ZA is a very good athlete (reported 4.5 forty) and appears to possess the intangibles that are difficult to teach. He is perfect for our current offensive system.

I have no idea who starts next season, but I think ZA's January enrollment gives him a shot.

 

[DaveR52]

I'm not going to pretend to know ANYTHING about the NFL and how that league operates, but I do know they look for certain measurables at every position, and imo just coming out and saying Justin is a sure first- or second-day draft pick and is gone is a real stretch. To me he does not have the height, arm length or strength (yet) of a prototypical NFL prospect at that position worthy of such a high selection. He may even project as a center at that level (again, what do I know; pure speculation) and any team agreeing with that assessment would never draft him that highly. Again, that kind of feedback will be available to him from the real pros after the season, and I think that will shape his decision greatly. If he goes everybody can say they told me so, but I'm not convinced yet.

 

[billsin01]

You could be right.

Selfishly, I'd love for JP to stay for his RS senior season. We'd have one of the better Olines in the country.

Maybe I misunderstood my source, he made it sound like JP was told he could go in the first round. Much like Chandler Jones, I think JP will wow scouts when he works out for them.

This is the key for him, I'd think. I mean, if you're good enough to go in the top 3 rounds, with as short as most pro football careers are, you might as well go and start earning some money. Sucks for us that we didn't get a full, healthy year out of him this year. May have won us the NW game ... of course the same could be said for any sort of special teams play.

But, regardless, I think the thing with Pugh is that he'll need to make sure he's healthy enough and back into premium shape prior to the combine. If he's not wowing folks while running around cones and lifting weight in his underwear than he could take a pretty significant tumble.

 

[billsin01]

I'm not going to pretend to know ANYTHING about the NFL and how that league operates, but I do know they look for certain measurables at every position, and imo just coming out and saying Justin is a sure first- or second-day draft pick and is gone is a real stretch. To me he does not have the height, arm length or strength (yet) of a prototypical NFL prospect at that position worthy of such a high selection. He may even project as a center at that level (again, what do I know; pure speculation) and any team agreeing with that assessment would never draft him that highly. Again, that kind of feedback will be available to him from the real pros after the season, and I think that will shape his decision greatly. If he goes everybody can say they told me so, but I'm not convinced yet.

Thanks for the info. Any idea how close to 100% Pugh is, not necessarily in terms of health, but in terms of conditioning? Wasn't his injury like a pectoral injury or something? That usually seems to sap these guys of strength and the reps on the bench press seem to count for a lot in the eye of the scouts.

 

[Chip]

IB, have you watched Allen's video? ZA is a very good athlete (reported 4.5 forty) and appears to possess the intangibles that are difficult to teach. He is perfect for our current offensive system.

I have no idea who starts next season, but I think ZA's January enrollment gives him a shot.

I'd still love to see him redshirt. Two of the best all around QBs in college football this year, Johnny Football and Mariota from Oregon, were both Rivals 3 stars who redshirted. Look at them now. Oh and they almost both went to Oregon, which would be completely unfair.

If enrolling in January works out to the point where he's just better than what we have, then so be it. But true freshman QBs (even early enrollees) can be dangerous. Future looks bright though.

 

[DaveR52]

It was a shoulder injury. From the waist down he has always been a pretty flawless player in terms of technique and strength. From the waist up I'm just not so sure, but this is really amateur hour for me in terms of my expertise. I know Hickey is stronger bench-wise.

 

[billsin01]

Justin is gone. He gains nothing by staying another year especially given his injury.

George Morris is according to all sources the best all around back we have had on the Hill in years. I dont see how he stays off the field.

Ashton what to do with these great athlete. The Paul Harris of our football team. I think that if he doesnt get a run at QB and i doubt he will based on what im hearing than he may be moved to or more of a Provo role Hybrid WR/TE/FB. I doubt they move him to D.

DL is going to be lights out. If Jay comes back we will be as strong as we have been up front in a very long time. Everyone is back and you add in Raymon and Williams and we are going to be something.

Good thoughts. My comments are the following:

-- On Pugh, there is something to be gained if he's not absolutely guaranteed to go by round 3. With the NFL, where almost no money is guaranteed, there is HUGE value in being drafted as highly as humanly possible. If he thought he could get healthy and make slight gains in the conditioning department as well as be drafted in a weaker OL class next year (not sure if that is true or not), then there is at least some incentive to come back. Not saying he won't go, obviously.

