this means very little, but we're 93rd in offense | Syracusefan.com

this means very little, but we're 93rd in offense

Millhouse

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the numbers will look less nutty after people finish playing cupcakes, don't take this as some big rip of the team

but still... 93rd???? it's hard to believe

450 ypg doesn't even get you in the top 25. college football is nuts.

but 328 ypg (where we are this year) would've been good for 94th in the country last year.

numbers are low because of wake but hey they still scored 36..

they're not that bad in scoring, 25 per game.

you'd think 38 ppg would get you in the top 25 but it wouldn't. (again cupcakes.. )

there is such a big gap between getting in the 80s vs the 110s where we used to be during the dark years.
 

SWC75

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The big thing is that this was the year the offense was supposed to carry the defense and it isn't.
 

IthacaBarrel

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the numbers will look less nutty after people finish playing cupcakes, don't take this as some big rip of the team

but still... 93rd???? it's hard to believe

450 ypg doesn't even get you in the top 25. college football is nuts.

but 328 ypg (where we are this year) would've been good for 94th in the country last year.

numbers are low because of wake but hey they still scored 36..

they're not that bad in scoring, 25 per game.

you'd think 38 ppg would get you in the top 25 but it wouldn't. (again cupcakes.. )

there is such a big gap between getting in the 80s vs the 110s where we used to be during the dark years.

Really when you look at it, we have kind of sucked on both sides of the ball, granted I thought the O looked decent versus USC but that didn't translate into big yards or points
 

OttoinGrotto

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the numbers will look less nutty after people finish playing cupcakes, don't take this as some big rip of the team

but still... 93rd???? it's hard to believe

450 ypg doesn't even get you in the top 25. college football is nuts.

but 328 ypg (where we are this year) would've been good for 94th in the country last year.

numbers are low because of wake but hey they still scored 36..

they're not that bad in scoring, 25 per game.

you'd think 38 ppg would get you in the top 25 but it wouldn't. (again cupcakes.. )

there is such a big gap between getting in the 80s vs the 110s where we used to be during the dark years.
That's why I'm saying for all this talk about needing to recruit better (we do) it sure looks like a lot of craptacular programs find a way to move the ball all over the field. I think we're moving in the right direction by throwing it a lot more, but we need moar offense.
 

OrlandoCuse

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Our (lack of) running game is really killing us.

Take away Bailey's 50 yard run vs Wake and what do you get?!
 

Scooch

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Really when you look at it, we have kind of sucked on both sides of the ball, granted I thought the O looked decent versus USC but that didn't translate into big yards or points

That's where I'm at too. At times we've "looked" really good, but it seems to come in short bursts and doesn't translate statistically. And it's why I like Millhouse posting these rankings. Even though it's early, and thus the data is really random, it's not a good sign. Granted USC was tough but we should have been able to fatten up on our cupcake, and we're still a bottom-feeder statistically. Not encouraging.
 

GoSU96

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the numbers will look less nutty after people finish playing cupcakes, don't take this as some big rip of the team

but still... 93rd???? it's hard to believe

450 ypg doesn't even get you in the top 25. college football is nuts.

but 328 ypg (where we are this year) would've been good for 94th in the country last year.

numbers are low because of wake but hey they still scored 36..

they're not that bad in scoring, 25 per game.

you'd think 38 ppg would get you in the top 25 but it wouldn't. (again cupcakes.. )

there is such a big gap between getting in the 80s vs the 110s where we used to be during the dark years.

Part of the problem is the offense doesn't run all that many plays. 58 (299/5.2 ypp), 62 (354/5.7), and 59 (331/5.6) this year. Product of the problems on 3rd down on both sides of the ball so far this year, 83rd on offense, 99th on defense.

SU is 111th in offensive plays per game, 69th in yards per play, tied for 64th in total TD's.
 

Chip

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The big thing is that this was the year the offense was supposed to carry the defense and it isn't.

