zone

[Brooky03]

I agree with you and I’m tired of recruiting tall lanky projects for the zone. I want smart players. I want refuse to lose players. I want Bonafied point guards. I want man to man and zone as needed. Let’s open up the books to other player types

Our lack of legit PGs is not for a lack of trying.

 

[Ghost]

I don't know - I think it can still function if we hit on the right PG. However, gambling everything on turning shootings guards into point guards - when player development doesn't seem to be our forte is REALLY playing with fire. When your roster is the "land of misfit toys" you better be incredibly good at development...we don't seem to be.

Guys like Braswell, Goodine, Guerrier, Carey...could have the quickness, etc...to make it work again, and be a huge positive factor as it has been in the past, but that doesn't excuse the need for a functional point guard.

If we can reach that point, fine.

If we can't, we should be willing to throw down with some M2M, even if just for a couple minutes to get the players engaged when they're sleepwalking through the offense, or to change up the tempo. Whatever. We should be a tiny bit more flexible. And I'm okay with just a TINY bit.

Also, if we could have a Center with some ability to do something, pretty much anything, consistently...rebounding, mid-ranger jumpers, great defense, etc...that would be nice.

 

[Brooky03]

Probably could play it better with more elite athletes, but we can’t recruit those elite athletes anymore, in part because of the zone exclusivity.

Seems to be true with Centers. This isn't the case with other positions, though.

 

[longislandcuse]

Seems to be true with Centers. This isn't the case with other positions, though.

We used to have Jerami Grant, James Southerland types on the wing... I don’t see that anymore, in addition to no true Centers, along with a step down from the Triche, Rautins, G’s of the recent past up top.

 

[hoopsupstate]

Well, Iowa just lit it up from three in the second half against Cincy. Cincy played all man. They should have gone zone.

 

[Ghost]

I don't think they made a foul line jumper all night and all we did was defend it with fervor.

We did do a great job shutting that shot down. I like you're positive spin!

 

[Brooky03]

We used to have Jerami Grant, James Southerland types on the wing... I don’t see that anymore, in addition to no true Centers, along with a step down from the Triche, Rautins, G’s of the recent past up top.

There hasn't been much time between their tenures and now. Bazley fits that mold but decided to bounce. Lydon was athletic (more so that Southerland). Braswell is athletic. Guerrier is athletic. Roberson was athletic.

Jerami Grant was a special athlete. Hard to find recruits with that combo of height and bounce.

 

[Ghost]

Well, Iowa just lit it up from three in the second half against Cincy. Cincy played all man. They should have gone zone.

How many threes did they get to attempt against M2M for the game? How many did Baylor?

Were they able to limit the open attempts at least? Curious.

 

[kingtidge]

Personnel, personnel, personnel.

The zone has been doing it's job, evidenced by our defensive efficiency numbers over the years. Need better players to get back to the elite level it was at before.

What I'm saying is the era for playing it exclusively with a high level of success has ended I think.

If we continue with it exclusively, it will most likely be to the detriment of the overall success of the team.

Too many teams are now ready and capable to exploit it.

We need competent plan b man sets to have more success.

 

[GooseMutt]

Our lack of legit PGs is not for a lack of trying.

But really good ones want to play with other 5 stars. Our zone pushes many big men away

 

[SoBristol]

The big issue is lack of defensive rebounding.
I don’t think you can prove the zone is the problem when you have mediocre talent. The zone helped our talent get 20 wins in a tough ACC, and an 8 seed in the tournament. Without the exclusive use of zone, this bunch would do better? Wonder if you have seen Buddy, Chukwu, Dolezaj show skills in m2m?

 

[GooseMutt]

Well, Iowa just lit it up from three in the second half against Cincy. Cincy played all man. They should have gone zone.

Logic doesn’t work here

 

[kingtidge]

Well, Iowa just lit it up from three in the second half against Cincy. Cincy played all man. They should have gone zone.

Regardless, nice to have options.

