The outcome against ND is going to tell me a lot about this HC and staff

[JeremyCuse]

I try to be realistic when it comes to Syracuse football because its easy to get caught up in the what ifs especially when you are playing a team like ND or FSU or Clemson.

Tomorrows game to me represents a chance for the staff to rebound from the NW, Gatech, FSU, and Clemson embarrasements from last season. I think most Syracuse fans other then maybe that one guy who lost his mind on here last week realize that the ND matchup is a bad one for Syracuse and were a long shot to win.

While I would love to get an upset W to me its just as equally important that Syracuse at least looks competitive/competent and makes this a game late into the second half. One thing about Marrone lead teams was that you know that even if we had almost zero chance of winning the game would at least stay moderately close and we would acquit ourselves well.

With this new staff I honestly dont have those same feelings. I like our HC but a lot of the rhetoric simply hasnt matched the on field production especially in those blowout games from last year where we looked like the teams I saw from the Grob era. A competitive Syracuse game tomorrow will give me some faith going into this very difficult part of the season ( I hold no illusions that FSU and Clemson aren't going to roll us) and that a bowl game is not out of reach.

Less talk about being hardnosed, less George Mcdonald chest thumping on twitter and more points on the scoreboard and W's in the win column.

 

[Doc5120]

I try to be realistic when it comes to Syracuse football because its easy to get caught up in the what ifs especially when you are playing a team like ND or FSU or Clemson.

Tomorrows game to me represents a chance for the staff to rebound from the NW, Gatech, FSU, and Clemson embarrasements from last season. I think most Syracuse fans other then maybe that one guy who lost his mind on here last week that the ND matchup is a bad one for Syracuse and were a long shot to win.

While I would love to get an upset W to me its just as equally important that Syracuse at least looks competitive/competent and makes this a game late into the second half. One thing about Marrone lead teams was that you know that even if we had almost zero chance of winning the game would at least stay moderately close and we would acquit ourselves well.

With this new staff I honestly dont have those same feelings. I like our HC but a lot of the rhetoric simply hasnt matched the on field production especially in those blowout games from last year where we looked like the teams I saw from the Grob era. A competitive Syracuse game tomorrow will give me some faith going into this very difficult part of the season ( I hold no illusions that FSU and Clemson are going to roll us) and that a bowl game is not out of reach.

Less talk about being hardnosed, less George Mcdonald chest thumping on twitter and more points on the scoreboard and W's in the win column.

Afreakingmen to that!

 

[TheCusian]

I try to be realistic when it comes to Syracuse football because its easy to get caught up in the what ifs especially when you are playing a team like ND or FSU or Clemson.

Tomorrows game to me represents a chance for the staff to rebound from the NW, Gatech, FSU, and Clemson embarrasements from last season. I think most Syracuse fans other then maybe that one guy who lost his mind on here last week realize that the ND matchup is a bad one for Syracuse and were a long shot to win.

While I would love to get an upset W to me its just as equally important that Syracuse at least looks competitive/competent and makes this a game late into the second half. One thing about Marrone lead teams was that you know that even if we had almost zero chance of winning the game would at least stay moderately close and we would acquit ourselves well.

With this new staff I honestly dont have those same feelings. I like our HC but a lot of the rhetoric simply hasnt matched the on field production especially in those blowout games from last year where we looked like the teams I saw from the Grob era. A competitive Syracuse game tomorrow will give me some faith going into this very difficult part of the season ( I hold no illusions that FSU and Clemson aren't going to roll us) and that a bowl game is not out of reach.

Less talk about being hardnosed, less George Mcdonald chest thumping on twitter and more points on the scoreboard and W's in the win column.

We've struggled against elite teams and that's not good. Especially since Marrone seemed to avoid the blowout via good game planning.

But - I don't think you can erase how well we've played against peer programs. Off the top of my head: WF, NC State, Maryland last season, Pitt, BC, Minny. I think they may have had 3 yards rushing all together . I think we were better than Maryland last week.

Also: Not everyone sees ND in the same class as FSU and Clemson. They haven't played anyone. I think they are better than us - but by how much? We will see.

 

[Full_Rebar]

Less talk about being hardnosed, less George Mcdonald chest thumping on twitter and more points on the scoreboard and W's in the win column.

I wish I could like this statement x1000. Let the on-field actions do the talking.

 

[CousCuse]

No more moral victories against , this team is good enough to pull the upset and slay a Goliath. The time is now.

