Those two kids Marrone passed on

[TheCusian]

Just looked at the recruiting side of things then came over here to find this thread. I'm not sure any of it matters now - live Shafer and the future is bright.

 

[Orangeyes]

NFL scouts love Gordon's home run ability

 

[SmilinBob]

I always compare Marrone to the Wolf on Pulp Fiction. SU called...he cleaned up the mess and left. He wasn't there to make friends. Now, we have what I think is an excellent staff so I'm thrilled with how this has progressed.

 

[wfschrec]

I'd rather have won games and turned the program around, as Marrone did, then to worry about potentially missing on a couple of kids. We owe Doug a debt of gratitude that I *hope* Shafer eventually reaches.

For every guy we "miss" on there is a Jay Bromley that is discovered ... sweating over these two, while they are very good players, is fruitless.

 

[Rocco]

Why was that? Mele was a workout warrior who got more out of himself than most.

He may have been a weight-room stud, but he wasn't BCS D1 material. Same goes for a number of those guys.

 

[rrlbees]

He may have been a weight-room stud, but he wasn't BCS D1 material. Same goes for a number of those guys.

Talent wasn't the question. Although he did have a decent season being 3rd(?) in tackles. So since we have 85 man rosters, I guess we should just tell the bottom 10 or more to get lost each year.

 

[Pyle]

Talent wasn't the question. Although he did have a decent season being 3rd(?) in tackles. So since we have 85 man rosters, I guess we should just tell the bottom 10 or more to get lost each year.

Mele, Flaherty, Giruzzi, etc were all major players in the 2008 disaster. Art gets a pass but the rest of that defense is highly suspect after giving up 40+ to Akron. Many of them didn't belong in D1 period, let alone on a BCS team. Doesn't mean I don't respect those kids for giving everything they had but in that game alone, Mele had 3 solo tackles. 2 of them occured after a 15+ yard gains. The other was in garbage time while Akron ran out the clock. Not exactly SportsCenter highlight type stuff. Fast forward 1 year to D. Smith and D. Hogue at LB and we had a legit squad.

 

[SWC75]

Jim Calhoun on recruiting:

 

[Finwad32]

Mele, Flaherty, Giruzzi, etc were all major players in the 2008 disaster. Art gets a pass but the rest of that defense is highly suspect after giving up 40+ to Akron. Many of them didn't belong in D1 period, let alone on a BCS team. Doesn't mean I don't respect those kids for giving everything they had but in that game alone, Mele had 3 solo tackles. 2 of them occured after a 15+ yard gains. The other was in garbage time while Akron ran out the clock. Not exactly SportsCenter highlight type stuff. Fast forward 1 year to D. Smith and D. Hogue at LB and we had a legit squad.

That Akron game was when I officially gave up on Greg Robinson, it's the first and only season I didn't attend all games possible. After watching that Defense get beat repeatedly on the outside they refused to give safety help to either Nico or Kevin Scott on the edge. Whats worse is Akron put up 250 + on the ground against 8 in the box all day. Ridiculous show of futility for major college football.

My blood pressure raised 50 points discussing this, how quickly we forget.

 

[Rocco]

Talent wasn't the question. Although he did have a decent season being 3rd(?) in tackles. So since we have 85 man rosters, I guess we should just tell the bottom 10 or more to get lost each year.

Someone who doesn't want to accept the "new regime, new rules" needs to go. Someone who was blatantly told they wouldn't play also needs to go.

What should of DM done?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Someone who was blatantly told they wouldn't play also needs to go.

I think, just throwing this out there, that some of the guys that were told they wouldn't play that left... probably would have actually played a lot.

 

[Rocco]

I think, just throwing this out there, that some of the guys that were told they wouldn't play that left... probably would have actually played a lot.

Out of necessicity if anything. Some of those had no quickness or speed, relatively speaking to their competition. Might as well play the young guys.

After losing 25 guys to start off his first season, Marrone still tied GRob's best campaign at 4-8. He went to a bowl game the next year.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Out of necessicity if anything. Some of those had no quickness or speed, relatively speaking to their competition. Might as well play the young guys.

We didn't actually do that, though, or even have that many young guys coming in at the time.

I've done this goat dance before, and there's no need to go in to this again, but in my opinion Marrone wanted to establish himself as the boss man right away (he needed to). Some of the things he did in order to show the players he was in charge went a little too far and were unnecessary, and it cost us some guys that could have helped. I do think he learned from that, but there were some things at the beginning when the roster was turning over that he handled badly.

 

[rrlbees]

Someone who doesn't want to accept the "new regime, new rules" needs to go. Someone who was blatantly told they wouldn't play also needs to go. What should of DM done?

Again, every season, every roster, there are guys that will never see the field. And it had nothing to do with new rules. What rules were those?

