Class of 2015 3 commits in one day??

[Sudano]

How can you be critical... Are you a judge of D1 talent and D1 potential? What basis do you have to be critical?

I have been a SU fan for 30 yrs. I have subscribed and followed player evaluations and recruiting since I was 12. My statement is critical and not in a bad way. If I had your take I would think every player to every class since 1982 was terrific. I know it hasn't. My experience tells me as an involved fan who has followed this process very critically and following recruiting from Phil Bogle to Frank Giufre to Jim Leible. I do have a discerning eye for talent and recruiting. I do like one of the line recruits. I just don't understand the viewpoint that just because a player signs with SU they are an automatic contributor to a 9-4 season. As fans we can be a more critical eye for that. If you don't, don't just assume. I will always have a critical eye for SU sports because of my passion, and that's a good thing. And by the way talent evaluation isn't black and white. By questioning if there are better options doesn't mean they are terrible. They do have good qualities to work from. I just want more better players that many other top schools want to.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Interesting breakdown on the commits so far -

4 from Florida
2 from New York
1 from Illinois

 

[anomander]

I have been a SU fan for 30 yrs. I have subscribed and followed player evaluations and recruiting since I was 12. My statement is critical and not in a bad way. If I had your take I would think every player to every class since 1982 was terrific. I know it hasn't. My experience tells me as an involved fan who has followed this process very critically and following recruiting from Phil Bogle to Frank Giufre to Jim Leible. I do have a discerning eye for talent and recruiting. I do like one of the line recruits. I just don't understand the viewpoint that just because a player signs with SU they are an automatic contributor to a 9-4 season. As fans we can be a more critical eye for that. If you don't, don't just assume. I will always have a critical eye for SU sports because of my passion, and that's a good thing. And by the way talent evaluation isn't black and white. By questioning if there are better options doesn't mean they are terrible. They do have good qualities to work from. I just want more better players that many other top schools want to.

this is fair. despite the excitement of adding new players to the program i try to evaluate players with an unbiased opinion.

 

[CuseOnly]

I have been a SU fan for 30 yrs. I have subscribed and followed player evaluations and recruiting since I was 12. My statement is critical and not in a bad way. If I had your take I would think every player to every class since 1982 was terrific. I know it hasn't. My experience tells me as an involved fan who has followed this process very critically and following recruiting from Phil Bogle to Frank Giufre to Jim Leible. I do have a discerning eye for talent and recruiting. I do like one of the line recruits. I just don't understand the viewpoint that just because a player signs with SU they are an automatic contributor to a 9-4 season. As fans we can be a more critical eye for that. If you don't, don't just assume. I will always have a critical eye for SU sports because of my passion, and that's a good thing. And by the way talent evaluation isn't black and white. By questioning if there are better options doesn't mean they are terrible. They do have good qualities to work from. I just want more better players that many other top schools want to.

Awful long answer to confirm that you are just a critical fan with an opinion and no real experience is judging D1 talent.

Way to string it out though, kudos.

Just to reiterate, being a fan critical of the talent brought in (what you are) and being someone qualified to judge D1 talent are 2 entirely different things. I asked basically what your qualifications were to judge talent other than being a fan and you have none.

So I guess criticize away.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Awful long answer to confirm that you are just a critical fan with an opinion and no real experience is judging D1 talent.

Way to string it out though, kudos.

Just to reiterate, being a fan critical of the talent brought in (what you are) and being someone qualified to judge D1 talent are 2 entirely different things. I asked basically what your qualifications were to judge talent other than being a fan and you have none.

So I guess criticize away.

This is pretty much a ridiculous response to Sudano's post.

 

[wfschrec]

this is fair. despite the excitement of adding new players to the program i try to evaluate players with an unbiased opinion.

Which is fine but to quote your post in the Clausman thread:

"Clausman was named as one of the top performers without an offer (apparently Syracuse doesn't exist to ) at a loaded Miami Camp Series. Good thing we are in early on this kid, we definitely won't be his only offer."

So there are obviously people out there who think this kid is a good player ... that and his SPARQ rating tell me more than a fan who has performed his own evals. I don't care if he has been doing it for 30 years or 3 ... which I think is CuseOnly's point ... it is not just some people on this board that are excited about him. Do we as fans of the program get overly excited and possibly give players a better nod than they should get? Of course but it is still early in the process and the fact is a lot of people get too wrapped up in an offer sheet ... how did that offer sheet work out for Bromley?

In my opinion having over enthusiastic fans and a lot of excitement even if not totally justifiable is the best thing for the program right now. New staff, new conference and a bowl win ... so much momentum. Stand behind the kids and those who are committing to SU ... make it a place they want to be. These kids have Ivy League schools and NW looking at them and they play for an elite high school program ... they have the brains and play at the highest level of HS ball ... compare their resumes to some of the guys on our roster ... am I downgrading the guys we have? No, but look at the pedigree ... I think that is what excited fans here are looking at, I know I am.

 

[CuseOnly]

This is pretty much a ridiculous response to Sudano's post.

