Tired of All the Red Bashing... | Page 2 | Syracusefan.com

Tired of All the Red Bashing...

The more I am watching from Red the more I am questioning if last year he did a good job or we just had Mintz. Headcase or not he saved a lot of games.
Don't forget Brown. He was a force on defense and the most efficient SU player on the roster. And he wasn't starting until the starting center went down and the other three centers on the roster couldn't play at this level.
 
I dont re-call anybody saying that we shouldn't bother with Lampkin when there was some question about his honoring the NIL agreement. Everybody was on board with making sure we wrapped him up. Is he this slow because he is hurting or because he is just this slow ?

Hindsight criticism is easy.

I admit to having wanted Lampkin, but I never preferred him to Brown.

A poster above said he had some alternate names to Lampkin and Carlos, but declined to name them. How about we get everything front and center if you want to pound on the Coach.
The coach owns the roster. I like his HS recruiting, but our transfers have mostly been a mess. We have hit on 2 guys. JJ and Davis. The 6 other guys we have signed through the portal the past two seasons have given us nothing or nothing close to expectations.

That said the rotations and game strategy need help as well.

We are shooting 26% from 3 on the year! 26% in 2024. Unheard of! 7 teams in all of D1 are worse. That is it.
 
That is one thing that really isn't true. Brown did not want to play the 5. He thought he would play the 4 at Duke. He was wrong and is playing small ball 5. Red deserves his share of critique. But not in this case.
That's fine. I don't get how Maliq didn't see this though. They had the best PF recruit going back at least a decade.
 
There are threads from all offseason about the Lampkin concerns and the PG concerns on the recruiting forums.

Suggesting it's hindsight is ignorance or gaslighting.
I just went back and checked the lampkin thread. There are over 100 pages. I went thru the first five. Vast majority wanted him and quite a few even preferred him to Brown if we could not have both.

so I stand by my hindsight comment.

check it out for yourself.
 
We have hit on 2 guys. JJ and Davis.
JJ? The guy who can't go left, doesn't shoot all that well, and has awful defense? The fact that he's not the worst starter on the team is more of an indictment on the roster overall than a positive. Jyare has been great for what he is and probably should be getting a lot more run.
 
Don't forget Brown. He was a force on defense and the most efficient SU player on the roster. And he wasn't starting until the starting center went down and the other three centers on the roster couldn't play at this level.
Now the decision to start JT over Brown (early in season) and over Quadir (after Brown started at center) seems screwed up.

 
JJ? The guy who can't go left, doesn't shoot all that well, and has awful defense? The fact that he's not the worst starter on the team is more of an indictment on the roster overall than a positive. Jyare has been great for what he is and probably should be getting a lot more run.
Not going to have any disagreement here. I do think JJ did take a step up this offensively, but his defense is atrocious.
 
Now the decision to start JT over Brown (early in season) and over Quadir (after Brown started at center) seems screwed up.

Quadir ended up at Mcneese for a reason. I don’t blame Red for not starting him. He was good at basketball and terrible at everything else that came with it.
 
I dont re-call anybody saying that we shouldn't bother with Lampkin when there was some question about his honoring the NIL agreement. Everybody was on board with making sure we wrapped him up. Is he this slow because he is hurting or because he is just this slow ?

Hindsight criticism is easy.

I admit to having wanted Lampkin, but I never preferred him to Brown.

A poster above said he had some alternate names to Lampkin and Carlos, but declined to name them. How about we get everything front and center if you want to pound on the Coach.

You SURE about this post? Really sure?
 
I dont re-call anybody saying that we shouldn't bother with Lampkin

I just went back and checked the lampkin thread. There are over 100 pages. I went thru the first five. Vast majority wanted him and quite a few even preferred him to Brown if we could not have both.

so I stand by my hindsight comment.

check it out for yourself.

So is it anybody or vast majority?
 
I think everybody would agree that he did somewhere between a solid to a very good job last season.

This season's roster is screwed up because we blew the portal. Was that Red's fault ? Can anybody point to some other players in the portal that we could have gotten with our available NIL $$$$ that are doing better ?

Carlos and Lampkin are disappointments compared to our expectations. Taylor is a total bust. Only Davis has shown value in terms of our portal grabs.

We didnt pay up for Leffew who we clearly wanted. We let Brown leave. Team would have been entirely different if we had spent competitively. Same happened the year before when we didnt pay up for Jesse. Is that cheapness on Red ? You think Red didnt see that Brown > Lampkin or Leffew > Carlos ???

This season's mess got compounded with the JJ injury.

So what can we lay on Red ?

In terms of player development - maybe a lack of improvement by Bell is on the Coach. On the plus side - very nice progressions from Freeman and JJ (before he was hurt). Moore is coming along nicely - my biggest gripe with Red is I think Moore should be seen more.

On the recruiting front - Red has been a huge upgrade from what we saw of the last ten or so Jimmy years. Five stars in consecutive classes plus 4 stars Kiyan and Moore. I have a good feeling about the Aussie kid, though it is obviously pre-mature to say he will be the PG answer. We are in the mix for others. I think we have clearly had A level recruiting the last two classes. Only issue will be can we keep these kids for more than one season ??

This team cant shoot. A game with zero threes made in this day and age ???? Poor to erratic FT %. Well, that is at least something that just continues our long tradition.

On D - thank goodness we are basically done with the dino-Zone. I see the D gradually improving, but how good can it get with an undersized PG and a slow center ?