 

[kingtidge]

The big issue is lack of defensive rebounding.
I don’t think you can prove the zone is the problem when you have mediocre talent. The zone helped our talent get 20 wins in a tough ACC, and an 8 seed in the tournament. Without the exclusive use of zone, this bunch would do better? Wonder if you have seen Buddy, Chukwu, Dolezaj show skills in m2m?

I can't prove anything. It's just my opinion.

I believe the college game has changed and we need to change with it to be as successful as we can be.

Of course I haven't seen our current players play regularly in m2m sets. What kind of question is that?

 

[Brooky03]

What I'm saying is the era for playing it exclusively with a high level of success has ended I think.

If we continue with it exclusively, it will most likely be to the detriment of the overall success of the team.

Too many teams are now ready and capable to exploit it.

We need competent plan b man sets to have more success.

I hear you, but plan b will be a trunk monkey. Playing the zone like we do necessitates extreme practice time and focus. If we throw in m2m, it will be a defense that we'll kind of suck at. Might confuse teams for a few possessions, but they'd shred it after that. There's no guarantee it'd stop 3's anyway.

If we're going to switch up the defense, I'd rather see more fullcourt pressure and deeper rotations.

 

[kingtidge]

I hear you, but plan b will be a trunk monkey. Playing the zone like we do necessitates extreme practice time and focus. If we throw in m2m, it will be a defense that we'll kind of suck at. Might confuse teams for a few possessions, but they'd shred it after that. There's no guarantee it'd stop 3's anyway.

If we're going to switch up the defense, I'd rather see more fullcourt pressure and deeper rotations.

Not a valid argument.

The team we played last night is a zone-first team but does both and they essentially won the game by switching at the right time.

It seems they can do both.

It is right there staring us in the face.

 

[Forloveoforange]

We've been fighting this 3 pointer since Steve Alford went 7 for 10 in 1987. Its not getting any better for us.

 

[Brooky03]

Not a valid argument.

The team we played last night is a zone-first team but does both and they essentially won the game by switching at the right time.

It seems they can do both.

It is right there staring us in the face.

In my defense, Baylor was playing against an offense composed of toddlers.

 

[longislandcuse]

I’m as anti-zone exclusivity as they come but I don’t hate being a zone team. I kind of like it when we have athletes.

Just have press/token press and a secondary m2m defense.

Why we don’t token press and fall back already is beyond me. Shot clock went from 35 to 30, and we can then take another 10 off by token pressing, thus allowing only 20 seconds to probe our zone.

Then if they bomb of us out of it. Switch to man for a bit. Switch back to zone if you want, but get them out of their rhythm.

 

[PauliePeppas]

I’m as anti-zone exclusivity as they come but I don’t hate being a zone team. I kind of like it when we have athletes.

Just have press/token press and a secondary m2m defense.

Why we don’t token press and fall back already is beyond me. Shot clock went from 35 to 30, and we can then take another 10 off by token pressing, thus allowing only 20 seconds to probe our zone.

Then if they bomb of us out of it. Switch to man for a bit. Switch back to zone if you want, but get them out of their rhythm.

Pitino mastered this and is why he owned Boeheim and imo a way better coach

 

[kingtidge]

In my defense, Baylor was playing against an offense composed of toddlers.

toddlers?

not sure I follow...

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Hang on.

Last year the zone defense was arguably the biggest reason why we made the Sweet Sixteen.

Now it's a gimmick because we lost in the first round.

College basketball changed that much in one year?

 

[longislandcuse]

Hang on.

Last year the zone defense was arguably the biggest reason why we made the Sweet Sixteen.

Now it's a gimmick because we lost in the first round.

College basketball changed that much in one year?

I think that shows evidence of 100% zone being a gimmick.

...because I think both assumptions re: last year/this year are accurate.

 

[Brooky03]

toddlers?

not sure I follow...

Our players have the collective basketball IQ of 3 year olds who don't know what a basketball is

 

[kingtidge]

Our players have the collective basketball IQ of 3 year olds who don't know what a basketball is

Marek seems to have decent court vision on offense.

He doesn't always make good decisions on defense however (a lot of stupid fouls.)