Was last night's game... | Syracusefan.com

Was last night's game...

bnoro

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...the least-watched conference game in SU Basketball history?

Can't imagine many folks stayed up to watch that debacle, and I'm even more sure that those that did turned it off after 17-0.

Embarrassing how far we've fallen.
 
When JB was relieved of duty by ADJW, we were teetering on the precipice. The program was at what seemed like the nadir of bottoming out [oops] at that point, and making the right replacement hire was either going to help the program right the ship, or cause the program to fall of the cliff.

Setting aside whichever approach individuals supported / advocated for at the time, hiring an unproven coach and emphasizing ties to the program instead of legitimate evaluative criteria was a really bad, dumb approach.

Continuity hires make sense when things are going well, and the AD / fanbase wants to maintain a steady level of success. It makes zero sense to make a continuity hire when a program is struggling.

And here we are.
 
Continuity hires make sense when things are going well, and the AD / fanbase wants to maintain a steady level of success. It makes zero sense to make a continuity hire when a program is struggling.
This was my fear. I remember banging that drum. We saw how Duke and UNC handled the transition away from their coaching legends and failed to take into account that our new coach wouldn't be starting from the same place as them.
 
When JB was relieved of duty by ADJW, we were teetering on the precipice. The program was at what seemed like the nadir of bottoming out [oops] at that point, and making the right replacement hire was either going to help the program right the ship, or cause the program to fall of the cliff.

Setting aside whichever approach individuals supported / advocated for at the time, hiring an unproven coach and emphasizing ties to the program instead of legitimate evaluative criteria was a really bad, dumb approach.

Continuity hires make sense when things are going well, and the AD / fanbase wants to maintain a steady level of success. It makes zero sense to make a continuity hire when a program is struggling.

And here we are.
I remember well that you argued against a continuity hire in the years leading up to JB’s forced retirement and at that time of him getting pushed out as well. But when the time came, I think a lot of people on here accepted that Wildhack had to hire Red or Gmac, one of JB’s guys, in order to force JB out without too much drama. And we all just wanted JB gone by any means necessary because he had hijacked the program for so long. We can debate if Wildhack should have done the more difficult thing and gone with the outside hire then, but some insiders on here have suggested he might not have even had that choice. I wanted a proven outside hire but was hopeful that Red had the chops.
 
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I remember well that you argued against a continuity hire in the years leading up to JB’s forced retirement and at that time of him getting pushed out as well. But I think a lot of people on here accepted that Wildhack had to hire Red or Gmac, one of JB’s guys, in order to force JB out without too much drama. And we all just wanted JB gone by any means necessary because he had hijacked the program for so long. We can debate if Wildhack should have done the more difficult thing and gone with the outside hire then, but some insiders on here have suggested he might not have even had that choice. I wanted a proven outside hire but was hopeful that Red had the chops.

In a perfect world, we should have gone outside the program for the hire. However, if we had done that, JB would have gone scorched earth.

Because of that, I understand trying a legacy hire to see if we can make it work.

But make no mistake, legacy hires are always a gamble and even more so when they are handed the baton when the program is in rough shape.

What we are seeing is an eventuality that was NOT a low-probability scenario.

The probability it wouldn't work was fairly high.

We knew that going in.

Now that we know it isn't working, we're not prepared act?? We can't afford Red's buyout??

There was no contingency plan??

How many compounding mistakes will be piled on top of this situation?
 
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I legitimately forgot Syracuse had a game last night. I think I’ve crossed a new threshold where I’m not even looking up the score the morning after a game…it’s hard to do that when you forget there even was a game.
 
In a perfect world, we should have gone outside the program for the hire. However, if we had done that, JB would have gone scorched earth.

Because of that, I understand trying legacy a hire to see if we can make it work.

But make no mistake, legacy hires are always a gamble and even more so when they are handed the baton when the program is in rough shape.