Why ridiculous?

I asked how he can be critical and judge what the staff is doing and the talent they are bringing in. Basically his answer was that he has been a fan for 30 years, not a qualification. He said he was excited about 1 of the 3 lineman recruits and was critical of the other 2. So in other words, he thought 1 kid of the 3 was good, I asked what his qualifications are to judge.

I will choose to be excited that kids from STA are coming here and any kid that comes here that the staff deems is good enough because I trust THEIR QUALIFICATIONS, THEIR EXPERIENCE, THEIR KNOWLEDGE. Not a fans opinion and "critical eye" as he put it.

 

[Sudano]

Awful long answer to confirm that you are just a critical fan with an opinion and no real experience is judging D1 talent.

Way to string it out though, kudos.

Just to reiterate, being a fan critical of the talent brought in (what you are) and being someone qualified to judge D1 talent are 2 entirely different things. I asked basically what your qualifications were to judge talent other than being a fan and you have none.

So I guess criticize away.

Wow what a dork response. You take the time to criticize the length of my post trying to detail my point with a lengthy post of your own trying to diminish my skills of talent evaluation. Of course I'm not a football coach but that doesn't mean every fan's ability to evaluate who SU signs is not the same. We all have different levels of knowledge and experience. I will put up my skills of recruiting analysis against yours every day of every week. I follow this stuff, alot, closely for a long period of time-decades. My point wasn't my skills at talent evaluation are better than SU coaches its that the players we sign could possibly not be the best as compared to other options and our ACC competitors on the field. To shift that point to the one your trying to make is just an attempt to be a complete D***.

 

[Libero2]

5/16/14-- the day the 2016 Offensive line committed.

These guys with Roberts and Ward should make for a damn formidable OL in the next couple seasons.

 

[WickedOrange]

 

[anomander]

Which is fine but to quote your post in the Clausman thread:

"Clausman was named as one of the top performers without an offer (apparently Syracuse doesn't exist to ) at a loaded Miami Camp Series. Good thing we are in early on this kid, we definitely won't be his only offer."

So there are obviously people out there who think this kid is a good player ... that and his SPARQ rating tell me more than a fan who has performed his own evals. I don't care if he has been doing it for 30 years or 3 ... which I think is CuseOnly's point ... it is not just some people on this board that are excited about him. Do we as fans of the program get overly excited and possibly give players a better nod than they should get? Of course but it is still early in the process and the fact is a lot of people get too wrapped up in an offer sheet ... how did that offer sheet work out for Bromley?

In my opinion having over enthusiastic fans and a lot of excitement even if not totally justifiable is the best thing for the program right now. New staff, new conference and a bowl win ... so much momentum. Stand behind the kids and those who are committing to SU ... make it a place they want to be. These kids have Ivy League schools and NW looking at them and they play for an elite high school program ... they have the brains and play at the highest level of HS ball ... compare their resumes to some of the guys on our roster ... am I downgrading the guys we have? No, but look at the pedigree ... I think that is what excited fans here are looking at, I know I am.

That all makes sense too. All i'm saying is I can respect other people's opinions on prospects. Now in no way am I saying any of these kids we bring in deserve to be criticized, but I can deal with a judging eye if there is at least a logical explanation to support it. You never know the backgrounds of some of the average fans. I know we have plenty of coaches here, or others who have grown up around the game. I know I appreciate some of our posters who give feedback like Money, Finwad, and NovaOrange to name a few. But we also have to remember our coaches have evaluated the players in a live setting, get feedback from coaches who are around these kids daily, and probably have game film for each kid. I just think it's part of being a fan.

Also, my post wasn't specifically referring to Clausman. imo he is a very sound prospect that I am glad we snagged a commitment from. I have the same exact feelings for Byrne as well. Plus you can't say enough for getting back into St. Thomas Aquinas. I do feel both are interior line prospects.

As for Conway I admit I am a bit more excited for him as a prospect. Now I don't think there is anything wrong with liking some recruits more then other. It's nothing against the STA kids, it's just that I feel Conway has more room for growth.

 

[CuseOnly]

Wow what a dork response. You take the time to criticize the length of my post trying to detail my point with a lengthy post of your own trying to diminish my skills of talent evaluation. Of course I'm not a football coach but that doesn't mean every fan's ability to evaluate who SU signs is not the same. We all have different levels of knowledge and experience. I will put up my skills of recruiting analysis against yours every day of every week. I follow this stuff, alot, closely for a long period of time-decades. My point wasn't my skills at talent evaluation are better than SU coaches its that the players we sign could possibly not be the best as compared to other options and our ACC competitors on the field. To shift that point to the one your trying to make is just an attempt to be a complete D***.

LOL, now we are name calling. I simply asked what your qualifications were to judge the talent and the coaches ability to judge it and determine which kids are good enough.

You were very critical of 2 of the linemen judging whether they were good enough or as you said "our best options".

My simple question to you was, who are you and what are your qualifications to judge the coaches or the talent itself. And you stated that you are about as qualified as anyone on the planet but you are a fan and follow it.

