To everyone on this board who called for Marrone's head...

[Forza Azzurri]

You could not see obvious improvement on the field this year, especially offensively and from an overall talent level standpoint? I know you said we are improving (I'm not responding to you directly persay). We are on the rise. I hate the "turned the corner" phrase as it is so abused on this board - I'd like it banned actually. Marrone has the program trending in the right direction, and more importantly, the players are all-in. They believe in what this staff is preaching to them, and it is starting to show on the field. The team chemistry and program values are so much greater than they were 5 years ago. That is how I determine "turned the corner" or "improved".

Every game has it share of bad breaks, depends on which way they fall that could influence your W-L in some of them. Just like you say we were "two terrific last minute drives away from being 5-7", well that could also be said that if we didn't turn the ball over, commit untimely penalties and have other horrible mistakes, we would be 11-1 and easily headed to a BCS bowl. This year's team was never out of a game, unlike in recent years' past. The kids are competitive as hell, and I give the staff huge credit for instilling confidence in the team that they can beat anyone on the schedule. A few years ago, if we were down 20-0 to USF at halftime, we would've lost 48-7. This year the team sacked up, went out and played their game and wound up winning. That game was pivotal and it showed how far we have come from a confidence standpoint.

I can't imagine the **** Marrone was hearing after that Rutgers loss. It comes with the job for sure. Frankly, he is the face of the program so he will get the tomatoes in his face during rough times and treated like a savior during good times. He was still able to fire up his team to finish 5-1 down the stretch. And I'm damn happy he's our coach, and have been since he was hired.

Not disagreeing with a word in this post. Our posts are not mutually exclusive.

We are improving. We are on the rise. I am also damn glad he is our coach.

But to me, "turned the corner" means we are now where we ought to be and I don't think we are there yet.

When we are a perennial top 25 program again, we will have turned the corner.

 

[Orangetradition44]

Big Picture, the guy has done a great job.

I agree. I just think it won't matter if he doesn't get to a certain level in a certain amount of time, and I'm still not 100% confident he'll get there.

 

[Orangetradition44]

And he's getting better at his job over time.

And I think that is the biggest positive to come out of this year that hopefully is an indicator that we will continue on our current trajectory.

 

[NashvilleOrange]

I was beginning to lose faith in DM but obviously he has proven me wrong. I obviously cheer for him and wish the program nothing but the greatest success but the timely turn around is beginning to look better and better. If he had tanked the rest of the year and the choice was to let him go, the other programs looking for coaches would make finding a suitable replacement very difficult. Auburn, Arkansas, Tennessee, Colorado, California, Purdue, NC State and even Kentucky would all be jobs that could be taken over SU.

 

[Rocco]

When we are a perennial top 25 program again, we will have turned the corner.

When we are perennially in the top 25 again, alot of people will be thrilled.

 

[tep624]

Not disagreeing with a word in this post. Our posts are not mutually exclusive.

We are improving. We are on the rise. I am also damn glad he is our coach.

But to me, "turned the corner" means we are now where we ought to be and I don't think we are there yet.

When we are a perennial top 25 program again, we will have turned the corner.

Where we ought to be is relative. We are where we ought to be coming of a 4 year stretch at 10-37 with a roster that was 1/3 1AA talent. If we win this bowl game, we'll be 25-25 over Marrone's tenure, 2 winning seasons, 2 bowl wins and a conference championship. I think the hard part for everyone was last season - if you swap the results of 2010 and 2011, you see a trend that shows more of a progression. Maybe we were ahead of schedule with 2010?

We may have been 2 last minute drives away from 5-7, as you said above, but we were also a last minute drive away from 8-4 (NW game) and really a turnover away from beating both Rutgers (the blocked Kick TD - 1 play with a 10 pt swing) and MN (1st and goal at MN 1 in 3rd Q - Nassib INT on 3rd down). We could be 10-2 as easily as 5-7.

 

[KaiserUEO]

Pretty close?

As in, "Fire his arse now"?

Well if anything, that's certainly how I'd phrase it.

In the backwash of the cindy game, I may have tossed that 1 out there, but never spent any time driving that point home.

