Syracuse University to overhaul budget system, in part due to 'controversial' athletic budget (PS)

[AZOrange]

And, for instance, spending $40,000 to put the team in a hotel the night before a home football game because the players can't be trusted not to [fill in the blank] if they're left in their dorm rooms or apartments.

One can be the biggest fan in the world and still be some level of concerned (or disgusted) with how money is wasted on athletics.

Wait...this happened? Holy ...

 

[rrlbees]

Wait...this happened? Holy ...

Has for years.

 

[AZOrange]

Has for years.

Under PP? Man I don't remember that. I took a long hiatus from cuse football after that.

 

[rrlbees]

Under PP? Man I don't remember that. I took a long hiatus from cuse football after that.

Yes .

 

[anomander]

And, for instance, spending $40,000 to put the team in a hotel the night before a home football game because the players can't be trusted not to [fill in the blank] if they're left in their dorm rooms or apartments.

One can be the biggest fan in the world and still be some level of concerned (or disgusted) with how money is wasted on athletics.

ya but that happens everywhere in the country. this just isn't a Syracuse thing. i am sure almost every major football program does this. i know for a fact a majority do at the very least.

 

[OttoMets]

...I still want to ask Nancy Cantor about the wall built in front of Crouse College that was built for 500k.

Well that's an art installation. I think it's ghastly and at the very least should never should have been placed in that location (the whole row of buildings is on the National Register; that piece detracts from the aesthetics of the area).

But it, like all art on campus, was commissioned thanks to the support of donors and isn't contributing to the very real debt problem you speak of.

 

[OttoMets]

Under PP? Man I don't remember that. I took a long hiatus from cuse football after that.

I think it started under him, but maybe even during Coach Mac's tenure. Six home games a year, lodging and feeding almost 100 kids who have on-campus apartments at a hotel closer to the Dome than those apartments are.

No matter the justification, it's a sad waste.

 

[OttoMets]

ya but that happens everywhere in the country. this just isn't a Syracuse thing. i am sure almost every major football program does this. i know for a fact a majority do at the very least.

I think that's right. Nevertheless, it's a startling example of excess. Doesn't speak too highly of the coaches' faith in their student-athletes, either.

 

[cuseinchina]

I think that's right. Nevertheless, it's a startling example of excess. Doesn't speak too highly of the coaches' faith in their student-athletes, either.

Or maybe it's about gathering as team psychologically the night before a game. going to bed with that focus on team and the task tomorrow is very different from having a meeting and everyone going home to their apartments. If everyone else is doing this, it would likely put us at a disadvantage on game day not to do it. Seems like this came well before the 'arms race' for facilities and such began so this should be one of those tip of the iceburg sort of expenditure categories. Does seem wasteful...but if they can find a way to pay for it, why not? ACC money.

 

[OttoMets]

Or maybe it's about gathering as team psychologically the night before a game. going to bed with that focus on team and the task tomorrow is very different from having a meeting and everyone going home to their apartments. If everyone else is doing this, it would likely put us at a disadvantage on game day not to do it. Seems like this came well before the 'arms race' for facilities and such began so this should be one of those tip of the iceburg sort of expenditure categories. Does seem wasteful...but if they can find a way to pay for it, why not? ACC money.

Paranoid coaches certainly think it gives an advantage (or, since everyone else does it, not doing so would put us at a disadvantage).

I'm skeptical.

It's like The Sneetches (Dr. Seuss): these people are trying to one-up each other in the most picayune ways and then everyone else panics and tries to play catch-up for no reason other than they fact that everyone else is doing it.

 

[cuseinchina]

Paranoid coaches certainly think it gives an advantage (or, since everyone else does it, not doing so would put us at a disadvantage).

I'm skeptical.

It's like The Sneetches (Dr. Seuss): these people are trying to one-up each other in the most picayune ways and then everyone else panics and tries to play catch-up for no reason other than they fact that everyone else is doing it.

so they are modeling themselves on how everything else in the world works .

 

[Millhouse]

This seems SIGNIFICANTLY more important than fake rumors about UConn going to the B1G.

So it'll get 3 replies.

hard thread to respond to because so little information is public. my attitude is that if cantor and gross were willing to spend so much money out in the open on things that are obvious wastes of money (women's lax coach, connective corridor), you have to assume they were even more reckless about expenses that never see the light of day.

it's hard to believe that 95% of the benefit of going to the ACC is going to the school outside the athletic department (7.5M-375K)/7.5M

if the athletic dept can't get a loan on their own to pay the big east fee, even though they'll be getting plenty more back from the ACC, what does that say about the AD's credit worthiness?

every tub on its own bottom. everything is so cross subsidized. worthless majors need to be culled, athletic department needs more discipline

 

[AZOrange]

I think it started under him, but maybe even during Coach Mac's tenure. Six home games a year, lodging and feeding almost 100 kids who have on-campus apartments at a hotel closer to the Dome than those apartments are.

No matter the justification, it's a sad waste.

Yeah what a waste and with the ncaas crazy rules on everything surprised this can happen.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The entire university spent like a drunken sailor the minute Nancy Cantor stepped on campus. This isn't isolated to just athletics. I wish I had a picture of the entire university from 2003 when I stepped on campus, but there was at least one capital improvement started or finished by the university from about 2004-2012. I know a lot of construction was funded by donations, but it is clear that by the amount of debt the University has that a lot of it was done through loans. I still want to ask Nancy Cantor about the wall built in front of Crouse College that was built for 500k.