What we are seeing is an eventuality that was NOT a low-probability scenario.

The probability it wouldn't work was fairly high.

We knew that going in.

Now that we know it isn't working, we're not prepared act?? We can't afford Red's buyout??

There was no contingency plan??

How many compounding mistakes will be piled on top of this situation?
Exactly. With a continuity or alumni hire, you have to act fast if it doesn’t work out (see: Louisville). I think if it wasn’t for Kiyan and the Melo family coming in next season (and perhaps to some extent JB’s influence), Wildhack would likely be pulling the plug after this season. I think the Melo factor (and Red’s recruiting abilities) throws a wrench into that. Is there proven head coach Wildhack could hire that would keep Kiyan, Melo and family committed to Cuse?
 
In a perfect world, we should have gone outside the program for the hire. However, if we had done that, JB would have gone scorched earth.

Because of that, I understand trying legacy a hire to see if we can make it work.

But make no mistake, legacy hires are always a gamble and even more so when they are handed the baton when the program is in rough shape.

What we are seeing is an eventuality that was NOT a low-probability scenario.

The probability it wouldn't work was fairly high.

We knew that going in.

Now that we know it isn't working, we're not prepared act?? We can't afford Red's buyout??

There was no contingency plan??

How many compounding mistakes will be piled on top of this situation?
No doubt -- he would have.

Because over time, he grew increasingly more petty and short tempered. And despite his clear love for SU, he hijacked the program and held it hostage for several years, which wasn't in the program's best interests. There is no doubt whatsoever that JB would have gone scorched earth.

And then it would have been over. Short term pain / ugliness, instead of long term pain / ugliness as the program slips into further irrelevancy.

And if we'd actually done due diligence and hired a qualified head coach, instead of someone who was completely unqualified and has demonstrated quickly that he's in over his head, then the program would have righted the ship, and the fans would have quickly gotten over any temper tantrum JB would have thrown, and gotten behind the new coach.

Because if there is anything that Syracusans back, it's a winner. Those negative feelings would have quickly been put in the rear view mirror IF the successor won games.

Instead, we're seeing a continuation of the program's decline, with no end in sight.
 
Exactly. With a continuity or alumni hire, you have to act fast if it doesn’t work out (see: Louisville). I think if it wasn’t for Kiyan and the Melo family coming in next season (and perhaps to some extent JB’s influence), Wildhack would likely be pulling the plug after this season. I think the Melo factor (and Red’s recruiting abilities) throws a wrench into that. Is there proven head coach Wildhack could hire that would keep Kiyan, Melo and family committed to Cuse?

I am not convinced the school can or is willing to buyout Red and hire a coach after year 2 regardless. It's simply not a combined expenditure they want to foot the bill for now.

If that makes us a cheap, unserious, irrelevant program, then perhaps so be it.
 
The Louisville game really was like two ships passing in the night. Kelsey turned over their whole roster in his first month, has weathered some injury problems and now they haven't lost in six weeks. The schedule in that time hasn't been the toughest in that they haven't played Duke and they got Clemson at home, but they also have five road wins in that stretch.
 
The Louisville game really was like two ships passing in the night. Kelsey turned over their whole roster in his first month, has weathered some injury problems and now they haven't lost in six weeks. The schedule in that time hasn't been the toughest in that they haven't played Duke and they got Clemson at home, but they also have five road wins in that stretch.

I'll take that analogy one step further.

Their ship has weathered the storm and sailed through difficulties, and is cruising.

We started taking on water in the first game, against Le Moyne, and we're sinking / already underwater.
 
I'll take that analogy one step further.

Their ship has weathered the storm and sailed through difficulties, and is cruising.

We started taking on water in the first game, against Le Moyne, and we're sinking / already underwater.
Somebody stunk up the bathroom on our ship and clogged the toilet.
 
...the least-watched conference game in SU Basketball history?