I want the SU alum, who called this his dream job and the only reason he's been coaching for 20 years was to get this job...to have it for 20 years. But there were moments where I thought his dream was going to end the same as mine...the 1 where i buy Jeters apt with cash...it aint gonna happen.

He's got a better shot of realizing his dream than I though....

 

[solvaycuse44]

Go. Pound. Salt.

BE co-champs. Dominated down the stretch.

Enjoy the balogne Doug. F all of the naysayers.

I loved marrone and knew he was the right guy from jump(the beginning)

 

[Scooch]

I'm thrilled at the way the second half of this season went. Thrilled.

I assume if we go 5-7 next year everyone thumping their chests now will eat crow?

 

[BostonOrange]

Didn't the two 4thQ winning drives with less than two minutes and one or no timeouts? Didn't they run a four minute offense to perfection in a 1pt win against Pitt.

There wasn't a single clock mgmt decision that needed to be made on any of those drives that a 2nd grader couldn't make. Umm...lets see...we are down 5 with 2 minutes to go...lets throw the ball and get up to the line quickly. Genius! And against Pitt he handed the ball off at the end when a kneel down would have ended the game. And his dec to kick the long fg in the rain against cincy was dumb. That said in a more general sense you are absolutly right. All the stuff I usually bitch about is 'micro' in nature. From a macro point of view there is no doubt we are waaaaay better than we were when he arrived. No doubt. I just want him to keep getting better at the micro stuff because as we continue to improve it will matter more and more. That's all I'm saying.

 

[Jeepers]

#1 for me is that the guy was willing to change and adapt. Something I never felt Coach P would be able to do.

 

[anomander]

Still not where we need to be. Headed in the right direction. No doubt. But it's not a foregone conclusion that we'll get there. Lots of question marks. Doug and the team had a hell of a second half to the season, and I'm all for enjoying it and waiting to answer the questions next year.

I couldn't be happier where we are. Just 4 years ago DM took over arguably the worst football team in the nation. Now we are set up to compete in the top half of the acc immediately. The amount of talent he has stock piled in the fr/so class is something to be very optimistic about. Not to mention a lot of these guys saw serious big game action this year and last. The depth he has developed so quickly should be commended. Not to mention he has done this with almost exclusively under the radar kids. The coaching staff has done an excellent job of identifying talent, and especially products that fit their system. I just can't wait to see what he does once he actually starts to get 4 star talent mixed in. I am fully aboard the Doug Marrone bandwagon.

 

[SoBristol]

Lots of reasons for 5-1 finish this season, versus 0-5 finish last season.
An improved Nassib had Sales, an improved West, to go along with Lemon. These 4 were the key to the passing attack -- you think these players weren't the biggest reason for the offensive success of this team?
OK, here are some others:
Hickey was a huge upgrade.
Up-tempo mostly shot-gun offense installed by Hackett. Marrone & Hackett researched what other teams were doing, made changes.
Hackett was in his 2nd season as OC -- much improved.
Depth at RB -- we had some vs none. Smith emerged as a tough 1000 yd runner, and Gulley stayed healthy
LBs -- much better with a year of experience under the belt.
DTs - Bromley, Crume & Goggins got better.
Specials -- kicking and coverage much better. Players like Vaughan, Coker, Vigile, Desir, Morgan devoted themselves to coverage.

Marrone said, repeatedly, "I have to do a better job" -- and he did. Ball control became a point of emphasis; fewer dumb penalties (maybe); sideline demeanor improved as he showed a little energy.

I have no doubt that Marrone deserves credit for a solid rebuilding job; and no doubt that he did do a better job week to week (specials, for example). He is the right guy for SU. And what I would add is that a lot of good things came together to allow Marrone to be successful this season.

 

[chakka3421]

I always supported Marrone - I hope we are seeing just the beginning of his potential. It seems to me that we just need a few more playmakers and a decent replacement for Nassib and will be in contention for conference championships more often than not.

TGD needs to pay DM a competitive wage to keep him here for another 4-5 years so Marrone can have the time to finish the rebuilding process.

