What if DM had been Scoops coach

[kcsu]

I just got done reading Toms report on the fundraiser that i wish i could have been in town for . The part about Scoop and how he has turned his life around as a result of his time on the Hill and how JB and the other coaches helped him is truly fantastic. I realize that running a bball team is much different than dealing with a 100 kids on a football team. Having said that here we go. How to you think Scoop would have worked out if DM and his style had been his coach. My guess is that Scoop would have left the program. I know from the report that DM and some of the other football coaches attended and i really hope that Doug takes a lesson or two from JB on how to handle young men. Dougs approach seems to be one size fits all vs JB who treats each player as an individual both from a discipline stand point and in motivating them.

 

[OttoForLife]

Fascinating question. Makes me think that I would love to see a journalist write a lengthy piece juxtaposing SU football and basketball over the last 15 years. The contrasting styles, circumstances, personalities all found under one roof would be an interesting read.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

4 years of "why is Nassib starting over Scoop" posts.

 

[Cadillac]

I don't know. I think the question assumes Scoop would be in DM's doghouse from the get-go, while Jimmy B let Scoop do whatever.

I'm sure Jimmy B telling Scoop to get serious and drop a bunch of weight wasn't a pleasant chat. Starting Triche in 09-10 probably didn't sit well with ol' Scoop-a-loop.

The thing with Flynn and Ricky, I think DM would have his players' back in a similar weird situation.

I just think Scoop is tough and appreciative and if he played football would have ran as many Dome steps as asked and graduated team captain.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I don't know. I think the question assumes Scoop would be in DM's doghouse from the get-go, while Jimmy B let Scoop do whatever.

Scoop's uncle wouldn't have been living here for a month, and the Cheesesteak incident wouldn't have happened.

 

[GoSU96]

I just got done reading Toms report on the fundraiser that i wish i could have been in town for . The part about Scoop and how he has turned his life around as a result of his time on the Hill and how JB and the other coaches helped him is truly fantastic. I realize that running a bball team is much different than dealing with a 100 kids on a football team. Having said that here we go. How to you think Scoop would have worked out if DM and his style had been his coach. My guess is that Scoop would have left the program. I know from the report that DM and some of the other football coaches attended and i really hope that Doug takes a lesson or two from JB on how to handle young men. Dougs approach seems to be one size fits all vs JB who treats each player as an individual both from a discipline stand point and in motivating them.

85 vs 10. You already know why it's different.

And considering that Marrone is not a one strike and done guy, what's so different?

 

[Cadillac]

Scoop's uncle wouldn't have been living here for a month, and the Cheesesteak incident wouldn't have happened.

Yes that's it, I knew there was something else that led a whole bunch of people to use the dreadful "th--" word toward Scoop.

 

[kcsu]

85 vs 10. You already know why it's different.

And considering that Marrone is not a one strike and done guy, what's so different?

Im not sure what is different that is why i asked the question. My gut tells me that Doug possibly because he is dealing with about a 100 yes including walk ons that he has to be more firm in his rules. Scoop by all accounts wasnt a one and done guy but rather a 12 and stay kind of guy. Just a question Go how do you think Scoop would have ended up?

 

[xc84]

I just got done reading Toms report on the fundraiser that i wish i could have been in town for . The part about Scoop and how he has turned his life around as a result of his time on the Hill and how JB and the other coaches helped him is truly fantastic. I realize that running a bball team is much different than dealing with a 100 kids on a football team. Having said that here we go. How to you think Scoop would have worked out if DM and his style had been his coach. My guess is that Scoop would have left the program. I know from the report that DM and some of the other football coaches attended and i really hope that Doug takes a lesson or two from JB on how to handle young men. Dougs approach seems to be one size fits all vs JB who treats each player as an individual both from a discipline stand point and in motivating them.

Hmmm...maybe he would have given Scoop another chance like he did with Williams, Carter, Sales? In addition... take your pick on the f-ups Boeheim has recruited that have not worked out... did they benefit from Boeheim's style? Cherry picking Scoop and treating him as the norm rather than the exception may not be the best point to argue from.

 

[kcsu]

Hmmm...maybe he would have given Scoop another chance like he did with Williams, Carter, Sales? In addition... take your pick on the f-ups Boeheim has recruited that have not worked out... did they benefit from Boeheim's style? Cherry picking Scoop and treating him as the norm rather than the exception may not be the best point to argue from.

Gee take a break. This is a dead time of year and im just throwing stuff out. Im sure Scoop would have ended up a captain under DM

 

[GoSU96]

Im not sure what is different that is why i asked the question. My gut tells me that Doug possibly because he is dealing with about a 100 yes including walk ons that he has to be more firm in his rules. Scoop by all accounts wasnt a one and done guy but rather a 12 and stay kind of guy. Just a question Go how do you think Scoop would have ended up?

If he was a serial screw up, he'd probably be gone. Boeheim has a lot more time, space, and babysitters per head to keep guys around. And like most people Scoop would have likely calibrated his behavior based on limits, or lack thereof, provided.

Serious question, what's your point with this exercise?

 

[xc84]

Gee take a break. This is a dead time of year and im just throwing stuff out. Im sure Scoop would have ended up a captain under DM

Hey, I'm just throwing stuff out...don't get all in a tizzy about my response.

 

[OrangeAl]

Now try a post about how JB's loosey-goosey policies have brought embarrassment to the program over the years.