That's not unique to Syracuse. You're right it's not just athletics, but schools as a whole in the last 15 years or so are spending significantly more on new buildings/facilities, etc. It's part of the rising tuition problem.

 

[CuseOnly]

I have a question as to what a year at SU actually cost and what actually gets tagged as paid or allocated to the Athletic Department as the cost of the scholarship.

Is it the full cost for tuition/expenses or is it tuition/expenses minus assistance, grants government subsidy ? My son went to a private school in MA for a year that was almost $50K a year but at the end if the day he only would have had to take loans for half after all the assistance but we paid cash. He transferred and will get his degree from UMASS which is way less than half the cost.

How does this part of the accounting work. I thought maybe Bees would know.

 

[kcsu]

Outside of Newhouse Syracuse is known on a national basis much more for its sports. And when it comes to Newhouse the graduates who cover sports are those that are known. Sports have been and will continue to be huge when it comes to our reputation. Our sports history and reputation is what got us invited to the ACC i hope that our new leader understands that

 

[GFTakedown]

Why doesn't SU showcase the Carrier Dome as a concert venue for top acts anymore? I remember the days of the Rolling Stones, U2, Billy Joel, Bruce Springsteen, Michael Jackson, Pink Floyd, Genesis, Elton John and many more. I am guessing those profits would go towards the Athletic Department.

 

[BORZAK]

The one argument I would make as a faculty memeber is that what they are paying Gary Gait for women's lacrosse is insane. How can anyone justify that salary for a non-revenue sport. All I know is that Hop and our football coordinators should make a lot more than Gary Gait. I would gather that he is making twice what the next coach is making in women's lacrosse or probably men's lacrosse too.

women's lacrosse coach Gary Gait was fifth at $716,409.
Gait's compensation includes $172,756 from Syracuse University, $85,000 from IMG and $128,540 from women's lacrosse camps.

From post standard articles

Who knows how accurate, who knows his other deals . Is It that from his irs forms. Most of us have no clue? Good for Gary hope he loves Life at SU. And for the chancellor I believe he is Cantor on steroids.

 

[Full_Rebar]

He understands that, but unlike his predecessor he understands that a bit of fiscal responsibility is needed. SU can have strong athletics, academics, and a community presence in Syracuse without blowing money left and right. All of the changes Syverud is pushing indicate that he is looking at getting SU away from spending without thinking of the consequence.

 

[cuseinchina]

women's lacrosse coach Gary Gait was fifth at $716,409.
Gait's compensation includes $172,756 from Syracuse University, $85,000 from IMG and $128,540 from women's lacrosse camps.

From post standard articles

Who knows how accurate, who knows his other deals . Is It that from his irs forms. Most of us have no clue? Good for Gary hope he loves Life at SU. And for the chancellor I believe he is Cantor on steroids.

elaborate on your Cantor on steroids comment - what do you mean by this? what would you expect his agenda to look like?

 

[jekelish]

As someone who recently applied for a job in the SUAD this timing couldn't possibly be worse.

 

[BlackKnight76]

And for the chancellor I believe he is Cantor on steroids.

Is there anything behind this thought, or is railing against the Chancellor still just the cool thing to do?

 

[nzm136]

Stereotyping maybe, but I'm surrounded by academics via my wife, sister, and many of our friends. I can say that based on my experience, academics tend to be really caught up in their own little world - and that world often times has very very little to do with what should be the core mission of a college or university - teaching students to think creatively, analytically, and in a way that allows them to contribute to society.

Without athletics as a draw, a school like Syracuse with middling rankings, is going to find itself facing an enrollment crunch when people start realizing that the public school is a better deal for the same outcome and the things that made Syracuse Syracuse have been de-emphasized. The experience is what you are selling when you try to get people to go to SU. At $160k, the economics don't justify it, at $200k they certainly won't. So the experience has got to be differentiated. the numbers are getting to the point where upper middle class people making less than $200k a year are just not going to pay up. For my own kids, if they can't get into a top 20 school I would totally advise them to get straight A's at the best state school and then focus on getting a top knotch GRE/GMAT score to get into a top 20 grad school. If they wanted to go to cuse I'd probably pay up...but it's really not the smart thing to do. That's why keeping the experience really great, including the legacy of athletics, is super important to a place like Syracuse.

I heard this theory too, but going to Syracuse got me $160,800 of grad school academic scholarships, at top tier schools (one of which was top 25) and a job for a company that is in the elite echelon of its field. Most of my friends who went to state schools (even pretty good ones)ended up managing retail stores, restaurants, etc. after college. I guess that's the long way of saying that I disagree with everything in bold. Syracuse is a steal. However, Syracuse would take a HUGE hit if athletics were de-emphasized. I agree with your end point.

 

[Scooch]

Outside of Newhouse Syracuse is known on a national basis much more for its sports. And when it comes to Newhouse the graduates who cover sports are those that are known. Sports have been and will continue to be huge when it comes to our reputation. Our sports history and reputation is what got us invited to the ACC i hope that our new leader understands that

SU has some very well regarded programs beyond Newhouse. And there's a lot of famous Newhouse alums that don't work in sports. Ted Koppel says hello.

 

[Full_Rebar]

I'd say the I-School alums like Crowley of FourSquare are going to completely overshadow the ESPN crew in terms of appealing to the next generation of students...if this hasn't happened already. The starting salary for Newhouse folks is among the lowest at SU.