I heard DM state once that he wanted to compete in a NC game. I think he stays until he runs the table in the ACC and competes for a NC title. Only then I see him going back to NFL.

 

[KaiserUEO]

#1 for me is that the guy was willing to change and adapt. Something I never felt Coach P would be able to do.

thats because he built a Hall of Fame worthy resume doing it his way.

if they upgraded the facilities etc for him, he would still be here.

Oh Lord

 

[swish7]

Go. Pound. Salt.

BE co-champs. Dominated down the stretch.

Enjoy the balogne Doug. F all of the naysayers.

Ugh.

If he sucks the first half of next year, he'll get his again. He is not bigger than the program. Where were all his now-mas-macho supporters during the deepest suckage? Ans. all turtled up.

Kudos to Dougie for a great 2nd half season. Lets hope there is indeed a foundation, and that Nassib is not the next Delone Carter.

 

[rrlbees]

if they upgraded the facilities etc for him, he would still be here.

Oh Lord

Shallow excuse. We were losing to Temple. They had no facilities and no fans. We were losing to rutgirls. They had very little facilities and no talent. Those, and epic blowout loses cost him his job.


Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[Cuseregular]

There wasn't a single clock mgmt decision that needed to be made on any of those drives that a 2nd grader couldn't make. Umm...lets see...we are down 5 with 2 minutes to go...lets throw the ball and get up to the line quickly. Genius! And against Pitt he handed the ball off at the end when a kneel down would have ended the game. And his dec to kick the long fg in the rain against cincy was dumb. That said in a more general sense you are absolutly right. All the stuff I usually bitch about is 'micro' in nature. From a macro point of view there is no doubt we are waaaaay better than we were when he arrived. No doubt. I just want him to keep getting better at the micro stuff because as we continue to improve it will matter more and more. That's all I'm saying.

yep. This is why I'm not overly concerned if he decides to move on (though that said this fan is hoping and praying he sticks around a long long time). Macro he haas the programs corner turned to at least respectability, and I think a good hire (which the program in it's current state should have no problem attracting), a good hire builds on that. And maybe just maybe get the micro right too as you and Millhouse note.

 

[Cuse2010]

Where we ought to be is relative. We are where we ought to be coming of a 4 year stretch at 10-37 with a roster that was 1/3 1AA talent. If we win this bowl game, we'll be 25-25 over Marrone's tenure, 2 winning seasons, 2 bowl wins and a conference championship. I think the hard part for everyone was last season - if you swap the results of 2010 and 2011, you see a trend that shows more of a progression. Maybe we were ahead of schedule with 2010?

We may have been 2 last minute drives away from 5-7, as you said above, but we were also a last minute drive away from 8-4 (NW game) and really a turnover away from beating both Rutgers (the blocked Kick TD - 1 play with a 10 pt swing) and MN (1st and goal at MN 1 in 3rd Q - Nassib INT on 3rd down). We could be 10-2 as easily as 5-7.

We are also an overtime fumble against Rutgers, or dropped pick 6 in same game from being in 3 straight bowls

 

[Rocco]

Ugh.

If he sucks the first half of next year, he'll get his again. He is not bigger than the program. Where were all his now-mas-macho supporters during the deepest suckage? Ans. all turtled up

Well I'd say that I am right here, and was right here during last season's collapse as well as this year's rough start. I cannot speak for others, but I know others on here who have been just as supportive of him as me.

He is not bigger than the program. I agree with this; however, I also believe that he is one of the few great coaches that we will have in this school's history (albeit prematurely). The man has a unique vision for the direction of the program. I really hope that it comes to fruition; I think we saw a sneak peak over the last 6-7 games of the year. Looking forward to seeing it over the course of a whole season based on finishing out this year 5-1 and, of course, a little bit of blind faith.

 

[Rocco]

yep. This is why I'm not overly concerned if he decides to move on (though that said this fan is hoping and praying he sticks around a long long time). Macro he haas the programs corner turned to at least respectability, and I think a good hire (which the program in it's current state should have no problem attracting), a good hire builds on that. And maybe just maybe get the micro right too as you and Millhouse note.