 

[RF2044]

No more moral victories against , this team is good enough to pull the upset and slay a Goliath. The time is now.

I like the bravado, but I think some perspective is needed--ND is a top 10 team. They are LEGIT. This will be a de facto road game, given the numbers disparity between fans in the stadium.

I would love to believe that we're going to rise to the occasion and make this a tough game, but we could very easily lose--and probably should lose, given the talent / athleticism disparity. Doesn't mean we can't / won't make it close, doesn't mean we can't / won't make it competitive, doesn't mean we can't / won't even find a way to win. But I don't resonate with the "no moral victories" or "no excuses" crowd--that makes it sound like we SHOULD win the game, which I don't think is the case.

Now, I hope we come out plum mad dog mean, don't shoot ourselves in the foot, and make this a game in the fourth quarter. If we do that, I can live with the outcome. You might call that a moral victory, but I call it playing competitively against a top 10 team. That's all we can ask--from there, it would be anybody's game.

But to discount that outcome, or suggest that if we lose close that it reflects poorly on the staff [not claiming that the OP was saying that]--no, I don't think either of those assessments are valid.

 

[CousCuse]

I like the bravado, but I think some perspective is needed--ND is a top 10 team. They are LEGIT. This will be a de facto road game, given the numbers disparity between fans in the stadium.

I would love to believe that we're going to rise to the occasion and make this a tough game, but we could very easily lose--and probably should lose, given the talent / athleticism disparity. Doesn't mean we can't / won't make it close, doesn't mean we can't / won't make it competitive, doesn't mean we can't / won't even find a way to win. But I don't resonate with the "no moral victories" or "no excuses" crowd--that makes it sound like we SHOULD win the game, which I don't think is the case.

Now, I hope we come out plum mad dog mean, don't shoot ourselves in the foot, and make this a game in the fourth quarter. If we do that, I can live with the outcome. You might call that a moral victory, but I call it playing competitively against a top 10 team. That's all we can ask--from there, it would be anybody's game.

But to discount that outcome, or suggest that if we lose close that it reflects poorly on the staff [not claiming that the OP was saying that]--no, I don't think either of those assessments are valid.

It is not conducive to achieve an optimal outcome by already settling psychologically on a lesser outcome before the endeavor has even begun. In effect , you are creating the mentality of failure , which is self fulfilling at that point.

 

[RF2044]

It is not conducive to achieve an optimal outcome by already settling psychologically on a lesser outcome before the endeavor has even begun. In effect , you are creating the mentality of failure , which is self fulfilling at that point.

Arm chair psychology at its finest. ; )

 

[upperdeck]

I dont know how beating rice/Purdue and Michigan would tell anyone that ND is a top 10 team. maybe they are but beating is too isnt not going to really show it either.. the rest of the schedule will define how good they might be.

 

[CousCuse]

Arm chair psychology at its finest. ; )

I'll take that. Notre Dames motto , " Play like a Champion Today" . Syracuse's motto , " Play to not get Humiliated Today" .

 

[CanadianSU]

Don't put ND in the same list as Clemson or FSU.

 

[RF2044]

It is not conducive to achieve an optimal outcome by already settling psychologically on a lesser outcome before the endeavor has even begun. In effect , you are creating the mentality of failure , which is self fulfilling at that point.

I'll take that. Notre Dames motto , " Play like a Champion Today" . Syracuse's motto , " Play to not get Humiliated Today" .

Hey--wanted to circle back, because I had to go into a meeting and cut the last response short. Again, I applaud the sentiment you are expressing. And it is one thing to go into a game believing you can win, versus hoping to not fail [which I think is the point you are making]. But honestly--me taking an objectively realistic view of our chances against a top 10 team has ZERO to do with the preparation, readiness, and outcome of the game Saturday.

To me, this is no different than people proclaiming "final four or bust" on the hoops board every year. Or what? If we don't make the final four, then somehow the program is worse the wear? Or we're less fervent as a fanbase? Or people are going to abandon rooting for the team?

Actually, that latter might happen, because outside of the diehards, our fanbase is comprised of a bunch of generally fair weather fans [hence, the home attendance issues], but that isn't germaine to this dicussion.

I hate Notre Dame. Hate them with the passion of 1000 burning suns. Back when I used to write for Mason on the hoops side, I kicked off one of my pre-game summaries before a game against the Irish with a several paragraphs long diatribe describing up front how much I hate all things ND, and how I couldn't stand losing to them. None of that changes here. My dad [who still lives in Syracuse, and is a season ticket holder] is en route to the game right now. I passionately want to believe that we can win. I'm not "settling" for anything, nor "psychologically [accepting] a lesser outcome..."