I have followed for decades as well, since I was a little boy and I can tell you...I am not qualified and most likely neither are you.

Unless you have played or coached at a High School, D1 level or above, you are not qualified. And as I stated earlier on that note, criticize away as most will do because this is the internet.

Wasn't being a D***, I choose not to criticize because I am not qualified to do so.

Apparently on that note, you don't like to be criticized, not fun is it.

 

[TheCusian]

1. They got kids high on their list.
2. They were amped to do so.
3. Everyone knows that some kids work out and others don't.
4. Everyone knows that more stars and more offers from high profile schools is better than not on the whole.

None of these facts demand that we be critical on the day they sign with us. It's alright to be amped with staff, even knowing #3 and 4.

We'd all love to be competing with Alabama and FSU for kids every cycle - but that's a poor excuse to crap on the staff and kids the day of the commitment.

 

[wfschrec]

That all makes sense too. All i'm saying is I can respect other people's opinions on prospects. Now in no way am I saying any of these kids we bring in deserve to be criticized, but I can deal with a judging eye if there is at least a logical explanation to support it. You never know the backgrounds of some of the average fans. I know we have plenty of coaches here, or others who have grown up around the game. I know I appreciate some of our posters who give feedback like Money, Finwad, and NovaOrange to name a few. But we also have to remember our coaches have evaluated the players in a live setting, get feedback from coaches who are around these kids daily, and probably have game film for each kid. I just think it's part of being a fan.

Also, my post wasn't specifically referring to Clausman. imo he is a very sound prospect that I am glad we snagged a commitment from. I have the same exact feelings for Byrne as well. Plus you can't say enough for getting back into St. Thomas Aquinas. I do feel both are interior line prospects.

As for Conway I admit I am a bit more excited for him as a prospect. Now I don't think there is anything wrong with liking some recruits more then other. It's nothing against the STA kids, it's just that I feel Conway has more room for growth.

I'm with you ... I respect opinions but when someone says they aren't ACC caliber and their experience is not that of our coaching staff it is hard to take what they say seriously. Shafer came out and said the ACC has more speed ... so in turn he would then extend early offers to slower linemen that can't compete in the ACC?

That is pretty much what was implied and I think an unfair statement based on what most of us, even knowledgeable fans have currently at our disposal. You can watch video and that is great ... I've seen some video of these GA kids and then seen them live ... totally different feel to me. The one thing I haven't done is seen what they do at camps and things of the like ... which gives coaches another data point we don't get as fans. Of course no doubt I am a glass half full kind of guy but I find it hard to digest these early commits aren't worthy of the ACC because if the coaches are offering them they obviously feel differently.

As a fan I am more excited than I have been in quite some time, seeing who we are offering and who we are competing against for prospects (for the most part) has really given me cause to focus more on this stuff myself. I can say however I won't pass judgement on them till they put on SU uniforms and play. I do collect information from people like you and some of the other knowledgeable guys like money and value it along with the stuff I hear from the coaching community here in GA ... the hardest thing for me is to temper my excitement ... but once Shafer starts talking I'm ready to plow someone over and that self control flies right out the window

 

[CuseOnly]

I am excited and will continue to be for any kid that wants to come here and contribute to this program.

As Shafer has said many times..."the one thing you know is that you never know, talk to me about how good a kid or a class is/was 4-5 years from now and we will know".

They seem to recruit and offer kids with high motors, great work ethic, potential, leadership as well as talent. All of them have talent in my opinion but do all of them have the work ethic to reach their potential.

I trust in this staff and especially Shafer to have a vision for each kid coming in and their ability to get these kids to perform and reach their potential.

There is a reason why they each are recruited and offered.

EDIT: I forgot attitude. As Shafer has also said that there are some highly "rated" kids that are not recruited/offered because they don't fit the mold or aren't the right fit.

 

[Trueblue25]

TH for heisman...

 

[JDubbin]

TH for heisman...

So a Theisman, if you will... see what I did there?!?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Are you suggesting we just received a veritable Thickburger of commitments?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I choose not to criticize because I am not qualified to do so.

Oh, man, take it from me... you are really missing out.

 

[baggerbob]

For all the experts, as Floyd Little said " You can't measure Heart, and Desire ", the intangible's which make players great. I'm satisfied the coaches have a better idea then we do who fits our system. Athletic ability doesn't always equate to greatness.

 

[CuseOnly]

Oh, man, take it from me... you are really missing out.

It is much more fun to criticize experts on the internet.

 

[tep624]

Never said they were duds. I'm sure they're solid recruits. Just remember, though, we're competing against Florida State, Clemson, Miami, Georgia Tech and others.

We lost to those teams (Miami exclude because we didn't play them) last year by a combined 1 million to 0 - don't you think expecting our commits to have FSU and Clemson offers the May before signing day is a bit aggressive at this point?

 

[kcsu]

I love early offers and commits. We hire a staff to trust them if these kids are an early offer that means they are high on the board. Good enough for me