Well, the offense is supposed to carry the defense enough for us to win games. Right now we're 2-1. Which is where everyone thought we'd be right now. Mediocre offense this Saturday combined with bad defense and a loss, then yeah, they're not carrying the D. Same for the next 2. Gotta get through this part of the schedule 5-1.
 

Millhouse

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Part of the problem is the offense doesn't run all that many plays. 58 (299/5.2 ypp), 62 (354/5.7), and 59 (331/5.6) this year. Product of the problems on 3rd down on both sides of the ball so far this year.

hopefully they go more no huddle this year. i'm a little encouraged about going for it more on 4th down that will help.

ga tech is ridiculous. 13.5 yards per play against kansas. some big 12 team should've stolen their offense - no one would know what to do against it out there
 

Millhouse

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That's where I'm at too. At times we've "looked" really good, but it seems to come in short bursts and doesn't translate statistically. And it's why I like Millhouse posting these rankings. Even though it's early, and thus the data is really random, it's not a good sign. Granted USC was tough but we should have been able to fatten up on our cupcake, and we're still a bottom-feeder statistically. Not encouraging.
I'm pretty convinced that a lot of people don't really fully understand how insane offense is now.

Our offense in 1998 was great at 430 ypg.

You'd think that would be a top 25 offense but it wouldn't have been in 2010. (would've been 27th)

Our greatest offense ever (1959) would've only been 19th in 2010 ypg. Obviously different eras, but that's kinda my point. we're willing to account for different eras to give more credit to past teams but we're not as willing to look at todays era to evaluate todays teams (ie omg we broke a syracuse passing attempts record! whoopee)
 
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44USMC

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Team hasn't been world beaters, but so far as good as I thought this team would be.
 

kcsu

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We cant run the ball or maybe teams are challanging us to win through the air knowing that we have no true deep threat anyway you look at it we are short on playmakers big time
 

suloyalfan

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Based on what I saw against USC, we held back alot for that game... the offense in the first 2 games was not like that.

I think that if our offense plays like that against the other teams on our schedule, we're going to see alot of points and yardage racked up.
 
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44USMC

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As it turns out, Toledo gives up more than 300+ ypg through the air. I think their weakness plays to this team's strength :rolleyes:
 

GoSU96

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We cant run the ball or maybe teams are challanging us to win through the air knowing that we have no true deep threat anyway you look at it we are short on playmakers big time

That's not news.

Scheme and execution
 

OttoinGrotto

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Our greatest offense ever (1959) would've only been 19th in 2010 ypg. Obviously different eras, but that's kinda my point. we're willing to account for different eras to give more credit to past teams but we're not as willing to look at todays era to evaluate todays teams (ie omg we broke a syracuse passing attempts record! whoopee)
Hey. I resemble that.
 

SWC75

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From my pre-season preview:

Our eventual goal, reasonably, is to be a perennial top 25 team with the potential for something more than that when the circumstances are right. I calculated the average numbers that the top passer, runner and receiver had, on average for the teams that finished in the top 25 of last year’s AP poll, (which was done after the bowls: the BCS standings are before the bowls and so not the final poll).

The average quarterback for a top 25 team last year completed 224 of 351 passes, (65.8%) for 2,895 yards and threw 23 touchdown passes and 9 interceptions. Last year, Ryan Nassib completed 202 of 358 passes (.564%) for 2,334 yards, 19 TDs and 8 interceptions. He was the first SU quarterback to complete 200 passes in a season. His accuracy was well short of the top 25 standard, as was noted by SU fans last year. We also complained about his pocket presence- he seemed to panic in a rush and run in the wrong direction to avoid it. But he threw 19 touchdown passes, something only Don McPherson and Donovan McNabb have exceeded. And he did this with a young offensive line and a receiving corps depleted by injuries. He proved in the bowl game that, given protection and a good receivers, he could put up big numbers. I’m not sure about the completion percentage but I think with good injury luck this year, he could match or exceed the other “top 25” standards.