 

[rrlbees]

Mele, Flaherty, Giruzzi, etc were all major players in the 2008 disaster. Art gets a pass but the rest of that defense is highly suspect after giving up 40+ to Akron. Many of them didn't belong in D1 period, let alone on a BCS team. Doesn't mean I don't respect those kids for giving everything they had but in that game alone, Mele had 3 solo tackles. 2 of them occured after a 15+ yard gains. The other was in garbage time while Akron ran out the clock. Not exactly SportsCenter highlight type stuff. Fast forward 1 year to D. Smith and D. Hogue at LB and we had a legit squad.

Smith had already been moved to LB and Hogue would have been regardless of Marrone. He wanted to move the prior season but due to early season injuries we did not. But yes, they were a huge upgrade.

 

[Pyle]

We didn't actually do that, though, or even have that many young guys coming in at the time.

I've done this goat dance before, and there's no need to go in to this again, but in my opinion Marrone wanted to establish himself as the boss man right away (he needed to). Some of the things he did in order to show the players he was in charge went a little too far and were unnecessary, and it cost us some guys that could have helped. I do think he learned from that, but there were some things at the beginning when the roster was turning over that he handled badly.

Mistakes? Yes. Totally changed the culture overnight(at least relatively speaking)? Yes. This team needed an enema and DM gave it one.

Again, every season, every roster, there are guys that will never see the field. And it had nothing to do with new rules. What rules were those?

IDK stuff like enforcing curfews, not letting players break in and vandalize equipment rooms without severe penalties, making players look respectable in interviews, not letting guys run Hookah bars. I didn't really think anyone would need this spelled out. The team culture between DM and Grob is night and day.

 

[Rocco]

We didn't actually do that, though, or even have that many young guys coming in at the time.

I've done this goat dance before, and there's no need to go in to this again, but in my opinion Marrone wanted to establish himself as the boss man right away (he needed to). Some of the things he did in order to show the players he was in charge went a little too far and were unnecessary, and it cost us some guys that could have helped. I do think he learned from that, but there were some things at the beginning when the roster was turning over that he handled badly.

Again, every season, every roster, there are guys that will never see the field. And it had nothing to do with new rules. What rules were those?

Would be easiest to discuss this in person. I really don't feel like typing out my take, "new rules", etc especially that I cannot provide context. I disagree with both of you to an extent, but certainly see agree with some of the points.

End of the day, Marrone was disgusted with the way Syracuse Football had fallen off and was going to make wholesale changes across the board. He did that, and it seems like it worked out well. Things could've been done better, but a philosophical change program-wide was necessary in his eyes.

 

[rrlbees]

Mistakes? Yes. Totally changed the culture overnight(at least relatively speaking)? Yes. This team needed an enema and DM gave it one. IDK stuff like enforcing curfews, not letting players break in and vandalize equipment rooms without severe penalties, making players look respectable in interviews, not letting guys run Hookah bars. I didn't really think anyone would need this spelled out. The team culture between DM and Grob is night and day.

And a lot more kids got in trouble under Marrone. So I guess the players didn't get the memo.

 

[GoSU96]

I think, just throwing this out there, that some of the guys that were told they wouldn't play that left... probably would have actually played a lot.

Which guys?

 

[wfschrec]

And a lot more kids got in trouble under Marrone. So I guess the players didn't get the memo.

Well either that or it wasn't handled the same as it was under GRob. When I was a student there a lot of players did really bad things and it was swept under the rug when it could be controlled ... maybe Marrone didn't want to consistently bail kids out of tough spots and finally let them feel the heat. I was on M-Street when a former linebacker launched someone through a pizza shop window and that whole thing was buried, very little was done to said player.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Which guys?

Parker Canty for sure. Chestnut, we forget about him. Middleton for sure. Probably Mele. Cervino might have offered some special teams help.

 

[Full_Rebar]

Chestnut's situation was determined outside of the football office...and to be fair incidents were "swept under the rug" under DM as well.

 

[Orangeyes]

Chestnut's situation was determined outside of the football office...and to be fair incidents were "swept under the rug" under DM as well.

Very sad situation with Nick he could do the work but was sidetracked. Great kid, great family.

 

[GoSU96]

Parker Canty for sure. Chestnut, we forget about him. Middleton for sure. Probably Mele. Cervino might have offered some special teams help.

Chestnut and Middleton didn't leave the program because they were told they weren't going to play.

Cervino was a 1-AA player, same with Mele.

Canty - might have made the two deep, but he was never going to start.

The two kids that hurt were Mike Jones - didn't want to switch positions and Collier - couldn't stay off the pipe.

 

[Orangeyes]

and Collier - couldn't stay off the pipe.

Didn't he and Josh White set off smoke alarms once?