Yankees in the midst of an epic choke job.

[Briancuse]

I would love CuseHulk's analysis of when the Mets traded Carlos Beltran STRAIGHT UP for a pitching prospect by the name of Zack Wheeler.
How can you trade a former MVP candidate for pitching prospect.
Or when the Cleveland Indians traded Cy Young winner Bartolo Colon to the Montreal Expos for 3 unknown prospects Grady Sizemore, Cliff Lee, and Brandon Philips.

Wake me up when they did anything.

To be fair, in the Expos situation, Omar Minaya was told that he wasn't going to have a team anymore, and had to unload everything.

 

[Noexcuse]

Ah, the view from the top is pretty nice. Can almost see Solvay from here. As Mark Twain used to say back in the day, "Reports of the Yankees demise have been greatly exaggerated". Or something like that.

 

[victor]

Ah, the view from the top is pretty nice. Can almost see Solvay from here. As Mark Twain used to say back in the day, "Reports of the Yankees demise have been greatly exaggerated". Or something like that.

Incredible performance by Tanaka. Bases loaded with nobody out and Jays only get one run, and how about Beltran although I must say he now runs like he's carrying a piano on his back. Hoping for the sweep tomorrow against a guy with an 11-2 record and a 5.25 ERA. As for Solvay all I can say is go Bearcats.

 

[CaliCuse]

They have now played their way out of first place. 9 runs total in the last 7 games. Two weeks ago they were tearing the cover off the ball and now it's looking like it was all a mirage and they have returned to form as the team that just can't score runs.

It's really been a team effort... this precipitous falling out of 1st place. Outside of Gregorious and Beltran these guys can't get on base and when they do there is nobody to drive them in. Really depressing to watch this team right now. Severino can come up with a decent effort and the team helps him with run support this will be a successful series for the YankeesNow they still have plenty of time to play out the "CHOKE"scenario.

 

[Flacusian]

Time to weigh in on the two outstanding pitching efforts from Nova and Tanaka. Props go out to Betances and Miller as well. Friday nights game was about as good as it gets in terms of excitement. The Yanks have served notice that they aren't going to let the Jays take the division without a fight. Hopefully the Yankees can return the favor of a 3 game sweep on the opponents turf with a win today.

 

[donniesyracuse]

I'm not rejecting them, but I am not sure why you are devaluing era. Look at other teams who are either going to be in the playoffs, or are in the hunt for the playoffs, where would you put the Yankees Rotation?

Advanced stats exist because ERA is woefully inadequate for comparing pitchers. There are only a million articles on the Internet explaining why.

The stats say Yankee starting pitching is somewhere between second and sixth in the American League. I think that is probably correct. I do not think there is a ton of separation between the top staffs. Anyway, I think Yankee starting pitching is pretty good (better than the Blue Jays) and the stats support my position.

 

[Briancuse]

Advanced stats exist because ERA is woefully inadequate for comparing pitchers. There are only a million articles on the Internet explaining why.

The stats say Yankee starting pitching is somewhere between second and sixth in the American League. I think that is probably correct. I do not think there is a ton of separation between the top staffs. Anyway, I think Yankee starting pitching is pretty good (better than the Blue Jays) and the stats support my position.

There are a million articles out there because everyone wants to be a contrarian and try to reinvent the wheel. Era is still an important stat when it comes to pitching, is it everything?, No, but it is still telling. If Tanaka is going to pitch like he did on saturday, then yes the Yankees rotation is probably a little better, if not, than I will take the Jays.

 

[donniesyracuse]

There are a million articles out there because everyone wants to be a contrarian and try to reinvent the wheel. Era is still an important stat when it comes to pitching, is it everything?, No, but it is still telling.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that.

Do you also think that teams which employ the infield shift, after 150 years of not doing so, are just being contrarian?

Old habits die hard. There is so much valuable information available to us now, why be a slave to archaic stats? With ERA, you're using an Apple II+ when the rest of us are using iMacs.

 

[Hoo's That]

Advanced stats exist because ERA is woefully inadequate for comparing pitchers. There are only a million articles on the Internet explaining why.

The stats say Yankee starting pitching is somewhere between second and sixth in the American League. I think that is probably correct. I do not think there is a ton of separation between the top staffs. Anyway, I think Yankee starting pitching is pretty good (better than the Blue Jays) and the stats support my position.

For starting pitchers, I've come to like "Quality Starts" as the best stat. Regardless of the outcome, the pitcher put his team in an excellent position to win by giving up 3 or less earned runs. You can't expect much more than that and it's definitely not going to happen every outing.

 

[donniesyracuse]

For starting pitchers, I've come to like "Quality Starts" as the best stat.

I understand, but I have a problem with judging pitchers on the number of runs they give up. Obviously, runs are the the most important commodity, but I have grown to accept that a pitcher does not have that much control over them. I prefer to evaluate pitchers on things they can actually control (e.g., strike outs, walks, home runs [although that is also debatable]). Chance plays a huge role in weather a ball put into play results in a run or out. Hard hit balls are often hit directly at fielders resulting in an outs. Bloops often drop in for hits; sometimes even doubles and triples for multiple RBIs. Conventional wisdom held that this balances out over a long season, but there is actually significant evidence that it does not. A pitcher's ERA can vary greatly from year to year with the only difference being how many balls put into play resulted in hits.

There are no perfect stats. Many pitchers have made a living pitching to soft contact and manage to keep low ERAs throughout their careers. My main point is that an Earner Run is as much about random luck as it is about a pitcher's effectiveness.