Can't imagine many folks stayed up to watch that debacle, and I'm even more sure that those that did turned it off after 17-0.

Embarrassing how far we've fallen.
Unfortunately, I listened to my heart and not my head last night. Stayed up until midnight (Central time) to watch that debacle. Early in the game (when it was 25-2) I joked that I was going to be able to go to bed early/on time. But being the glutton for punishment I am.....I stayed up to just be disappointed (yet again).
 
Unfortunately, I listened to my heart and not my head last night. Stayed up until midnight (Central time) to watch that debacle. Early in the game (when it was 25-2) I joked that I was going to be able to go to bed early/on time. But being the glutton for punishment I am...I stayed up to just be disappointed (yet again).
I'm surprised your heart is even telling you to watch. I'm completely apathetic to whatever this program has become.
 
I'm surprised your heart is even telling you to watch. I'm completely apathetic to whatever this program has become.

I get it, though -- because fans love their team.

I stayed up, too, even knowing / expecting that we were going to get pasted. We are coming up on a very difficult portion of the schedule, and we're not very good.

People were excited about beating Notre Dame -- when we were down 17 in the first half -- just so we could stay out of the bottom 3 and not miss the ACC tournament.

Expectations have changed. Which is sad.
 
I get it, though -- because fans love their team.

I stayed up, too, even knowing / expecting that we were going to get pasted. We are coming up on a very difficult portion of the schedule, and we're not very good.

People were excited about beating Notre Dame -- when we were down 17 in the first half -- just so we could stay out of the bottom 3 and not miss the ACC tournament.

Expectations have changed. Which is sad.

I posted this, I think, in the game thread maybe?

But as bad as this season's been (and it is the worst I've ever seen), there is a stretch here where if we don't grab some dubs, I would assume the players may just plan their trip to Cancun (do college kids still go there?).

Cal is NET 118. Duke will smash us. BC/Miami are 224/247, respectively. There is a shot that we can get three of four before UNC.

The nightmare is lose to Cal, get embarrassed by Duke by like 30 and then when we play BC/Miami, it's just games of zombie teams playing each other. If we lose three of those four before UNC, I mean, that's pretty dark times on top of where we already are.
 
In a perfect world, we should have gone outside the program for the hire. However, if we had done that, JB would have gone scorched earth.

Because of that, I understand trying legacy a hire to see if we can make it work.

But make no mistake, legacy hires are always a gamble and even more so when they are handed the baton when the program is in rough shape.

What we are seeing is an eventuality that was NOT a low-probability scenario.

The probability it wouldn't work was fairly high.

We knew that going in.

Now that we know it isn't working, we're not prepared act?? We can't afford Red's buyout??

There was no contingency plan??

How many compounding mistakes will be piled on top of this situation?
I don’t quite understand the “JB scorched earth” thing.

I have always said it would be very difficult for the AD to go outside because it meant firing three alums/former players, and that would have been ugly.

But how does JB’s ire have anything to do with it? They should have given JB a bonus package, receipt contingent upon his good grace in the aftermath.
 
...the least-watched conference game in SU Basketball history?

Can't imagine many folks stayed up to watch that debacle, and I'm even more sure that those that did turned it off after 17-0.

Embarrassing how far we've fallen.
I didn't even know we were playing. I just don't care enough to keep up with the schedule like I used to.
 
I don’t quite understand the “JB scorched earth” thing.

But how does JB’s ire have anything to do with it? They should have given JB a bonus package, receipt contingent upon his good grace in the aftermath.

He has whale donors that would stop donating on his direction.
 
...the least-watched conference game in SU Basketball history?

Can't imagine many folks stayed up to watch that debacle, and I'm even more sure that those that did turned it off after 17-0.

Embarrassing how far we've fallen.
This is way worse than any team JB fielded in his 40 something years as a head coach at our program. We were nationally known until he put us on the national level. Hell he is a game winner away from having 2 national championships.
 

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