The average top running back for a top 25 team last year carried the ball 199 times for 1093 yards, (a 5.5 average) and 12 TDs. Last year, Delone Carter exceeded the yardage with 231 carries for 1233 yards, (5.3) and 9TDS. Delone lacked explosiveness but was a strong power runner and a good technician between the tackles. But he’s gone. His back-up Antwon Bailey, is smaller, quicker and more versatile. I think he can approach the top 25 standards and also be a threat as a pass receiver. He’s also a fine blocker.

The average leading pass receiver on a top 25 team last year caught 63 passes for 947 yards and 8 touchdowns. Syracuse has never had a player catch 63 passes, although Kevin Johnson and Mike Williams have caught 60. Only Tommy Kane, Rob Moore and Marvin Harrison have accumulated that amount of yardage, with Harrison the leader at 1131. The eight touchdowns have been matched or exceeded several times. The question is: do we have anyone who can do that this year? Marcus Sales, who caught three long TD passes in the Pinstripe Bowl was thought to be our best returning receiver but took himself out of the running by getting arrested for (allegedly) trying to sell drugs with his brother. The actual top returning receiver is Van Chew, who caught 41 for 611 yards and 5 TDs, well short of the top 25 standards, although the average per catch is similar, (14.9 vs. 15.0). Van got off to a great start with 30 catches for 498 yards and 4 scores in the first 7 games. But injuries rendered him ineffective after that. With a full healthy season, he could approach the top 25 standard.

Nassib is on his way to a top 25 season: 296 of 408 (.725) for 2904 yards, 28 TDs passes, 4 interceptions

Both Lemon and Chew are on a pass for top 25 receiving years: Lemon 96 receptions 872 yards (9.1) 8TDs, Chew 60 receptions for 960 yards, 12 TDs.

Bailey will wind up short of top 25 standards: 196 carries ofr 816 yards, (4.2), 8TDs.

Of course, they have to maintina their current rates through the rest of the seaosn to reach those numbers. Wemight not play a better team than USC this eyar but we will play better teams than Wake Forest and Rhode Island.
 

Millhouse

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From my pre-season preview:

Our eventual goal, reasonably, is to be a perennial top 25 team with the potential for something more than that when the circumstances are right. I calculated the average numbers that the top passer, runner and receiver had, on average for the teams that finished in the top 25 of last year’s AP poll, (which was done after the bowls: the BCS standings are before the bowls and so not the final poll).

The average quarterback for a top 25 team last year completed 224 of 351 passes, (65.8%) for 2,895 yards and threw 23 touchdown passes and 9 interceptions. Last year, Ryan Nassib completed 202 of 358 passes (.564%) for 2,334 yards, 19 TDs and 8 interceptions. He was the first SU quarterback to complete 200 passes in a season. His accuracy was well short of the top 25 standard, as was noted by SU fans last year. We also complained about his pocket presence- he seemed to panic in a rush and run in the wrong direction to avoid it. But he threw 19 touchdown passes, something only Don McPherson and Donovan McNabb have exceeded. And he did this with a young offensive line and a receiving corps depleted by injuries. He proved in the bowl game that, given protection and a good receivers, he could put up big numbers. I’m not sure about the completion percentage but I think with good injury luck this year, he could match or exceed the other “top 25” standards.

The average top running back for a top 25 team last year carried the ball 199 times for 1093 yards, (a 5.5 average) and 12 TDs. Last year, Delone Carter exceeded the yardage with 231 carries for 1233 yards, (5.3) and 9TDS. Delone lacked explosiveness but was a strong power runner and a good technician between the tackles. But he’s gone. His back-up Antwon Bailey, is smaller, quicker and more versatile. I think he can approach the top 25 standards and also be a threat as a pass receiver. He’s also a fine blocker.

