Why is it that... | Page 2 | Syracusefan.com

Why is it that...

of all the teams that have committed serious violations, for example, Louisville, N. Carolina, Kansas, UConn, Arizona, USC, Duke, etc., etc., why is it that the only measurable penalty from the NCAA was against us for a relatively minor infraction of a term paper and a couple innocent YMCA jobs. Our coach has had 101 wins taken off his resume while these other schools continuously delay proceedings until the issue is forgotten. I know this has been discussed before, but I really believe that our newspaper should editorialize this until some attention is brought and those wins are reinstated. The severity of the charges against these other institutions scream out for some sort of punishment and we just sit there and feel the lasting sting of our minor violations. Can't believe the national media has ignored our plight.
I've said this before, but SU is a private university and most of the others you listed are state schools. That is a factor. NCAA does not want state or federal governments getting too involved in their dealings and decisions.

Also, don't discount the NCAA's simple dislike of JAB in this equation. Say what you will, but he's polarizing, especially for those that aren't able to consume the totality of his character. I'm not saying he's a saint, but some just see what they want to see and they perceive him as a longstanding media bully who has ruled over his fiefdom for 4+ decades in a cantankerous fashion. Thus, the target on his back. And 3-4 years ago, an NCAA sniper picked him off from long range. It made them very happy.

Lastly, SU negotiated the scope/term of their investigation. Kept 2003 outside of the parameters. I think those on that panel always resented that too, and overcompensated in their sanctions.

Me? I am legitimately proud that SU was investigated for the better part of a decade and all they found was 5 jobs at the Y, a (voluntary) drug policy violation(s), and an altered footnote on a term paper. Oh, and a ride back to campus. Shoulda had the kid walk 12 miles instead.

Whatever, NCAA.
 
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that was not a minor thing at all & i can't take seriously anyone who still wants to pretend that it was

Uh, as compared to DECADES LONG INSTITUTIONAL-LEVEL ACADEMIC FRAUD for hundreds of student-athletes (and regular students - which made it all just a-ok), as perpetuated by UNCheat?
vs.
ONE paper, for ONE student, who was ESL.

Yeah, it's a minor thing.
I can't take seriously anyone who still wants to pretend that it wasn't. :rolleyes:

We got SLAMMED. UNCheat skated.
 
that was not a minor thing at all & i can't take seriously anyone who still wants to pretend that it was
Then shouldn't all SU students be held to the same standard and be investigated to make sure that is being upheld? The person challenging for PRESIDENT of the USA was accused of much more serious things at SU, and it hasn't affected him. Untold more, and if you attended a college or university you would be aware of this fact.
 
Uh, as compared to DECADES LONG INSTITUTIONAL-LEVEL ACADEMIC FRAUD for hundreds of student-athletes (and regular students - which made it all just a-ok), as perpetuated by UNCheat?
vs.
ONE paper, for ONE student, who was ESL.

Yeah, it's a minor thing.
I can't take seriously anyone who still wants to pretend that it wasn't. :rolleyes:

We got SLAMMED. UNCheat skated.


Carolina also played nice in public and spend tens of millions in legals fees to fight back.
 
SU is very hard academically and didn’t give athletes the preferential pass you’d think they would get.
Admittedly, I may not be very bright.
But that may be overstating SU's academic standing in many areas.

I do recall my gold standard for knowing I was taking the right class.
The perfect example was when I walked into the Maxwell auditorium lecture hall on the first day of class.
I was overjoyed to see half the football and basketball teams there.
Probably just a coincidence...but the course was Criminal Justice.
 
Then shouldn't all SU students be held to the same standard and be investigated to make sure that is being upheld? The person challenging for PRESIDENT of the USA was accused of much more serious things at SU, and it hasn't affected him. Untold more, and if you attended a college or university you would be aware of this fact.
I don't want to get too political but The Biden family has a lot of money I'm sure that helped.
 
Genius move by UNC really. Offer BS classes to every student and you have no issue for your players
I hadn't thought about this before but let's say in the case of Fab... what if we had assigned tutors to help write papers for students as well as him? Even advertise it... if you're struggling with your writing, get a tutor to "help". Would this have helped us escape punishment like UNC? Sounds like moving forward, anything that we may want to do to assist a player which might not be okay with the NCAA, we just make sure we also do it for students as well.
 
I hadn't thought about this before but let's say in the case of Fab... what if we had assigned tutors to help write papers for students as well as him? Even advertise it... if you're struggling with your writing, get a tutor to "help". Would this have helped us escape punishment like UNC? Sounds like moving forward, anything that we may want to do to assist a player which might not be okay with the NCAA, we just make sure we also do it for students as well.

I think like LeMoyne Cuse alluded to ... we were the crash dummy - schools took notice. Self reporting was clearly a mistake but having a committee decide to write the paper for him (i dont remember the exact specifics but i do remember the committee) killed us as well. All i know is that if we had done something for all students - we likely would have been ok
 
Uh, as compared to DECADES LONG INSTITUTIONAL-LEVEL ACADEMIC FRAUD for hundreds of student-athletes (and regular students - which made it all just a-ok), as perpetuated by UNCheat?
vs.
ONE paper, for ONE student, who was ESL.