-- The plan with Broyld, IMO, has to be to take a loooooonnnnnnngggggg look at him at QB given his natural gifts. I just think they have to give it a true shot before they simply rule it out, particularly if they aren't 100% sold on Loeb/Hunt/Allen. If that doesn't work out, to me he's got to LB. Yes, it seems odd to move a difference maker type to the defensive side but Shafer gets a lot out of athletic linebackers. Take Dy Davis -- 10.5 TFLs last year as a true frosh (yes, I know he had a pg year at Milford) and then 9 more this year with a 52-yd fumble return and a 28-yd INT return. Athletes make plays in this defense and with as much depth as we have at RB and WR (at least potentially), I just think it could make the most sense to move him to LB and get him on the field in a hurry.

-- DL is already as strong as it has been in a while. I'd go back to the simpkins days, I think. Regardless, if it is back in tact, mostly, and even better next year, that would be outstanding.

 

[billsin01]

I'd still love to see him redshirt. Two of the best all around QBs in college football this year, Johnny Football and Mariota from Oregon, were both Rivals 3 stars who redshirted. Look at them now. Oh and they almost both went to Oregon, which would be completely unfair.

If enrolling in January works out to the point where he's just better than what we have, then so be it. But true freshman QBs (even early enrollees) can be dangerous. Future looks bright though.

Yeah, I beat this drum all the time but people often make the mistake of confusing playing with developing. A redshirt year doesn't development and, I'd argue, most often it accelerates it. I think there is something to be said for taking a year to sit back and watch what needs to be done and digest it before trying to force a playbook down a kid's throat and send them out on the field while crossing your fingers.

This doesn't mean Allen isn't capable of coming in and playing from Day 1, but I too tend to believe that redshirting is the way to go with most of your frosh.

 

[RMH44]

Good thoughts. My comments are the following:

-- On Pugh, there is something to be gained if he's not absolutely guaranteed to go by round 3. With the NFL, where almost no money is guaranteed, there is HUGE value in being drafted as highly as humanly possible. If he thought he could get healthy and make slight gains in the conditioning department as well as be drafted in a weaker OL class next year (not sure if that is true or not), then there is at least some incentive to come back. Not saying he won't go, obviously.

-- The plan with Broyld, IMO, has to be to take a loooooonnnnnnngggggg look at him at QB given his natural gifts. I just think they have to give it a true shot before they simply rule it out, particularly if they aren't 100% sold on Loeb/Hunt/Allen. If that doesn't work out, to me he's got to LB. Yes, it seems odd to move a difference maker type to the defensive side but Shafer gets a lot out of athletic linebackers. Take Dy Davis -- 10.5 TFLs last year as a true frosh (yes, I know he had a pg year at Milford) and then 9 more this year with a 52-yd fumble return and a 28-yd INT return. Athletes make plays in this defense and with as much depth as we have at RB and WR (at least potentially), I just think it could make the most sense to move him to LB and get him on the field in a hurry.

-- DL is already as strong as it has been in a while. I'd go back to the simpkins days, I think. Regardless, if it is back in tact, mostly, and even better next year, that would be outstanding.

If things don't work out at QB, I'd love to see AB add 10-15 pounds of muscle and move MLB. I think he'd be a beast!

 

[orangepassion]

-- The plan with Broyld, IMO, has to be to take a loooooonnnnnnngggggg look at him at QB given his natural gifts. I just think they have to give it a true shot before they simply rule it out, particularly if they aren't 100% sold on Loeb/Hunt/Allen. If that doesn't work out, to me he's got to LB.

I agree w/ you, but i don't know if he's up for switching to the other side of the ball if he's not the QB. LB is definitely our greatest position of need and he could probably start there. If not, he could be a nasty TE.

Has anyone heard anything about Sugar bear's recovery?

 

[orangepassion]

.

Dave, any guesses where Broyld ends up next year?

 

[DaveR52]

A mystery. I'll certainly investigate for postseason wrap/look ahead.

 

[orangepassion]

A mystery. I'll certainly investigate for postseason wrap/look ahead.

Thanks-Between Smith, Gulley, Ameen-Moore, Morris, Mcfarlane, and the incoming backs, I think he'd be waste at RB (and hope this year wasn't a waste for him). Would love to see him get a legit shot at QB, and if he doesn't win it, contribute somewhere on the field where he is needed.