The average leading pass receiver on a top 25 team last year caught 63 passes for 947 yards and 8 touchdowns. Syracuse has never had a player catch 63 passes, although Kevin Johnson and Mike Williams have caught 60. Only Tommy Kane, Rob Moore and Marvin Harrison have accumulated that amount of yardage, with Harrison the leader at 1131. The eight touchdowns have been matched or exceeded several times. The question is: do we have anyone who can do that this year? Marcus Sales, who caught three long TD passes in the Pinstripe Bowl was thought to be our best returning receiver but took himself out of the running by getting arrested for (allegedly) trying to sell drugs with his brother. The actual top returning receiver is Van Chew, who caught 41 for 611 yards and 5 TDs, well short of the top 25 standards, although the average per catch is similar, (14.9 vs. 15.0). Van got off to a great start with 30 catches for 498 yards and 4 scores in the first 7 games. But injuries rendered him ineffective after that. With a full healthy season, he could approach the top 25 standard.

Nassib is on his way to a top 25 season: 296 of 408 (.725) for 2904 yards, 28 TDs passes, 4 interceptions

Both Lemon and Chew are on a pass for top 25 receiving years: Lemon 96 receptions 872 yards (9.1) 8TDs, Chew 60 receptions for 960 yards, 12 TDs.

Bailey will wind up short of top 25 standards: 196 carries ofr 816 yards, (4.2), 8TDs.

Of course, they have to maintina their current rates through the rest of the seaosn to reach those numbers. Wemight not play a better team than USC this eyar but we will play better teams than Wake Forest and Rhode Island.
That's an interesting way to look at this stuff. One of these days, I'll be curious to compare the avg performance of a qb/wr/rb on a top 25 team vs the avg performances of the top 25 qb/wr/rb (some of which might be on bad teams. Not asking you to do that. Your idea makes sense, it could be that being at the top of the individual stats means your team isn't balanced enough to win a lot
 

SWC75

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That's an interesting way to look at this stuff. One of these days, I'll be curious to compare the avg performance of a qb/wr/rb on a top 25 team vs the avg performances of the top 25 qb/wr/rb (some of which might be on bad teams. Not asking you to do that. Your idea makes sense, it could be that being at the top of the individual stats means your team isn't balanced enough to win a lot


http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs
 

Dnyr85

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As it turns out, Toledo gives up more than 300+ ypg through the air. I think their weakness plays to this team's strength :rolleyes:

Our weakness plays into their strength right now as well. They can pass the ball quite well, especially how effective they run that screen play. Our hurt secondary is gonna have it's hands full with them, especially Page.
 

dollarbill44

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Our offense seems to run best when it moves quickly. For some reason, we seem to take our time between plays an awful lot. I wish we'd run more no-huddle.

That may be why offensive numbers are so high, lately. A few high-profile programs are going up-tempo, which means a lot more plays on offense, which means more chances to score. We aren't getting nearly the number of snaps per game that we should be. Didn't Marrone state at some point that he wanted about 80-85 snaps on offense per game? Some of that comes down to not moving the chains enough, but I think a lot of it just comes down to not prioritizing tempo?
 

OttoinGrotto

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Our offense seems to run best when it moves quickly. For some reason, we seem to take our time between plays an awful lot. I wish we'd run more no-huddle.

That may be why offensive numbers are so high, lately. A few high-profile programs are going up-tempo, which means a lot more plays on offense, which means more chances to score. We aren't getting nearly the number of snaps per game that we should be. Didn't Marrone state at some point that he wanted about 80-85 snaps on offense per game? Some of that comes down to not moving the chains enough, but I think a lot of it just comes down to not prioritizing tempo?
Good post.
 

dollarbill44

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i'm guessing he wants to keep our defense off the field. especially our secondary who cramps up more than menopause

Maybe, but if it means picking up a first down or two instead of a 3 and out, it's not really bringing the D back on any quicker. Besides, you can always slow down after a couple of 1st downs, then pick it up again. Cycling tempo up and down may be more effective overall because the D doesn't know what speed you're going to be operating from down to down.

I don't know, maybe the entire offense isn't ready for this kind of game yet, but when they have been most effective this season, it has been when they have moved with more purpose (see 4th Q v WFU and the last TD drive against USC).
 

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