Yeah, it's a minor thing.
I can't take seriously anyone who still wants to pretend that it wasn't. :rolleyes:

We got SLAMMED. UNCheat skated.
1. the director of athletics organized a conspiracy to commit academic fraud.

2. whataboutism is intellectually weak
 
Hmm...yet 'whataboutery' apparently is intellectually strong when arguing sanctions being the proximate cause of 5 straight seasons of mediocrity. Go figure.
 
It’s a convenient tale to tell ourselves that Jim Boeheim was a powerless agent against the cabal of NCAA officials who decided that he was going g to go down for meaningless violations and as a result the program was crippled for going on six years and more.
 
1. the director of athletics organized a conspiracy to commit academic fraud.

2. whataboutism is intellectually weak

This has been gone over so many times, but I disagree that point 1 can be stated so unequivocally.

The AD organized the resources of the school to understand how to help a student althete remain acedemically eligible when they ran into some problems with grades. In and of itself that is not only NOT a problem, it is in exact alignment with the mission of the institution. To help students learn and progress in their academic careers at the university. I have seen absolutely nothing that says the meetings held on the topic were discussions of cheating methods. They were discussions of what options were potentially available within the existing framework to give the kid a chance to bring his grade back up. Reasonably this is nothing an academic advisor to any student wouldn't aide them in doing if they ran into a similar situation (assuming academic advisors, on the whole, gave a crap but mine never did at a different college).

The fact that later down the road, a person completed some revisions to part of an assignment right before the deadline is a separate issue, which is a violation, but a preposterously minor one in the landscape of what we have seen come to light at other universities.
 
The vacated wins were a result of the use of players that should have been ineligible due to impermissable benefits or theterms of our internal drug policy. Penalty matched the letter, if not the spirit, of the law.

The historically severe scholarship reductions and recruiting restrictions on the other hand had no basis in precedent or documented legislation.
 
The vacated wins were a result of the use of players that should have been ineligible due to impermissable benefits or theterms of our internal drug policy. Penalty matched the letter, if not the spirit, of the law.

The historically severe scholarship reductions and recruiting restrictions on the other hand had no basis in precedent or documented legislation.

The other aspect that burned me was that there was also a coordinated effort to trash the program in the media. I'm sure we all recall the sudden leaks and headlines year after year in the week between selection sunday and the 1st round (when attention is at a peak), claiming "throw a dart at the rule book and you'll find a Syracuse violation" etc etc. These were orchestrated attacks. Just imagine what we now know was going on at basically every major school when that headline was being trotted out. It's not like insiders didn't know all that stuff was happening. That was a purposeful slander of the program and it went on for years (and years before any "findings" came out from a decade long investigation). It's bonkers when you look back on it.
 
What really grates me is that my in-laws (HUGE Dookie fans) consider their program cleaner than ours. Apparently they don't need to cheat. That's really what they say.
 
What really grates me is that my in-laws (HUGE Dookie fans) consider their program cleaner than ours. Apparently they don't need to cheat. That's really what they say.

They may be right. Duke may not need to cheat. They just do it anyway!
 
I don't want to get too political but The Biden family has a lot of money I'm sure that helped.
I was just citing as a well know example. To trash a poor kid like Fab when it is wide spread as it is was just cruel. The was a huge scandal across the Ivy league of organized cheating and it goes on from grade school on up. You don't recall in high school 1 person doing the work and the others using it. I do.
 
I don't think its any coincidence that we got hit when we were at our most successful.

We had so mastered defense first commitment to the zone but with NBA talent. JB got lax on his zone in the 2000s but really ramped up the coaching and rotations for the Wes team and the ones that followed.
 
It's sickening how much power Paterno had and like I said before I hope he is rotting in hell right now but jb is more influential than your making him out to be. No way there is none more people at su with more influence.

Well that’s more the community in general which of course he’s the most famous citizen.

You’d have to hold a gun to the guys head to get him to go to a trustees meeting or give a about internal university politics. JB stays in his lane and coaches basketball. Unless they tap him to coach golf.

Maybe we should bring golf back I bet he’d still be down to coach the team.
 
Well that’s more the community in general which of course he’s the most famous citizen.

You’d have to hold a gun to the guys head to get him to go to a trustees meeting or give a about internal university politics. JB stays in his lane and coaches basketball. Unless they tap him to coach golf.

Maybe we should bring golf back I bet he’d still be down to coach the team.
I agree but if he ever had an.issue with a trustee they would listen to jb for sure. I could actually see jb coaching or teaching golf when he retires
 
I was just citing as a well know example. To trash a poor kid like Fab when it is wide spread as it is was just cruel. The was a huge scandal across the Ivy league of organized cheating and it goes on from grade school on up. You don't recall in high school 1 person doing the work and the others using it. I do.
The whole thing was a joke what college kid doesn't rip off a paper at some point in their academic career?
 

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