 

[PhatOrange]

What is Allen's true skill set? How good of an athlete is he? I truly have no idea just curious to hear thoughts here. I still say Loeb starts. Is Allen a poor man's Johnny football? I have no idea

It appears Allen has the potential to be very good but imho he's way to skinny to compete next year. I think he needs 20 lbs or more.

I'm really hoping Hunt gets it done in the spring. He's the guy I want under center. The rookies can redshirt

 

[PhatOrange]

If Broyld isn't going to make it at QB I wouldn't mind seeing him get into the 240 range and playing tight end. I don't think he's as fast as Vernon Davis but I think he's very similar. Davis was 6-3 220 when he entered Maryland and 6-3 250 now.

Broyld is so good in space with the ball that if he stays on offense you have to put him in a position where you're going to be able to do that. He just doesnt look fast enough to be WR though.

 

[bnoro]

I agree w/ you, but i don't know if he's up for switching to the other side of the ball if he's not the QB. LB is definitely our greatest position of need and he could probably start there. If not, he could be a nasty TE.

Has anyone heard anything about Sugar bear's recovery?

He was sitting up in 305, a few rows in front of us for the Ville game with John Raymon. Both of those guys are huge and were really into the game. Thompson didn't seem to be limping or labored from what I remember. He's gonna be an animal next season IMO.

 

[Cadillac]

I'm not going to pretend to know ANYTHING about the NFL and how that league operates, but I do know they look for certain measurables at every position, and imo just coming out and saying Justin is a sure first- or second-day draft pick and is gone is a real stretch. To me he does not have the height, arm length or strength (yet) of a prototypical NFL prospect at that position worthy of such a high selection. He may even project as a center at that level (again, what do I know; pure speculation) and any team agreeing with that assessment would never draft him that highly. Again, that kind of feedback will be available to him from the real pros after the season, and I think that will shape his decision greatly. If he goes everybody can say they told me so, but I'm not convinced yet.

He's got to add a solid 20 and not lose a step at the combine. I suppose it's possible.

Someone here said Andy Levitre which is a great comparison IMO. All-Pro caliber G but had to move from T at Oregon State.

I asked before since 2/3rds of posters here are Giants fans. Do you want a T on the small side looking at developmental time and a possible position change in the 1st round? No, you want an immediate starter.

The Giants, Steelers, Pats always seem to find immediate help at the bottom of the round and that's a big reason why they keep picking there as opposed to the crappy team I follow.

 

[billsin01]

I agree w/ you, but i don't know if he's up for switching to the other side of the ball if he's not the QB. LB is definitely our greatest position of need and he could probably start there. If not, he could be a nasty TE.

Has anyone heard anything about Sugar bear's recovery?

yeah, certainly have to "want" to play defense to excel at it. So that's a valid point. TE is an intriguing option as well.

 

[RICuse44]

I'm not going to pretend to know ANYTHING about the NFL and how that league operates, but I do know they look for certain measurables at every position, and imo just coming out and saying Justin is a sure first- or second-day draft pick and is gone is a real stretch. To me he does not have the height, arm length or strength (yet) of a prototypical NFL prospect at that position worthy of such a high selection. He may even project as a center at that level (again, what do I know; pure speculation) and any team agreeing with that assessment would never draft him that highly. Again, that kind of feedback will be available to him from the real pros after the season, and I think that will shape his decision greatly. If he goes everybody can say they told me so, but I'm not convinced yet.

Could not agree more. I think if he is a projected first round pick he should go. That way if he slides he still ends up a second round pick. What happened with Chandler was an anomaly and not the norm. Rarely do you see guys climb that high. Chandler's rise shows the stock the NFL puts on pass rushers. Now JP would be the opposite side of the equation and everyone knows how much onus there is on left tackles. But, if he is not projected at tackle I think that lowers him as well. The good news for him is that a former NFL line coach happens to be his head coach and can give Justin an accurate reading of his chances. In the end, I think whatever decision JP makes will be a good one because of the input he will get from Doug et al. But, first round money (even waiting a year for it) is a big difference. Also, higher picks are given more of an opportunity because of the investment the team has already made into them.

 

[orangepassion]

Also, higher picks are given more of an opportunity because of the investment the team has already made into them.

This is definitely true