You even suggesting that sounds weird to me. Think about it for a second--substitute Florida State for ND, and does your logic still hold up--or is it somehow "ok" to lose to them? Would it make me more of a fan to refuse to even acknowledge the possibility that we might lose to FSU--the #1 team in the nation--because I'm 'psychologically settling on a lesser outcome?' Just because we acknowledge that those teams are better / deservedly favored doesn't "create the mentality of failure." Being unrealistic creates "the mentality of failure," because then you're going to have people running around having temper tantrums and proclaiming that the sky is falling if we lose. Notice that I said "if" -- because I want to beat these MFers like a rented mule.

But if we don't--it isn't the end of the season. I'd say that most reasonable prognostications circled this as a "L" on the schedule before the season kicked off. Doesn't mean we can't win [see: Nebraska, Florida, Louisville a few years ago, etc.]. Of course we can. But the team's ability to win or lose isn't affected nor impacted in any way by any fan's single minded determination or blind inability to acknowledge the possibility that we might lose to a top 10 team that is a double digit favorite.

 

[bevosu]

At halftime of the Maryland game I said to myself..."this second half will show me something about our team and coaching staff". What it showed me was...the defense held its own (thanks in part to Maryland basically sitting on a comfortable lead). The offense was disappointing, couldn't score points. The coaching staff didn't impress me.

I think Notre Dame is overrated as usual...anything can happen, but I'm not optimistic.

 

[007]

I try to be realistic when it comes to Syracuse football because its easy to get caught up in the what ifs especially when you are playing a team like ND or FSU or Clemson.

Tomorrows game to me represents a chance for the staff to rebound from the NW, Gatech, FSU, and Clemson embarrasements from last season. I think most Syracuse fans other then maybe that one guy who lost his mind on here last week realize that the ND matchup is a bad one for Syracuse and were a long shot to win.

While I would love to get an upset W to me its just as equally important that Syracuse at least looks competitive/competent and makes this a game late into the second half. One thing about Marrone lead teams was that you know that even if we had almost zero chance of winning the game would at least stay moderately close and we would acquit ourselves well.

With this new staff I honestly dont have those same feelings. I like our HC but a lot of the rhetoric simply hasnt matched the on field production especially in those blowout games from last year where we looked like the teams I saw from the Grob era. A competitive Syracuse game tomorrow will give me some faith going into this very difficult part of the season ( I hold no illusions that FSU and Clemson aren't going to roll us) and that a bowl game is not out of reach.

Less talk about being hardnosed, less George Mcdonald chest thumping on twitter and more points on the scoreboard and W's in the win column.

Good post, Jeremy.

It will be very important not to get smoked Saturday night. Prime time, NYC, "elite" program. We need to show well. Getting blown out again will not only tell us a lot about the staff, it will also, unfortunately, reinforce the national perception that we are a lower tier P5 team .

 

[IthacaBarrel]

It's 1 game. Let's see where we end up at the end of November.

 

[FAL]

I try to be realistic when it comes to Syracuse football because its easy to get caught up in the what ifs especially when you are playing a team like ND or FSU or Clemson.

Tomorrows game to me represents a chance for the staff to rebound from the NW, Gatech, FSU, and Clemson embarrasements from last season. I think most Syracuse fans other then maybe that one guy who lost his mind on here last week realize that the ND matchup is a bad one for Syracuse and were a long shot to win.

While I would love to get an upset W to me its just as equally important that Syracuse at least looks competitive/competent and makes this a game late into the second half. One thing about Marrone lead teams was that you know that even if we had almost zero chance of winning the game would at least stay moderately close and we would acquit ourselves well.

With this new staff I honestly dont have those same feelings. I like our HC but a lot of the rhetoric simply hasnt matched the on field production especially in those blowout games from last year where we looked like the teams I saw from the Grob era. A competitive Syracuse game tomorrow will give me some faith going into this very difficult part of the season ( I hold no illusions that FSU and Clemson aren't going to roll us) and that a bowl game is not out of reach.

Less talk about being hardnosed, less George Mcdonald chest thumping on twitter and more points on the scoreboard and W's in the win column.

Excellent post! You succinctly outlined in a few paragraphs what a lot of us feel. Well done, sir!