Alright, I see your point here and I can't disagree with you to an extent. The extent being if he moved on, we would essentially be starting over, even if we can go out and get an up-and-coming coach. For this program's sake, we need to keep someone at the helm for a little longer than 4 years. While there is no guarantee that DM will truly succeed, I feel he already has accomplished enough in terms of righting the ship. Just need to continue improving to consistently be a winner and be able to compete for conf championships. A change in leadership would stunt the program's growth right now IMO.

 

[GoSU96]

Ugh.

If he sucks the first half of next year, he'll get his again. He is not bigger than the program. Where were all his now-mas-macho supporters during the deepest suckage? Ans. all turtled up.

Kudos to Dougie for a great 2nd half season. Lets hope there is indeed a foundation, and that Nassib is not the next Delone Carter.

Turtled?, BS.

Deepest suckage? they played one bad game all year. And what's with "bigger than the program"? Whoever claimed that.

When the record was 2-4 I said they were going 4-2 or better.

 

[RF2044]

Not disagreeing with a word in this post. Our posts are not mutually exclusive.

We are improving. We are on the rise. I am also damn glad he is our coach.

But to me, "turned the corner" means we are now where we ought to be and I don't think we are there yet.

When we are a perennial top 25 program again, we will have turned the corner.

I don't disagree with this post. I believe that the FOUNDATION has clearly been set for accomplishing what you list above. In that regard, the team has come a LONG way in four years. Recruiting is better, the kids are bigger / more athletic / faster than they were, the system seems exciting, etc.

The key will now be sustainability: can we keep the momentum rolling, or will there be a dropoff next year sans Nassib / Lemon / Sales?

 

[SoBristol]

... I believe that the FOUNDATION has clearly been set for accomplishing what you list above. In that regard, the team has come a LONG way in four years. Recruiting is better, the kids are bigger / more athletic / faster than they were, the system seems exciting, etc.

The key will now be sustainability: can we keep the momentum rolling, or will there be a dropoff next year sans Nassib / Lemon / Sales?

No doubt we have come a long way under Marrone (two bowls speak for themselves); we have also been very lucky this season. How many teams have played one QB all season, nearly every snap? The entire OL (after Pugh's return) and starting TE intact -- all season. All top receivers healthy -- all season? DL, DBs & LBs -- similar. Nothing like last season when we lost key players (Sales, Gulley) and limped through November.

As for recruiting, Marrone has clearly improved the depth and size of the team. It hasn't been dramatic (in terms of top skill players or high profile defenders); and it has been something of a patchwork (blending in JUCOs to fill gaps). And, if you follow recruiting, you can see that Rutgers, Pitt and West Virginia have filled their 2013 classes, while SU is still working hard to catch up.

 

[RF2044]

No doubt we have come a long way under Marrone (two bowls speak for themselves); we have also been very lucky this season. How many teams have played one QB all season, nearly every snap? The entire OL (after Pugh's return) and starting TE intact -- all season. All top receivers healthy -- all season? DL, DBs & LBs -- similar. Nothing like last season when we lost key players (Sales, Gulley) and limped through November.

As for recruiting, Marrone has clearly improved the depth and size of the team. It hasn't been dramatic (in terms of top skill players or high profile defenders); and it has been something of a patchwork (blending in JUCOs to fill gaps). And, if you follow recruiting, you can see that Rutgers, Pitt and West Virginia have filled their 2013 classes, while SU is still working hard to catch up.

Hmmm, I don't agree with your assessment of 2013 recruiting--at all--and I think that our strong finish to the season positions us to close out recruiting strongly. I'm highly optimistic think you might change your opinion as well over the course of the next few weeks as things unfold.

But I don't disagree with the rest of your post. It has been a slow build in some respects, but it is also noteworthy to mention that we were perceived [and probably were] the worst BCS conference team in the nation 4 years ago. Not saying that we are 100% all the way back to the glory days of the late 80s / 90s, but incrementally we have made very solid gains in a fairly short period of time.
And to my point from the earlier post you responded to, the FOUNDATION for continued success has been established by the roster overhaul. Now, it's up to the coaches and players to sustain the success and take it to the next level.