 

[billsin01]

I have no idea and I'm not sure it's a great thing to cherry pick one player. But I'll say this in defense of Marrone -- "discipline" is one of the founding pillars of Successful Football Coaching 101." It is literally ingrained in the sport and treated as essentially gospel.

So, is "discipline" really practiced by all the coaches who preach about it? Does "discipline" on and off the court/field in reality make you better prepared on the field/court? If you make your bed every morning, shave your facial hair off and go to bed every night at 9 p.m., are you a better athlete or soldier or whatever than if you don't necessarily do those things?

I don't know, but either way DM is just the latest in a long line of football coaches at every level espousing the essential nature of the virtue of discipline. Of all the things we can be critical of with DM, this one seems a bit overblown particularly since most here aren't aware of the ins and outs of the situations at hand.

 

[rrlbees]

If DM had been Scoops coach I am willing to bet we wouldn't have gone 34-3.

 

[xc84]

If DM had been Scoops coach I am willing to bet we wouldn't have gone 34-3.

Undefeated?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

If DM had been Scoops coach I am willing to bet we wouldn't have gone 34-3.

Boomtown!

 

[kcsu]

If he was a serial screw up, he'd probably be gone. Boeheim has a lot more time, space, and babysitters per head to keep guys around. And like most people Scoop would have likely calibrated his behavior based on limits, or lack thereof, provided.

Serious question, what's your point with this exercise?

My excercise is too fold. First im trying to get the board going. Second it is obvious that JB's players hold him in high regard past and present and that Jim has always treated each kid as an individual. I dont see too much within the management of a player that isnt custom. Doug on the other hand at least on the surface seems to have a set of rules that all players are held to regardless of the individual or the circumstance. My question is a simple one. Pretty straight forward and i provided my answer as i dont think that Dougs application of his rules would have allowed for Scoop to remain with the team. Im not saying that if JB had 100 kids to manage that he wouldnt do things more like Doug does as with a large team you might have to. I can say that Lombardi Knight Parcells to just name a few good coaches also managed players like more JB or more as individuals than Doug seems to. Different styles, different circumstances and situations to be sure and so far different results.

 

[xc84]

My excercise is too fold. First im trying to get the board going. Second it is obvious that JB's players hold him in high regard past and present and that Jim has always treated each kid as an individual. I dont see too much within the management of a player that isnt custom. Doug on the other hand at least on the surface seems to have a set of rules that all players are held to regardless of the individual or the circumstance. My question is a simple one. Pretty straight forward and i provided my answer as i dont think that Dougs application of his rules would have allowed for Scoop to remain with the team. Im not saying that if JB had 100 kids to manage that he wouldnt do things more like Doug does as with a large team you might have to. I can say that Lombardi Knight Parcells to just name a few good coaches also managed players like more JB or more as individuals than Doug seems to. Different styles, different circumstances and situations to be sure and so far different results.

Faulty argument premises. First, ask the kids who left SU (transferred) how much they Boeheim. You think Rock Lloyd was enamored with Jim and holds him in high regard? Sure, Derrick Colement loves Boeheim. We get it. Second, Marrone's "application of the rules" clearly has been giving second and even third chances. Did Scoop need 4? Yeah, Bobby Knight allowed payers to be themselves.

 

[kcsu]

Faulty argument premises. First, ask the kids who left SU (transferred) how much they Boeheim. You think Rock Lloyd was enamored with Jim and holds him in high regard? Sure, Derrick Colement loves Boeheim. We get it. Second, Marrone's "application of the rules" clearly has been giving second and even third chances. Did Scoop need 4? Yeah, Bobby Knight allowed payers to be themselves.

Ok im raising the white flag!!! If Scoop had played for Doug he would have been a first round draft choice and Rhodes Scholar

 

[MadNY3]

First im trying to get the board going..

You take it upon yourself to be some sort of Board Martyr. Leading the charge of if a football coach had been the basketball coach doesn't get the board going. It is a side turn from talking about real football.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Holy - Shoot me with this stuff.. We get it!! You think Doug should have FUN!! He should loosen up on the kids! Whistle dixie and ride a unicycle to work with a pinwheel hat. What.

He is getting paid 7 figures to get results out of 18-23 year old kids, he is also trying to make sure these kids graduate and are ready for the real world when the graduate. His approach is his approach, like or hate it but he isn't going to change. I also don't think Marrone is anywhere near the oger/ curmudgeon that many make him out to be, in fact I know he isn't. He is far from perfect on or off the field but for christ sake enough with the loosen up nonsense. Whether that equates to success, I have no idea but it's irrelevant.

I find my job much easier to do when I have 15 carpenters working as opposed to 115- Imagine that

 

[xc84]

Let's have a thread each week posing the question: What if _____________ (name a famous historical figure) had been Scoops coach? Discuss!

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Let's have a thread each week posing the question: What if _____________ (name a famous historical figure) had been Scoops coach? Discuss!

What if Scoop had been with Napoleon at Waterloo?

 

[longtimefan]

Hmmm...maybe he would have given Scoop another chance like he did with Williams, Carter, Sales? In addition... take your pick on the f-ups Boeheim has recruited that have not worked out... did they benefit from Boeheim's style? Cherry picking Scoop and treating him as the norm rather than the exception may not be the best point to argue from.

I hardly think Scoop qualifies as the "exception".