Bottom line - you cant win without talent. We lack even mid-ACC pack level talent, especially without JJ.

Now, if somebody thinks they can hang the portal selections on Red, then criticism is fair. If not, give the man a chance to prove or not prove how good a coach he is when we have a level playing field in terms of talent on the Court.
I love the contrarian take here and think there is some merit to your thoughts. It's easy to join the mob and flip out when things aren't going well. Specifically, I believe you are correct in that there are challenges here that are going to make it a different era of syracuse basketball -- if we can't compete on NIL, this is a very challenging job for whoever is sitting in that head coach chair.

Where I disagree is that it's too early to critique what Red is putting on the floor. While I absolutely acknowledge the NIL issues, I'm fairly certain we actively moved off of Maliq Brown and into the Eddie Lampkin business. Lampkin is a fine player and whether he is worth the money or not is not something I want to debate. But a big, physical center who doesn't move well on the perimeter is going to be tough if you see yourself as a team that plays pressure man defense.

Similarly, we made a concerted decision to ride with JJ and Bell. I don't want to knock either kid personally but I'm not sure either are corner-stone players, particularly not on the defensive end of the floor (I give Bell a ton of credit, by the way, because I think he has worked hard to become significantly better on that end the past two years).

I really thought we would have been well-served at bringing in some longer, athletic, defensive-minded players the past two years. Given the NIL budget, this likely means sacrificing offense, but I just don't get how you're going to run a defense that wants to limit how much help you're giving unless you've got versatile, switchable wing defenders. We had one last year (Q). We have zero this year. It just won't work that way.

Lastly, I'm just completely mystified by what we are even trying to accomplish defensively. Obviously if we are not getting the talent we desire (and again, perhaps this is all NIL related, which isn't expressly Red's fault), our defense is going to suffer. But what we are running is extremely simplistic and rudimentary. Further, I would argue that you really show your chops as a coach when you have to adapt and adjust depending on the various challenges you face. We'll see what happens here, but doesn't look great on that front so far.

So, I'm not entirely out on Red, but I'll acknowledge that I agree with the crew that doesn't think it looks good for him. I think 20 wins last year was nice, but that was a very flawed team with some odd personnel decisions (although Jesse returning, would have put us in the tourney discussion, IMO). This year's group doesn't look like it will sniff 20 ... 10 may be difficult.

It is an uphill battle for Red, I'm afraid.
 
I'm sorry, but if you have a multi million dollar contract then you will be subject to intense scrutiny. And contrary to what many think, Red has not done a good job. Roster construction, game preparation, rotations, in game adjustments, etc have been all frankly embarrassing and substandard. Not saying he won't improve but right now he is failing miserably.
 
Also can we stop with this 20-win BS !! 20 wins is now an arbitrary number which means very little. In the previous no-data era 20 wins almost guaranteed you a spot in the tournament and now it doesnt. All that matters is if your team makes the tournaments saying a coach or team won 20 games as it is some sort of measure of success is such an out dated way of thinking.
 
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So is it anybody or vast majority?
How much a poster on this board appreciated Maliq Brown is a litmus test for how much people know about what wins/loses basketball games. That's an east coast liberal elite stance, I understand it. But Brown is a player who's value extended far beyond his numbers or the number of sports center top 10 dunks he had. For most fans, an appreciation on this level is elusive. It's much easier to love Bell's three-point shooting (at least it was last year) or, in past years, Devendof's swag and scoring than it is to love Josh Pace's versatility and unselfishness or Andy Rautins' ability to push offenses away from the basket at the top of the 2-3. It's basketball snobby, I get it. But it's also true.
 
tired of all the red apologists
I'm tired of all of it. All I know is this is far and away the worst SU basket all has ever been in my Fandom, dating back to 1977.
The people who deserve blame are the ones who aren't fixing this cesspool.
I can't watch it anymore because every game makes me upset.
At least when I listen to the radio feed, I have no idea what the score is, so I can pretend we're winning every game.

Make me feel good again. Make me feel good again... (scene fades with Dollarbill sobbing).
 
The more I am watching from Red the more I am questioning if last year he did a good job or we just had Mintz. Headcase or not he saved a lot of games.

Yeah I’m wondering the same thing.
No need to wonder -- I was arguing this all year last year. The criticisms of Mintz were warranted in many key ways but got so out of control that they lost sight of the fact that he was a really talented basketball player. He spend the first half of the year playing largely with a lineup that included McLeod, Taylor, a struggling JJ and a standstill shooter (albeit a very good one) in Bell. He was creating about 80% of that group's offense.
 
No need to wonder -- I was arguing this all year last year. The criticisms of Mintz were warranted in many key ways but got so out of control that they lost sight of the fact that he was a really talented basketball player. He spend the first half of the year playing largely with a lineup that included McLeod, Taylor, a struggling JJ and a standstill shooter (albeit a very good one) in Bell. He was creating about 80% of that group's offense.
Despite the "20 Wins", the fact he played Taylor as much as he did was something to bring up as a negative for sure.

Taylor currently averages 10 mins a game, 1.7 pts, 1.7 rbs for James Madison
 
I'm tired of the team sucking.

And I'm even more tired of segments of the fanbase telling me how I should feel about it.
Just be happy with your memories. It's mean to expect Red to be good at his job. He waited a long time for the big chair and deserves 3+ years to put his stamp on the program that was handed to him without a real candidate search.
 
I think we can safely look back and give this one to Townie.
 

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