 

[syr02esq]

Offensive stats are nice but the only one that counts is the final score. Let's do it.

 

[Chris02M]

id rather they get blown out that played scared ball and lose 31-17 running clock. We need to play our game and be competitve

 

[FAL]

id rather they get blown out that played scared ball and lose 31-17 running clock. We need to play our game and be competitve

Good point, but the problem is that I believe we're all still trying to figure out just what "our game" is.

 

[qdawgg]

It's interesting the perspective on this board when Marrone was the coach, we had a conservative game plan and didn't get blown out. Lots of pissed off people that we weren't more aggressive in those games and we were just playing not to lose instead of playing to win.

However, on the flip side. That MD game, I think was the most conservative that I've ever seen Shafer.

 

[Crusty]

I try to be realistic when it comes to Syracuse football because its easy to get caught up in the what ifs especially when you are playing a team like ND or FSU or Clemson.

Tomorrows game to me represents a chance for the staff to rebound from the NW, Gatech, FSU, and Clemson embarrasements from last season. I think most Syracuse fans other then maybe that one guy who lost his mind on here last week realize that the ND matchup is a bad one for Syracuse and were a long shot to win.

While I would love to get an upset W to me its just as equally important that Syracuse at least looks competitive/competent and makes this a game late into the second half. One thing about Marrone lead teams was that you know that even if we had almost zero chance of winning the game would at least stay moderately close and we would acquit ourselves well.

With this new staff I honestly dont have those same feelings. I like our HC but a lot of the rhetoric simply hasnt matched the on field production especially in those blowout games from last year where we looked like the teams I saw from the Grob era. A competitive Syracuse game tomorrow will give me some faith going into this very difficult part of the season ( I hold no illusions that FSU and Clemson aren't going to roll us) and that a bowl game is not out of reach.

Less talk about being hardnosed, less George Mcdonald chest thumping on twitter and more points on the scoreboard and W's in the win column.

I am too old to be realistic. Also - don't want to be!

I don't think anyone knows what ND is yet. Their secondary is not great, their entire O Line has been reshuffled, 6 of the front 7 D are new. Maybe they are a top 10 team, maybe not. What we do know that our secondary is vulnerable and if Golson has a great day we are in big trouble. All this means to me that we have a chance to win but the staff needs to have a good plan on both sides of the ball and the team needs to play with a chip on their shoulder. They have to have a good plan that Hunt can handle and he has to on his passing game. If the game plans are not up to snuff we could get blown out. I will be very disappointed if that happens as this staff is very easy to like.

 

[SoBeCuse]

It's interesting the perspective on this board when Marrone was the coach, we had a conservative game plan and didn't get blown out. Lots of pissed off people that we weren't more aggressive in those games and we were just playing not to lose instead of playing to win.

However, on the flip side. That MD game, I think was the most conservative that I've ever seen Shafer.

The Marrone teams to me played more disciplined football and executed better. They didn't get too cute and used the players they had well given their abilities and/or limitations. Usually sound execution which kept us in games (USC) for a little while before superior talent took over. If this team keeps making mistakes then it will be ugly tonight and we'll continue to lose to the 'peer' teams a la the Maryland game.

 

[Crusty]

The Marrone teams to me played more disciplined football and executed better. They didn't get too cute and used the players they had well given their abilities and/or limitations. Usually sound execution which kept us in games (USC) for a little while before superior talent took over. If this team keeps making mistakes then it will be ugly tonight and we'll continue to lose to the 'peer' teams a la the Maryland game.

Sees to me we had poor ST for the most part under Marrone and we made the same stupid pre-snap penalties. We lost a lot of games beating ourselves. Nothing much has changed leading me to believe we still have a talent gap. I cannot for the life of me explain that GT game.

 

[SoBeCuse]

Sees to me we had poor ST for the most part under Marrone and we made the same stupid pre-snap penalties. We lost a lot of games beating ourselves. Nothing much has changed leading me to believe we still have a talent gap. I cannot for the life of me explain that GT game.

No question about that GT debacle and pre-snap penalties. I have selective memory I suppose.

 

[qdawgg]

Sees to me we had poor ST for the most part under Marrone and we made the same stupid pre-snap penalties. We lost a lot of games beating ourselves. Nothing much has changed leading me to believe we still have a talent gap. I cannot for the life of me explain that GT game.

I agree. Every year we complained, rightfully so, that how come this team is supposed to be based on discipline but continues to make the same mistakes over and over again.